I am curious, who's going to guard the Drummond, Embid and Cousins of the world?

[Michael Jackson]

That's my only concern with WCJ. He has All-Defense potential, but dude looks like a 4 out there

How does he? Because he plays like a center. Unless you're talking about his height and general size.

Yeah he reminds me of a lesser Hakeem. Not really in game, I doubt he will ever have the footwork Olajuwon had which was amazing but he has a certain fluidity about him that reminds me. Def not the bruiser that a Steven Adams is but he is a fine center.

[TheSuzerain]

We forget what Wendell was doing because it was so long ago.

I can't be assed (because I've forgotten how to do it) posting an image of his game log, but under Hoiberg, Wendell had a stretch of games that were damn impressive. Have a look at the game log. Under Boylen, who totally misused Carter, he didn't have a massive game like he did on several occasions under Hoiberg.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/cartewe01/gamelog/2019/

Game 6-16, he was putting up double figure scoring numbers, grabbing rebounds, doing everything on the floor. And he was doing that while playing in some pretty horrible lineups with no support defensively as a 19-year-old.

I know I keep harping on about it and it's probably nauseating at this point but I'm not sure I've believed in a Bulls prospect this much since Rose. Even before Rose, going back to the Baby Bulls days, more so than Kirk, Lu and BG, I'm higher on Carter than I was those guys.

I hope I'm not wrong here, but I think the Bulls have themselves a special talent. Maybe not one who's good enough to be a focal point of a franchise, but certainly one who should spend the next 10+ years of his career being one of the smartest and complete players in the league.

I think within a couple of years we will have the best front court in the NBA. And if not the absolute best, one so close to the best that it will be a near wash. I’ve said this many times, but I consider Lauri and WCJ to be about as perfect a pairing as you are going to get in the “modern” NBA (which admittedly I consider an over-stated concept).

I am a huge believer in Lauri and WCJ. I’m higher on Lavine than the board’s generally negative view of him, but I still have some big questions. I’m high on OPJ but realize he may not be a long term player here. And I’m not sold on anything else even a tiny bit. So lots must be shown for me to believe in the expanded core.

But I’m absolutely sold on our front court. It’s a miracle return on back to back 7th picks.

wow, I find that view to be incredibly optimistic. If by a couple of years you mean 3...Giannis will be 27 with a 30 year old Middleton, Jokic will be 26 with a 31 year old Will Barton and 27 year old Jerami Grant, Karl Anthony Towns will be 26 with a 26 year old Wiggins, Embiid will be 27 with a 29 year old Harris, New Orleans will have a 22 year old Zion with a 31 year old Favors and a 24 year old Brandon Ingram, and Kawhi will be 30 with a 31 year old Paul George. Anthony Davis at 28 and Lebron at 37 might still be plugging away.

I'm high on Lauri and MCJ also, but I don't think our front court will be as good as these teams listed above. If you mean more than 5 years it could be whatever teams win the lottery the upcoming years, or the Pelicans/Thunder with all the draft picks they have.

I guess Lauri and MCJ could suprise me, but there's a lot of superstar talent in frontcourts right now.

Yeah it's way off. Any team with one of the superstar bigs (Embiid, Jokic, AD, Giannis and then maybe Gobert/Towns) will be better off.

And I don't really think Lauri can be considered an ideal 4 in the modern NBA. Too vulnerable on D without plus ball skills.

[Ugly Duckling]

That's my only concern with WCJ. He has All-Defense potential, but dude looks like a 4 out there

How does he? Because he plays like a center. Unless you're talking about his height and general size.

Yeah size wise

[kingkirk]

I think within a couple of years we will have the best front court in the NBA. And if not the absolute best, one so close to the best that it will be a near wash. I’ve said this many times, but I consider Lauri and WCJ to be about as perfect a pairing as you are going to get in the “modern” NBA (which admittedly I consider an over-stated concept).

I am a huge believer in Lauri and WCJ. I’m higher on Lavine than the board’s generally negative view of him, but I still have some big questions. I’m high on OPJ but realize he may not be a long term player here. And I’m not sold on anything else even a tiny bit. So lots must be shown for me to believe in the expanded core.

But I’m absolutely sold on our front court. It’s a miracle return on back to back 7th picks.

wow, I find that view to be incredibly optimistic. If by a couple of years you mean 3...Giannis will be 27 with a 30 year old Middleton, Jokic will be 26 with a 31 year old Will Barton and 27 year old Jerami Grant, Karl Anthony Towns will be 26 with a 26 year old Wiggins, Embiid will be 27 with a 29 year old Harris, New Orleans will have a 22 year old Zion with a 31 year old Favors and a 24 year old Brandon Ingram, and Kawhi will be 30 with a 31 year old Paul George. Anthony Davis at 28 and Lebron at 37 might still be plugging away.

I'm high on Lauri and MCJ also, but I don't think our front court will be as good as these teams listed above. If you mean more than 5 years it could be whatever teams win the lottery the upcoming years, or the Pelicans/Thunder with all the draft picks they have.

I guess Lauri and MCJ could suprise me, but there's a lot of superstar talent in frontcourts right now.

Duck was referring to a 4-5 combination. Half the guys you mentioned are wings. Andrew Wiggins has no bearing on the Markkanen and Carter combination -- and even if he did, he's bad.

[Indomitable]

I think within a couple of years we will have the best front court in the NBA. And if not the absolute best, one so close to the best that it will be a near wash. I’ve said this many times, but I consider Lauri and WCJ to be about as perfect a pairing as you are going to get in the “modern” NBA (which admittedly I consider an over-stated concept).

I am a huge believer in Lauri and WCJ. I’m higher on Lavine than the board’s generally negative view of him, but I still have some big questions. I’m high on OPJ but realize he may not be a long term player here. And I’m not sold on anything else even a tiny bit. So lots must be shown for me to believe in the expanded core.

But I’m absolutely sold on our front court. It’s a miracle return on back to back 7th picks.

wow, I find that view to be incredibly optimistic. If by a couple of years you mean 3...Giannis will be 27 with a 30 year old Middleton, Jokic will be 26 with a 31 year old Will Barton and 27 year old Jerami Grant, Karl Anthony Towns will be 26 with a 26 year old Wiggins, Embiid will be 27 with a 29 year old Harris, New Orleans will have a 22 year old Zion with a 31 year old Favors and a 24 year old Brandon Ingram, and Kawhi will be 30 with a 31 year old Paul George. Anthony Davis at 28 and Lebron at 37 might still be plugging away.

I'm high on Lauri and MCJ also, but I don't think our front court will be as good as these teams listed above. If you mean more than 5 years it could be whatever teams win the lottery the upcoming years, or the Pelicans/Thunder with all the draft picks they have.

I guess Lauri and MCJ could suprise me, but there's a lot of superstar talent in frontcourts right now.

Duck was referring to a 4-5 combination. Half the guys you mentioned are wings. Andrew Wiggins has no bearing on the Markkanen and Carter combination -- and even if he did, he's bad.

People are just prone to being negative.

[ArtMorte]

While I think it's a fair point to make that we don't have the most physical centers, I'm not really worried. Low-post wrestling matches are rare in today's NBA and even a guy like Embiid likes to play away from the basket a lot. Also, Wendell and Lauri make up in mobility what they lose in weight and strength against some of the centers.

[BullsRBest]

I think the buffet table is going to be guarding Boogie the rest of his career. He's finished unless he slims down to 5% body fat and I doubt he is that committed.

As for the rest of those guys, it's a half dozen games a year give or take. WCJR is as able to guard those guys as well as anybody not named Embiid or Davis or Gobert really.

Bulls have much bigger concerns.

Sad but true Boogie will have a very hard time coming back from his torn Achilles & now torn acl...early retirement seems more likely without a crazy amount of rehab, conditioning, damage control from keep happening.
Others before him have come back from catastrophic injuries and have gotten paid huge...other positions/skill levels than him on the court but both of his injured former GS teammates in Durant (Achilles tear) & Thompson (acl tear) got paid huge both suffering the same injuries he has sustained.

[BullsRBest]

Cristiano Felicio, come on down!

Better to use Felicio/Shrek and his $8M/year salary as a enforcer to use your team/personal fouls to at least slow down a dynamic scorer big man than just sitting on his butt being a cheerleader on the bench!

Pretty much impossible trading him without taking on a equally bad or worse dead weight contract!

[BullsRBest]

I just took a trip down WCJ memory lane with a bunch of youtube clips and a few things stand out.

First, he looks like a puppy out there. Like a huge, one year old St. Bernard/rottweiler mix. He doesn't even look really big yet, but he weighed in at over 250 at the combine and that was after losing weight.

Secondly, he has a fluidity and coordination that is rare for someone his size. IMO, he is so smooth you get tricked into underestimating his athleticism if that makes any sense.

Finally, his skill set and IQ for a 19 year old center with elite defensive potential is off the charts imo.

I'm not basing this off watching some Youtube highlights, but it just reminded me how special I think he can be.

Looking forward to seeing our team this year and hopefully we stay healthy and the young kids take the next steps in their careers reaching higher levels and are taught well by our vet on court teachers (Otto/Tomas/Thad) & coaching staff!

[drosereturn]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

[drosereturn]

Continuing my post, the FO needs to make a serious decision in several yrs. Do they keep the current core of Lavine Lauri WCJ or trade them all for top 5 picks which might land another Doncic or even Young?

Ceiling wise, Poor mans Dirk and Horford arent too shabby but its clear they dont have any superstar ceiling and are very injury prone. Even the great KP was gotten for peanuts recently.
Even though Bulls have right veterans this time in Porter and Young, I am not sure whether the core deserves them. Dallas Memphis already has a much brighter core and they didnt tank as hard.

[transplant]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

Hard disagree.
Markkanen was never considered a center despite his height. Carter is their center. He can defend the position and be useful in the modern NBA where centers can do more than post up.

[Dez]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

Did you actually watch Carter against Drummond? Carter at 19 years of age was able to put up 28 points, 7 boards, 1 assist and 3 blocks.

He'll have no issues as he gets older with players like Drummond.

Also you're vastly overrating Mitch Robinson just like Knicks fans.

[Indomitable]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

Did you actually watch Carter against Drummond? Carter at 19 years of age was able to put up 28 points, 7 boards, 1 assist and 3 blocks.

He'll have no issues as he gets older with players like Drummond.

Also you're vastly overrating Mitch Robinson just like Knicks fans.

There is no logic and all hype. I miss him being on the GB.

[musiqsoulchild]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

Bulls are paying the least amount at the C position compared to every other slot. Dont understand the premise of your point.

[Mbrahv0528]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

Bulls are paying the least amount at the C position compared to every other slot. Dont understand the premise of your point.

There wasn't one, it was just a nonsensical **** on the Bulls post.

Sent from my SM-G975U using RealGM mobile app

[WookieOnRitalin]

None of this matters since Shaq was the last big center to win a NBA title back with Wade in '06.

Consider, for a moment, 15 years of how the game has moved away from these types of players because they cannot bring organizations titles.

Dwight was the last one to come close.

So, isn't it irrelevant to pose this question considering that if your team is built around these players, then it will likely fail to deliver later on? I think you focus on helping neutralize the other 4 teammates instead of worrying about these types of big men. Defending them is not that critical anymore. You turn them into a liability on the defensive end by either pulling them away from the basket with a 3 point shooter if they choose to stay inside or you pull them away from the basket to create more offensive rebounding opportunities.

[NZB2323]

wow, I find that view to be incredibly optimistic. If by a couple of years you mean 3...Giannis will be 27 with a 30 year old Middleton, Jokic will be 26 with a 31 year old Will Barton and 27 year old Jerami Grant, Karl Anthony Towns will be 26 with a 26 year old Wiggins, Embiid will be 27 with a 29 year old Harris, New Orleans will have a 22 year old Zion with a 31 year old Favors and a 24 year old Brandon Ingram, and Kawhi will be 30 with a 31 year old Paul George. Anthony Davis at 28 and Lebron at 37 might still be plugging away.

I'm high on Lauri and MCJ also, but I don't think our front court will be as good as these teams listed above. If you mean more than 5 years it could be whatever teams win the lottery the upcoming years, or the Pelicans/Thunder with all the draft picks they have.

I guess Lauri and MCJ could suprise me, but there's a lot of superstar talent in frontcourts right now.

Duck was referring to a 4-5 combination. Half the guys you mentioned are wings. Andrew Wiggins has no bearing on the Markkanen and Carter combination -- and even if he did, he's bad.

People are just prone to being negative.

Duck specifically mentioned OPJ when talking about our front court, the front court involves the small forward, and we’re seeing a trend more and more with small forwards playing power forward.

And really? I’m being negative by saying I think it’s optimistic to think we’ll have the best frontcourt in the NBA in a couple of years with Giannis, Embiid, KAT, Jokic, AD, and Zion in the league?

[sco]

The problem with Bulls is that they invested heavily in Center position which is regarded as least important in modern era and consumed 2 prime draft assets but with no outcome at all. (Carter, Lauri to some degree but they still cannot deal with the Drummonds and starting front court is not top 15 )

Basically you paid huge backup money but the guy is unplayable. WCJ is barely 19 and needs several yrs to becomes above average starter which is when his contract will have to be renewed to 20+mil a yr. Which is why Lauri has to be somewhat KP lite to be the #1 option on defense and offense but thats probably impossible.

If they meet Detroit in the playoffs they will get destroyed 4-0. Just a terrible matchup nightmare.
This is why I want Robinson even though Carter can still be the better player since he has DPOY potential. Hopefully Gafford can be a poor mans Robinson and Carter becomes Horford.

Bulls are paying the least amount at the C position compared to every other slot. Dont understand the premise of your point.

There wasn't one, it was just a nonsensical **** on the Bulls post.

Sent from my SM-G975U using RealGM mobile app

I will say that if we make the playoffs, we won't be playing Detroit. Also, Griffin, Drummond is a good combo, but (depending on development this season), Lauri/WCj don't match-up too badly. I am worried/excited about the prospects for our guys, but I think the key will be keeping both guys quick vs. bulky.

[erlim]

That's my only concern with WCJ. He has All-Defense potential, but dude looks like a 4 out there

How does he? Because he plays like a center. Unless you're talking about his height and general size.

Yeah he reminds me of a lesser Hakeem. Not really in game, I doubt he will ever have the footwork Olajuwon had which was amazing but he has a certain fluidity about him that reminds me. Def not the bruiser that a Steven Adams is but he is a fine center.

I really doubt any center in this era is going to really really exploit a poised and physical defender that’s 2” or 3” inches shorter then them with a good reach. We routinely see 7’3” guys like Unicron Porzingas get absolutely SHUT DOWN EMBARASSED DESTROYED by 6’7” Draymond Green; and even if you consider him the greatest defender in NBA history like I do; we’ve seen years of guys like Niko and Lauri unable to post or play physical against 6’0” pgs. Point is, I’m not buying that a healthy Boogie or Embiid or anybody like that is not going to grind all night tear up WCJ for 40 points or whatever. WCJ is more opposition than most outdated traditional centers of this era are used to. I feel like Kurt Thomas and Antonio Davis guys would look real good on the Bulls now.