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Leslie Forman
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#321 » by Leslie Forman » Tue Oct 13, 2020 12:16 am

Kawhi went to Jimmy before PG. Jimmy turned him down.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#322 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:36 am

Ice Man wrote:
Grodoboldo wrote:It's actually not that hard to stop super teams.
Hard cap + no max salaries. Done. If any superstar wants to be buddy buddy with another, well, put your money where your mouth is and leave cash on the table.


I've been lusting after that solution since forever. But the Players Union won't have it, because the ideal team with such an approach would be $50 million each for two superstars, then $20 million total for all the other players. The median wage would go down, so the median player won't support that measure.

you really want a system where a team that drafts and develops well has to jettison home-grown, burgeoning stars that fans have grown to love? "sorry joakim, derrick's up for a mega deal. see ya"

blech
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#323 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:39 am

Southpaw wrote:
TheStig wrote:
Southpaw wrote:100% agree. To me Jordan is still the undisputed GOAT tho I understand people who think Lebron or Kareem is GOAT. Jordan is just on a different level and. Lebron biggest strike on his resume imo is his 2011 Finals performance. You can't claim to be the GOAT and perform that way on the biggest stage.

It's also hard with as much as he moves around. Bron is not the greatest Heat or Laker of all time. He is the greatest Cav of all time. Same with Kareem. Kareem is a 6x champion but only 2x finals MVP. It's hard to be the Goat when people are winning the finals MVP over you. Is he the greatest Laker? I think Magic is the greatest Laker.

Yeah, I think Wade is the greatest Heat followed by Lebron while it's Magic then Kobe for the Lakers. I hate that stars nowadays jump ship from team to team to try and win a ring instead of sticking to one team and building a legacy there but that's the product of shorter contracts anf the media/fans pressure on players to win or be clowned.

both kareem and jerry west were significantly better players than kobe
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#324 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:44 am

otwok wrote:Bubble overall was okay. The biggest winner was Adam Silver to prove that he could do it. Good for him and the NBA. But I think what we saw was the result of how important travel/crowds are to quality and presentation of the game and how it can actually affect results.

agreed, although the product was better than i expected it to be. and it's an unqualified success that not a single player tested positive in the bubble

In a normal post season, I don't see Miami getting past Milwaukee, and I also see the Lakers losing a few more Western Conference games (they may still win the championship). Playing in the playoffs in loud environments is hard for young and role players. Think about playing on the road in Denver with the altitude against a young team. Tough. Not to mention with Anthony Davis and his injury history, I actually think the lack of travel and no 82 game season helped. This is really the first time in his career he was able to finish out a season. He played a total of 83 games including the playoffs this year, and towards the end was really wincing at any contact.

at the same time, in a normal season the playoffs are stretched out more, benefiting older/injured players. the compressed schedule and lack of outside distractions benefitted teams like the heat
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#325 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:58 am

TheStig wrote:
TheSuzerain wrote:Yeah the bubble was a good time. Level of play was usually very high, likely due to the lack of travel.

Clippers kind of spoiled what should have been a great WCF.

LeBron vs Giannis also would have been a fun time but can't deny the Miami run was an unexpected and entertaining alternative. I enjoy seeing team's that play great team basketball being rewarded.

Clips just just choked. They anointed themselves the champion and had people in and out of the bubble. And then traded the farm for PG choke job. I think that will end up coming back to bite them in the ass. It'll also be interesting because they've got Morris and Harrell who will look to get paid.

amazingly, the clippers are pretty much co-favorites with the lakers to win it all in 2021:

7/2 lakers
4/1 clippers

13/2 bucks

12/1 celtics/warriors
14/1 nets/heat

20/1 nuggets/rockets/raps

30/1 mavs/sixers/blazers
40/1 pels/suns/jazz
60/1 thunder

100/1 hawks/bulls/pacers/grizz/wiz

4 worst projected teams in the league (cavs, pistons, knicks, hornets) all in the east, so bulls expected to battle for the 7/8 seeds :o
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#326 » by jc23 » Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:44 am

^^^Clippers can still turn the boat around with a few tweaks. lebron has shown that the first year of a team rebuild has its bumps. Most importantly that teams needs a vet point guard that isnt an overrated defensive specialist or a shot maker who doesnt show up in the playoffs.

Either way unless lebron falls off a cliff this summer or Giannis makes a power play; the most talented duo next season will be on the lakers
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#327 » by Michael Jackson » Tue Oct 13, 2020 12:16 pm

TheStig wrote:
Michael Jackson wrote:
TheStig wrote:I know they had to do it to get Kawhi. I just wished they picked a better 2nd star.



Like Jimmy Butler. I bet Philly would have taken SGA gladly.

Or they could have just signed Jimmy and kept SGA and all those picks. And possibly used those assets for a big.



I’d they have the capspace? I know Miami dint and had to do a S&T, don’t know if the clips had enough space for 2 max.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#328 » by Ice Man » Tue Oct 13, 2020 12:30 pm

dice wrote:7/2 lakers
4/1 clippers

13/2 bucks

12/1 celtics/warriors
14/1 nets/heat

20/1 nuggets/rockets/raps

30/1 mavs/sixers/blazers
40/1 pels/suns/jazz
60/1 thunder

100/1 hawks/bulls/pacers/grizz/wiz

4 worst projected teams in the league (cavs, pistons, knicks, hornets) all in the east, so bulls expected to battle for the 7/8 seeds :o


So of the league's top 17 teams, 12 are in the West. If you believe that, sure, the Bulls might get an #8 seed, maybe even better. But they would still be worse than OKC, NO, Phoenix, Utah, and either Mavs or Blazers. Which to be honest, is probably true.

I have no idea how the East can be inferior year after year, decade after decade.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#329 » by troza » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:03 pm

Ice Man wrote:
dice wrote:7/2 lakers
4/1 clippers

13/2 bucks

12/1 celtics/warriors
14/1 nets/heat

20/1 nuggets/rockets/raps

30/1 mavs/sixers/blazers
40/1 pels/suns/jazz
60/1 thunder

100/1 hawks/bulls/pacers/grizz/wiz

4 worst projected teams in the league (cavs, pistons, knicks, hornets) all in the east, so bulls expected to battle for the 7/8 seeds :o


So of the league's top 17 teams, 12 are in the West. If you believe that, sure, the Bulls might get an #8 seed, maybe even better. But they would still be worse than OKC, NO, Phoenix, Utah, and either Mavs or Blazers. Which to be honest, is probably true.

I have no idea how the East can be inferior year after year, decade after decade.


Indeed. The East started to become week in 1996/97 (when Shaq went to west, the knicks started to decline) but still had some nice teams (the Heat, the Pacers and even the Knicks although they were weaker), while on the West there were Sonics, Rockets, Jazz, Lakers, Spurs (although the injury of Robinson took them out of that season). But I would say that since 2001 it has been way weaker than the West. There were years with 2 or 3 good teams and I think there was actually one year with 3 contenders (2011 with Heat, Bulls and Celtics) but as far as I remember there were years that no team on the east was a real contender.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#330 » by TheStig » Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:38 pm

Michael Jackson wrote:
TheStig wrote:
Michael Jackson wrote:

Like Jimmy Butler. I bet Philly would have taken SGA gladly.

Or they could have just signed Jimmy and kept SGA and all those picks. And possibly used those assets for a big.



I’d they have the capspace? I know Miami dint and had to do a S&T, don’t know if the clips had enough space for 2 max.

They had cap space for 2 guys.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#331 » by Ice Man » Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:54 pm

MrSparkle wrote:Here are my All-NBA Bubble Teams:

1st team:

Murray
Butler
Leonard
James
Davis

2nd:

Mitchell
Harden
Doncic
Tatum
Jokic


The Top 10 playoff performances, per the VORP statistic. (I stole this from a post on the General Board.)

1.) Lebron James 2.43
2.) Anthony Davis 2.08
3.) Nikola Jokic 1.65
4.) Jimmy Butler 1.62
5.) Jamal Murray 1.50
6.) Kawhi Leonard 1.47
7.) Jayson tatum 1.42
8.) James Harden 1.28
9.) Bam Adebayo 1.03
10.) Giannis Antekounpo .92

Almost the same as your list, except VORP has Giannis and Bam instead of Mitchell and Luka, no doubt because the latter two guys went out in the first round.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#332 » by TheStig » Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:02 pm

Ice Man wrote:
dice wrote:7/2 lakers
4/1 clippers

13/2 bucks

12/1 celtics/warriors
14/1 nets/heat

20/1 nuggets/rockets/raps

30/1 mavs/sixers/blazers
40/1 pels/suns/jazz
60/1 thunder

100/1 hawks/bulls/pacers/grizz/wiz

4 worst projected teams in the league (cavs, pistons, knicks, hornets) all in the east, so bulls expected to battle for the 7/8 seeds :o


So of the league's top 17 teams, 12 are in the West. If you believe that, sure, the Bulls might get an #8 seed, maybe even better. But they would still be worse than OKC, NO, Phoenix, Utah, and either Mavs or Blazers. Which to be honest, is probably true.

I have no idea how the East can be inferior year after year, decade after decade.

The draft and FA haven't happened. Way to early to buy into odds.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#333 » by dice » Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:11 pm

TheStig wrote:
Ice Man wrote:
dice wrote:7/2 lakers
4/1 clippers

13/2 bucks

12/1 celtics/warriors
14/1 nets/heat

20/1 nuggets/rockets/raps

30/1 mavs/sixers/blazers
40/1 pels/suns/jazz
60/1 thunder

100/1 hawks/bulls/pacers/grizz/wiz

4 worst projected teams in the league (cavs, pistons, knicks, hornets) all in the east, so bulls expected to battle for the 7/8 seeds :o


So of the league's top 17 teams, 12 are in the West. If you believe that, sure, the Bulls might get an #8 seed, maybe even better. But they would still be worse than OKC, NO, Phoenix, Utah, and either Mavs or Blazers. Which to be honest, is probably true.

I have no idea how the East can be inferior year after year, decade after decade.

The draft and FA haven't happened. Way to early to buy into odds.

nothing can happen in the draft that would change the odds other than a major trade. and there's not much of a free agent market either - AD will almost certainly stay, restricted ingram will have any offer matched, biggest unrestricted name is...van vleet?
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#334 » by TheStig » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:50 am

dice wrote:
TheStig wrote:
Ice Man wrote:
So of the league's top 17 teams, 12 are in the West. If you believe that, sure, the Bulls might get an #8 seed, maybe even better. But they would still be worse than OKC, NO, Phoenix, Utah, and either Mavs or Blazers. Which to be honest, is probably true.

I have no idea how the East can be inferior year after year, decade after decade.

The draft and FA haven't happened. Way to early to buy into odds.

nothing can happen in the draft that would change the odds other than a major trade. and there's not much of a free agent market either - AD will almost certainly stay, restricted ingram will have any offer matched, biggest unrestricted name is...van vleet?

You can get a generational player in the draft and make a playoff run. But I mainly meant a draft day trade and other trades. No one saw PG13 getting traded and he did.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#335 » by dice » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:54 am

TheStig wrote:
dice wrote:
TheStig wrote:The draft and FA haven't happened. Way to early to buy into odds.

nothing can happen in the draft that would change the odds other than a major trade. and there's not much of a free agent market either - AD will almost certainly stay, restricted ingram will have any offer matched, biggest unrestricted name is...van vleet?

You can get a generational player in the draft and make a playoff run. But I mainly meant a draft day trade and other trades. No one saw PG13 getting traded and he did.

sure, but by that token you could say that we shouldn't buy into championship odds until after the trade deadline. and there aren't any perceived generational talents in this year's draft either, so it's highly unlikely that any major player will be dealt for a package that involves a top pick
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#336 » by Wingy » Wed Oct 14, 2020 1:54 am

Does Ty Lue have compromising photos of pretty much everyone in the league?
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#337 » by R3AL1TY » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:13 am

Ty Lue, Jeff Can Gundy, and Mark Jackson are the three stooges for head coaching job rumors, but they never get hired. At least Jeff never seems interested in coaching again and Lue doesn't want a short term contract.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#338 » by MrFortune3 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:24 am

R3AL1TY wrote:Ty Lue, Jeff Can Gundy, and Mark Jackson are the three stooges for head coaching job rumors, but they never get hired. At least Jeff never seems interested in coaching again and Lue doesn't want a short term contract.


Jackson never gets hired because of how his exit from GS went down and no one wants to touch that after review.

JVG is only leaving for the right situation and the one he desires to be in.

Lue is a good coach, he just thinks too highly of himself with regards to contract length.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#339 » by TheStig » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:50 am

dice wrote:
TheStig wrote:
dice wrote:nothing can happen in the draft that would change the odds other than a major trade. and there's not much of a free agent market either - AD will almost certainly stay, restricted ingram will have any offer matched, biggest unrestricted name is...van vleet?

You can get a generational player in the draft and make a playoff run. But I mainly meant a draft day trade and other trades. No one saw PG13 getting traded and he did.

sure, but by that token you could say that we shouldn't buy into championship odds until after the trade deadline. and there aren't any perceived generational talents in this year's draft either, so it's highly unlikely that any major player will be dealt for a package that involves a top pick

Not at all. There might be a big trade at the deadline. But lots of teams make trades and signings in the summer. It's a little different than a handful of small or financial deals at the deadline or someone adding a 7th man.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#340 » by Ice Man » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:27 pm

I don't see anything that will immediately move the East-West needle. There is a BIG talent discrepancy between the two conferences. One year's worth of FA shuffling, trades, and drafts can't do more than nudge the East in a better direction, particularly in a year with a meh FA class and a weak draft.

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