Alfonzo McKinnie??

[dougthonus]

McKinnie couldn't make a team that desperately needs quality minimum players and has deep knowledge of what he can and can't do. That doesn't bode particularly well for McKinnie and should be seen as a pretty huge red flag.

Huh? It’s the Warriors. They get their pick of all the vet mins. They chose over McKinnie a 22 year old former top 5 pick who plays their position of greatest need - C. Kerr spoke glowingly about Alfonzo. Let’s not look a gift horse in the mouth.

Not sure how C is their biggest need when of their five NBA caliber players Looney and Cauley Stein are both Cs and Green is a PF that often plays C. They Russell/Curry as good guards and literally do not have an NBA caliber wing that is a sure thing to be above replacement value on the roster until Thompson returns from injury.

I mean who is their starting SF? McKinnie, if he was playing even remotely well, would have projected to be their starter going into camp.

[mtron32]

McKinnie looked nice in his role, hell yes sign him

[bad knees]

McKinnie couldn't make a team that desperately needs quality minimum players and has deep knowledge of what he can and can't do. That doesn't bode particularly well for McKinnie and should be seen as a pretty huge red flag.

Huh? It’s the Warriors. They get their pick of all the vet mins. They chose over McKinnie a 22 year old former top 5 pick who plays their position of greatest need - C. Kerr spoke glowingly about Alfonzo. Let’s not look a gift horse in the mouth.

Not sure how C is their biggest need when of their five NBA caliber players Looney and Cauley Stein are both Cs and Green is a PF that often plays C. They Russell/Curry as good guards and literally do not have an NBA caliber wing that is a sure thing to be above replacement value on the roster until Thompson returns from injury.

I mean who is their starting SF? McKinnie, if he was playing even remotely well, would have projected to be their starter going into camp.

As Dan explained above, Cauley-Stein is out for several weeks, so Looney is their only C right now. And as The Athletic explains, Looney has not played in the preseason because of a hamstring issue. So the Dubs need a C right now, desperately. And Chriss is that guy.



But there are factors, beyond upside, that tipped the scales his direction. Chriss is of more immediate need than McKinnie.

Which is a surprise. McKinnie was one of only three traditional small forwards on the roster. He started there twice in the preseason. Only Glenn Robinson III and Alec Burks remain. But the Warriors can upsize Jacob Evans and Jordan Poole or downsize Paschall in times of need.

They have less wiggle-room at center. Willie Cauley-Stein will miss a handful of games to start the season after missing all of the preseason with a foot sprain. Kevon Looney missed the entire preseason with a hamstring tweak, though he’s likely for the opener. Alen Smailagić is still in a walking boot after badly spraining his ankle. Omari Spellman has been ineffective.

That completely cleared the path for Chriss, who cruised right down it with four straight productive preseason games, averaging 9.5 points, 8.3 rebounds, 3.0 assists and 1.3 blocks in 22.6 minutes.

“He’s been the surprise of camp,” Kerr said.

https://theathletic.com/1305205/2019/10/18/why-did-the-warriors-choose-marquese-chriss-over-alfonzo-mckinnie-age-and-immediate-need/?source=spotrac&redirected=1

[Ccwatercraft]

I'd love to have him over Harrison but ill trust Jim's judgement

[MGB8]

Bulls desperately need a legit option for a reserve 3. Val (offense) and Hutch (defense) both are huge questions due to limitations and current/past injuries.

So convert Shaw to a 2 way deal and sign McKinnie.

[dougthonus]

Huh? It’s the Warriors. They get their pick of all the vet mins. They chose over McKinnie a 22 year old former top 5 pick who plays their position of greatest need - C. Kerr spoke glowingly about Alfonzo. Let’s not look a gift horse in the mouth.

Not sure how C is their biggest need when of their five NBA caliber players Looney and Cauley Stein are both Cs and Green is a PF that often plays C. They Russell/Curry as good guards and literally do not have an NBA caliber wing that is a sure thing to be above replacement value on the roster until Thompson returns from injury.

I mean who is their starting SF? McKinnie, if he was playing even remotely well, would have projected to be their starter going into camp.

As Dan explained above, Cauley-Stein is out for several weeks, so Looney is their only C right now. And as The Athletic explains, Looney has not played in the preseason because of a hamstring issue. So the Dubs need a C right now, desperately. And Chriss is that guy.



But there are factors, beyond upside, that tipped the scales his direction. Chriss is of more immediate need than McKinnie.

Which is a surprise. McKinnie was one of only three traditional small forwards on the roster. He started there twice in the preseason. Only Glenn Robinson III and Alec Burks remain. But the Warriors can upsize Jacob Evans and Jordan Poole or downsize Paschall in times of need.

They have less wiggle-room at center. Willie Cauley-Stein will miss a handful of games to start the season after missing all of the preseason with a foot sprain. Kevon Looney missed the entire preseason with a hamstring tweak, though he’s likely for the opener. Alen Smailagić is still in a walking boot after badly spraining his ankle. Omari Spellman has been ineffective.

That completely cleared the path for Chriss, who cruised right down it with four straight productive preseason games, averaging 9.5 points, 8.3 rebounds, 3.0 assists and 1.3 blocks in 22.6 minutes.

“He’s been the surprise of camp,” Kerr said.

https://theathletic.com/1305205/2019/10/18/why-did-the-warriors-choose-marquese-chriss-over-alfonzo-mckinnie-age-and-immediate-need/?source=spotrac&redirected=1

Not sure how any of this changes what I said. In the long run, the Warriors have a much bigger need at SF. They obviously feel that playing guys whom are all replacement level players out of position is still fine relative to McKinnie, whom clearly didn't have much value to them.

They've had a long look at McKinnie over two years, and if they thought he was valuable they would have kept him. I personally wouldn't waive anyone on our roster for McKinnie, whom didn't look like anything special to me either. He was so completely worthless at everything in the playoffs when the Warriors desperately needed anyone to step up and do anything.

[IliketheBullsNBearstoo]

Plays defense, understands how to play without the ball in his hands, plays his role, an upgrade to every backup wing we currently have. He would improve this team.

[Johnny Bball]

Read on Twitter

Bulls could always pick up Payne *ducks*

[bad knees]

Not sure how C is their biggest need when of their five NBA caliber players Looney and Cauley Stein are both Cs and Green is a PF that often plays C. They Russell/Curry as good guards and literally do not have an NBA caliber wing that is a sure thing to be above replacement value on the roster until Thompson returns from injury.

I mean who is their starting SF? McKinnie, if he was playing even remotely well, would have projected to be their starter going into camp.

As Dan explained above, Cauley-Stein is out for several weeks, so Looney is their only C right now. And as The Athletic explains, Looney has not played in the preseason because of a hamstring issue. So the Dubs need a C right now, desperately. And Chriss is that guy.



But there are factors, beyond upside, that tipped the scales his direction. Chriss is of more immediate need than McKinnie.

Which is a surprise. McKinnie was one of only three traditional small forwards on the roster. He started there twice in the preseason. Only Glenn Robinson III and Alec Burks remain. But the Warriors can upsize Jacob Evans and Jordan Poole or downsize Paschall in times of need.

They have less wiggle-room at center. Willie Cauley-Stein will miss a handful of games to start the season after missing all of the preseason with a foot sprain. Kevon Looney missed the entire preseason with a hamstring tweak, though he’s likely for the opener. Alen Smailagić is still in a walking boot after badly spraining his ankle. Omari Spellman has been ineffective.

That completely cleared the path for Chriss, who cruised right down it with four straight productive preseason games, averaging 9.5 points, 8.3 rebounds, 3.0 assists and 1.3 blocks in 22.6 minutes.

“He’s been the surprise of camp,” Kerr said.

https://theathletic.com/1305205/2019/10/18/why-did-the-warriors-choose-marquese-chriss-over-alfonzo-mckinnie-age-and-immediate-need/?source=spotrac&redirected=1

Not sure how any of this changes what I said. In the long run, the Warriors have a much bigger need at SF. They obviously feel that playing guys whom are all replacement level players out of position is still fine relative to McKinnie, whom clearly didn't have much value to them.

They've had a long look at McKinnie over two years, and if they thought he was valuable they would have kept him. I personally wouldn't waive anyone on our roster for McKinnie, whom didn't look like anything special to me either. He was so completely worthless at everything in the playoffs when the Warriors desperately needed anyone to step up and do anything.

You asked for an explanation why C is a bigger need for GSW right now. I provided that.

You also conclude that McKinnie did not have much value to them. I prefer to take Kerr at face value when he spoke of the great value that McKinnie provided. Kerr is not the type to lie about such things and had no motive to do so.

GSW is scrambling to fill their lineup in the face of a daunting injury situation. They also naturally favor their recent draft picks when deciding who to keep. They were faced with the choice of keeping Chriss or McKinnie. The fact that they chose Chriss says little, to me, about McKinnie’s value.

What I do know is that the Bulls really need a backup SF. And that McKinnie played that position last year in the regular rotation of the best team in the league. I also know what Kerr said about him as a teammate. To me, he is more valuable to us than Valentine, Shaq, Dunn or Felicio.

[logical_art]

McKinnie couldn't make a team that desperately needs quality minimum players and has deep knowledge of what he can and can't do. That doesn't bode particularly well for McKinnie and should be seen as a pretty huge red flag.

They liked the former lottery pick more than him. Doesn't mean he wouldn't be a good add for the Bulls.

[Andi Obst]

McKinnie couldn't make a team that desperately needs quality minimum players and has deep knowledge of what he can and can't do. That doesn't bode particularly well for McKinnie and should be seen as a pretty huge red flag.

They liked the former lottery pick more than him. Doesn't mean he wouldn't be a good add for the Bulls.

Just like the fact that Chriss was a former lottery pick doesn't mean anything.

[dougthonus]

You asked for an explanation why C is a bigger need for GSW right now. I provided that.

Sure. I provided a reason why that explanation isn't meaningful enough to make the decision to go with a center vs a small forward if they viewed the small forward as a better player.

You also conclude that McKinnie did not have much value to them. I prefer to take Kerr at face value when he spoke of the great value that McKinnie provided. Kerr is not the type to lie about such things and had no motive to do so.

One view is based on actions. One view is based on words. I will almost always take the view based on actions over the view based on words.

GSW is scrambling to fill their lineup in the face of a daunting injury situation. They also naturally favor their recent draft picks when deciding who to keep. They were faced with the choice of keeping Chriss or McKinnie. The fact that they chose Chriss says little, to me, about McKinnie’s value.

Fair enough.

What I do know is that the Bulls really need a backup SF. And that McKinnie played that position last year in the regular rotation of the best team in the league. I also know what Kerr said about him as a teammate. To me, he is more valuable to us than Valentine, Shaq, Dunn or Felicio.

I think Valentine is much better than McKinnie if healthy. I think Dunn is much better (even if you play small at SF) and has a more useful contract than McKinnie. I think Felicio has a more useful contract than the gap between his and McKinnie's value.

I'd have no problem if they dumped Shaq for McKinnie, but I think Shaq is a similar caliber player and his value as a Dunn trade hedge is probably of similar value.

[logical_art]

McKinnie couldn't make a team that desperately needs quality minimum players and has deep knowledge of what he can and can't do. That doesn't bode particularly well for McKinnie and should be seen as a pretty huge red flag.

They liked the former lottery pick more than him. Doesn't mean he wouldn't be a good add for the Bulls.

Just like the fact that Chriss was a former lottery pick doesn't mean anything.

Yes it does mean something. It means he's got talent, even if he hasn't used it effectively so far.

[dougthonus]

They liked the former lottery pick more than him. Doesn't mean he wouldn't be a good add for the Bulls.

Doesn't mean the former undrafted player that was waived by his team, whom literally has no above replacement value player at his position for more than half the season on the roster, would be a good add either.

I get that that GS is in a tough bind, they really are. However, as I noted, the team has 5 above replacement value guys on the team and 3 of them can play center and two of them can't play together. Adding another pure center isn't a good roster fit for them long term. If they have reason to believe their internal injury situation is worse than reported and that maybe they'll lose Looney / Cauley-Stein for extended period of time (30% of the season or more) then maybe it makes sense.

[Andi Obst]

They liked the former lottery pick more than him. Doesn't mean he wouldn't be a good add for the Bulls.

Just like the fact that Chriss was a former lottery pick doesn't mean anything.

Yes it does mean something. It means he's got talent, even if he hasn't used it effectively so far.

It really doesn't. It means that at least one team thought he has talent, but not that he actually has it. Many lottery picks just never had the talent to make it.

[logical_art]

They liked the former lottery pick more than him. Doesn't mean he wouldn't be a good add for the Bulls.

Doesn't mean the former undrafted player that was waived by his team, whom literally has no above replacement value player at his position for more than half the season on the roster, would be a good add either.

I get that that GS is in a tough bind, they really are. However, as I noted, the team has 5 above replacement value guys on the team and 3 of them can play center and two of them can't play together. Adding another pure center isn't a good roster fit for them long term. If they have reason to believe their internal injury situation is worse than reported and that maybe they'll lose Looney / Cauley-Stein for extended period of time (30% of the season or more) then maybe it makes sense.

Right. A lot of us aren't making the case that he'd be a good add just because he was cut for a former lottery. Rather we're making the case that based on watching him play he's a pretty decent player at a position the Bulls lack decent depth at.

Do you think Denzel and Hutch are both better than him?

[samwana]

I'm in. Buyout Felicio finally.

Yep he is the most useless player on the team

Sent from my POT-LX1 using RealGM mobile app

[dougthonus]

Right. A lot of us aren't making the case that he'd be a good add just because he was cut for a former lottery. Rather we're making the case that based on watching him play he's a pretty decent player at a position the Bulls lack decent depth at.

Do you think Denzel and Hutch are both better than him?

Denzel yes, and even if he wasn't, his contract is more valuable if the Bulls make a trade and need to make a trade.

Hutch, who knows, but he hasn't had much opportunity to play, so I'd like to look at him given the has two more cheap years on his contract.

I mean if you waive someone it is Shaq. I don't really care if we waive Shaq for McKinnie, but I don't think there's any reason to think McKinnie is better than Shaq either. I don't think there's any reason to think he's an NBA caliber player except that he was on GS and thus got a ton of publicity relative to other guys.

In the playoffs, with Durant out, he was basically not in the rotation due to his poor play. He's a guy, much like Shaq, who's simply on the fringe of NBA quality. Due to playing for GS, he'll probably get more of an opportunity than his play would otherwise merit.

I wouldn't be beside myself with anger or anything if we brought him in, I just also think it's irrelevant. I think there's virtually no chance he helps us, but same could be said of Shaq.

[MGB8]

Problem is Valentine, impacted by injury issues, hasn't proven he's a rotation level NBA wing. And his pre-existing athletic limitations were cause for concern, in and of themselves, although he has a very nice perimeter skillset. Hutchinson is also plagued by injury issues. And while there is no real concern about his athleticism, there's a concern about his skillset.

Shaq Harrison is a 26 year old 6'4 guard who doesn't shoot well but has lots of energy, particularly on defense - basically a slightly worse version of David Nwaba.

Alfonso McKinnie is a 27 year old (yikes!) 6'8 wing who has shown flashes of shooting well and becoming a 3&D wing - a guy who worked his way into the Warriors rotation in a year they went to the finals.

For this team, that has more guys in that 6'3-6'4 range who can play in the perimeter than they have 6'7-6'8 guys... McKinnie >>> Harrison.

[Repeat 3-peat]

McKinnie is not a better shooter than Valentine, also isn't even close to being the defender that Shaq is.

So I'm not sure why they should sign McKinnie. I'm all for a upgrade on the wing though but don't see how this is the upgrade.