Image ImageImage Image

Lavine is....

Moderators: HomoSapien, Tommy Udo 6 , dougthonus, GimmeDat, DASMACKDOWN, Payt10, kulaz3000, fleet, RedBulls23, AshyLarrysDiaper, Ice Man

Lavine is...

1-a budding 1st option who we must keep
11
7%
2-a soon-to-be All Star who can be a #2 on a contender, and worth keeping
70
44%
3-A solid 3rd option/elite 6th man worth keeping
28
18%
4-A bum we should trade immediately
5
3%
5-a solid, yet flawed player who we should trade while his value is high
38
24%
6-I miss DRose and MJ (other)
6
4%
 
Total votes: 158

pipfan
Head Coach
Posts: 6,895
And1: 1,473
Joined: Aug 07, 2010

Lavine is.... 

Post#1 » by pipfan » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:17 pm

please vote for the one that fits your feelings towards Zach
User avatar
dougthonus
Senior Mod - Bulls
Senior Mod - Bulls
Posts: 47,410
And1: 7,462
Joined: Dec 22, 2004
Contact:

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#2 » by dougthonus » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:30 pm

I think I'm somewhere between #2 and #3 and could be in #5 if there was a good trade for him available, but I don't think there will be a good trade available for him. It's hard to choose #5 without knowing what "sell high" really looks like.
User avatar
Fastbrk4brkfast
Head Coach
Posts: 6,846
And1: 2,186
Joined: Oct 16, 2010
     

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#3 » by Fastbrk4brkfast » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:31 pm

Option 2 is the closest. But "soon to be all-star who can be #2 on a contender and is worth trading high on" could also be the case with a new front office.
League Circles
RealGM
Posts: 30,714
And1: 7,907
Joined: Dec 04, 2001
       

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#4 » by League Circles » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:37 pm

5 is the closest to what I think. Basically I think he's a solid 2nd scoring option offensively, but not good enough to be the 2nd best overall player on a really good team.
https://august-shop.com/ streetwear & sneakers
User avatar
FriedRise
Head Coach
Posts: 7,448
And1: 6,591
Joined: Jan 13, 2015
Location: Chicago
 

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#5 » by FriedRise » Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:38 pm

I think he's somewhere in between #2 - #3 right now, but he can solidly be a #2 if the team has more wins. #1 is a long shot given he's mostly average/below average in other things outside of scoring.

I do not think he is a bum that we should immediately trade (good contract, elite scorer, not that bad defensively), but that's something I'd absolutely explore if the potential return is worth it. That probably applies to every player on this team really.
User avatar
JohnnyTapwater
Veteran
Posts: 2,704
And1: 1,180
Joined: Nov 06, 2009
Location: Chicago
   

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#6 » by JohnnyTapwater » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:25 pm

He's definitely a star worth keeping ...

LOVE his skill and work ethic. I LOVE what I've been hearing in the off-season. Because of that, I think he's a budding superstar.

I'm going to speak it into existence.
User avatar
nomorezorro
General Manager
Posts: 9,919
And1: 5,990
Joined: Jun 22, 2006
Location: GARPAX FOREVER

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#7 » by nomorezorro » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:30 pm

an American professional basketball player for the Chicago Bulls of the National Basketball Association (NBA). He was selected in the first round of the 2014 NBA draft with the 13th overall pick by the Timberwolves. He is a two-time Slam Dunk Contest champion.
WookieOnRitalin wrote:Game 1. It's where the series is truly 0-0.
ZOMG
Analyst
Posts: 3,709
And1: 2,096
Joined: Dec 31, 2013

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#8 » by ZOMG » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:40 pm

... someone whose large trade value is pretty much a fantasy. Sure, a lot of teams might want him... for cheap.
Current status: ACTIVE
Former status: BANNED FOR DERAILING DISCUSSION
User avatar
The Force.
Head Coach
Posts: 6,022
And1: 1,281
Joined: May 30, 2008
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#9 » by The Force. » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:42 pm

#5. If he learns to play defense possibly #2.
bad knees
Analyst
Posts: 3,739
And1: 1,220
Joined: Jul 09, 2009

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#10 » by bad knees » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:44 pm

He's a 5 for me. Hugely talented offensively, but his bbiq holds him back. I can see him going through his career without making the playoffs until he reaches his 30's and settles for a lesser role.
ZOMG
Analyst
Posts: 3,709
And1: 2,096
Joined: Dec 31, 2013

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#11 » by ZOMG » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:45 pm

The Force. wrote:#5. If he learns to play defense possibly #2.


Defense won't make him an All Star in this league. Winning will.

Trouble is, he's not a winning player and everybody knows it.
Current status: ACTIVE
Former status: BANNED FOR DERAILING DISCUSSION
User avatar
nomorezorro
General Manager
Posts: 9,919
And1: 5,990
Joined: Jun 22, 2006
Location: GARPAX FOREVER

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#12 » by nomorezorro » Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:50 pm

i've been optimistic about zach ever since he joined the team, but at this point in his career i think his "best case scenario" requires

1) us finding a legitimate #1 option on offense
2) him accepting that, on a great team, he is a complementary player rather than an offensive centerpiece

i don't think zach is a selfish player in the traditional sense — he's shown a willingness to get others involved and seems to be genuinely happy when someone like lauri or coby is rolling and putting up big scoring numbers — but i do think that philosophically he sees himself as The Guy, and i have questions about how well he'd take on a secondary or tertiary role if he was asked to.

still, it's not fair to assume he'd be incapable of it. he has legitimately been the best player on our team ever since he got here. hopefully we get an opportunity to find out what he's like playing next to someone even better!
WookieOnRitalin wrote:Game 1. It's where the series is truly 0-0.
kodo
RealGM
Posts: 14,047
And1: 8,833
Joined: Oct 10, 2006
Location: Wrigleyville

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#13 » by kodo » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:37 pm

I'm somewhere between 2/3. He's a #2 on a good team, but not a championship team as those often have 2+ superstars.

I see starting guards on contending teams like Eric Bledsoe and Russell Westbrook play with much worse IQ than Lavine, and their teams still win.

When teams with title aspirations like the Lakers and Brooklyn want to trade for Lavine, the problem probably isn't the player.
User avatar
Ugly Duckling
Veteran
Posts: 2,746
And1: 1,393
Joined: Jul 20, 2014
Location: The Windy
 

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#14 » by Ugly Duckling » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:43 pm

My prediction is he's going to make another significant jump this yr. He's been going hard already in term of training and hasn't reached his prime. His combination of excellent shooting and elite athleticism is very rare. Name some players like that. I can't think of any right now. Usually elite athletes cap off at above average shooting at best and excellent shooters aren't elite athletes. That's an incredibly useful combo to have in a player. He needs someone to handle the rock and cover up his defensive lapses so he can focus on putting the ball in the hole
mudsak wrote:Watching Kawhi plow through the playoffs like the most stoic gangster to walk the earth has been one of the most epic things I've watched in a while.
Ebo21
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,817
And1: 46
Joined: Jul 30, 2003
Location: Baltimore

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#15 » by Ebo21 » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:54 pm

I think he’s #2. He has all of the offensive ability in the world and I don’t think we lose because he’s necessarily the best option on the team. We lose because we suck and our coaching was terrible. I expect him to improve simply from the coaching change and compounded with his continued hard work on his craft he should take another step.
User avatar
drosereturn
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,409
And1: 1,426
Joined: Oct 12, 2018

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#16 » by drosereturn » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:57 pm

#5. #3 doesnt make any sense since who the hell keeps 20mil guy as your 6th man? your basically admitting he is lou williams except he is twice more pricey.

Bottom line is whether he is all star caliber or not is not very important. He is very expensive (30+) soon, isnt a #1,2, and yet makes it impossible to draft someone like Ball, Young bc Lavine is terrible defensively which forces you to play 2 3&D players with him which limits further playmaking by not playing with a pass first pg.
If Trae young/ MPJ was available, would you draft him knowing your going to give up 150 points? You can have 1 defensively weak player as long as he is so good at the offensive end he makes up for. But 2 is impossible to take cover. Lavine makes going bpa impossible.
Lamelo will be a future superstar Bull. Book it. Lavar for president!
_txchilibowl_
Senior
Posts: 713
And1: 500
Joined: Aug 17, 2017
     

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#17 » by _txchilibowl_ » Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:00 pm

I miss Jordan is the correct answer.
cool007
RealGM
Posts: 15,715
And1: 1,593
Joined: Feb 03, 2005

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#18 » by cool007 » Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:15 pm

For me it's easy, #2. He just needs a Kawhi, Doncic, Greek Freak, etc as a 1st option and you will see how good of a #2 option he would be.

And yeah, better coaching and team staying healthy would help greatly. It looks bad because he has been playing next to G-League like players in Payne, Dunn, Harrison, Arci, etc while other talented players are always hurt (Carter, Porter, Lauri, etc). Whenever he played next to a healthy squad, he and the team both performed well (see after the trade for Porter).
bledredwine
RealGM
Posts: 11,555
And1: 3,305
Joined: Sep 17, 2010
   

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#19 » by bledredwine » Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:15 pm

Always trade high if you aren't going to be in contention soon and said player is not a star/superstar in impact.

I said it with hobbled Jo, I said it with Deng, I said to wait on Mirotic (which obviously backfired on our tank) and I'll say it with Lavine.

That said, our new FO actually seems proactive. Maybe they'll surround him with some good vets to compete for a playoff spot. If you get a couple of good picks though... trade.
Image

dice wrote:James Harden is currently in the same league as Michael Jordan as a scorer.



Playoffs- to age 27
MJ 35.4 PPG
JH 20.6 PPG

LBJ 27% in the clutch in the Finals: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1651184
User avatar
TheSuzerain
RealGM
Posts: 13,160
And1: 8,331
Joined: Mar 29, 2012

Re: Lavine is.... 

Post#20 » by TheSuzerain » Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:17 pm

He's a 2nd option scoring wise who needs to be your 4th best player.

Easiest way to fit him in would be as an elite 6th man who you probably do include in your closing lineup when teams mostly go small.

Return to Chicago Bulls