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Around The NBA

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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#381 » by kodo » Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:13 am

Morey did great even before the Harden trade, which was a game changer.

The Kevin Martin / Luis Scola greatly outperformed their talent level, winning 42-43 games in the WC. 4th best offense in the league with Martin & Aaron Brooks taking the shots.

Houston could have easily been irrelevant the last 10 years without Morey, as the old owner strictly forbade tanking and they were unlikely to have found a better star than Harden with their mediocre picks.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#382 » by ZOMG » Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:41 am

kodo wrote:Morey did great even before the Harden trade, which was a game changer.

The Kevin Martin / Luis Scola greatly outperformed their talent level, winning 42-43 games in the WC. 4th best offense in the league with Martin & Aaron Brooks taking the shots.

Houston could have easily been irrelevant the last 10 years without Morey, as the old owner strictly forbade tanking and they were unlikely to have found a better star than Harden with their mediocre picks.


Which talent level is that? Luis Scola is a career-long winner whose international accomplishments are comparable to Ginobili's. He's also a surefire Hall of Famer.

You make it sound like he's some random guy.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#383 » by Southpaw » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:59 am

Ice Man wrote:
Southpaw wrote:Yeah, I think Wade is the greatest Heat followed by Lebron while it's Magic then Kobe for the Lakers. I hate that stars nowadays jump ship from team to team to try and win a ring instead of sticking to one team and building a legacy there but that's the product of shorter contracts anf the media/fans pressure on players to win or be clowned.


Said it before and will say it again -- the fans share in the blame. I can't tell you how many times I read on realgm about how some guy is a winner because his team advanced in the playoffs and another guy is a loser because he can't get out of the first round. Then the players form superteams and the guy who used to be a loser (say, AD) now becomes regarded as a winner. Take KD. If he stays in OKC he might never have made the Finals. People pretended to be angry when he joined the Warriors, but now those same people talk about how great he is, in a way that they would not have had he stayed in OKC.

We have the arrangement that we, the fans, reward.

As a huge KG fan, I hear you. People used to rag on KG for failing to carry the Wolves deeper in the playoffs when in reality, they shouldn't even be making the playoffs with how poor their rosters are. But after he was traded to BOS and won, everything was forgotten.

As for KD, I don't think may people respect his titles with GSW. It's organization to go play with Kyrie in BKN. He wanted to prove that he can win a chip without the Warriors machine, a la Kobe minus Shaq.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#384 » by Leslie Forman » Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:46 am

ZOMG wrote:Which talent level is that? Luis Scola is a career-long winner whose international accomplishments are comparable to Ginobili's. He's also a surefire Hall of Famer.

You make it sound like he's some random guy.

He was a random guy. Just a mediocre starter/good backup type. Hall of Fame? Sure as hell not for anything he did in the NBA.

Hell, PJ Tucker at center? They were rolling out Chuck Hayes at center back then.

I will say, I don't know what the hell Morey was thinking by having Kevin McHale as his head coach for five years. That was a real WTFer. If he had gotten D'Antoni in earlier they could have really maximized that Harden/Lin/Parsons team.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#385 » by Southpaw » Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:02 am

I think both MIA and DAL are great destinations for Giannis.

DAL has a higher ceiling because they have the best player in Luka, and Giannis would be a great fit with Luka and KP but it could look/feel like the KD/Warriors situation where he joined another star player who is seen equal or better than him in Luka. Playing in the west is another negative.

With MIA he'd clearly be the best player and staying with the east would almost guarantee them a finals appearance. Also, the Heat FO led by Pat Riley can be relied upon and they have a lot of quality young players in Bam, Herro, Robinson and Nunn. You also have a superstar in Butler who's willing to do anything to win. His fit with Butler and Bam could be an issue but their defense would be suffocating.

Having said all that, I still wish he'd sign here and build the Bulls up with AKME and Donnovan or if not, he stay in MIL hahaha
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#386 » by ZOMG » Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:49 am

Leslie Forman wrote:He was a random guy. Just a mediocre starter/good backup type. Hall of Fame? Sure as hell not for anything he did in the NBA.


That's why it's not called the "NBA Hall of Fame". It's also why winning several NBA championships (even while playing an important role) isn't nearly enough to get you into the HOF.

Scola will get in, though. Not surprisingly, he was underrated and overlooked in the NBA, and still is.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#387 » by troza » Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:40 am

Southpaw wrote:
As for KD, I don't think may people respect his titles with GSW. It's organization to go play with Kyrie in BKN. He wanted to prove that he can win a chip without the Warriors machine, a la Kobe minus Shaq.


I will say this cause it is my honest opinion... KD was super stupid. Not that he was super stupid to move to Warriors... that was the obvious move when you have Lebron (and you believe that you are better than him) forming super team after super team and you are supposed to stay on OKC where you could have the super team but you saw them taking preference of some players besides others and those choices weren't the right ones (not paying Harden was the most obvious but also keeping Westbrook instead of Harden was bad... of course, I know what happened and at that time it made sense to keep him all that time).

But he was super stupid in his final moments on the Warriors:
- Playing in the finals putting his career on danger. This wasn't a game 7 or anything like that... they were down, he had to think of himself but decided to play for some stupid notion of reputation. Let's see if he gets back to that level.
- Deciding to leave... you had the best possible team to win tons of titles. Again... that stupid notion of reputation... Lebron doesn't even get a bad reputation anymore for joining top players after top players
- Deciding to play with Irving... He is an amazing player but after what happened in Boston why would you trade the Warriors for this?

I know... the Warriors without him only one against injured plagued rosters but they were good (not as good as people say they were or even the 73 say they were... in my opinion) and you were the one that made things unfair by going there. Win the rings, do not care about any narrative out there and stay healthy.

Instead of talking about Lebron now maybe we would be talking about Durant missing last year's final and getting back this year to win it all again. Sure they wouldn't have an answer for Davis... but would the Lakers have an answer to all that fire power?

As long as Lebron is there recruiting and forming super teams and playing with top players... this decision by Durant is super stupid. Wait, get less money for now, embrace the titles and move to another team (with superstars or something close to it) to win more money in the end.

When he was playing super well in the finals against Lebron people were even wondering if he was better than Lebron. He was playing very well, getting amazing numbers and in the first finals he even dominated when he didn't had to if the other Warriors were so good. That shows how well he was playing.

Now he will have a rookie coach, he might not ever recover from that injury and his co-star is worse than Lebron's co-star right now.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#388 » by FriedRise » Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:26 pm

Read on Twitter


Hey, we have a couple assistant coach openings.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#389 » by Southpaw » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:31 pm

troza wrote:
Southpaw wrote:
As for KD, I don't think may people respect his titles with GSW. It's organization to go play with Kyrie in BKN. He wanted to prove that he can win a chip without the Warriors machine, a la Kobe minus Shaq.


I will say this cause it is my honest opinion... KD was super stupid. Not that he was super stupid to move to Warriors... that was the obvious move when you have Lebron (and you believe that you are better than him) forming super team after super team and you are supposed to stay on OKC where you could have the super team but you saw them taking preference of some players besides others and those choices weren't the right ones (not paying Harden was the most obvious but also keeping Westbrook instead of Harden was bad... of course, I know what happened and at that time it made sense to keep him all that time).

But he was super stupid in his final moments on the Warriors:
- Playing in the finals putting his career on danger. This wasn't a game 7 or anything like that... they were down, he had to think of himself but decided to play for some stupid notion of reputation. Let's see if he gets back to that level.
- Deciding to leave... you had the best possible team to win tons of titles. Again... that stupid notion of reputation... Lebron doesn't even get a bad reputation anymore for joining top players after top players
- Deciding to play with Irving... He is an amazing player but after what happened in Boston why would you trade the Warriors for this?

I know... the Warriors without him only one against injured plagued rosters but they were good (not as good as people say they were or even the 73 say they were... in my opinion) and you were the one that made things unfair by going there. Win the rings, do not care about any narrative out there and stay healthy.

Instead of talking about Lebron now maybe we would be talking about Durant missing last year's final and getting back this year to win it all again. Sure they wouldn't have an answer for Davis... but would the Lakers have an answer to all that fire power?

As long as Lebron is there recruiting and forming super teams and playing with top players... this decision by Durant is super stupid. Wait, get less money for now, embrace the titles and move to another team (with superstars or something close to it) to win more money in the end.

When he was playing super well in the finals against Lebron people were even wondering if he was better than Lebron. He was playing very well, getting amazing numbers and in the first finals he even dominated when he didn't had to if the other Warriors were so good. That shows how well he was playing.

Now he will have a rookie coach, he might not ever recover from that injury and his co-star is worse than Lebron's co-star right now.

Totally agree. IMO, Durant decided based on his heart and not his head. He probably felt like he did everything to win back to back titles, even matching and outplaying Lebron but he doesn't have the respect he feels he deserves and will never get that as long as he's playing on Curry's team. And let's be honest, the Warriors will never be KD's team as long as Curry is there even if Durant is the superior player.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#390 » by troza » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:33 pm

Southpaw wrote:Totally agree. IMO, Durant decided based on his heart and not his head. He probably felt like he did everything to win back to back titles, even matching and outplaying Lebron but he doesn't have the respect he feels he deserves and will never get that as long as he's playing on Curry's team. And let's be honest, the Warriors will never be KD's team as long as Curry is there even if Durant is the superior player.


The thing is... with time, with him clearly being the best player on the team, he would get that recognition.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#391 » by kodo » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:35 pm

I'd have reservations about Payton because around Seattle he had a reputation as a rambling, incoherent guy you would mistake as a crazy person if he wasn't famous. Maybe he's mellowed out & stabilized in his old age.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#392 » by Southpaw » Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:49 pm

troza wrote:
Southpaw wrote:Totally agree. IMO, Durant decided based on his heart and not his head. He probably felt like he did everything to win back to back titles, even matching and outplaying Lebron but he doesn't have the respect he feels he deserves and will never get that as long as he's playing on Curry's team. And let's be honest, the Warriors will never be KD's team as long as Curry is there even if Durant is the superior player.


The thing is... with time, with him clearly being the best player on the team, he would get that recognition.

It probably would have, specially if they won a couple more titles and he was clearly the best player.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#393 » by MrFortune3 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:24 pm

troza wrote:
Southpaw wrote:Totally agree. IMO, Durant decided based on his heart and not his head. He probably felt like he did everything to win back to back titles, even matching and outplaying Lebron but he doesn't have the respect he feels he deserves and will never get that as long as he's playing on Curry's team. And let's be honest, the Warriors will never be KD's team as long as Curry is there even if Durant is the superior player.


The thing is... with time, with him clearly being the best player on the team, he would get that recognition.


I think the issue for KD was the Warriors being seen as Steph and Klay's team.
He was clearly the best player but no matter what he did, he was also the guy that came along to put them over the top again and not the guy who helped build it up.

Then his personality never truly meshed with the other Warriors. He has a different mindset and it fits with Kyrie but I don't think they're going to win nearly as much as the Warriors do.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#394 » by NecessaryEvil » Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:45 pm

FriedRise wrote:
Read on Twitter


Hey, we have a couple assistant coach openings.



After the way MJ clowned him on the last dance, I doubt he’d want anything to do with the Bulls
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#395 » by Michael Jackson » Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:57 pm

NecessaryEvil wrote:
FriedRise wrote:
Read on Twitter


Hey, we have a couple assistant coach openings.



After the way MJ clowned him on the last dance, I doubt he’d want anything to do with the Bulls



Except MJ owns the Hornets and GP’s Seattle team is now Thunderous. Mind you I don’t want anything to do with GP as an assistant honestly. He doesn’t seem like a good coach, he does not communicate very well imho. You have to be very succinct as a coach and he is a rambler. That being said an assistant is more running drills which he may be very good at.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#396 » by Michael Jackson » Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:45 pm

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DASMACKDOWN wrote:Think fast!

Who would you rather trade for Westbrook or CP3?


Paul and I don't think it's particularly close. One less year, and he looked laughably better last year and in the playoffs. I watched Westbrook and at times was convinced he had money on the Lakers. He looked like he was actively trying to lose games at times.



I really don’t like CP3 as a person,but I’ll take him over Russ. He doesn’t require athleticism to be effective and would be great for White to play with and learn how to be off shots around the trees. That being said don’t pine for him either. Paul is a much smarter basketball player though and you would be bringing him on for that reason.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#397 » by MrSparkle » Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:43 pm

So on the note of the potentially shrinking cap - owners whined about salaries and played hard-ball before the pandemic and China blackout - I imagine any team in the red is going to avoid signing free agents at anything above value unless they’re total superstars.

It’s been apparent that M. Reinsdorf is not holding back with expenses for the FO and coaching staff. In the end, Chicago Bulls are one of the biggest market teams (when winning) in basketball. Could be a good opportunity to get a leg up over 25 teams.

I feel like LAL, LAC, GSW, MIA and DAL are locked into some sort of FA success due to talent and ownership, but after that, CHI could get a strategic advantage due to revenue if they become buyers. Unless Grandpa Jerry starts barking and puts his foot down.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#398 » by Pax for Prez » Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:59 pm

MrSparkle wrote:So on the note of the potentially shrinking cap - owners whined about salaries and played hard-ball before the pandemic and China blackout - I imagine any team in the red is going to avoid signing free agents at anything above value unless they’re total superstars.

It’s been apparent that M. Reinsdorf is not holding back with expenses for the FO and coaching staff. In the end, Chicago Bulls are one of the biggest market teams (when winning) in basketball. Could be a good opportunity to get a leg up over 25 teams.

I feel like LAL, LAC, GSW, MIA and DAL are locked into some sort of FA success due to talent and ownership, but after that, CHI could get a strategic advantage due to revenue if they become buyers. Unless Grandpa Jerry starts barking and puts his foot down.


Agreed, I have been pleasantly surprised at the dollars spent and eaten so far this offseason by Uncle Jerry.

Our biggest issues might be available roster spots only 2 after singing our 1st rd pick (if all of Dunn, Valentine and Harrison are renounced), and our second round pick agrees to a 2 way deal.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#399 » by Ccwatercraft » Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:07 am

FriedRise wrote:
Read on Twitter


Hey, we have a couple assistant coach openings.


I'd rather they stick with established names for now. With that said I hope Billy has a list in mind along with AK's input and a team checkbook.
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Re: Around The NBA 

Post#400 » by TheStig » Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:52 am

Southpaw wrote:I think both MIA and DAL are great destinations for Giannis.

DAL has a higher ceiling because they have the best player in Luka, and Giannis would be a great fit with Luka and KP but it could look/feel like the KD/Warriors situation where he joined another star player who is seen equal or better than him in Luka. Playing in the west is another negative.

With MIA he'd clearly be the best player and staying with the east would almost guarantee them a finals appearance. Also, the Heat FO led by Pat Riley can be relied upon and they have a lot of quality young players in Bam, Herro, Robinson and Nunn. You also have a superstar in Butler who's willing to do anything to win. His fit with Butler and Bam could be an issue but their defense would be suffocating.

Having said all that, I still wish he'd sign here and build the Bulls up with AKME and Donnovan or if not, he stay in MIL hahaha

I think Dallas is the best fit. KP will spread the floor for him and Luka will get better at 3's. It would be really exciting to watch.

He might mentally fit in better with Jimmy and Bam but those 3 would be a pretty poor shooting team. Even if you started Duncan and Herro with them. It's just not enough shooting. Though I think they'd be an incredible suffocating defense with those 3.

The problem with Giannis is that he can't shoot. It's hard playing with another star because he can't really play off ball.

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