OT: Joakim Noah's Quiet Career Comeback

[dumbell78]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

[madvillian]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

I don't see Noah as a mentor type. The only thing I see here is a bunch of nostalgia.

[Dan Z]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

I don't see Noah as a mentor type. The only thing I see here is a bunch of nostalgia.

Why not? He's always been supportive of his teammates. I can see the concern being that he'll get lazy and lose focus, but as someone pointed out earlier....Noah is looking to end his career on his terms. I bet he'll be locked in at least for another year or two.

[madvillian]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

I don't see Noah as a mentor type. The only thing I see here is a bunch of nostalgia.

Why not? He's always been supportive of his teammates. I can see the concern being that he'll get lazy and lose focus, but as someone pointed out earlier....Noah is looking to end his career on his terms. I bet he'll be locked in at least for another year or two.

I think Noah is the type of guy that wants to prove something to himself for a short time and then really DGAF. I am the same type myself. I think he wanted to prove he's still a legit NBA player and he's done that. I wouldn't expect him to be "tuned in" anymore. He'll go right back to his hard partying offseason this summer and come into camp out of shape. He's never been an off court leader he's always been a guy that lead by his play on court. I don't expect age to turn him into a guy that might steer a youthful player's career away from any temptation, the opposite really.

I don't want Noah anywhere near the young guys on this team.

[Dan Z]

I don't see Noah as a mentor type. The only thing I see here is a bunch of nostalgia.

Why not? He's always been supportive of his teammates. I can see the concern being that he'll get lazy and lose focus, but as someone pointed out earlier....Noah is looking to end his career on his terms. I bet he'll be locked in at least for another year or two.

I think Noah is the type of guy that wants to prove something to himself for a short time and then really DGAF. I am the same type myself. I think he wanted to prove he's still a legit NBA player and he's done that. I wouldn't expect him to be "tuned in" anymore. He'll go right back to his hard partying offseason this summer and come into camp out of shape. He's never been an off court leader he's always been a guy that lead by his play on court. I don't expect age to turn him into a guy that might steer a youthful player's career away from any temptation, the opposite really.

I don't want Noah anywhere near the young guys on this team.

Okay. Fair enough. I don't agree, but only time will tell.

[dumbell78]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

I don't see Noah as a mentor type. The only thing I see here is a bunch of nostalgia.

Not really nostalgia from my POV. Outside of Jimmy I dont ever recall a teammate not respecting or not loving Jo. Almost everyone that goes to NY end up being part of a $hit show, Im not putting much stock into that. Its the NYK after all.

I remember Jo playing like how he's playing now, all heart and leaving it out all there. WCJ can learn from him. I rather a former DPOY with all the heart in the world mentoring WCJ. He certainly can learn so much more from Jo as opposed to ROLO. Thats not a knock on ROLO but Jo can have more impact with what he has done.

We can disagree though and thats cool.

[TheStig]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

Why? Does WCJ need help rolling a blunt or growing out his hair?

Noah is not the professional I'd want mentoring out bigs.

[NecessaryEvil]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

Why? Does WCJ need help rolling a blunt or growing out his hair?

Noah is not the professional I'd want mentoring out bigs.

[Grodoboldo]

I love Noah, I really do. But the only role I could see him filling right now is as a locker room leader. So I'd rather bring someone who can backup both front court positions and may teach some post moves to WCJ.
You know who fits that bill, is also a plus locker room presence with ties to the Bulls and is a free agent this summer?
Taj Gibson.

So yeah, Joakim Noah may be one of my top 5 favorite Bulls player ever, but I'd rather bring Taj back next season.

[dougthonus]

I tend to update my impression of a player based on what they do post Bulls. So him essentially stealing money from another team and its fans rubs me the wrong way.

If an ex Bull you liked got into trouble off the court, would you still root for him because that doesn't matter? I see what Jo did as a character flaw, not just him not playing wrong so I see it equivalently.

I don't see what Jo did as a character flaw, at least not to the level you do. We saw him falling apart here before NY signed him to that ridiculous contract. They also gave up on him and didn't work to try to make the situation better.

I would agree he probably didn't do the absolute best possible and could have been better.

[jnrjr79]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

Why? Does WCJ need help rolling a blunt or growing out his hair?

Noah is not the professional I'd want mentoring out bigs.

Ah, yes. Jo Noah's suspected recreational weed use makes him a huge outlier in the NBA, and long hair is for...something something. These are definitely cogent arguments about his mentoring abilities.

[jnrjr79]

I tend to update my impression of a player based on what they do post Bulls. So him essentially stealing money from another team and its fans rubs me the wrong way.

If an ex Bull you liked got into trouble off the court, would you still root for him because that doesn't matter? I see what Jo did as a character flaw, not just him not playing wrong so I see it equivalently.

I don't see what Jo did as a character flaw, at least not to the level you do. We saw him falling apart here before NY signed him to that ridiculous contract. They also gave up on him and didn't work to try to make the situation better.

I would agree he probably didn't do the absolute best possible and could have been better.

It's funny seeing Jo crucified for admitting he enjoyed the NY nightlife too much. If he hadn't been honest about it, then everyone would have simply written off his decline to resulting exclusively from injury. I don't think any of us really knows how effective he would have been if he was in bed at 10:00 every night given his injury struggles were very real separate and apart from his social life.

In any event, Noah is older and more mature now, obviously. Regardless of how he got there, he had to bust his butt to get back into the league and he has capitalized on his opportunity. I would think a guy who has learned from less responsible younger days is a pretty ideal mentor for younger players - he knows what to be on the lookout for and how bad habits can slow you down.

In any event, if we're going to have a nostalgic reunion with a former big, I prefer Taj for the normal reasons - a little more left in the tank and can play the 4 as well as the 5. But if Taj doesn't want to come back, Noah on a vet minimum contract is a perfectly decent option if he doesn't want to go ring chasing.

[Dieselbound&Down]

I don't see Noah as a mentor type. The only thing I see here is a bunch of nostalgia.

Why not? He's always been supportive of his teammates. I can see the concern being that he'll get lazy and lose focus, but as someone pointed out earlier....Noah is looking to end his career on his terms. I bet he'll be locked in at least for another year or two.

I think Noah is the type of guy that wants to prove something to himself for a short time and then really DGAF. I am the same type myself. I think he wanted to prove he's still a legit NBA player and he's done that. I wouldn't expect him to be "tuned in" anymore. He'll go right back to his hard partying offseason this summer and come into camp out of shape. He's never been an off court leader he's always been a guy that lead by his play on court. I don't expect age to turn him into a guy that might steer a youthful player's career away from any temptation, the opposite really.

I don't want Noah anywhere near the young guys on this team.

Agree/disagree with this. I don't think Noah will be a big negative to WCJ but you're right that he's never been an offseason warrior. He has a long history of not being in shape for the first several months and I think his lack of focus on conditioning caused some of his issues. I also think he's just a large man and Thibs played him insane minutes for several years. I never thought he could physically recover and letting him go to the Knicks was absolutely the right move.

I think it's amazing Noah is back to where he is. He plays with his heart and has some many plus skills that are unique to someone his size (paired with some very bad holes in his game). He's a great player to watch when he is moving well, moving the ball and dialed in.

I'm rooting for him but am ambivalent whether he comes back to the Bulls. For the right price and contract length, business decisions, that would be great. But neither side owes it to the other to have a "last hurrah" victory lap for nostalgia.

[TheStig]

Modest two year deal to mentor WCJ is not a bad idea, especially if ROLO walks this summer.

Why? Does WCJ need help rolling a blunt or growing out his hair?

Noah is not the professional I'd want mentoring out bigs.

Ah, yes. Jo Noah's suspected recreational weed use makes him a huge outlier in the NBA, and long hair is for...something something. These are definitely cogent arguments about his mentoring abilities.

What about Jo do you think makes him a good mentor? Do you think we need someone to be lazy and call people Hollywood? I don't see Jo as some sort of great pro or role model.

Now if you wanted to bring someone back to the Bulls, I think Taj would be a great role model for our bigs and a great third big.

I think we need to avoid the Rose and Noah's of the world.

[jnrjr79]

Why? Does WCJ need help rolling a blunt or growing out his hair?

Noah is not the professional I'd want mentoring out bigs.

Ah, yes. Jo Noah's suspected recreational weed use makes him a huge outlier in the NBA, and long hair is for...something something. These are definitely cogent arguments about his mentoring abilities.

What about Jo do you think makes him a good mentor? Do you think we need someone to be lazy and call people Hollywood? I don't see Jo as some sort of great pro or role model.

Now if you wanted to bring someone back to the Bulls, I think Taj would be a great role model for our bigs and a great third big.

I think we need to avoid the Rose and Noah's of the world.

I don't know whether Noah is a great mentor. My point was that his haircut or rumored affinity for recreational pot are not remotely valid reasons to believe he would not be a good mentor. Presumably the Bulls' front office and coaching staff would have a good idea about Noah's abilities in that department.

The only thing I'm aware of that suggests that Noah would be a poor mentor is that he was often not in great shape entering camp. That seems to be over given his extensive training and rehab connected to his NBA comeback, though obviously he could fall back into bad habits. Otherwise, Noah seemed to be a beloved teammate and would give the Bulls an element of on-court toughness that they are going to lose with RoLo.

I'm with you that Taj is a preferable option; I just find Noah to be an acceptable one. I would also pass on Derrick Rose for a host of reasons, but aside from any of the baggage, I don't think Rose's style of play is what would best complement Lauri and Zach.

[TheStig]

Ah, yes. Jo Noah's suspected recreational weed use makes him a huge outlier in the NBA, and long hair is for...something something. These are definitely cogent arguments about his mentoring abilities.

What about Jo do you think makes him a good mentor? Do you think we need someone to be lazy and call people Hollywood? I don't see Jo as some sort of great pro or role model.

Now if you wanted to bring someone back to the Bulls, I think Taj would be a great role model for our bigs and a great third big.

I think we need to avoid the Rose and Noah's of the world.

I don't know whether Noah is a great mentor. My point was that his haircut or rumored affinity for recreational pot are not remotely valid reasons to believe he would not be a good mentor. Presumably the Bulls' front office and coaching staff would have a good idea about Noah's abilities in that department.

The only thing I'm aware of that suggests that Noah would be a poor mentor is that he was often not in great shape entering camp. That seems to be over given his extensive training and rehab connected to his NBA comeback, though obviously he could fall back into bad habits. Otherwise, Noah seemed to be a beloved teammate and would give the Bulls an element of on-court toughness that they are going to lose with RoLo.

I'm with you that Taj is a preferable option; I just find Noah to be an acceptable one. I would also pass on Derrick Rose for a host of reasons, but aside from any of the baggage, I don't think Rose's style of play is what would best complement Lauri and Zach.

I wouldn't want Noah or Rose back. Not sure why you think he's a great mentor and if they thought he was worth bringing him back, they could have signed him this year for the minimum.

If I were looking for good vet bulls, I'd look at Taj and Deng.

[jnrjr79]

What about Jo do you think makes him a good mentor? Do you think we need someone to be lazy and call people Hollywood? I don't see Jo as some sort of great pro or role model.

Now if you wanted to bring someone back to the Bulls, I think Taj would be a great role model for our bigs and a great third big.

I think we need to avoid the Rose and Noah's of the world.

I don't know whether Noah is a great mentor. My point was that his haircut or rumored affinity for recreational pot are not remotely valid reasons to believe he would not be a good mentor. Presumably the Bulls' front office and coaching staff would have a good idea about Noah's abilities in that department.

The only thing I'm aware of that suggests that Noah would be a poor mentor is that he was often not in great shape entering camp. That seems to be over given his extensive training and rehab connected to his NBA comeback, though obviously he could fall back into bad habits. Otherwise, Noah seemed to be a beloved teammate and would give the Bulls an element of on-court toughness that they are going to lose with RoLo.

I'm with you that Taj is a preferable option; I just find Noah to be an acceptable one. I would also pass on Derrick Rose for a host of reasons, but aside from any of the baggage, I don't think Rose's style of play is what would best complement Lauri and Zach.

I wouldn't want Noah or Rose back. Not sure why you think he's a great mentor and if they thought he was worth bringing him back, they could have signed him this year for the minimum.

If I were looking for good vet bulls, I'd look at Taj and Deng.

Literally nowhere have I said I think he's a "great mentor." I simply noted that the argument that his haircut or affinity for weed mean that he's not is an obviously silly, non-serious position.

I don't know whether he's a good mentor, but I suspect the Bulls do know one way or the other. I'm not sure why you think their decision not to sign him this year suggests they don't think he's a good locker room presence, when (1) Noah appeared to be physically done and (2) the Bulls already had 3 centers under contract.

The Noah thing only makes sense next year assuming RoLo is not around. It wouldn't have made sense this year.

[TheStig]

I don't know whether Noah is a great mentor. My point was that his haircut or rumored affinity for recreational pot are not remotely valid reasons to believe he would not be a good mentor. Presumably the Bulls' front office and coaching staff would have a good idea about Noah's abilities in that department.

The only thing I'm aware of that suggests that Noah would be a poor mentor is that he was often not in great shape entering camp. That seems to be over given his extensive training and rehab connected to his NBA comeback, though obviously he could fall back into bad habits. Otherwise, Noah seemed to be a beloved teammate and would give the Bulls an element of on-court toughness that they are going to lose with RoLo.

I'm with you that Taj is a preferable option; I just find Noah to be an acceptable one. I would also pass on Derrick Rose for a host of reasons, but aside from any of the baggage, I don't think Rose's style of play is what would best complement Lauri and Zach.

I wouldn't want Noah or Rose back. Not sure why you think he's a great mentor and if they thought he was worth bringing him back, they could have signed him this year for the minimum.

If I were looking for good vet bulls, I'd look at Taj and Deng.

Literally nowhere have I said I think he's a "great mentor." I simply noted that the argument that his haircut or affinity for weed mean that he's not is an obviously silly, non-serious position.

I don't know whether he's a good mentor, but I suspect the Bulls do know one way or the other. I'm not sure why you think their decision not to sign him this year suggests they don't think he's a good locker room presence, when (1) Noah appeared to be physically done and (2) the Bulls already had 3 centers under contract.

The Noah thing only makes sense next year assuming RoLo is not around. It wouldn't have made sense this year.

Clearly it was a joke. But Noah is not a hard worker or some great mentor or leader. So I don't see why we'd be bringing him in.

Actually that would have been the great time to bring him in as a leader if he were so. He would have come for the minimum and wouldn't be expecting a lot of playing time. It's not like he went to Memphis expecting a lot of playing time playing behind Gasol and Jackson. Even with his breakout, he's only getting 16mpg.

[jnrjr79]

I wouldn't want Noah or Rose back. Not sure why you think he's a great mentor and if they thought he was worth bringing him back, they could have signed him this year for the minimum.

If I were looking for good vet bulls, I'd look at Taj and Deng.

Literally nowhere have I said I think he's a "great mentor." I simply noted that the argument that his haircut or affinity for weed mean that he's not is an obviously silly, non-serious position.

I don't know whether he's a good mentor, but I suspect the Bulls do know one way or the other. I'm not sure why you think their decision not to sign him this year suggests they don't think he's a good locker room presence, when (1) Noah appeared to be physically done and (2) the Bulls already had 3 centers under contract.

The Noah thing only makes sense next year assuming RoLo is not around. It wouldn't have made sense this year.

Clearly it was a joke. But Noah is not a hard worker or some great mentor or leader. So I don't see why we'd be bringing him in.

Actually that would have been the great time to bring him in as a leader if he were so. He would have come for the minimum and wouldn't be expecting a lot of playing time. It's not like he went to Memphis expecting a lot of playing time playing behind Gasol and Jackson. Even with his breakout, he's only getting 16mpg.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, obviously, and as I said, I'd rather bring Taj back than Noah if the team is going that route. But I don't understand what your factual basis for the bolded part is. Are there reported instances of Noah being a bad influence in the locker room? Is there any basis for the "not a hard worker" belief beyond conditioning issues when reporting to training camp earlier in his career? Noah is a guy who transformed his spindly body and obviously busted his ass in connection with his recent comeback attempt. While the past conditioning issues are certainly a knock, that doesn't seem like enough to write him off as "not a hard worker," given that at a minimum we know he was serious about strength training in the offseason.

Anyway, I'm defending this more strongly than I feel, but the whole "bad mentor" thing just seems totally made up. I don't know one way or the other, and it seems weird that somebody would believe there's enough public information to reach that conclusion.

[TheStig]

Literally nowhere have I said I think he's a "great mentor." I simply noted that the argument that his haircut or affinity for weed mean that he's not is an obviously silly, non-serious position.

I don't know whether he's a good mentor, but I suspect the Bulls do know one way or the other. I'm not sure why you think their decision not to sign him this year suggests they don't think he's a good locker room presence, when (1) Noah appeared to be physically done and (2) the Bulls already had 3 centers under contract.

The Noah thing only makes sense next year assuming RoLo is not around. It wouldn't have made sense this year.

Clearly it was a joke. But Noah is not a hard worker or some great mentor or leader. So I don't see why we'd be bringing him in.

Actually that would have been the great time to bring him in as a leader if he were so. He would have come for the minimum and wouldn't be expecting a lot of playing time. It's not like he went to Memphis expecting a lot of playing time playing behind Gasol and Jackson. Even with his breakout, he's only getting 16mpg.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, obviously, and as I said, I'd rather bring Taj back than Noah if the team is going that route. But I don't understand what your factual basis for the bolded part is. Are there reported instances of Noah being a bad influence in the locker room? Is there any basis for the "not a hard worker" belief beyond conditioning issues when reporting to training camp earlier in his career? Noah is a guy who transformed his spindly body and obviously busted his ass in connection with his recent comeback attempt. While the past conditioning issues are certainly a knock, that doesn't seem like enough to write him off as "not a hard worker," given that at a minimum we know he was serious about strength training in the offseason.

Anyway, I'm defending this more strongly than I feel, but the whole "bad mentor" thing just seems totally made up. I don't know one way or the other, and it seems weird that somebody would believe there's enough public information to reach that conclusion.

In terms of a role model, he was always out of shape to start the year and basically disappeared once he got the knicks money. Not to mention going on a profanity laced tirade against the coaching staff and getting suspended. He also never added to his game. Never added post moves or a jumper. And when the tide was changing with Jimmy being the star he refused to really transition over.

I think there are plenty of better options. It's not to take away from Noah's few good years here. He was very good. But there are elite players who never became good mentors.