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OT: COVID-19 thread #3

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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#841 » by Dresden » Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:21 pm

I heard a news reporter who is based in China saying how the Chinese look at Americans complaining about shutdowns and shelter in place orders and other restrictions, and they think we're soft and spoiled for complaining about these measures. Meanwhile in China, which underwent a severe shutdown early on, the virus is virtually non existent, and life has returned to normal (although many restrictions for moving in and out of China).

The New England Journal of Medicine backs this up, in their editorial this week:

“We know that we could have done better. China, faced with the first outbreak, chose strict quarantine and isolation after an initial delay. These measures were severe but effective, essentially eliminating transmission at the point where the outbreak began and reducing the death rate to a reported 3 per million, as compared with more than 500 per million in the United States,” the editorial stated. “Countries that had far more exchange with China, such as Singapore and South Korea, began intensive testing early, along with aggressive contact tracing and appropriate isolation, and have had relatively small outbreaks. And New Zealand has used these same measures, together with its geographic advantages, to come close to eliminating the disease, something that has allowed that country to limit the time of closure and to largely reopen society to a prepandemic level. In general, not only have many democracies done better than the United States, but they have also outperformed us by orders of magnitude.”
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#842 » by MrSparkle » Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:32 pm

The frustrating thing is my family did quarantine very strictly for about 4 weeks (well, a lot of people I know) before loosening up and starting to grocery shop, socially distantly walk in the parks, etc. Figured most the population could handle it; we loaded up on essentials and food, started a lot of home projects, continued working from home.

Meanwhile WI, FL, AZ, and a whole lot of people everywhere decided to have beach parties, covid infection parties, eat out as much as possible, etc.

Times like these where I prefer the disciplined hive-mind of Scandinavia or Korea, Japan. Not so far as China.

It’s a numbers game, and this gov. and country failed. It’s gonna get worse before it gets better. On the bright side, it seems even obese politicians are getting treated alright.

Hey no biggie right? People go to the hospital and need a respirator in case of emergency with the flu, right?
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#843 » by dice » Mon Oct 12, 2020 3:02 am

Dresden wrote:Wisconsin is not doing well:

"Wisconsin’s numbers are sobering. On Thursday the state’s new daily case count cleared 3,000 for the first time. Its seven-day average (2,491) has more than tripled since the start of September. Daily hospitalizations have also tripled over the same period. Nearly 20 percent of Wisconsin’s COVID-19 tests are coming back positive.
...
The first and perhaps most consequential of these skirmishes came in the spring, when the Legislature’s Republican leaders filed a lawsuit arguing that Evers’s “safer at home” order would leave the state’s economy “in shambles” — even though it was no stricter than dozens of other shelter-in-place orders in effect across the country. On May 13 the state’s Supreme Court, which was also controlled by conservatives, sided with the GOP and overturned the order. Evers was not pleased, telling CNN that the court’s ruling “puts our state into chaos.”

“Now we have no plan and no protections for the people of Wisconsin,” the governor said. “When you have more people in a small space — I don’t care if it’s bars, restaurants or your home — you’re going to be able to spread the virus. And so now, today, thanks to the Republican legislators who convinced four Supreme Court justices to not look at the law but [to] look at their political careers, I guess, it’s a bad day for Wisconsin.”

the prior regime was disasterous for the people of the state. unions were crushed, and then when a democratic governor was elected they stripped him of many powers in the lame duck period before he took office
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#844 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:22 am

"borat is an idiot" - rudy giuliani
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#845 » by PaKii94 » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:36 am

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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#846 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:40 am


he's really doing his darnedest to kill off his voting base
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#847 » by ChiCitySPORTS#1 » Tue Oct 13, 2020 4:43 am

If Trump asked his almost cult like following to wear a mask, they would. Watching his Florida rally was embarrassing. We are absolute clowns on the global stage. It's pathetic and has set our country back decades as a global leader.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#848 » by Dresden » Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:12 pm

ChiCitySPORTS#1 wrote:If Trump asked his almost cult like following to wear a mask, they would. Watching his Florida rally was embarrassing. We are absolute clowns on the global stage. It's pathetic and has set our country back decades as a global leader.


Trump may still be able to charm his faithful, but he's clueless behavior is costing him more support every day. He's now down 4 points in Florida, only up 2 in Texas, and his campaign is on the verge of conceding WIS, MN and MI. They'll hope to pull off FLA, AZ and PA as a path to 270, but that looks like a long shot as well, as Biden is up 6 in PA right now.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#849 » by SalmonsSuperfan » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:57 am

dougthonus wrote:
TheStig wrote:Yes, that is correct. For important positions on your ballot, you should take a few moments and see what they stand for. I don't think that's a lot to ask for the freedom to elect your leaders.


The reason why this doesn't happen is basic game theory.

Four combinations
You do this and society does not do this - benefit for you? No.
You do not do this and society does not do this - benefit for you? No.
You do this and society does this - benefit for you? Yes. (assuming your needs generally match society)
You do not do this and society does this - benefit for you? Yes. (assuming your needs generally match society)

You could solve this in somewhat simple ways if you wanted to. Simply make voting a requirement to have certain rights in this country. If you want to own property or hold a job you have to vote at all elections. It's way less work and much simpler than filing taxes which we require, and you could simplify the process into a trivial national electronic process.

You could also trivially add information about what each candidate states they stand for and whether or not they have voted based on what they say they stand for in the past and make that 30 seconds of research readily available to the voter as they are voting.

this is a really scary idea. you're basically saying that 110million americans, disproportionately non-white, should be immediately plunged into abject poverty. it's probably worth considering why people either do not want to or cannot participate in the electoral process before destroying society.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#850 » by HomoSapien » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:56 am

How have people found traveling during Covid? Due to a family emergency, my senior-aged parents are planning on staying with us. I'm trying to convince them to drive to me (it's a 12-hour drive), but they're leaning towards flying (an hour and a half flight) due to concerns about not wanting to use public bathrooms during the road trip. In my opinion, driving + breaking the trip up with an AirBnB (even if it's simply to use a sanitized bathroom) is safer.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#851 » by johnnyvann840 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:17 am

I can't believe I just heard this for the first time and nobody has ever brought this up. "trumpery" is a real word and it literally means "worthless nonsense". Comes from Middle English (ultimately Middle French) word "trompe" , which means - to deceive. lol. How fitting.

This is a real word in the Merriam-Webster dictionary... TRUMPERY. Looked it up and here's what I found....

trumpery noun

trum·​pery | \ ˈtrəm-p(ə-)rē \
Definition of trumpery
1a: worthless nonsense
b: trivial or useless articles : JUNK
a wagon loaded with household trumpery
— Washington Irving
2archaic : tawdry finery

Synonyms

applesauce [slang], balderdash, baloney (also boloney), beans, bilge, blah (also blah-blah), blarney, blather, blatherskite, blither, bosh, bull [slang], bunk, bunkum (or buncombe), claptrap, codswallop [British], crapola [slang], crock, drivel, drool, fiddle, fiddle-faddle, fiddlesticks, flannel [British], flapdoodle, folderol (also falderal), folly, foolishness, fudge, garbage, guff, hogwash, hokeypokey, hokum, hoodoo, hooey, horsefeathers [slang], humbug, humbuggery, jazz, malarkey (also malarky), moonshine, muck, nerts [slang], nonsense, nuts, piffle, poppycock, punk, rot, rubbish, senselessness, silliness, slush, stupidity, taradiddle (or tarradiddle), tommyrot, tosh, trash, twaddle

Visit the Thesaurus for More

Did You Know?
Trumpery derives from the Middle English trompery and ultimately from the Middle French tromper, meaning "to deceive." (You can see the meaning of this root reflected in the French phrase trompe-l'oeil-literally, "deceives the eye"-which in English refers to a style of painting with photographically realistic detail.) Trumpery first appeared in English in the mid-15th century with the meanings "deceit or fraud" (a sense that is now obsolete) and "worthless nonsense." Less than 100 years later, it was being applied to material objects of little or no value. The verb phrase trump up means "to concoct with the intent to deceive," but there is most likely no etymological connection between this phrase and trumpery.

Examples of trumpery in a Sentence
claims (by the US President, Donald Trump) are based much more on White House Trumpery than on bariatric science

First Known Use of trumpery
15th century, in the meaning defined at sense 1a

History and Etymology for trumpery
Middle English (Scots) trompery deceit, from Middle French, from tromper to deceive
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#852 » by Dresden » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:06 am

HomoSapien wrote:How have people found traveling during Covid? Due to a family emergency, my senior-aged parents are planning on staying with us. I'm trying to convince them to drive to me (it's a 12-hour drive), but they're leaning towards flying (an hour and a half flight) due to concerns about not wanting to use public bathrooms during the road trip. In my opinion, driving + breaking the trip up with an AirBnB (even if it's simply to use a sanitized bathroom) is safer.


One study estimated that your odds of catching Covid on a 2 hour flight (fully loaded) was about 1 in 4,300. So it's pretty safe. Then you have to figure in what they might encounter in the airport as well.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#853 » by dougthonus » Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:33 pm

SalmonsSuperfan wrote:this is a really scary idea. you're basically saying that 110million americans, disproportionately non-white, should be immediately plunged into abject poverty. it's probably worth considering why people either do not want to or cannot participate in the electoral process before destroying society.


Not sure how any of this follows. I noted that you would need to simplify voting into a trivial electronic process with the implication that everyone can vote instantly, simply, with no barriers whatsoever in front of them (we should do that anyway).

Though I agree that you could not implement this with the current voting process, you need to make it trivially easy to vote. Like you can walk into work, use MFA at work, and vote electronically in 10 seconds, and any employer has to provide this functionality to employ people.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#854 » by Ccwatercraft » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:48 pm

HomoSapien wrote:How have people found traveling during Covid? Due to a family emergency, my senior-aged parents are planning on staying with us. I'm trying to convince them to drive to me (it's a 12-hour drive), but they're leaning towards flying (an hour and a half flight) due to concerns about not wanting to use public bathrooms during the road trip. In my opinion, driving + breaking the trip up with an AirBnB (even if it's simply to use a sanitized bathroom) is safer.


As I've mentioned in other posts, I've been flying, half due to work half due to family (non emergency stuff), counting connecting flights I think i've had 12 total plane trips. Honestly its really no big deal at all, toss on a mask, wash your hands and hop on a plane, a couple million of us are hopping on a plane every single day.

Basically if you are nervous and are worried about bathrooms on a road trip then Flying is probably not a good idea either, you probably aren't ready. Was in O'hare last week on a connector, only half the food court was open and lines were ridiculous due to limited options, gates were jammed with people, no distancing on the jetway or during boarding, and although everyone wears a mask, the minute that snacks gets served everyone takes the mask off at the same time for pretzels and water. You are either mentally prepared or you are not.

Note: can really really spot the people who are on their first flight, very nervous and constantly moving to create space which is quite impossible, I repeat, Impossible.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#855 » by Wingy » Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:55 pm

dice wrote:

he's really doing his darnedest to kill off his voting base


Sad thing is, how easily he could’ve gone for the prescribed precautions from the start, stuck with his usual shtick...and still set the right example that his worshippers would’ve followed.

“Wear a mask. Stay 6 feet apart. Simple. It’s simple. It’s so easy....it’s so easy that even Pelosi couldn’t screw it up! Schumer could do it! I mean...you wanna talk about easy?!?”

Then internet would’ve exploded with memes, and merch - and Geico-esque “so easy Pelosi can do it” shirts, and masks.

But nope. Lack of responsibility, and division must rule all things.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#856 » by Dresden » Thu Oct 15, 2020 8:52 am

Ccwatercraft wrote:
HomoSapien wrote:How have people found traveling during Covid? Due to a family emergency, my senior-aged parents are planning on staying with us. I'm trying to convince them to drive to me (it's a 12-hour drive), but they're leaning towards flying (an hour and a half flight) due to concerns about not wanting to use public bathrooms during the road trip. In my opinion, driving + breaking the trip up with an AirBnB (even if it's simply to use a sanitized bathroom) is safer.


As I've mentioned in other posts, I've been flying, half due to work half due to family (non emergency stuff), counting connecting flights I think i've had 12 total plane trips. Honestly its really no big deal at all, toss on a mask, wash your hands and hop on a plane, a couple million of us are hopping on a plane every single day.

Basically if you are nervous and are worried about bathrooms on a road trip then Flying is probably not a good idea either, you probably aren't ready. Was in O'hare last week on a connector, only half the food court was open and lines were ridiculous due to limited options, gates were jammed with people, no distancing on the jetway or during boarding, and although everyone wears a mask, the minute that snacks gets served everyone takes the mask off at the same time for pretzels and water. You are either mentally prepared or you are not.

Note: can really really spot the people who are on their first flight, very nervous and constantly moving to create space which is quite impossible, I repeat, Impossible.


What you describe would give me pause about flying right now. A couple hundred people packed in close proximity, all with masks off while they ate and drank- that's a recipe for infection. I know they have good air filtration in planes, but still...
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#857 » by Ccwatercraft » Thu Oct 15, 2020 1:15 pm

Dresden wrote:
Ccwatercraft wrote:
HomoSapien wrote:How have people found traveling during Covid? Due to a family emergency, my senior-aged parents are planning on staying with us. I'm trying to convince them to drive to me (it's a 12-hour drive), but they're leaning towards flying (an hour and a half flight) due to concerns about not wanting to use public bathrooms during the road trip. In my opinion, driving + breaking the trip up with an AirBnB (even if it's simply to use a sanitized bathroom) is safer.


As I've mentioned in other posts, I've been flying, half due to work half due to family (non emergency stuff), counting connecting flights I think i've had 12 total plane trips. Honestly its really no big deal at all, toss on a mask, wash your hands and hop on a plane, a couple million of us are hopping on a plane every single day.

Basically if you are nervous and are worried about bathrooms on a road trip then Flying is probably not a good idea either, you probably aren't ready. Was in O'hare last week on a connector, only half the food court was open and lines were ridiculous due to limited options, gates were jammed with people, no distancing on the jetway or during boarding, and although everyone wears a mask, the minute that snacks gets served everyone takes the mask off at the same time for pretzels and water. You are either mentally prepared or you are not.

Note: can really really spot the people who are on their first flight, very nervous and constantly moving to create space which is quite impossible, I repeat, Impossible.


What you describe would give me pause about flying right now. A couple hundred people packed in close proximity, all with masks off while they ate and drank- that's a recipe for infection. I know they have good air filtration in planes, but still...


As soon as sanitized bathrooms were mentioned in the post I knew right then it was a bad idea to consider flying. Either you are mentally ready or not. Sounds like not. I didn't have a choice.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#858 » by Dresden » Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:18 pm

To me, it's not about being mentally ready or not, it's about the science of how covid is spread.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#859 » by Dresden » Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:20 pm

Dr. Anthony Fauci on Thursday denounced the concept of herd immunity — the notion that if a large enough group of people contract an infection, it will ultimately stop the disease from spreading — calling it “nonsense” during an interview with Yahoo News.

“Anybody who knows anything about epidemiology will tell you that is nonsense and very dangerous,” Fauci told Yahoo News, “because what will happen is that if you do that, by the time you get to herd immunity, you will have killed a lot of people that would have been avoidable.”
...
When asked about the herd immunity approach, which has been reportedly embraced by the White House, Fauci said that while he agrees with the declaration, virtually anyone with a solid understanding of epidemiology would disagree with the idea of letting everyone get infected.

“My position is known. Dr. Deborah Birx’s position is known and Dr. [Robert] Redfield,” he said. “So you have me as the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, Debbie Birx, as the coordinator and a very experienced infectious disease person, the coordinator of the task force — and you have Bob Redfield, who's the director of the [Centers for Disease Control and Prevention]. All three of us very clearly are against that.”

https://www.yahoo.com/news/fauci-on-coronavirus-herd-immunity-132851933.html
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #3 

Post#860 » by molepharmer » Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:54 pm

A little science about other therapeutic options which may be used by themselves or in conjunction with a vaccine.....
from Matt Kaeberlein, a gerontologist at the University of Washington in Seattle....“If I had the power to go back to the beginning of this whole COVID pandemic and try one thing, I’d pick mTOR inhibitors — rapamycin specifically,” he says. According to his back-of-the-envelope calculations, if rapamycin works in the same way in people as it does in mice, it could reduce COVID-19 mortality by 90%.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02856-7
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