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I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in.

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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#61 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:56 pm

TheHrvReport wrote:
IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:
TheHrvReport wrote:The people who are saying they want a complete roster overhaul and miraculously go from 22 win team to playoffs are the same people who will say "i knew we shouldn't have traded X player" if AK actually got rid of one of Coby/Zach/Lauri/Wendell and they broke out somewhere else. Give me a break. Just be happy we got GarPax and Boylen out and we (hopefully) will not be the laughing stock of the league anymore.


I'm not asking for a complete roster overhaul so I'll exclude myself from that statement. But to just be happy that Garpax and Boylen are out? Sorry I can't just be happy about that. I mean I am happy with that but what difference does it make if we are the same team with a different front office? I mean I root for the entertainers that are playing out on the basketball court not the guys wearing the suits.

There is no point in trying to improve through trades at this point considering everyones trade value is at its lowest. And it also makes little sense to handicap our cap flexibility trying to sign mediocre free agents this season. AK/ME have preached player development from the beginning, with that we'll get a better idea of how good our players can become and even raise their value on the trade market to THEN start making moves.


Well first off I don't think anyone is asking to sign mediocre free agents. I'm all for player development but some of these players had their chance to develop already and they are what they are. But thats besides the point.

I'm not the GM obviously, I don't have the professional insight that they do. But as a fan I don't necessarily need to dig into that stuff to see that this team needs improvement and if no improvements are made then we are only to assume that we are settling for mediocrity until we "evaluate" or "develop" the players we already have with another set of coaches and/or let the current vet contracts expire. That is not a very exciting outcome from getting what we thought was a front office that was going to build a better product than the previous front office. But if we plan on using their leftovers then I guess some of us fans are just going to have to be patient....sigh
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#62 » by sco » Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:59 pm

IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:Everyone wants to keep saying the direction is "clear". Maybe it is for you guys but its not for me. An evaluation period, a developmental period? Thats what we've been doing with this roster.

So if he is saying he doesn't plan on drafting that high again that means he doesn't plan on having as bad of a season so that means he expects improvement. Well if its not going to come with roster changes then I guess he believes in the new coaching staff to work wonders on our current roster. That statement tells me they don't plan on rebuilding. So we are just conceding this season then but we're not tanking so we will be mediocre just to evaluate our future because they can't do this based on past performance or they want to see them under a real coach? ok then. I can guess a plan based on the obvious lack of moves just like the rest of you. But regardless, the direction hasn't been made clear for this upcoming season. We're just assuming. Maybe thats just because you can't tell your fanbase that you're not really trying this season.

I said this in another thread, I think the plan is to see if the current young core can lift this team to the playoffs - which would be a big step forward and likely mean that we have one or two real keepers on the roster. If not, we get the benefit of another lottery ticket. I think the mistake would be to add enough non-core talent to lift the guys up if they weren't getting there on their own. Moreover, there weren't any true, long-term #1 option guys that we could get via trade or FA, again supporting the notion of trying to "grow their own" this season.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#63 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:04 pm

sco wrote:
IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:Everyone wants to keep saying the direction is "clear". Maybe it is for you guys but its not for me. An evaluation period, a developmental period? Thats what we've been doing with this roster.

So if he is saying he doesn't plan on drafting that high again that means he doesn't plan on having as bad of a season so that means he expects improvement. Well if its not going to come with roster changes then I guess he believes in the new coaching staff to work wonders on our current roster. That statement tells me they don't plan on rebuilding. So we are just conceding this season then but we're not tanking so we will be mediocre just to evaluate our future because they can't do this based on past performance or they want to see them under a real coach? ok then. I can guess a plan based on the obvious lack of moves just like the rest of you. But regardless, the direction hasn't been made clear for this upcoming season. We're just assuming. Maybe thats just because you can't tell your fanbase that you're not really trying this season.

I said this in another thread, I think the plan is to see if the current young core can lift this team to the playoffs - which would be a big step forward and likely mean that we have one or two real keepers on the roster. If not, we get the benefit of another lottery ticket. I think the mistake would be to add enough non-core talent to lift the guys up if they weren't getting there on their own. Moreover, there weren't any true, long-term #1 option guys that we could get via trade or FA, again supporting the notion of trying to "grow their own" this season.


I understand what you and some of the others are saying about our direction. Its still a confusing position for a team to be in for the fans whether a handful of them "know" the plan going forward or not. We are somewhere in the middle of we will develop and try to win but if we suck we will get another lottery pick. Well that is more confusing than we are dumping all our vets and tanking or we are making a splash and trying to win. Its just very understandable for a fan to be confused about the direction of this team. Know what I'm saying?
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#64 » by MrFortune3 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:17 pm

TheSuzerain wrote:
MrFortune3 wrote:I don’t understand where the confusion lies. AK and Evs made it abundantly clear what their plan was for this year. They wanted to dive in and find out why players regressed, get a revamped developmental staff in place and move forward with the roster.

I don’t know why people kept expecting them to completely tear it down and move everyone.

Well there's still a lot that doesn't make sense.

If we're trying to rehab the value of the bigs, why did we not add an actual NBA playmaker?

If we're really trying to fill the team with versatile, 2-way, high IQ players, doesn't that rule out half of our "core" by default?


Because they like Coby. They’ve named him among players they like constantly.
They’re trying to open things up on offense for him, Zach and WCJ.
You just added Williams who has an improving handle and you have Donovan who loves ball movement.

They have named players on the team they liked and mentioned them constantly. Clearly they plan to develop them.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#65 » by Michael Jackson » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:25 pm

IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:
sco wrote:
IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:Everyone wants to keep saying the direction is "clear". Maybe it is for you guys but its not for me. An evaluation period, a developmental period? Thats what we've been doing with this roster.

So if he is saying he doesn't plan on drafting that high again that means he doesn't plan on having as bad of a season so that means he expects improvement. Well if its not going to come with roster changes then I guess he believes in the new coaching staff to work wonders on our current roster. That statement tells me they don't plan on rebuilding. So we are just conceding this season then but we're not tanking so we will be mediocre just to evaluate our future because they can't do this based on past performance or they want to see them under a real coach? ok then. I can guess a plan based on the obvious lack of moves just like the rest of you. But regardless, the direction hasn't been made clear for this upcoming season. We're just assuming. Maybe thats just because you can't tell your fanbase that you're not really trying this season.

I said this in another thread, I think the plan is to see if the current young core can lift this team to the playoffs - which would be a big step forward and likely mean that we have one or two real keepers on the roster. If not, we get the benefit of another lottery ticket. I think the mistake would be to add enough non-core talent to lift the guys up if they weren't getting there on their own. Moreover, there weren't any true, long-term #1 option guys that we could get via trade or FA, again supporting the notion of trying to "grow their own" this season.


I understand what you and some of the others are saying about our direction. Its still a confusing position for a team to be in for the fans whether a handful of them "know" the plan going forward or not. We are somewhere in the middle of we will develop and try to win but if we suck we will get another lottery pick. Well that is more confusing than we are dumping all our vets and tanking or we are making a splash and trying to win. Its just very understandable for a fan to be confused about the direction of this team. Know what I'm saying?



While that is fair I think the mediocre next season is to be expected. They have to know what their assets are to make a decision, so far it has been the plan to get the organization in line to give these guys a chance to succeed and if not them, the structure to succeed is set. Going for a win now is not wise as we don’t have the path to it at this second, perhaps by the trade deadline we will know what some of these guys futures are (WCJ, Otto, Lauri, Hutch, Coby (we know what LaVine is)) and make moves from there. It’s the smartest plan at this point. I have heard rumblings that PWill is supposed to be a Lauri replacement because as he grows and fills out he maybe more of a 4. So maybe a Lauri trade etc.... we don’t know as fans because well the GM generally doesn’t broad as it except in Philly where it was so extreme it had to be and he literally had a process. The Bulls aren’t good and don’t have a magic pill to take to change that overnight, in a weak FA class no money and a weak draft. They did what the could in trying to make the culture of this team better but that’s about all they really could do. Could hey get a Harden? Maybe but timelines aren’t amazing with that either as adding harden even without giving up assets doesn’t make us a contender. So yes we are definitely stuck in limbo until the season starts and beyond. If we are just as clueless after next seasons draft that is cause for concern but for right now it makes decent enough sense.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#66 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:27 pm

Michael Jackson wrote:
IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:
sco wrote:I said this in another thread, I think the plan is to see if the current young core can lift this team to the playoffs - which would be a big step forward and likely mean that we have one or two real keepers on the roster. If not, we get the benefit of another lottery ticket. I think the mistake would be to add enough non-core talent to lift the guys up if they weren't getting there on their own. Moreover, there weren't any true, long-term #1 option guys that we could get via trade or FA, again supporting the notion of trying to "grow their own" this season.


I understand what you and some of the others are saying about our direction. Its still a confusing position for a team to be in for the fans whether a handful of them "know" the plan going forward or not. We are somewhere in the middle of we will develop and try to win but if we suck we will get another lottery pick. Well that is more confusing than we are dumping all our vets and tanking or we are making a splash and trying to win. Its just very understandable for a fan to be confused about the direction of this team. Know what I'm saying?



While that is fair I think the mediocre next season is to be expected. They have to know what their assets are to make a decision, so far it has been the plan to get the organization in line to give these guys a chance to succeed and if not them, the structure to succeed is set. Going for a win now is not wise as we don’t have the path to it at this second, perhaps by the trade deadline we will know what some of these guys futures are (WCJ, Otto, Lauri, Hutch, Coby (we know what LaVine is)) and make moves from there. It’s the smartest plan at this point. I have heard rumblings that PWill is supposed to be a Lauri replacement because as he grows and fills out he maybe more of a 4. So maybe a Lauri trade etc.... we don’t know as fans because well the GM generally doesn’t broad as it except in Philly where it was so extreme it had to be and he literally had a process. The Bulls aren’t good and don’t have a magic pill to take to change that overnight, in a weak FA class no money and a weak draft. They did what the could in trying to make the culture of this team better but that’s about all they really could do. Could hey get a Harden? Maybe but timelines aren’t amazing with that either as adding harden even without giving up assets doesn’t make us a contender. So yes we are definitely stuck in limbo until the season starts and beyond. If we are just as clueless after next seasons draft that is cause for concern but for right now it makes decent enough sense.


I hear you but do they really need to see these guys play another season to know what to do with them? I don't :lol:
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#67 » by Red8911 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:21 pm

With a new President/Gm coming in I expected more immediate roster changes especially after the current roster failed last year. Maybe AK will make moves before the season starts but if he doesn’t it would be a bit disappointing.

He keeps saying that he wants to compete right away but how does he expect that to happen with pretty much the same roster ? I guess a healthy Otto makes a big difference but relying on him isn’t the best idea.Unless his real plan is to throw another season away? Not sure what his plan is either, all I know is if it was Paxson doing nothing everyone would go crazy on him.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#68 » by the ultimates » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:47 pm

They want to see that they have in the young players on the roster. People can't say coaching held some of these guys back and then with a better coach in Donovan not see what they could be. You can't say you want young upside players like Williams and then moan and groan about it. If some of the numerous high draft picks on the roster take a step forward due to better coaching you could be competing for a playoff spot. I'd much rather see that and be fine no matter how it turns out than make moves and give money to average free agents just because AK said they want to compete right away.
Losing to get high draft picks and hoping they turn into franchise players is not some next level, genius move. That's what teams want to happen in any rebuild/tank or whatever you want to market it as.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#69 » by PhilLeotardo » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:09 pm

Short answer: a better direction than the franchise has been headed in since 1995. That’s 25 YEARS, a quarter of a century

Good grief lmao, just let the man go to work

The nightmare is over! Let the professionals do their jobs & give them your support

PaxGar seriously decimated this fan base to smithereens. You can really see it now posthumously, just how much they rotted the fan base out from the inside. This board & the reddit sub are two of the most toxic places in the sports internet realm

Fans have gotten so used to having to root for a franchise “run” by completely rotten, nasty individuals & to just expect failure, that now all they can do is come up with different scenarios in which the team will fail miserably lol

18 years, & only one ECF appearance, y’all. Never ever forget
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#70 » by Dez » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:25 pm

PhilLeotardo wrote:Short answer: a better direction than the franchise has been headed in since 1995. That’s 25 YEARS, a quarter of a century

Good grief lmao, just let the man go to work

The nightmare is over! Let the professionals do their jobs & give them your support

PaxGar seriously decimated this fan base to smithereens. You can really see it now posthumously, just how much they rotted the fan base out from the inside. This board & the reddit sub are two of the most toxic places in the sports internet realm

Fans have gotten so used to having to root for a franchise “run” by completely rotten, nasty individuals & to just expect failure, that now all they can do is come up with different scenarios in which the team will fail miserably lol

18 years, & only one ECF appearance, y’all. Never ever forget


Seriously this FO has done nothing yet for you to be fellating them so much.

Also it was GarPax....GARPAX!
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#71 » by ChettheJet » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:39 pm

Red8911 wrote:With a new President/Gm coming in I expected more immediate roster changes especially after the current roster failed last year. Maybe AK will make moves before the season starts but if he doesn’t it would be a bit disappointing.

He keeps saying that he wants to compete right away but how does he expect that to happen with pretty much the same roster ? I guess a healthy Otto makes a big difference but relying on him isn’t the best idea.Unless his real plan is to throw another season away? Not sure what his plan is either, all I know is if it was Paxson doing nothing everyone would go crazy on him.



With so many teams making so many moves I would really like to see the Bulls pull the trigger on something. Part of that is take the chance on making some changes, not just simple additions from the draft and for the bench. If the way AK does things is to keep everything quiet until it happens, I'm fine with that, so long as there's something happening.

I don't know if AK is reluctant to trade anybody because he sees talent but with everyone being injured for some part of last season, he wants to wait and see if they can come back healthy and see what the assembled group can do when healthy. OR is it my fear that he's making calls and there's nobody interested in what he's got to offer. It's unlikely that he's overvaluing what he's got and is asking for too much and more likely he doesn't have much to offer that anybody else thinks helps their team. And that ain't good.

After some of the drafts and moves what I'm looking at are

ATL has signed a couple of big ticket FAs and look like they are taking the development minutes from some of their young recent picks. They really could consider moving some of them
MINN the same drafted, signed and resigned some players that should take minutes from their young recent picks, that doesn't help them
CLE has added guards but still lack size in the back court added wings and subtracted bigs
NYK added some players cut a bunch

I just can't help but think there aren't some trading partners to be found
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#72 » by NZB2323 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:00 pm

fleet wrote:
TheSuzerain wrote:
R3AL1TY wrote:Should be an assessment year for the new regime to see what direction the roster will go in as far as contracts expiring soon, players who are trade assets, and rookies developing. If the team is far outside playoff reach by the trade deadline, I can see them trading couple of the older vets on the team (Sato, Young, OPJ, Temple) and one out of Lauri, Zach, and Wendell. They probably won't land a big name free agent in 2021 unless AD takes a one year deal in LA to come home. But in 2021, they probably may sign couple key role playing guys or go after a player that turns down their player option.

So you're saying we're going to suck?

Minor roster changes via trades and no big name free agent = we suck

if the last 20 years have taught us anything, it should be to give up the free agent thing. Let it go.


Even in 20 years, the number of free agents who rejected us is a small sample size. Players didn’t want to sign with Krause after the dynasty broke up, so I’m not sure you can say players not wanting to sign with us in 2000 means they won’t want to sign with us in 2021.

In 2000 Tim Duncan chose to resign with the Spurs after winning a championship, and T-Mac chose to go to Orlando, and he grew up in Florida.

Kobe would have accepted a sign and trade to the Bulls if Deng wasn’t traded.

Lebron and Wade “almost” signed with Chicago. We did get Boozer, Gasol, and Wade later. Melo would have signed with us if we had the cap space to pay him more.

Anthony Davis has said playing for the Bulls would be a dream come true.

Just because something hasn’t happened in the past 20 years doesn’t mean it can’t happen. Housing prices increasing for years didn’t stop them from falling in 2008.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#73 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:28 am

Its just odd for me to be expected to be content with my favorite team to not make any improvements in any offseason let alone one that brought us an entire new front office and coaching staff. I'm not happy with coming back with the same roster especially when they sucked. Was there just so much hate for GarPax that some of the fanbase is willing to ignore that the new front office isn't doing any better so far? lol

Tired of excuses. Stop giving excuses to "developing" a team. There's no wasting seasons to evaluate players, players that they should already have enough tape on, regular season is the real deal. You play to win the game. The clock is ticking and there's a due date. Stop defending this team putting out a losing product. Don't be content with that!
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#74 » by PhilLeotardo » Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:36 am

Dez wrote:
PhilLeotardo wrote:Short answer: a better direction than the franchise has been headed in since 1995. That’s 25 YEARS, a quarter of a century

Good grief lmao, just let the man go to work

The nightmare is over! Let the professionals do their jobs & give them your support

PaxGar seriously decimated this fan base to smithereens. You can really see it now posthumously, just how much they rotted the fan base out from the inside. This board & the reddit sub are two of the most toxic places in the sports internet realm

Fans have gotten so used to having to root for a franchise “run” by completely rotten, nasty individuals & to just expect failure, that now all they can do is come up with different scenarios in which the team will fail miserably lol

18 years, & only one ECF appearance, y’all. Never ever forget


Seriously this FO has done nothing yet for you to be fellating them so much.

Also it was GarPax....GARPAX!


To wit. This is precisely the sort of toxic, cringey nonsense I was referring to. Lol I rest my case

Also no & no. This FO has done more to help this franchise in 5 short month, than PaxGar did over the course of nearly two decades, and that’s a fact

And it’s Paxgar
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#75 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:39 am

:roll: wow
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#76 » by JOHN » Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:50 am

They are probably going to evaluate the current players and try to build up some trade values.
Another lottery pick wont be bad.
A chance to burn capspace on their own terms,hence 1 year deals and no trades which bring back long term commitments for now.

Most likely there wont be fan revenue this year so they can burn this season quietly without the boos.
Remember remember the 1st of April.......
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#77 » by Chi town » Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:53 am

Sink or swim with the young guys. If they play well you make moves around your new core that fits what AK wants to do.

Really simple.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#78 » by IliketheBullsNBearstoo » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:16 am

Chi town wrote:Sink or swim with the young guys. If they play well you make moves around your new core that fits what AK wants to do.

Really simple.


Yeah you're right it is simple. We didn't need to hire a new front office for that lol. There's no new core. Its the same core. But you're right its very simple. As simple as not doing anything. I take it back, we let Dunn go and brought in Temple. Ok sink or swim guys our job is done!

I just hope they aren't done ok. There's no player on this team we haven't seen enough of to throw away a season to double check his talents. I'm not asking for the world I'm just asking for a heartbeat.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#79 » by Dez » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:21 am

PhilLeotardo wrote:
Dez wrote:
PhilLeotardo wrote:Short answer: a better direction than the franchise has been headed in since 1995. That’s 25 YEARS, a quarter of a century

Good grief lmao, just let the man go to work

The nightmare is over! Let the professionals do their jobs & give them your support

PaxGar seriously decimated this fan base to smithereens. You can really see it now posthumously, just how much they rotted the fan base out from the inside. This board & the reddit sub are two of the most toxic places in the sports internet realm

Fans have gotten so used to having to root for a franchise “run” by completely rotten, nasty individuals & to just expect failure, that now all they can do is come up with different scenarios in which the team will fail miserably lol

18 years, & only one ECF appearance, y’all. Never ever forget


Seriously this FO has done nothing yet for you to be fellating them so much.

Also it was GarPax....GARPAX!


To wit. This is precisely the sort of toxic, cringey nonsense I was referring to. Lol I rest my case

Also no & no. This FO has done more to help this franchise in 5 short month, than PaxGar did over the course of nearly two decades, and that’s a fact

And it’s Paxgar


So waiting to see the results of these changes "toxic, cringey nonsense"? No it's being realistic, you're literally praising them for no reason right now. What they've changed hasn't had a chance to succeed or fail hence why your constant blowing smoke up their ass and this high horse you seem to be sitting on criticizing other Bulls fans for is laughable. It's just as bad as those who have already been critical of the new FO, there's no evidence right now good or bad for them.

It's GarPax and always has been GarPax.
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Re: I'm not sure what direction this team is headed in. 

Post#80 » by TheSuzerain » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:39 am

IliketheBullsNBearstoo wrote:
Chi town wrote:Sink or swim with the young guys. If they play well you make moves around your new core that fits what AK wants to do.

Really simple.


Yeah you're right it is simple. We didn't need to hire a new front office for that lol. There's no new core. Its the same core. But you're right its very simple. As simple as not doing anything. I take it back, we let Dunn go and brought in Temple. Ok sink or swim guys our job is done!

I just hope they aren't done ok. There's no player on this team we haven't seen enough of to throw away a season to double check his talents. I'm not asking for the world I'm just asking for a heartbeat.

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