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Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Sat Mar 9, 2019 9:41 pm
by ZOMG
kodo wrote:ZOMG wrote:People seem to have decided that there's something wrong with his conditioning. But let's get real... there's no evidence at all of that. Sure, he missed some time at first. But since then he's played a LOT of minutes and games.
There might be nothing wrong with his conditioning, the issue is how much he's playing for a 7 footer.
Since the ASB, distance traveled per game:
1. Paul George
2. Ingram
3. Lavine
4. Beal
5. Hield
6. McCollum
7. Josh Richardson
8. Nic Batum
9. Harrison Barnes
10. Lauri Markkanen
One of these is not like the others. He runs more miles per game than Ben Simmons, Jimmy Butler, Steph Curry, Damian Lillard, or Kemba Walker.
When we look at even athletically elite MVPs like Durant & Giannis are far behind.
That is absurd for a 7 footer.
That's the unenviable task of a big who can (or has to) guard perimeter players - and who doesn't get creampuff assignments like some superstars, because their teams want them to save their energy for offense.
Also, Lauri plays off the ball a lot. He keeps switching positions, running to the weak side, cutting and screening.
But yeah... that list is still enough to give you pause.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Sat Mar 9, 2019 10:19 pm
by PaKii94
This new version of lauri is weird to me. I dont think we can point to one specific reason but I think it's a cumulative effect of a lot of small different things that people have pointed out.
- Fatigue due to his overall court activity
- injury recovery, it's easy to retweak an elbow
- poor conditioning, can happen due to injury. I dont think lauri is purposely out of shape
- streaky shooting, Lauri IS still only 21. Got a whole career to be more consistent. It's amazing he had this kind of stretch in 2nd season to begin with.
-gameplan, I truly think this team is making tank movies. There is no other reason to see a 5 bench lineup.
Lauri was fine again the first half. Shot was off but he still had 14 points. Then he was definitely gameplaned out. Relegated to a shooter again. We didnt see any lauri lavine pnr action. It was just spamming Lopez all day. That was purposeful by the coaching staff.
-body not maximized, he is still weaker than most post players and that's why he gets pushed around some. I'm sure he'll get stronger that's not a worry to me. He just had a setback this year with the elbow
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Sat Mar 9, 2019 10:32 pm
by DuckIII
ZOMG wrote:DuckIII wrote:ZOMG, I think multiple things can be true. I think Lauri is streaky, yes, but I also see a visibly exhausted player struggling to keep his energy up.
That or he’s prone to dogging it, which I simply don’t believe.
I know he seems to be struggling. But Lauri's weird like that. As far back as I can remember, he's had games where he first looks like he's really laboring to get up and down the court... and two minutes later easily beats a PG off the dribble for a dunk and seems 100% fresh.
People seem to have decided that there's something wrong with his conditioning. But let's get real... there's no evidence at all of that. Sure, he missed some time at first. But since then he's played a LOT of minutes and games.
All I've heard of Lauri's training habits tells me that he's one of those guys who's fanatical about his fitness. Just a complete gym and weight room rat, sometimes even to his own detriment. He had some problems with overtraining when he was younger.
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with his conditioning. I think he played an insane amount basketball the last 7 days and was sick.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:08 am
by Grodoboldo
You guys are way overthinking this.
He's in a funk. These things happen.
This is after a month of going supernova every night to the point of him returning to the discussion in being the best on his draft class.
I think it's fair questioning his ceiling (top 10? Top 15? Not even that?), but some posters speak as if he's marreese Speights or something.
Just relax.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 8:52 am
by ZOMG
I was bored so I went back and re-watched a bunch of Lauri's post-ups from the last few months.
He really is a very weird low post player. Not sure there's anyone else in the NBA with this kind of natural talent and size who's nevertheless totally confused about what he should be doing in there. Lauri lacks even the very basic post moves that everyone has in this League (back to the basket -> create contact for separation -> hard shoulder fake one way -> pivot to jump hook... with an up-and-under as a counter). Now, I'm sure he's able to do that stuff in practice, but a real NBA game is a completely different animal.
I mean... I see even skinny SG's scoring with moves like that all the time, with absolutely no hesitation. Lauri certainly has enough size, strength and athleticism to do it too.
You always hear a lot about Lauri being allowed/taught to play PG when he was young, despite his size. That's all well and good (we see the fruits of that experience in Point Lauri these days), but it seems someone completely failed to teach him routine low post stuff back then. That's just an incredible oversight. That fact that you CAN play all over the court as a 7 footer doesn't mean that you should totally abandon the one place that provides some of the most efficient shots in the game.
IMO the two most important things for an NBA post game are decisiveness and directness. Lauri lacks both currently. He often sets up in the low post, gets a pass (too far from the basket), slowly dribble fakes like he's going baseline but never does, turns back, gets pushed even further out, loses all separation and resorts to a fadeaway jumper to beat the shot clock. The trouble is that nobody is buying his fakes since his heart isn't in them - he's going through the motions. For once I'd just like to see him catch the ball and go right to an aggressive move like a jump hook or drop step, without that added crap.
Something to work on this offseason, definitely.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:10 am
by GrowingHorns
ZOMG wrote:I was bored so I went back and re-watched a bunch of Lauri's post-ups from the last few months.
He really is a very weird low post player. Not sure there's anyone else in the NBA with this kind of natural talent and size who's nevertheless totally confused about what he should be doing in there. Lauri lacks even the very basic post moves that everyone has in this League (back to the basket -> create contact for separation -> hard shoulder fake one way -> pivot to jump hook... with an up-and-under as a counter). Now, I'm sure he's able to do that stuff in practice, but a real NBA game is a completely different animal.
I mean... I see even skinny SG's scoring with moves like that all the time, with absolutely no hesitation. Lauri certainly has enough size, strength and athleticism to do it too.
You always hear a lot about Lauri being allowed/taught to play PG when he was young, despite his size. That's all well and good (we see the fruits of that experience in Point Lauri these days), but it seems someone completely failed to teach him routine low post stuff back then. That's just an incredible oversight. That fact that you CAN play all over the court as a 7 footer doesn't mean that you should totally abandon the one place that provides some of the most efficient shots in the game.
IMO the two most important things for an NBA post game are decisiveness and directness. Lauri lacks both currently. He often sets up in the low post, gets a pass (too far from the basket), slowly dribble fakes like he's going baseline but never does, turns back, gets pushed even further out, loses all separation and resorts to a fadeaway jumper to beat the shot clock. The trouble is that nobody is buying his fakes since his heart isn't in them - he's going through the motions. For once I'd just like to see him catch the ball and go right to an aggressive move like a jump hook or drop step, without that added crap.
Something to work on this offseason, definitely.
I was just yesterday thinking about he should hire a coach, find someone to mentor etc. He can easily be 20ppg type of guy, but adding this into mix, he'll score effortlessly more.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:00 am
by kulaz3000
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:35 pm
by ZOMG
Still thinking about this
amazing stat:
Since the ASB, distance traveled per game:
1. Paul George
2. Ingram
3. Lavine
4. Beal
5. Hield
6. McCollum
7. Josh Richardson
8. Nic Batum
9. Harrison Barnes
10. Lauri Markkanen
If the Bulls decide to shut Zach down, they should definitely consider inventing an injury for Lauri (shouldn't be hard, they have experience) and resting him as well. He's played a LOT of basketball in 2019.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:10 pm
by gardenofsound
ZOMG wrote:Still thinking about this
amazing stat:
Since the ASB, distance traveled per game:
1. Paul George
2. Ingram
3. Lavine
4. Beal
5. Hield
6. McCollum
7. Josh Richardson
8. Nic Batum
9. Harrison Barnes
10. Lauri Markkanen
If the Bulls decide to shut Zach down, they should definitely consider inventing an injury for Lauri (shouldn't be hard, they have experience) and resting him as well. He's played a LOT of basketball in 2019.
That's a one month sample. Yes, he's probably tired, and I think ramping his minutes down wouldn't be bad, but don't just shut him down. He's still young and game time is development time. Part of development is hitting a wall and figuring out how you'll get around/over it.
I so badly want to make wall jokes now. I'll take it to the Current Affairs forum.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:02 am
by RedBulls23
Griffin said Markkanen is going to a special player once he fully understands how the NBA game is being played.
“He’s unbelievably skilled. You can see that right away. That combined with his size makes him special. Once he really gets the physicality and the angles of the game down, he’s going to be trouble for a long time.”
https://clutchpoints.com/bulls-news-pistons-blake-griffin-believes-laurri-markkanen-is-going-to-be-trouble-for-a-long-time/
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:27 am
by AKfanatic
“Angles” I think is a huge part of it for Lauri. Once he slows down and finds those angles to get off shots, particularly in the post and in the midrange, I think his whole game will open up for him.
He really really needs to work on post/midpost patience and footwork. If he can slowly master that part of the court, he will be near unstoppable with his shooting touch and size.
Lauri needs to study some tape or Kevin McHale and Tim Duncan. There is so much that those two bigs did that he should really work on adding to his game. Hell, the midrange jab step to open up the drive or shot off the glass that Duncan mastered should be a staple of Lauri’s game. Once he works on that he can go from being the Finnisher, to being the Finnish Fundamental.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:45 am
by erlim
I believe Lauri has a soul-stealing big game and hardworking mindset and will be the talk of not just our town if he gets off to a healthy start next year. The biggest thing is he and Zach began to form a chemistry (whereas Dunn has not).
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:54 pm
by chitowndish
Axolotl wrote:Swuul wrote:Dieselbound&Down wrote:Question for the Fins reading this - What is a Finnish burrito, what would be in it?
Pulled oats, reindeer and lettuce? Just curious what we are talking about here.
The finnish equivalent would be "lihapiirakka"...
The thought of "lihapiirakka of skills" amuses me greatly
I really like this. I feel like we should change the thread title to Is Lauri Markannen a lihapiirakka of skills or a one reindeer saami herd? in honor of his heritage.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:04 pm
by sco
Lauri has looked Felicio-bad since the 4OT game. Are folks lining-up behind:
1) Lingering illness fatigue
2) Minor/unreported injuries
3) February was a Mirotic-esque unsustainable stretch
Of the 3, I guess I'm rooting for 1, because the other two are worse. That said, given the Zach treatment of late, I'm doubting that the Bulls would let Lauri play injured. Number 3 has a ring of truth to it because we've seen how quickly Lauri turns timid when his shot is off.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:30 pm
by Ice Man
sco wrote:Lauri has looked Felicio-bad since the 4OT game.
I was at the Philly game, and live you could see that he was getting pushed around by everybody, even Philly's guards. He would put a shoulder into Redick and J.J. wouldn't move. Now, Lauri isn't the most physical of 7 footers, which is common with young guys, but if he can't even move Redick ... there's something really wrong with him. Not that I have any idea what this is, but the guy's body is failing him right now.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:00 pm
by GrowingHorns
Ice Man wrote:sco wrote:Lauri has looked Felicio-bad since the 4OT game.
I was at the Philly game, and live you could see that he was getting pushed around by everybody, even Philly's guards. He would put a shoulder into Redick and J.J. wouldn't move. Now, Lauri isn't the most physical of 7 footers, which is common with young guys, but if he can't even move Redick ... there's something really wrong with him. Not that I have any idea what this is, but the guy's body is failing him right now.
I have been through body burn-out when I pushed myself being too tired; first I got the worst flu of my life and then my metabolism was bit ****d up for a while. It took months to regain my normal strengths... It was so horrible. I REALLY hope it isn't anything like that.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:31 pm
by madvillian
GrowingHorns wrote:Ice Man wrote:sco wrote:Lauri has looked Felicio-bad since the 4OT game.
I was at the Philly game, and live you could see that he was getting pushed around by everybody, even Philly's guards. He would put a shoulder into Redick and J.J. wouldn't move. Now, Lauri isn't the most physical of 7 footers, which is common with young guys, but if he can't even move Redick ... there's something really wrong with him. Not that I have any idea what this is, but the guy's body is failing him right now.
I have been through body burn-out when I pushed myself being too tired; first I got the worst flu of my life and then my metabolism was bit ****d up for a while. It took months to regain my normal strengths... It was so horrible. I REALLY hope it isn't anything like that.
sorry I just kinda chuckled, these are pro athletes they have access to health and nutrition and medicine us schmucks could only dream of.
This reminds me of Knicks fans lamenting KPs iron deficiency or whatever the **** it was.
Lauri need to spend his offseason training and relaxing with his wife, not playing for Finland. This is two years in a row (last year with the back) where the extra miles have caught up to him in the NBA grind.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:48 pm
by ralphisBullsFan
He's seen enough to know what he needs to work on in the off season. See if he has that Jimmy Butler, Zach LaVine will to become stronger and faster and improve on the skills what he's lacking.
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:46 pm
by Swuul
madvillian wrote:Lauri need to spend his offseason training and relaxing with his wife, not playing for Finland. This is two years in a row (last year with the back) where the extra miles have caught up to him in the NBA grind.
Now that Team Finland has been knocked out from WC, there are no matches for Team Finland next summer (except for the possible friendlies vs the teams going to the WC (like Team USA)).
Re: Is Lauri Markannen a burrito full of skills or a one trick pony?
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:48 pm
by sco
Swuul wrote:madvillian wrote:Lauri need to spend his offseason training and relaxing with his wife, not playing for Finland. This is two years in a row (last year with the back) where the extra miles have caught up to him in the NBA grind.
Now that Team Finland has been knocked out from WC, there are no matches for Team Finland next summer (except for the possible friendlies vs the teams going to the WC (like Team USA)).
Sorry Finns. That said, a summer off is better for our boy, IMO.