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OT: COVID-19 thread #4

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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#361 » by PlayerUp » Sun Jan 24, 2021 3:55 am

Chi town wrote:Also Spain is now enforcing N95 masks. Cloth masks no longer acceptable.


Cloth masks are pretty useless by all the stats I have seen. People around me think they're beneficial say they don't need N95 masks. That's a big problem and also why many are getting COVID still because they don't have the proper gear.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#362 » by PlayerUp » Sun Jan 24, 2021 4:01 am

TheSuzerain wrote:What should happen is that Vaccines should be made basically mandatory (even if we need the market to make that happen instead of overt government action because Americans are babies about that stuff).

That's how you prevent COVID from sticking around.


While I agree with this, it's going to be extremely difficult to get the entire nation to vaccinate themselves. You may get a high % but no way 100% of people get vaccinated.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#363 » by dice » Sun Jan 24, 2021 5:06 am

PlayerUp wrote:
Chi town wrote:Also Spain is now enforcing N95 masks. Cloth masks no longer acceptable.


Cloth masks are pretty useless by all the stats I have seen.

a simple google search provides a world of evidence that they are useful. and common sense should suggest the same. even pulling a shirt up over your face would have SOME positive effect
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#364 » by dice » Sun Jan 24, 2021 5:10 am

PlayerUp wrote:
TheSuzerain wrote:What should happen is that Vaccines should be made basically mandatory (even if we need the market to make that happen instead of overt government action because Americans are babies about that stuff).

That's how you prevent COVID from sticking around.


While I agree with this, it's going to be extremely difficult to get the entire nation to vaccinate themselves. You may get a high % but no way 100% of people get vaccinated.

i keep hearing that the target number is around 75% in order to drastically reduce the spread
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#365 » by dice » Sun Jan 24, 2021 5:16 am

PlayerUp wrote:
Chi town wrote:What does everyone think about Bezos and Amazon now stepping up to the plate to get the vaccine out much quicker?


Why couldn't they help out sooner is my question? That said, anytime a big tech company can help out of course it's a major plus.

trump regularly trashes bezos, so perhaps that had something to do with it. amazon offered to help out individual states last month
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#366 » by PlayerUp » Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:02 am

dice wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:
Chi town wrote:Also Spain is now enforcing N95 masks. Cloth masks no longer acceptable.


Cloth masks are pretty useless by all the stats I have seen.

a simple google search provides a world of evidence that they are useful. and common sense should suggest the same. even pulling a shirt up over your face would have SOME positive effect


Well I said pretty useless. Of course anything is helpful rather than nothing even holding your breath around people can work but cloth masks are not effective enough to be a real solution to combating the virus. You need an efficient mask solution which they are not.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#367 » by PlayerUp » Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:03 am

dice wrote:trump regularly trashes bezos, so perhaps that had something to do with it. amazon offered to help out individual states last month


Was not aware of that state assistance he offered.

Trump attacks are warranted with some, not with most. Bezos is not the core problem with mega billionaires in my opinion. He has greatly helped the middle class. Problem is the ones who stay private and are a burden to the economy.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#368 » by Dez » Sun Jan 24, 2021 9:58 am

PlayerUp wrote:
dice wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:
Cloth masks are pretty useless by all the stats I have seen.

a simple google search provides a world of evidence that they are useful. and common sense should suggest the same. even pulling a shirt up over your face would have SOME positive effect


Well I said pretty useless. Of course anything is helpful rather than nothing even holding your breath around people can work but cloth masks are not effective enough to be a real solution to combating the virus. You need an efficient mask solution which they are not.


Yes they are, they are very effective.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#369 » by PlayerUp » Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:55 am

Dez wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:
dice wrote:a simple google search provides a world of evidence that they are useful. and common sense should suggest the same. even pulling a shirt up over your face would have SOME positive effect


Well I said pretty useless. Of course anything is helpful rather than nothing even holding your breath around people can work but cloth masks are not effective enough to be a real solution to combating the virus. You need an efficient mask solution which they are not.


Yes they are, they are very effective.


What data are you guys looking at here? I'm referencing generic cloth masks. They are far less efficient than these other masks.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#370 » by molepharmer » Sun Jan 24, 2021 2:16 pm

Generally, masks are primarily worn by the user to minimize transmission of the virus. Which should be obvious that talking/coughing through a mask would decrease the amount of virus getting through to the environment.

On the other hand, masks offer very little protection by the user from getting the virus (last I looked at the data). Which again should be clear since if you walk through a viral environment, the virus could be picked up by your clothes, hands, face, eyes, etc, and even on your mask. Another reason why they strongly urge hand washing, so that you don't transmit the virus from your hands to your mouth, nose, etc.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#371 » by dougthonus » Sun Jan 24, 2021 3:24 pm

PlayerUp wrote:Well I said pretty useless. Of course anything is helpful rather than nothing even holding your breath around people can work but cloth masks are not effective enough to be a real solution to combating the virus. You need an efficient mask solution which they are not.


I think cloth masks are actually quite effective if you had 100% compliance. They massively reduce your ability to spread the virus widely into the air and somewhat reduce your ability to take in a large viral load if it is around. If everyone wore properly fittedN95s then it might be 99.99% effective, but if everyone wore cloth masks 100% of the time, it'd still probably be 70% effective which when looking at something that hops from person to person lowers the number of cases by an order of magnitude.

I guess it depends on what you mean by effective in combating the virus, cloth masks will probably never wipe it out completely, whereas if people 100% wore N95s all the time, you could probably wipe it out completely, so cloth masks are more of a containment strategy.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#372 » by dougthonus » Sun Jan 24, 2021 3:26 pm

PlayerUp wrote:Was not aware of that state assistance he offered.

Trump attacks are warranted with some, not with most. Bezos is not the core problem with mega billionaires in my opinion. He has greatly helped the middle class. Problem is the ones who stay private and are a burden to the economy.


I'm not an expert on Bezos, but I think he might actually be the worst of people hitting middle America. Any extremely successful products on Amazon from small businesses and Amazon will make a replica and sell it for less. The rise of online shopping in general, and Amazon's perfection of it also is probably the biggest destroyer of small local owned businesses.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#373 » by Dresden » Sun Jan 24, 2021 5:42 pm

dougthonus wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:Was not aware of that state assistance he offered.

Trump attacks are warranted with some, not with most. Bezos is not the core problem with mega billionaires in my opinion. He has greatly helped the middle class. Problem is the ones who stay private and are a burden to the economy.


I'm not an expert on Bezos, but I think he might actually be the worst of people hitting middle America. Any extremely successful products on Amazon from small businesses and Amazon will make a replica and sell it for less. The rise of online shopping in general, and Amazon's perfection of it also is probably the biggest destroyer of small local owned businesses.


I never thought about that- how for many products you see an "Amazon Basics" option. It makes sense though- they can see what is selling well, then just contact the manufacturer and start making it themselves, cutting out the middle man. It would suck if my business was selling, say, candles, and I had a good product, and next thing you know, you see an "Amazon Basics" candle that looks just like yours, but is 10% cheaper.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#374 » by HomoSapien » Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:50 pm

Yeah, for that reason I never purchase the Amazon basic option.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#375 » by CobyWhite0 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 9:16 pm

Chi town wrote:What does everyone think about Bezos and Amazon now stepping up to the plate to get the vaccine out much quicker?

Also Spain is now enforcing N95 masks. Cloth masks no longer acceptable.


Call me skeptical, but when I google "spain mandatory n95 masks", I get absolutely nothing saying that Spain has made N95 mandatory.
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#376 » by step » Sun Jan 24, 2021 9:42 pm

PlayerUp wrote:
Chi town wrote:What does everyone think about Bezos and Amazon now stepping up to the plate to get the vaccine out much quicker?


Why couldn't they help out sooner is my question? That said, anytime a big tech company can help out of course it's a major plus.

The offer was there before... but Trump doesn't like Bezos, so...
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#377 » by dice » Mon Jan 25, 2021 1:31 am

step wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:
Chi town wrote:What does everyone think about Bezos and Amazon now stepping up to the plate to get the vaccine out much quicker?


Why couldn't they help out sooner is my question? That said, anytime a big tech company can help out of course it's a major plus.

The offer was there before... but Trump doesn't like Bezos, so...

do you have a source on bezos having offered the trump admin. assistance? he should have publicly made that offer even if he knew that trump would reject it

also, there's rightfully suspicion that amazon is doing this to increase their exposure to the health care industry. the biden admin. should be careful about facilitating that
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#378 » by dice » Mon Jan 25, 2021 1:32 am

HomoSapien wrote:Yeah, for that reason I never purchase the Amazon basic option.

i'll pay a bit more for something at a non-walmart location for the same reason
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#379 » by dice » Mon Jan 25, 2021 1:35 am

dougthonus wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:Was not aware of that state assistance he offered.

Trump attacks are warranted with some, not with most. Bezos is not the core problem with mega billionaires in my opinion. He has greatly helped the middle class. Problem is the ones who stay private and are a burden to the economy.


I'm not an expert on Bezos, but I think he might actually be the worst of people hitting middle America. Any extremely successful products on Amazon from small businesses and Amazon will make a replica and sell it for less. The rise of online shopping in general, and Amazon's perfection of it also is probably the biggest destroyer of small local owned businesses.

i hear intelligent people note that bezos is this massive job creator, but the reality is that amazon isn't doing anything that wasn't being done already by countless smaller businesses. the jobs that he has "created" had to be destroyed first
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Re: OT: COVID-19 thread #4 

Post#380 » by step » Mon Jan 25, 2021 2:11 am

dice wrote:
step wrote:
PlayerUp wrote:
Why couldn't they help out sooner is my question? That said, anytime a big tech company can help out of course it's a major plus.

The offer was there before... but Trump doesn't like Bezos, so...

do you have a source on bezos having offered the trump admin. assistance? he should have publicly made that offer even if he knew that trump would reject it

also, there's rightfully suspicion that amazon is doing this to increase their exposure to the health care industry. the biden admin. should be careful about facilitating that

Amazon have issued public comments refuting the accusations that they never offered Trump assistance, so we can only take that at face value.

I mean given the track record of Trump and co, I know who I'd lean towards believing first.

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