2020 NBA Draft Thread: Bulls pick 4th: PT 3

[PlayerUp]

I think people expecting or hoping for the Bulls to trade back are going to be sorely disappointed.

This is not the draft for that and I doubt AK is thinking about it. If anything, I would garner a guess that he's seeking to add more picks in addition to #4 to add to the talent pool.

It depends if any of these prospects standout during workouts. AK said yesterday in an interview that these players haven't played in 7 months so he is aware that many of them have made major progress since the last time we saw them.

The fact that we're working out point guards though and only get 10 prospects total we can workout makes me think he is leaning point guard this draft.

Here are the rumors we have heard so far:

Kira Lewis - Measurements look better than expected
Tyrell Terry - Measurements look better than expected
James Wiseman - Looks stronger than last time we saw him
Deni - Warriors were thrilled with what they saw with him
LaMelo - His interviews with teams have poor
Edwards - Worked out this week
Haliburton - Worked out last week

Watch on YouTube

;t=202s

Watch on YouTube

;t=86s

We'll hear more over the next couple weeks.

[MrFortune3]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

[Clint Eastwood]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

I hope so. I would prefer another bite at the apple with lavine, lauri, or carter as the bait. If its lavine, though, it better be for another top 4 pick plus something. For lauri or Wendell, it better be for another top 10 pick.

[PlayerUp]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

I'm sure he will try but how exactly without giving up a major piece? Would need to be very creative. AK draft history recently has been solid through:

2016: Jamal Murray
2017: Donovan Mitchell (Traded)
2018: Michael Porter
2019: Bol Bol

If he didn't make that 2017 move, Nuggets would have been favorites this year to win a championship.

[DuckIII]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

I hope so. I would prefer another bite at the apple with lavine, lauri, or carter as the bait. If its lavine, though, it better be for another top 4 pick plus something. For lauri or Wendell, it better be for another top 10 pick.

I would not trade Lavine for “a pick” in this draft. There is not one single prospect that safely projects to be better and Lavine’s scoring is badly needed.

I would absolutely trade LaVine, but in this particular draft the package would need to be pretty good if it’s just based on picks.

To me the move is to look to trade Lauri for a pick in the 7-11 range.

[Chi town]

Like him better than Kira due to shooting over slashing.

Go with the player with 1 better quality versus a player with multiple better qualities?

Kira Lewis Last 10 Games
47.5% 3PT
28 Total 3's Made

Tyrell Terry Last 10 Games
41.3% 3PT
19 Total 3's Made

Then factor in Lewis is pretty much better at everything else and younger. You sure you want Terry over Lewis?

Sure do. I like Terry’s IQ much better. Watch the video. He put up the highest scores on NBA IQ tests from GMs that the league has ever seen. He’s a late bloomer and will grow into his body.

I like Lewis. JMO but I believe slashing is much less important than creating 3s off the dribble. If you could guarantee me that Lewis could get 7-8 FTs per game and stay healthy it’s be a different story. I just don’t believe that w his slight frame.

I’m a big fan of Herro. Terry looks to be Herro 2.0

[Chi town]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

I hope so. I would prefer another bite at the apple with lavine, lauri, or carter as the bait. If its lavine, though, it better be for another top 4 pick plus something. For lauri or Wendell, it better be for another top 10 pick.

I would not trade Lavine for “a pick” in this draft. There is not one single prospect that safely projects to be better and Lavine’s scoring is badly needed.

I would absolutely trade LaVine, but in this particular draft the package would need to be pretty good if it’s just based on picks.

To me the move is to look to trade Lauri for a pick in the 7-11 range.

Me too. I like Patrick Williams as a 3D PF. He’d play better D than Lauri day one and have an advantage off the dribble against PFs too.

[Chi town]

Here is my projection for the top 8:

1) MIN - Edwards
2) GSW - Okongwu (I think they have to pick at 2, because who wants to trade up? To me: none. And Okongwu fits them great and I have him higher than Wiseman).
3) CHA - Wiseman (I can´t believe that Jordan takes Ball. He´s not hungry enough and due to his father).
4) NYK - Ball (I think that this is the only option to trade back. LaMelo will be available at 4 and NY wants him. So to me: Chicago gets Pick 8 + 27
5) CLE - Avdija (Playmaking ability in addition to their scoring guards)
6) ATL - Okoro/Vassell/Haliburton (not sure who of them, defense next to Trey).
7) DET - Toppin
8) CHI - Hayes

I would love to get Hayes at 8. But maybe Detroit picks him up. Then take him at 4.

I don´t want Avdija at 4, I miss his star potential. Hayes has size, can play 1 and 2, has upside as a 3-level-scorer. And fits next to Coby.

I think the Bulls can do a little bit better than #8 + #27 for #4. Certainly include one of those future Dallas Mavericks Picks maybe the 2023 one at least.

Agreed. 27 isn’t enough. I’d look to love our 2nd and move up to late teens too. Nab Nesmith.

[Chi town]

AK is going to go with the highest ceiling player because he believes in his player development guys. I don’t think he cares about fit at all.

[sco]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

Just your hopes or anything to base them on?

[holv03]

Anthony Edward's should be our pick if we are able to land him. He is the only player in the draft that I would consider trading Lavine for.

[sco]

Anthony Edward's should be our pick if we are able to land him. He is the only player in the draft that I would consider trading Lavine for.

Would like him as a pick, but IMO, not worth trading Zach for. Would want more for Zach.

[MGB8]

Anthony Edward's should be our pick if we are able to land him. He is the only player in the draft that I would consider trading Lavine for.

Would like him as a pick, but IMO, not worth trading Zach for. Would want more for Zach.

It's a close call, for me. On the one hand, Zach right now is the better player, an efficient, really elite, shooter from distance, and can play both on and off ball (yes, he can play off ball --- but the rarely structured the offense to make him do that last season --- when the Bulls did that, Lavine looked good - maybe at his best). Meanwhile, for all his explosive powerhouse athleticism, Edwards is still an unknown.

BUT.... Edwards will also be on a rookie deal, as opposed to LaVine's current value-ish deal expiring after next season. If the Wolves called and offered #1 and Culver plus any other needed cap filler for LaVine (note - NOT LaVine and #4 - just for LaVine, or maybe LaVine and Hutch to offset their loss of Culver) - I'd probably do it. Not to knock LaVine - just because of the extra flexibility that brings going forward. It might even be something like LaVine + Hutch for J.Johnson + Culver + #1.

Then I might even see if I could send WCJ and #4 to the Warriors for #2 and a heavily protected future first round pick, a la top 20 or even top 24 protected (and any needed salary), take Wiseman. I figure that WCJ is worth a later lotto pick in most drafts (at this point in his rookie deal and at just 21 years old), and that seems a bit much to pay to move from #2 to #4, so offset with a very late first round pick down the line.

Bulls would then look like:

"1": White, Sato, Archi
"2": Edwards, Valentine, (Sato/Culver)
"3": Porter, Culver, (Sato/Valentine)
"4": Markkanen, Young, J.Johnson
"5": Wiseman/Gafford, Kornet, Grimace

[sco]

Anthony Edward's should be our pick if we are able to land him. He is the only player in the draft that I would consider trading Lavine for.

Would like him as a pick, but IMO, not worth trading Zach for. Would want more for Zach.

It's a close call, for me. On the one hand, Zach right now is the better player, an efficient, really elite, shooter from distance, and can play both on and off ball (yes, he can play off ball --- but the rarely structured the offense to make him do that last season --- when the Bulls did that, Lavine looked good - maybe at his best). Meanwhile, for all his explosive powerhouse athleticism, Edwards is still an unknown.

BUT.... Edwards will also be on a rookie deal, as opposed to LaVine's current value-ish deal expiring after next season. If the Wolves called and offered #1 and Culver plus any other needed cap filler for LaVine (note - NOT LaVine and #4 - just for LaVine, or maybe LaVine and Hutch to offset their loss of Culver) - I'd probably do it. Not to knock LaVine - just because of the extra flexibility that brings going forward. It might even be something like LaVine + Hutch for J.Johnson + Culver + #1.

Then I might even see if I could send WCJ and #4 to the Warriors for #2 and a heavily protected future first round pick, a la top 20 or even top 24 protected (and any needed salary), take Wiseman. I figure that WCJ is worth a later lotto pick in most drafts (at this point in his rookie deal and at just 21 years old), and that seems a bit much to pay to move from #2 to #4, so offset with a very late first round pick down the line.

Bulls would then look like:

"1": White, Sato, Archi
"2": Edwards, Valentine, (Sato/Culver)
"3": Porter, Culver, (Sato/Valentine)
"4": Markkanen, Young, J.Johnson
"5": Wiseman/Gafford, Kornet, Grimace

Yeah, IMO, teams with more than 2 young guys, both suck and the young guys tend not to get better on the same trajectory as teams with mostly vets.

The fact that we'd have guys on rookie deals only matters if we're landing stud vets on max deals, that I don't see happening, because those guys don't want to be on teams with guys in their first and second years because they make a ton of mistakes.

[PlayerUp]

Onyeka Okongwu Workout

He has started developing a 3PT shot. His form looks ugly. Way too slow of a release as well he'll never get that shot off in the NBA. Obviously one step at a time but his range has been extended since we last saw him.

Watch on YouTube

[Grodoboldo]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

I hope so. I would prefer another bite at the apple with lavine, lauri, or carter as the bait. If its lavine, though, it better be for another top 4 pick plus something. For lauri or Wendell, it better be for another top 10 pick.

I would not trade Lavine for “a pick” in this draft. There is not one single prospect that safely projects to be better and Lavine’s scoring is badly needed.

I would absolutely trade LaVine, but in this particular draft the package would need to be pretty good if it’s just based on picks.

To me the move is to look to trade Lauri for a pick in the 7-11 range.

Completely agree. I'd touch base with every team between 7-22 to see if something could be arranged. But in the end, I doubt any team accepts that trade.

[Grodoboldo]

Onyeka Okongwu Workout

He has started developing a 3PT shot. His form looks ugly. Way too slow of a release as well he'll never get that shot off in the NBA. Obviously one step at a time but his range has been extended since we last saw him.

Watch on YouTube

I agree that it's a step. But if I'm not mistaken, Simmons was also draining threes in a draft workout. So, you know, buyers beware.

[qianlong]

Here is my projection for the top 8:

1) MIN - Edwards
2) GSW - Okongwu (I think they have to pick at 2, because who wants to trade up? To me: none. And Okongwu fits them great and I have him higher than Wiseman).
3) CHA - Wiseman (I can´t believe that Jordan takes Ball. He´s not hungry enough and due to his father).
4) NYK - Ball (I think that this is the only option to trade back. LaMelo will be available at 4 and NY wants him. So to me: Chicago gets Pick 8 + 27
5) CLE - Avdija (Playmaking ability in addition to their scoring guards)
6) ATL - Okoro/Vassell/Haliburton (not sure who of them, defense next to Trey).
7) DET - Toppin
8) CHI - Hayes

I would love to get Hayes at 8. But maybe Detroit picks him up. Then take him at 4.

I don´t want Avdija at 4, I miss his star potential. Hayes has size, can play 1 and 2, has upside as a 3-level-scorer. And fits next to Coby.

I think the Bulls can do a little bit better than #8 + #27 for #4. Certainly include one of those future Dallas Mavericks Picks maybe the 2023 one at least.

Agreed. 27 isn’t enough. I’d look to love our 2nd and move up to late teens too. Nab Nesmith.

This should probably go in the trade thread but the following is my goal scenario:
Trade 4 to NY for 8 + 27 + dallas pick or next year protected pick.
Trade to Philly lavine + 27 + dallas pick or next year protected pick from NY for Simmons. Some additional pieces could be moved to match, like Thad or Markanen and Richardson.
Select Tyrell Terry, or Hayes, Kira or Haliburton.
Resulting line up:

Tyrell Terry/White/Porter/Simmons/Carter. Versatile line up with three players that can play two positions, three shooters, three good defenders. Add in Markanen as a potential 6th man that can play at pf or some minutes at Center to stretch the floor.

[Clint Eastwood]

I agree that prospects have improved. I just think that AK wants another 1st in addition to #4 and doesn’t plan on trading down.

I hope so. I would prefer another bite at the apple with lavine, lauri, or carter as the bait. If its lavine, though, it better be for another top 4 pick plus something. For lauri or Wendell, it better be for another top 10 pick.

I would not trade Lavine for “a pick” in this draft. There is not one single prospect that safely projects to be better and Lavine’s scoring is badly needed.

I would absolutely trade LaVine, but in this particular draft the package would need to be pretty good if it’s just based on picks.

To me the move is to look to trade Lauri for a pick in the 7-11 range.

I did say a top 4 pick plus something. But to me, if we are even considering a package for Lavine, its because we either don’t think his ceiling is that of a top option on a winning team, or that we feel whatever he will become will be not worth the amount of cap it will take to keep him past this current contract. To me, I fall in that category. So I would rather take another bite at the apple as I said. Might turn out to be a bad move, but in the end, his salary slot can be filled with a free agent or future trade anyway which would mitigate it if a mistake.

I do prefer trading Lauri for a 7-11 pick as well but I really have no feel if that is even a remote possibility.

[DuckIII]

My bad, you did say “plus something.” I would trade LaVine for a top 3 pick plus another asset of reasonable value. Especially if the FO views White as a Lavine replacement (which I don’t).