Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?

[HomoSapien]

I'm a little discouraged, but I'm not super worried. Even though the starts are similar, I think the injury really set him back. I'm still confident that he'll be an important player for us and will continue to develop.

[coldfish]

I'm a little discouraged, but I'm not super worried. Even though the starts are similar, I think the injury really set him back. I'm still confident that he'll be an important player for us and will continue to develop.

As you note, the stats are virtually identical. The concern is that this is who he is and he really didn't work on the right things this summer. Its not like he is trying new stuff and failing. If anything, it seems like the slow shift in the NBA to more mobile players is catching up to him.

[Dieselbound&Down]

An intoxicating hook (at least for my kids) with not a lot of substance behind it. Whether this is analogous to our Finnish friend I'll leave that to the listener.

Watch on YouTube

[Red Larrivee]

I'm a little discouraged, but I'm not super worried. Even though the starts are similar, I think the injury really set him back. I'm still confident that he'll be an important player for us and will continue to develop.

As you note, the stats are virtually identical. The concern is that this is who he is and he really didn't work on the right things this summer. Its not like he is trying new stuff and failing. If anything, it seems like the slow shift in the NBA to more mobile players is catching up to him.

Given the circumstances of missing training camp, preseason and playing in a trainwreck of an offense, I think he's done fine. That can also be a factor in not trying new things, since you're mostly playing your way back into shape and rhythm. For me, it's hard to be concerned that this is who he is at 21 years of age. We don't even have a game plan that's tailored to anyone's strengths.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[Leslie Forman]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

[Hangtime84]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

I will say this i don't mind the idea of let's say we draft Zion and have to move Lauri to 5 in order to make that work. However right now he isn't strong enough. Thus needs to continue to improve his ball handling.

[ZOMG]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

It's rare to find a long post where I disagree with almost everything, but this is one of those.

Don't even know where to start. You recommend MORE muscle mass for Lauri, not less. You think he can "bang inside with centers" then, even though it's not a question of strength, it's all about length and explosiveness these days. You say Zion is "more versatile", when the guy can't hit a jump shot to save his life.

A game plan won't help Lauri? What?? Haven't heard anything that crazy for a while. NBA teams go through a HELL of a lot of trouble to put their best players in positions where they can succeed, and they always have. They run these guys through 3 screens if necessary to get a favourable mismatch out of a switch. But I guess you just see that as one random ISO after another.

What a weird, weird post.

[The Evidence]

Read on Twitter

Markannen is clearly the superior athlete, but he just doesn't have the craftiness to get his own shot off.

[coldfish]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

Good post.

As this discussion was going on, it struck me that Lauri played a lot more at center last year than he has this year. I wonder how much of the good memories from last year were times when he was matched up against a bigger player?

Lauri really only makes sense at the 4 if he adds a post game AND lateral quickness. If he can defend the quicker 4's while taking them inside then he is a match up problem at the 4 and would be effective. As is, his lack of post game and poor footspeed make him a tweener in the bad sense of the word.

[PaKii94]

The reason why I think lauri can't play center is his wingspan. His defensive fundamentals are fine but bigger players just end up shooting over him and he isn't the most explosive player to be able to counter his shorter wingspan by agility and hops. This isn't really seen when he's matched up against smaller players because he has the length to alter the shot for them.

[Hugi Mancura]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

Good post.

As this discussion was going on, it struck me that Lauri played a lot more at center last year than he has this year. I wonder how much of the good memories from last year were times when he was matched up against a bigger player?

Lauri really only makes sense at the 4 if he adds a post game AND lateral quickness. If he can defend the quicker 4's while taking them inside then he is a match up problem at the 4 and would be effective. As is, his lack of post game and poor footspeed make him a tweener in the bad sense of the word.

So people really hate Lauri. They want him out of NBA in two years. Bang with centers? Center are dying breed, so ability to defend them is a dying skill. Why people think Rolo is not getting playing time. He is great at banging with centers and can shoot open 3's. He is out because he can't defend smaller players. Lauri still can defend smaller players, but if he gets more strength then he is as useful NBA players as me. He needs to get back to the speeds he had before going to Arizona. Only people who hate Lauri want him to get stronger. It is extremely stupid to build your career on defending Embiid or Jokic, if you can't be on court when those two are out. So as right now making Lauri faster should be the primary goal. If he will get stronger he is out from NBA in 2-3 years. Slow 7 footer is useless in 4-5 years. Why people hate RoLo? He is slow 7 footer who can defend Embiid or Jokic, but can't defend anyone else. But still it seems those same people want Lauri to become next RoLo.

Arizona really ruined Lauri's offensive game. He was fast and had post game, or actually it was more like mid range game, but year in Arizona and he is slow and now time in Bulls is making him even slower. Lauri should stop listening team's coaches and think does he want to long career in NBA. If he does then he should start training explosiveness. Post play will come with experience and repetition. One summer with Hakeem should be enough for him.

[Leslie Forman]

The reason why I think lauri can't play center is his wingspan. His defensive fundamentals are fine but bigger players just end up shooting over him and he isn't the most explosive player to be able to counter his shorter wingspan by agility and hops. This isn't really seen when he's matched up against smaller players because he has the length to alter the shot for them.

I don't see how anyone can think that Markkanen can't physically be a center but Carter can. Carter is quite a bit shorter and doesn't appear to be any stronger or more athletic. Standing reach matters more than wingspan there, and even if Carter has the longer wingspan, Markkanen likely has just as high a reach, if not even higher, simply from being taller.

The best use of Markkanen eventually I think is maybe as a higher output version of what Brook Lopez is now in Milwaukee. Gain strength and become more of a paint clogger and box out guy on defense, hang around the line and rain 3s on offense. Unlike Lopez, rather than occasionally taking guys down low perhaps he attacks poor closeouts more often. Ryan Anderson in Lopez's body, basically.

People may not like hearing that but this guy is not exactly out there looking like young Dirk, even on his hot nights.

[PaKii94]

The reason why I think lauri can't play center is his wingspan. His defensive fundamentals are fine but bigger players just end up shooting over him and he isn't the most explosive player to be able to counter his shorter wingspan by agility and hops. This isn't really seen when he's matched up against smaller players because he has the length to alter the shot for them.

I don't see how anyone can think that Markkanen can't physically be a center but Carter can.

For the exact reason I listed: wingspan

Look at this pic. Laurie's shoulder is about an inch higher. He's not blocking the ball with his much higher head



Then compare wingspan:
Lauri-6'11
Wendell- 7'5

Wendell got at least 3 inches of reach on him. That comes in mighty handy when dealing with players of similar size and that hinders lauri for the same reason.

Same reason Draymond can play small ball 5 and be DPOY and Blake Griffin can't play center defense effectively.

[kulaz3000]

Is Lauri's wingspan really 6'11?

I could never find Lauri's measurements anywhere.

[PaKii94]

Is Lauri's wingspan really 6'11?

I could never find Lauri's measurements anywhere.

That's what Google told me. I didn't look further. Either way people can go back and read the scoring reports. Most mention the average wingspan as a hindrance in rim protection

[kulaz3000]

Is Lauri's wingspan really 6'11?

I could never find Lauri's measurements anywhere.

That's what Google told me. I didn't look further. Either way people can go back and read the scoring reports. Most mention the average wingspan as a hindrance in rim protection

That part, I don't disagree with. Limited wingspan definitely is a hindrance to rim protection and defense in general.

I was just curious whether there were updated measurements for him.

[coldfish]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

Good post.

As this discussion was going on, it struck me that Lauri played a lot more at center last year than he has this year. I wonder how much of the good memories from last year were times when he was matched up against a bigger player?

Lauri really only makes sense at the 4 if he adds a post game AND lateral quickness. If he can defend the quicker 4's while taking them inside then he is a match up problem at the 4 and would be effective. As is, his lack of post game and poor footspeed make him a tweener in the bad sense of the word.

So people really hate Lauri. They want him out of NBA in two years. Bang with centers? Center are dying breed, so ability to defend them is a dying skill. Why people think Rolo is not getting playing time. He is great at banging with centers and can shoot open 3's. He is out because he can't defend smaller players. Lauri still can defend smaller players, but if he gets more strength then he is as useful NBA players as me. He needs to get back to the speeds he had before going to Arizona. Only people who hate Lauri want him to get stronger. It is extremely stupid to build your career on defending Embiid or Jokic, if you can't be on court when those two are out. So as right now making Lauri faster should be the primary goal. If he will get stronger he is out from NBA in 2-3 years. Slow 7 footer is useless in 4-5 years. Why people hate RoLo? He is slow 7 footer who can defend Embiid or Jokic, but can't defend anyone else. But still it seems those same people want Lauri to become next RoLo.

Arizona really ruined Lauri's offensive game. He was fast and had post game, or actually it was more like mid range game, but year in Arizona and he is slow and now time in Bulls is making him even slower. Lauri should stop listening team's coaches and think does he want to long career in NBA. If he does then he should start training explosiveness. Post play will come with experience and repetition. One summer with Hakeem should be enough for him.

Whaaaat?

I have no idea if you were agreeing or disagreeing with me.

[Leslie Forman]

Wendell got at least 3 inches of reach on him. That comes in mighty handy when dealing with players of similar size and that hinders lauri for the same reason.

Same reason Draymond can play small ball 5 and be DPOY and Blake Griffin can't play center defense effectively.

Carter's standing reach is 9'1". We don't know what Markkanen's is. But we can look at someone who might be comparable, guys around 6'11"ish barefoot and with a similar wingspan. I don't feel like listing it, but you can go through em all yourself right here: https://stats.nba.com/draft/combine-anthro/

Right there on the first page, you can see Mo Wagner, who's 6'10.5" barefoot and has a 7' wingspan, has a 9' reach. All 7-footers, even the ones with just 1:1 wingspans, typically have a 9' reach.

I mean, even if none of you people think Markkanen is a center…look at that picture of him next to Carter. Look how freaking huge he is. Look at him struggling to get by smaller, quicker players. If he isn't a 5…well then how the hell is he a 4?

[Red Larrivee]

A "game plan" isn't going to make him faster, stronger, a better ballhandler, or a better passer.

I don't know what people were expecting from a 7' 250 pound guy with low on-ball skill going up against smaller, quicker, more skilled guys. This is how he played in Arizona, too.

He is never, ever going to be a plus athlete, defender, or playmaker at the 4. The way to maximize his skill set is for him to just keep adding strength and becoming a physical beast who can actually bang inside with centers when necessary but also drag them out to the three on offense. Playing at the 4 doesn't maximize this because almost every damn team plays 4 out now.

People keep mentioning that Dunn/LaVine doesn't seem like a great pairing but I don't know how Markkanen/Carter looks any more cohesive either. If you've seen a game in person you'll immediately realize how much bigger Markkanen looks. The guy is almost Lopez sized. It's absurd that people think he makes sense at the 4 with what's happening in this league right now. It's only going to keep evolving this draft, with much more versatile guys like Williamson/Hunter/Hachimura all coming into the league.

Making a decent chef work at McDonalds isn't going to do anything for him. Of course Markkanen is a flawed player just like everyone else on this roster. But, this offense literally doesn't play to the strengths of anyone. Nobody is put into the positions to succeed.

He's 21 years old. I don't know what he will or won't figure out. All I know is right now, they're wasting a year by expecting him to perform well in this dumpster fire of an offense.

[GimmeDat]

He's being grossly misused. I don't have an Athletic subscription so I don't know what Stephen Noh wrote recently, but I think this was what his latest article was alluding to. The average difficulty of his shots this season is incredibly tougher than they were last season.