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FWIW, i dont think its fair to compare Simonovic and Markannen since expectations from Markannen was much higher than Simonovic will ever be. I dont think he met those expectations and thats why his future in Bulls is murky. Simonovic is coming with significantly lower pricetag (in year where Bulls need as many cap space they can free to add some talent to compete) with potential to be what Lauri now essentially is, a bench stretch big.

Vucevic had some quick interview few weeks ago for local TV via Zoom, where he essentially said that he expects Simonovic to arrive to Chicago after his season is done and that he will try to help him settle in for what i understood would be an evaluation period for him with coaches & franchise decision makers whether he will be coming over next season or not. He sounded optimistic about his chances to be Bull next season but take it with grain of salt.

Regarding some comments about reason for AK taking him in 2nd round, is probably strong ties he has from his Denver days with euro power agent Misko Raznatovic who is in Europe basically if you somehow combined powers of Rich Paul and Bill Duffy in NBA environment. He funneled some talent from Mega Leks to Denver whether through summer league rosters or late round fliers via draft & stash so they can raise their profile for euro market. Nuggets developed one of the best euro scouting networks during his tenure.

CoreyVillains wrote:Asked a very trusted source what he thinks about Marko and he isn't optimistic. Thinks any Bulls fan that believes he can be a Lauri replacement is very misguided. The league he plays in is very down this year talent wise. Also told me a few other things about why AK may have drafted him that aren't exactly related to his on court play but can't go into it.

Regardless of any inside sources, going into this draft, no one thought anything of Simonovic, and the Bulls absolutely needed to use their 2nd rounder on whatever draft/stash player could possibly be available because they had no roster spots.

Without knowing anything at all except the context of the situation (Simonovic not being on anyone's mock, Bulls basically forced into taking a European), my assumption is whomever they draft has very little chance of ever making it in the NBA.

dougthonus wrote:

CoreyVillains wrote:Asked a very trusted source what he thinks about Marko and he isn't optimistic. Thinks any Bulls fan that believes he can be a Lauri replacement is very misguided. The league he plays in is very down this year talent wise. Also told me a few other things about why AK may have drafted him that aren't exactly related to his on court play but can't go into it.

Regardless of any inside sources, going into this draft, no one thought anything of Simonovic, and the Bulls absolutely needed to use their 2nd rounder on whatever draft/stash player could possibly be available because they had no roster spots.

Without knowing anything at all except the context of the situation (Simonovic not being on anyone's mock, Bulls basically forced into taking a European), my assumption is whomever they draft has very little chance of ever making it in the NBA.

Marko was on two mocks that pop up on the first page of a google search for 2020 mock drafts - I found one that had him going 58, and one that had him 'on the bubble' of the 2nd round - they ranked 110 players, and Marko was 73rd. So he wasn't a complete unknown, but definitely he was as close to a complete unknown as one can be.

But the one draft that had him going 58 was to Philly, had him going there for the exact reason you stated that the Bulls were interested:

The Philadelphia 76ers are not going to be able to offer a roster spot to every player they draft, so they likely will be evaluating draft-and-stash prospects.

And the mock that had Marko going 58th to Philly had the Bulls taking a different draft-and-stash Euro, because as you pointed out, they didn't really have a choice.

There are lots of second round picks on 2-ways out there. The Bulls absolutely could’ve done that with anyone in that range. They were not forced to draft and stash.

Little Nathan wrote:There are lots of second round picks on 2-ways out there. The Bulls absolutely could’ve done that with anyone in that range. They were not forced to draft and stash.

And almost all of those players were taken in the 50-60 range. Players taken in the top half of the 2nd round almost always get NBA contracts, because they have better options to make more money than they would on a 2-way contract.

A team has to make a Required Tender to a 2nd-round pick (at least one season at the minimum salary). Most players in the top-50 can sign with a different team for the mimimum instead of signing a 2-way deal.

But when you draft a player already under contract to an overseas team, you don't have to offer the Required Tender until that players tells you he is ready to sign a contract.

It's quite rare for a top-50 pick to sign a 2-way deal - so rare that it sent shock waves around the league's financial geeks when the previous #44 pick (Bol Bol) signed a two-way contract.
________________________

"Anyone who finds this rather dramatic discrepancy a bit curious is in good company, as plenty of the most knowledgeable and astute NBA capologists and analysts were also left raising their eyebrows and scratching their heads."

Keith Smith
@KeithSmithNBA
"Something really doesn't smell right with this Bol Bol signing.

Most second round picks got multi-year contracts and many got guaranteed money in the millions. Bol was drafted 44th and got a two-year Two-Way contract.

Something has to be happening here that we don't know."

"Financially, this obviously isn't the best move for Bol Bol as he'll be starting his career receiving more $1 million less than the players he was immediately picked before and after in the 2019 draft."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/joelrush/2019/09/06/why-bol-bol-signing-a-two-way-contract-with-the-nuggets-is-raising-eyebrows/?sh=2b92412a534e

CobyWhite0 wrote:And almost all of those players were taken in the 50-60 range. Players taken in the top half of the 2nd round almost always get NBA contracts, because they have better options to make more money than they would on a 2-way contract.

I mean, it's not like the 44th pick is far from the 50s. There are 2 top 40 picks currently on 2-ways (Tyler Bey (#36) and Saben Lee (#38)). I'm not saying that every player in that range would've happily taken a two-way, but it's definitely possible to not go draft-and-stash there.

GoBlue72391 wrote:

Michael Jackson wrote:

GoBlue72391 wrote:And I think you forgot Dalibor Bagaric who revolutionized the game.

I don’t know how I could overlook him. Bags! On,y player with more impact was Kornel David.

That's disrespectful to Martynas Andriuskevicius (I spelled that without looking it up).

At least he made the news because he got in a fight in the dleague iirc

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I don't know how much it means in the Adriatic League, but Marko led the league in:

Minutes
Offensive Rebounds
Total Rebounds
Rebounds Per Game

He also finished:

2nd Field Goals
3rd Field Goal Attempts
8th 3pt Field Goals
3rd in 3pt Field Goal Attempts
10th in Free Throws
9th in Free Throw Attempts
18th Steals
19th Blocks
2nd Minutes Per Game
3rd Field Goal Percentage
4th Effective Field Goal Percentage

CobyWhite0 wrote:I don't know how much it means in the Adriatic League, but Marko led the league in:

Minutes
Offensive Rebounds
Total Rebounds
Rebounds Per Game

He also finished:

2nd Field Goals
3rd Field Goal Attempts
8th 3pt Field Goals
3rd in 3pt Field Goal Attempts
10th in Free Throws
9th in Free Throw Attempts
18th Steals
19th Blocks
2nd Minutes Per Game
3rd Field Goal Percentage
4th Effective Field Goal Percentage

IMO, Marko isn't coming over unless we loose Lauri and/or Theis. He clearly is skilled, the question is whether he has/can develop the necessary athleticism to be effective in NBA. Might be good to use one of our 2-way contracts on him next season to see if his game translates to G-league competition.

Marko should be coming here. His next step should be rotation NBA bench player or playing at higher level club at higher competition in Europe for a year. He shouldnt stay another year in Adriatic League. That's if he wants to have any semblance of NBA career.

He reminds me of a poor man's Lauri

PaKii94 wrote:He reminds me of a poor man's Lauri

That's a double-negative.

sco wrote:

PaKii94 wrote:He reminds me of a poor man's Lauri

That's a double-negative.

Exactly lol

TheFinishSniper wrote:Marko should be coming here. His next step should be rotation NBA bench player or playing at higher level club at higher competition in Europe for a year. He shouldnt stay another year in Adriatic League. That's if he wants to have any semblance of NBA career.

He should play at least 1 year in a higher level European league before we even think about bringing him over. The Adriatic League...let's just say it's obvious from watching highlights that he wouldn't be able to do most of those things against NBA competition.

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PaKii94 wrote:He reminds me of a poor man's Lauri

He basically is, and the fanbase in general hates Lauri's game, so I'm not sure why many of those same people are high on an even slower, less athletic, worse shooting version of him with an even slower release on his shot and likely even worse defense.

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GoBlue72391 wrote:

TheFinishSniper wrote:Marko should be coming here. His next step should be rotation NBA bench player or playing at higher level club at higher competition in Europe for a year. He shouldnt stay another year in Adriatic League. That's if he wants to have any semblance of NBA career.

He should play at least 1 year in a higher level European league before we even think about bringing him over. The Adriatic League...let's just say it's obvious from watching highlights that he wouldn't be able to do most of those things against NBA competition.

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Marko Simonovic, Age 20, Adriatic League

29.4 min, 16.2 pts, 7.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 50.2% FG, 31.5% 3's, 1.14 stl, 1.14 blk
30.5 min, 15.4 pts, 9.3 reb, 3.5 ast, 50.3% FG, 34.6% 3's, 1.54 stl, 0.92 blk

The 2nd set of numbers is Nikola Jokic, Age 20, Adriatic League.

He came over after that season, without playing "at least 1 year in a higher level European league". And still managed to average 10.0 pts, 7.0 reb, 2.4 ast, 1.0 stl in 21.7 minutes as an NBA rookie. Apparently, he figured out how "to do most of those things against NBA competition.

There are plenty of reasons why Marko almost certainly won't be the next Jokic, but the fact that he played in the Adriatic League at age 20 isn't one of them.

CobyWhite0 wrote:

GoBlue72391 wrote:

TheFinishSniper wrote:Marko should be coming here. His next step should be rotation NBA bench player or playing at higher level club at higher competition in Europe for a year. He shouldnt stay another year in Adriatic League. That's if he wants to have any semblance of NBA career.

He should play at least 1 year in a higher level European league before we even think about bringing him over. The Adriatic League...let's just say it's obvious from watching highlights that he wouldn't be able to do most of those things against NBA competition.

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Marko Simonovic, Age 20, Adriatic League

29.4 min, 16.2 pts, 7.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 50.2% FG, 31.5% 3's, 1.14 stl, 1.14 blk
30.5 min, 15.4 pts, 9.3 reb, 3.5 ast, 50.3% FG, 34.6% 3's, 1.54 stl, 0.92 blk

The 2nd set of numbers is Nikola Jokic, Age 20, Adriatic League.

He came over after that season, without playing "at least 1 year in a higher level European league". And still managed to average 10.0 pts, 7.0 reb, 2.4 ast, 1.0 stl in 21.7 minutes as an NBA rookie. Apparently, he figured out how "to do most of those things against NBA competition.

There are plenty of reasons why Marko almost certainly won't be the next Jokic, but the fact that he played in the Adriatic League at age 20 isn't one of them.

Good find - Thanks! So that mean that Jokic was also a poor man's Lauri?

sco wrote:

CobyWhite0 wrote:

GoBlue72391 wrote:He should play at least 1 year in a higher level European league before we even think about bringing him over. The Adriatic League...let's just say it's obvious from watching highlights that he wouldn't be able to do most of those things against NBA competition.

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Marko Simonovic, Age 20, Adriatic League

29.4 min, 16.2 pts, 7.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 50.2% FG, 31.5% 3's, 1.14 stl, 1.14 blk
30.5 min, 15.4 pts, 9.3 reb, 3.5 ast, 50.3% FG, 34.6% 3's, 1.54 stl, 0.92 blk

The 2nd set of numbers is Nikola Jokic, Age 20, Adriatic League.

He came over after that season, without playing "at least 1 year in a higher level European league". And still managed to average 10.0 pts, 7.0 reb, 2.4 ast, 1.0 stl in 21.7 minutes as an NBA rookie. Apparently, he figured out how "to do most of those things against NBA competition.

There are plenty of reasons why Marko almost certainly won't be the next Jokic, but the fact that he played in the Adriatic League at age 20 isn't one of them.

Good find - Thanks! So that mean that Jokic was also a poor man's Lauri?

Apparently, yes!

CobyWhite0 wrote:

GoBlue72391 wrote:

TheFinishSniper wrote:Marko should be coming here. His next step should be rotation NBA bench player or playing at higher level club at higher competition in Europe for a year. He shouldnt stay another year in Adriatic League. That's if he wants to have any semblance of NBA career.

He should play at least 1 year in a higher level European league before we even think about bringing him over. The Adriatic League...let's just say it's obvious from watching highlights that he wouldn't be able to do most of those things against NBA competition.

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Marko Simonovic, Age 20, Adriatic League

29.4 min, 16.2 pts, 7.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 50.2% FG, 31.5% 3's, 1.14 stl, 1.14 blk
30.5 min, 15.4 pts, 9.3 reb, 3.5 ast, 50.3% FG, 34.6% 3's, 1.54 stl, 0.92 blk

The 2nd set of numbers is Nikola Jokic, Age 20, Adriatic League.

He came over after that season, without playing "at least 1 year in a higher level European league". And still managed to average 10.0 pts, 7.0 reb, 2.4 ast, 1.0 stl in 21.7 minutes as an NBA rookie. Apparently, he figured out how "to do most of those things against NBA competition.

There are plenty of reasons why Marko almost certainly won't be the next Jokic, but the fact that he played in the Adriatic League at age 20 isn't one of them.

Oh FFS

CobyWhite0 wrote:

GoBlue72391 wrote:

TheFinishSniper wrote:Marko should be coming here. His next step should be rotation NBA bench player or playing at higher level club at higher competition in Europe for a year. He shouldnt stay another year in Adriatic League. That's if he wants to have any semblance of NBA career.

He should play at least 1 year in a higher level European league before we even think about bringing him over. The Adriatic League...let's just say it's obvious from watching highlights that he wouldn't be able to do most of those things against NBA competition.

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Marko Simonovic, Age 20, Adriatic League

29.4 min, 16.2 pts, 7.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 50.2% FG, 31.5% 3's, 1.14 stl, 1.14 blk
30.5 min, 15.4 pts, 9.3 reb, 3.5 ast, 50.3% FG, 34.6% 3's, 1.54 stl, 0.92 blk

The 2nd set of numbers is Nikola Jokic, Age 20, Adriatic League.

He came over after that season, without playing "at least 1 year in a higher level European league". And still managed to average 10.0 pts, 7.0 reb, 2.4 ast, 1.0 stl in 21.7 minutes as an NBA rookie. Apparently, he figured out how "to do most of those things against NBA competition.

There are plenty of reasons why Marko almost certainly won't be the next Jokic, but the fact that he played in the Adriatic League at age 20 isn't one of them.

Cool. Let's pretend like Jokic isn't an extreme exception to the rule and other prospects should certainly be compared to him. Let's pretend like he's not a unique one of a kind player. Let's also ignore the fact that the Adriatic League has gotten worse as a whole since Jokic was in it. Yes, let's definitely do that.

For an equally apt comparison;

Player A: 8, 3, and 1 on 41/21/77 as a rookie and 18, 7, and 3 on 46/38/83 as a second year player

Player B: 15, 8, and 1 on 43/36/83 as a rookie and 19, 9, and 1 on 43/36/87 as a second year player

Player A is Dirk. Player B is Lauri. Yes, it's a stupid comparison, but not as stupid as the Jokic/Simonovic comparison.

Lauri put up much better pre-NBA stats against much better competition than Simonovic did. Pac-12 + FIBA > Adriatic League. The current Adriatic League looks noticeably worse than G League competition.

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