The simple move that would turn this thing around

[JimmyJammer]

While finding a real coach this offseason is something that will have to be considered, I think finding a PG is going to be a bigger deal in order to move this franchise forward. Dunn is obviously not the answer.

Our first order of business will be getting that guy in the draft or free-agency. The options should be simple. Go get a PG like Morant in the draft or sign Rondo in free-agency. Morant is dynamic, explosive and he is a great leader. He can be that galvanizing force that this team so desperately needs. And if we happen to like Barrett more than Morant, since we also need a sf, we might as well go ahead and try to sign Rondo on a one to two-year rental.

While signing a guy like Rondo is not the kind of blockbuster move you need in free-agency, it, however, has its own merit. If you want proof of that, go ask the Pelicans. Getting a savvy veteran PG like Rondo this offseason would really fit the bill on so many levels. He is vocal and very good with young players and you can always count on him to cover up the coaches' mistakes out there. Additionally, signing him would give us another year to evaluate Dunn as a backup or potential starter. Didn't LaVine say that the team needs a veteran whose voice can be respected in the locker room? Well, Rondo is just that, and beyond.

[coldfish]

I will catch a lot of grief forever for the Arci vs Dunn thread. Arci looks like he barely belongs in the NBA at times. He is overpowered on defense. On offense, he can't create for himself and has virtually no shot of making something inside the lane.

That said, his on off numbers continue to look better than Dunn. Just being a threat to shoot and knowing to get the right players the ball has significant value.

Arci isn't the answer, but neither is Dunn. I agree with the OP that a good PG would make the whole thing look a LOT better. Where I disagree is that whomever you get has to be a good 3p shooter. At least enough of a threat to keep people honest. The Bulls don't have enough talent to maximize a Rondo or a Morant.

[RSP83]

Would Dinwiddie be the better option over Dunn or Arci?

[JimmyJammer]

I will catch a lot of grief forever for the Arci vs Dunn thread. Arci looks like he barely belongs in the NBA at times. He is overpowered on defense. On offense, he can't create for himself and has virtually no shot of making something inside the lane.

That said, his on off numbers continue to look better than Dunn. Just being a threat to shoot and knowing to get the right players the ball has significant value.

Arci isn't the answer, but neither is Dunn. I agree with the OP that a good PG would make the whole thing look a LOT better. Where I disagree is that whomever you get has to be a good 3p shooter. At least enough of a threat to keep people honest. The Bulls don't have enough talent to maximize a Rondo or a Morant.

If a team cannot shoot, your best alternative is to play fast and score easy basket in transitions. We have the athletes and youth on our side, so why not? Both Rondo and Morant can provide you with that high-pace style of offense. They are both great playmakers in the halfcourt offense as well. Additionally, Rondo is the best at picking apart the opponent's playbook, an advantage that should not be ignored. Morant is this year's DeAron Fox, a dynamic young player with a reputation of not being a very good outside shooter. But, look at what Fox is doing now. Think about it this way, if you were to put LaVine with DeAron Fox on that Sacremento's explosive offense, it would be crazy.

[JimmyJammer]

Would Dinwiddie be the better option over Dunn or Arci?

Oh, you went there, huh!

[coldfish]

I will catch a lot of grief forever for the Arci vs Dunn thread. Arci looks like he barely belongs in the NBA at times. He is overpowered on defense. On offense, he can't create for himself and has virtually no shot of making something inside the lane.

That said, his on off numbers continue to look better than Dunn. Just being a threat to shoot and knowing to get the right players the ball has significant value.

Arci isn't the answer, but neither is Dunn. I agree with the OP that a good PG would make the whole thing look a LOT better. Where I disagree is that whomever you get has to be a good 3p shooter. At least enough of a threat to keep people honest. The Bulls don't have enough talent to maximize a Rondo or a Morant.

If a team cannot shoot, your best alternative is to play fast and score easy basket in transitions. We have the athletes and youth on our side, so why not? Both Rondo and Morant can provide you with that high-pace style of offense. They are both great playmakers in the halfcourt offense as well. Additionally, Rondo is the best at picking apart the opponent's playbook, an advantage that should not be ignored. Morant is this year's DeAron Fox, a dynamic young player with a reputation of not being a very good outside shooter. But, look at what Fox is doing now. Think about it this way, if you were to put LaVine with DeAron Fox on that Sacremento's explosive offense, it would be crazy.

The Bulls speed and athleticism is drastically overrated on this board. Last night, Lavine and Markannen had the ball on a break as a clear 2 on 1. Markannen got run down and Lavine's ensuing pass was deflected.

The only up tempo guy the Bulls have on the roster is Lavine and he isn't the best decision maker on the break either.

I think the issue is that the whole league is more athletic than it was 15+ years ago. What would have looked athletic two decades ago isn't really going to outrun anyone nowadays. That was one of Hoiberg's big issues here.

[contestedlayups]

I completely disagree with the premise that a change of a point guard will fix all that ails the Bulls. The Bulls back-stab each other to get to the top of the organization, from players to coaches to FO employees. It's how it has been for at least 10 years, if not longer. No single talented player will fix that. It may not start with ownership, but it certainly starts with GarPax. The Bulls clearly have talented players, but they will be nothing in this league together if the FO continues to talk crap about the players and coaches behind their backs. The trickle down effect has been real in Chicago for many years, and this is the real reason why this group of clearly talented individuals can't band together and win games.

[DASMACKDOWN]

I thought about it 2 games ago against Denver that the Bulls just dont have a glue piece to bring it all together.

When you think about Denver, they tried to be traditional and have Mudiay as pg. But when Jokic came along, they decided that the offense should run thru him and get complimentary pieces.

Harris and Murray are not PGs. But they dont need to be because they go thru Jokic. And it works beautifully.

Bulls dont have a glue person right now. Which is why individually Lavine or Lauri or Dunn or whomever can look good in a game where everyone else would look crappy.

The PG of the future is still at large in my opinion. There isnt anything critically wrong with Dunn. He is a good player. But what he lacks sort of stands out like a sore thumb on this team.

We need a PG or a Wing that can command the offense and get people involved. In the recent drafts, Luka would be amazing for us. Or even Trae Young would work.

[Ice Man]

In other words, Smack, we need a star. With a couple of exceptions all the best players in today's league are guys who command the ball and make plays. Position does not matter, they effectively are the points.

Those guys make teams, if you have one. Our guys are all just role players, even at their best.

[coldfish]

In other words, Smack, we need a star. With a couple of exceptions all the best players in today's league are guys who command the ball and make plays. Position does not matter, they effectively are the points.

Those guys make teams, if you have one. Our guys are all just role players, even at their best.

Agreed and its rather damning for several pieces of the "core".

Lauri has one of the lowest assist rates on the team. You certainly would never run an offense though him.

Lavine has close to a 1:1 A:TO ratio. He does at least pass the ball but he really doesn't create for others well and has a fair share of dumb passes.

[pylb]

Morant hasn't played a game in the league yet, and rookies are generally pretty bad NBA players. Add him to the Bulls right now and I don't think it would change a thing this season.

Rondo doesn't shoot and overpasses. He would be an upgrade because we wouldn't have to play Arci/Shaq/Blakeney nearly as much. But he wouldn't turn the ship around.

What we lack is overall talent. To turn the ship around we would need to add two all-star caliber players and a couple of bench rotation guys.

[RastaBull]

For the record ... I am NOT nor ever have been one to think Dunn is the "point guard of the future" for the Bulls. But I have always, and remain, optimistic about him a really solid NBA player. I think he can be a starting PG in this league and on a winning team ... if that team was organized around two other all-around stars.

Regardless, we need a star in the draft. I'm not sold on Lauri as an all-around star ... although I am still optimistic. Lavine is a star level scorer, but so much else in his game is lacking.

But we absolutely need a new coach that can take star-level talent (like Lauri and Lavine or whoever we draft) and turn them into star level players in reality. Coaching decision is absolutely the most important move this summer. We can draft Morant, we can draft Barret or Reddick ... we can draft whoever, but if we have middle-level or subpar coaching we are going to be questioing that draft pick the same way we still aren't sure what's up with Lauri; the same way the league and fans look at Lavine and wonder why he's so limited (because it's not his athleticism, shooting, so natural skill that's the problem!)

[I will say ... I see Williamson as a star no matter who his coach is haha ... but his flexability position wise and adapting to NBA team systems still puzzles me ... but yeah, he the real #1 pick no doubt]

Back to Dunn ... I know this coach will likely never leave for NBA, but I wonder if Jay Wright and Dunn would be as a sweet a pairing as I'd like to think. Dunn's never had a coach that can tap into the success he had in his NCAA system. He's not a PG to slow it down, and he's not a PG to play 7 seconds or less chuck-it up style either. Jay Wright imposes a structured system of defense, fast break, and ball movement with a lot of cutting. I think maybe we'd see Dunn evolve at another level and get to some of his untapped potential in that ... and cherry on top is the STRUCTURE of that system could unlock a solid partnership with Lavine too.

[Red8911]

If the front office actually decides that they want to win next season then there’s more than a simple move to make. First get lucky in the draft. Second sign a couple of good veteran players. Third get the best coach available, I don’t blame Boylen for this mess it’s not his fault and he’s ok but if there’s someone available that is proven then bulls need to make a change.

If they continue not caring about winning though then I guess they going to keep tanking with the hope that they get lucky one time for a star. This imo is a bad idea.

[kulaz3000]

As critical of Boylen as I am, and I want to reaffirm my stance that I want him gone, however, I don't blame him entirely for the train wreck. It's not uncommon for assistants to be promoted to the head coaching position, and have done well, but usually this change happens in the off season, because it allows the assistant to put his stamp during the off season and training camp.

That said, getting an upgrade at head coach would be a huge start, not only for wins and losses, but also for the growth and development of our players which is probably more crucial than immediate wins and losses at this stage.

I love Morant, and have been touting him for quite some time, however, he isn't going to turn this team around and make this team a playoff team right away, as he is a young player who still requires a lot of work. What would be immediate though, is that the pace of this team should pick up right from the get go and he will force the players to keep up with him, not because he is such a speed demon, but because he is such a willing passer not only to players in the paint for easy basket but also finds shooters with ease.

Whether Morant or any other guard, I want someone who will play with pace, has intelligence when it comes to finding players, ESPECIALLY when two of our 3 best players are big men, who need the ball provided to them, and our best scorer right now, who is most ideal as a catch and shoot player.

[ZOMG]

In other words, Smack, we need a star. With a couple of exceptions all the best players in today's league are guys who command the ball and make plays. Position does not matter, they effectively are the points.

Those guys make teams, if you have one. Our guys are all just role players, even at their best.

Agreed and its rather damning for several pieces of the "core".

Lauri has one of the lowest assist rates on the team. You certainly would never run an offense though him.

Lavine has close to a 1:1 A:TO ratio. He does at least pass the ball but he really doesn't create for others well and has a fair share of dumb passes.

That's just an unbelievably bad take. On this team, Lauri's assist ratio doesn't have anything to do with his passing ability. Boylen has clearly instructed him to score, score, score. He's an unselfish player who keeps taking bad shots because the coach has told him to be "more selfish".

Besides, who the hell is he gonna pass it to? This is a crappy, static ISO offense, and like everyone else, Lauri only sees teammates standing still when it's his turn to go 1-on-1.

The only players who get assists in the flow of the game are the ballhandlers, since occasionally we manage to score out of pick and pops.

Dunn sometimes has a lot of assists. Nobody in their right mind would call HIM a great playmaker or passer.

[holv03]

I would have to agree with you. We could try to make a trade for Dennis Smith Jr at the deadline. Another move is grab a wing in the draft maybe Barrett or Reddish.

[ZOMG]

I would have to agree with you. We could try to make a trade for Dennis Smith Jr at the deadline. Another move is grab a wing in the draft maybe Barrett or Reddish.

DSJ is no starting NBA point guard in the same way Dunn is no starting NBA point guard.

[kulaz3000]

I would have to agree with you. We could try to make a trade for Dennis Smith Jr at the deadline. Another move is grab a wing in the draft maybe Barrett or Reddish.

DSJ is no starting NBA point guard in the same way Dunn is no starting NBA point guard.

Sure, at this point no - it would be a parallel move. However, DSJ is several years younger, and would have 2 additional years remaining on his rookie contract to see whether he could turn it around within that time.

I've never been a huge fan of DSJ, but if we were to be able to trade for him at a reasonable cost, I'd be all for adding him to the team to see whether he can grown and develop with this team.

[ZOMG]

I would have to agree with you. We could try to make a trade for Dennis Smith Jr at the deadline. Another move is grab a wing in the draft maybe Barrett or Reddish.

DSJ is no starting NBA point guard in the same way Dunn is no starting NBA point guard.

Sure, at this point no - it would be a parallel move. However, DSJ is several years younger, and would have 2 additional years remaining on his rookie contract to see whether he could turn it around within that time.

I've never been a huge fan of DSJ, but if we were to be able to trade for him at a reasonable cost, I'd be all for adding him to the team to see whether he can grown and develop with this team.

Meh. He's another guy who can only play as a high usage combo guard. Would be a horrible fit with Zach unless LaVine were moved to the 2nd unit, which is not gonna happen due to optics.

[coldfish]

In other words, Smack, we need a star. With a couple of exceptions all the best players in today's league are guys who command the ball and make plays. Position does not matter, they effectively are the points.

Those guys make teams, if you have one. Our guys are all just role players, even at their best.

Agreed and its rather damning for several pieces of the "core".

Lauri has one of the lowest assist rates on the team. You certainly would never run an offense though him.

Lavine has close to a 1:1 A:TO ratio. He does at least pass the ball but he really doesn't create for others well and has a fair share of dumb passes.

That's just an unbelievably bad take. On this team, Lauri's assist ratio doesn't have anything to do with his passing ability. Boylen has clearly instructed him to score, score, score. He's an unselfish player who keeps taking bad shots because the coach has told him to be "more selfish".

Besides, who the hell is he gonna pass it to? This is a crappy, static ISO offense, and like everyone else, Lauri only sees teammates standing still when it's his turn to go 1-on-1.

The only players who get assists in the flow of the game are the ballhandlers, since occasionally we manage to score out of pick and pops.

Dunn sometimes has a lot of assists. Nobody in their right mind would call HIM a great playmaker or passer.

Lauri had a pass last night where he threw a pass right through traffic and was picked off last night. Lauri had a 6.4% assist rate last year, which is similarly awful. Dirk had the role that you think Lauri has and he was routinely in the mid teens for assist rate (which isn't great).

I think you are just making an excuse for Lauri. There is no evidence that he is a good playmaker.

I do agree that the offense sucks. Its not a motion offense. That said, the impact of that isn't as great as people make it out to be. Lauri has complete freedom to drive and kick and he never does.