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Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine

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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#41 » by SHO'NUFF » Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:13 am

Showtime23 wrote:
CjayC wrote:That's a serious amount of disrespect right there. Marcus Smart better than Zach? :lol:


Well if you talk garbage back to media and expect something good, gl.
That being said he just needs to show improvement. For few seasons his defense was so bad he was giving up more point than getting for his team.



When did he talk garbage back to the media?

Are you referring to this?

“I’m just tired of people talking [bleep] about my defense,’’ LaVine said on Monday. “I’ve always been a good on-ball defender. But there’s no reason I can be this good offensively and not be that good on the defensive end. So I’m taking more pride in it. I’m pretty sure it’ll show. I’ll make sure of that.’’
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#42 » by Ebo21 » Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:20 am

I find it a little funny that just this time last season most everyone on this board was just as low on LaVine as this article writer.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#43 » by Mbrahv0528 » Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:42 am

Showtime23 wrote:
CjayC wrote:That's a serious amount of disrespect right there. Marcus Smart better than Zach?


Well if you talk garbage back to media and expect something good, gl.
That being said he just needs to show improvement. For few seasons his defense was so bad he was giving up more point than getting for his team.
Except that never happened.

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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#44 » by dice » Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:45 am

Ebo21 wrote:I find it a little funny that just this time last season most everyone on this board was just as low on LaVine as this article writer.

lavine was significantly worse at this time last season :dontknow:

lavine is still a below avg. starting SG in this league. people saying that he shouldn't be considered far behind booker are correct. but those saying that booker is overrated are also correct

minutes-weighted RPM (last 3 seasons unless otherwise noted):

3.60 oladipo

2.34 beverley****
2.19 green
2.17 mitchell
1.70 smart**
1.65 beal
1.26 thompson
1.14 satoransky**
1.13 gordon
1.01 g harris
0.99 brogdon
0.88 evans****
0.73 lamb
0.61 mccollum
0.58 booker*
0.52 hield*
0.47 redick
0.30 dinwiddie
0.21 brown**
-0.04 KCP**
-0.06 curry****
-0.37 hart
-0.40 j harris**
-0.41 galloway****
-0.46 huerter
-0.48 ross****
-0.49 lavine* (went positive in calendar 2019)
-0.71 fournier
-0.75 connaughton**
-1.00 temple

* last season only due to player on upswing
** last two seasons for player leveling after upswing
**** 4 season sample due to missing time
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#45 » by Indomitable » Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:37 am

mj234eva wrote:All you can do is laugh

The media has its narrative.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#46 » by Indomitable » Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:39 am

Mbrahv0528 wrote:
Showtime23 wrote:
CjayC wrote:That's a serious amount of disrespect right there. Marcus Smart better than Zach?


Well if you talk garbage back to media and expect something good, gl.
That being said he just needs to show improvement. For few seasons his defense was so bad he was giving up more point than getting for his team.
Except that never happened.

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He believes he did.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#47 » by HomoSapien » Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:52 am

This is just a crazy snub. Smart and Brown aren't better than LaVine, and neither is Richardson. I'm really high on LeVert but I have no idea how you pick him over LaVine given he was limited by the injury significantly last year. I suppose they're giving him the benefit of the doubt based on his playoff performance.

Zach has the talent to move into the top 3 here.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#48 » by ZOMG » Wed Oct 16, 2019 11:14 am

HomoSapien wrote:This is just a crazy snub. Smart and Brown aren't better than LaVine, and neither is Richardson. I'm really high on LeVert but I have no idea how you pick him over LaVine given he was limited by the injury significantly last year. I suppose they're giving him the benefit of the doubt based on his playoff performance.

Zach has the talent to move into the top 3 here.


Outside of the Bulls, LaVine is seen as a talented ballhog who can't or won't guard a chair. Like it or not, that's how it is. Impressions are hard to change in the NBA.

Lauri is still known as a "sharpshooter" by the media even though his stats say he's just pretty good.

Still, a total snub is very weird, there's no way Zach doesn't belong somwhere on that list.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#49 » by HomoSapien » Wed Oct 16, 2019 11:22 am

ZOMG wrote:
HomoSapien wrote:This is just a crazy snub. Smart and Brown aren't better than LaVine, and neither is Richardson. I'm really high on LeVert but I have no idea how you pick him over LaVine given he was limited by the injury significantly last year. I suppose they're giving him the benefit of the doubt based on his playoff performance.

Zach has the talent to move into the top 3 here.


Outside of the Bulls, LaVine is seen as a talented ballhog who can't or won't guard a chair. Like it or not, that's how it is. Impressions are hard to change in the NBA.

Lauri is still known as a "sharpshooter" by the media even though his stats say he's just pretty good.

Still, a total snub is very weird, there's no way Zach doesn't belong somwhere on that list.


Absolutely. I mean his approval rating on this board was terrible when he first got here, and now I'd guess that about 90% of the board is on team Zach. I certainly get it if outsiders haven't had a chance to be converted yet. Still, like you said, a total snub makes absolutely no sense.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#50 » by JohnnyTapwater » Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:22 pm

kodo wrote:
JohnnyTapwater wrote:Zach should be in the 8 - 10 range. Hopefully Zach can shake that reputation of being a poor defender this season. That's the only thing that keeps him from being mentioned in high regard.


Devin Booker is even a worse defender and he's ranked #5. -2.4 on DRPM.
Bradley Beal is also as bad as Lavine and ranked #3, -1.7 DRPM.
Lavine is -1.8 DRPM, as is Klay Thompson.

Although you did specify his "reputation" as a defender, which is 10x worse than what actual analytics say. The average fan would say Klay or Beal are incredible defensively next to Zach, but they're all the same.



This is an awesome take.

I think the media perception is Booker is a much better scorer than Zach. Scoring 70 points in a game might have that effect.

I do think Booker is a better shooter, but the gap is not as big as the media likes to think.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#51 » by khufure » Wed Oct 16, 2019 3:38 pm

Red Larrivee wrote:Nobody watching Bulls games last season is probably the reason. I doubt it's defense, because it's not like Devin Booker defends anyone.

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Nobody's watching Suns games either? Or is it 'cause they had Ayton people watched a few Suns games...
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#52 » by erlim » Wed Oct 16, 2019 3:50 pm

I wonder what the author actually considers Lavine, like the top 40s-50s?
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#53 » by TeK » Wed Oct 16, 2019 4:20 pm

Nothing to see here folks. It's very evident that we are seeing a different Zach this season. Diff confidence, diff swag, diff defense.

This article will be proved wrong by the first quarter of the season when ZL is avg 26ppg on 45% shooting.

I wouldn't be surprised if he was left off to further add fuel to the fire.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#54 » by Daxel » Wed Oct 16, 2019 4:49 pm

I used to go to BR back when I used to watch WWE, that's why is so hard for me to take them seriously, my mind keep linking them to wrestling.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#55 » by PrimzyBulls81 » Wed Oct 16, 2019 4:51 pm

This report is a joke!
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#56 » by Michael Jackson » Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:11 pm

dougthonus wrote:15: Marcus Smart
14: Jaylen Brown
13: Josh Richardson
12: Caris LaVert
11: Gary Harris
10: Buddy Hield
9: D'Angelo Russell
8: Victor Oladipo
7: C.J. McCollum
6: Donovan Mitchell
5: Devin Booker
4: Jrue Holiday
3: Bradley Beal
2: Paul George
1: James Harden

George isn't a SG. He played 0% of his minutes there last season. Holiday and Russell are both PGs first as well, but I guess you can at least count them as combo guards and Russell will certainly be lining up as a SG this season due to the trade.

I'd say Zach is somewhere in the 3-10 range. Right now, I'd probably place him 7th because I'd remove George/Holiday as non SGs on this list. I think he's better than the other guys listed 9 and below which gets me to 7th. That said, Booker, Mitchell, McCollum, and Oladipo are all guys that are in a similar tier. I'd expect Zach to have a better year than Oladipo for sure given the injury.


Yeah Agree on Russ and Jrue but maybe they are factoring that they may both play SG more this year. George I guess this year is the SG by default? Not sure honestly. By that logic though why isn’t Jimmy Butler on this list?
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#57 » by Red Larrivee » Wed Oct 16, 2019 11:25 pm

khufure wrote:
Red Larrivee wrote:Nobody watching Bulls games last season is probably the reason. I doubt it's defense, because it's not like Devin Booker defends anyone.

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Nobody's watching Suns games either? Or is it 'cause they had Ayton people watched a few Suns games...


Booker's dropped some really big scoring games the last two seasons, including that 70 point game against Boston. I'd guess that's why his national perception is stronger.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#58 » by Michael Jackson » Tue Oct 29, 2019 2:19 am

Seems like Bleacher Report was right.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#59 » by Eddy_JukeZ » Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:01 am

He has moments where he plays in control and through the flow of the offense.

Then he has moments where he makes you go wtf.
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Re: Bleacher Report “ top 15 SGs” no Lavine 

Post#60 » by Michael Jackson » Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:04 am

Eddy_JukeZ wrote:He has moments where he plays in control and through the flow of the offense.

Then he has moments where he makes you go wtf.



He really really wants to get it. I believe he puts the effort in. I just don’t think he can get it. He is like a bass player who can play this great runs but is always late on the one.

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