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PG: Finally!

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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#161 » by MGB8 » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:19 pm

ChiCitySPORTS#1 wrote:
FriedRise wrote:Next 5: Indiana, Toronto, Atlanta, Minnesota, Memphis. All on the road and 2 sets of back to backs.

It’d be nice to get at least 3 wins from this stretch, especially against Indiana, Atlanta, and Toronto. We can make up some serious ground in the Standings if we can get those games.


This new team should be favored to win all those games. With the expectation of them winning all those games. No margin left anymore


??? Memphis and Atlanta are good teams this season, and Indiana and Toronto on the same tier.

Only Minnesota is really worse - and they have more raw talent. The Bulls will be lucky to get 3 wins out of that.

Compressed end of season, too - BD needs to be very smart and careful with minutes, and use the bench heavily.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#162 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:25 pm

weneeda2guard wrote:
FranchisePlayer wrote:
Betta Bulleavit wrote:It sure was. I paid close attention to that shot in particular because I knew that someone would try to classify it as a bad shot when (in fact) it was just a clutch dagger that somebody had to take.


It WAS a mindless shot to take. Way too deep and from a player 0-4 for the night until then. It was a classic Lavine-low-bb-IQ shot.

I know we have been in tank and terrible mode so long that we forget how real life basketball teams operate

But stars carry teams. And if we want any shot of having any success for the rest of the season and going forward, this team has to go forward understanding that this is a 2 star team now and everyone else needs to fall in their roles. Stars score stars take big shots. I dont care if lavine was 0-7. Game coming down to the wire, vs a good team making a run on us to steal the game from us I want the ball in my 2 stars hands early and often and I want my stars taking nearly all of the big shots unless it's heavily contested which lavine was not.

I dont want satoransky taking my big shots. I dont want Troy brown Jr taking my big shots. I dont care If they are 3-4 from 3. Things change in closing minutes. And if we want any shot in hell of being a playoff team now and in the future , we need lavine and Vucevic to be stars.

Let me also say, I'm sorry but lauri has had his shot. You can blame everyone else but this is on him. He didn't take advantage of his opportunity that he had for more than 3 seasons. Now he is either going to be a role player here or moved.


Well, I'm sorry to say this but you and many other posters have one distinctive, serious misunderstanding. That is, I hope it's a misunderstanding, otherwise this kind of targeting is pretty lame. I see ZOMG has also had to explain the same thing lately.

My post had n-o-t-h-i-n-g t-o d-o w-i-t-h L-a-u-r-i. That last paragraph of yours was unnecessary. Just because Lauri's my favorite player and I post a lot about him, doesn't mean the only objective in my every post is to refer to him. This is some weird obsession a lot of you guys have in your heads now.

Last night I would've preferred the guy you detest, Satoransky, to take clutch shots. He was hot, hot like Kate Upton dressed in wet t-shirt at noon in July by the pool.

Let's be clear of one other thing: Zach made a lucky shot, good for him. But seriously, he didn't carry the Bulls in this game. His performance was very average, nothing like a performance of a "star". You're setting the bar really low if you really thought that was the case. If you referred to him as an ASG player generally speaking, fine. I think going with the hot hand in a single game is better tactics but to each his own, I guess.

No matter how you slice it, to me that was a poorly judged low percentage shot.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#163 » by DuckIII » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:30 pm

It’s interesting how people see things differently. The Lavine shot at the end of the game was not a problem at all. There were only 3 seconds on the shot clock.

But he ad other shots in the game, and in the last few games frankly, that I did find problematic from a shot quality/shot clock perspective. Shots more reminiscent of the Lavine or years prior who seemed to feel the need to do everything himself.

But the late game shot wasn’t one of them.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#164 » by Fastbrk4brkfast » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:34 pm

DuckIII wrote:1. Nice seeing Lauri looking to drive and post up.

2. Zach recently has been a little more “old Zach” than I’d like to see.

3. I hated the Coby White pick. But then I saw some things I liked last year that I thought he could build on. Not sure where the “blame” falls for this season, but one thing was pretty clear: He wasn’t missed. Granted it’s only 1 game but he really has been hurting us this year.


Hypothesis: 2021 Zach + painkillers = 2018 Zach
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#165 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:36 pm

ChiCitySPORTS#1 wrote:
FriedRise wrote:Next 5: Indiana, Toronto, Atlanta, Minnesota, Memphis. All on the road and 2 sets of back to backs.

It’d be nice to get at least 3 wins from this stretch, especially against Indiana, Atlanta, and Toronto. We can make up some serious ground in the Standings if we can get those games.


This new team should be favored to win all those games. With the expectation of them winning all those games. No margin left anymore


After 6 straight losses we win a good, but an injury-riddled team and now we should be favored to win all of the next 5 games?

Maybe no margin left but let's not get carried away. Toronto beat on Friday the Warriors, without Curry but still, by 53 points. Atlanta has a 3 game winning streak. Doesn't sound like we're facing clear underdogs.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#166 » by WindyCityBorn » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:42 pm

SfBull wrote:
donaldtrump_00 wrote:
HOTCARL_o wrote:What’s going to happen when Coby is back? I’d rather see TBJ on the court. Coby kills momentum of the game with bad plays or dumb turnovers.



I hate to say it but we just have to wait for coby to understand the game. He's young and dumb currently but you see he is one of the young players we still have because wendell is gone and gafford. Most likely Lauri. It's not looking like we will have pieces to grow with. I'd love to keep coby motivated and possibly even raise his value. Billy Donovan just will need to sit him down on the spot when he does dumb things. He's actually our best rebounder out of all our guards. Once he figures out how to control his superhero act he'll be fine

I'm rooting for the starting lineup that won the game over the Nets can stay healthy leaving players like PWill,Lauri and Coby playing from the bench.


Coby is never going to learn to be a NBA PG. It’s fool’s errand. He can be a decent player, but he doesn’t have innate skills to be lead facilitator. It would take a miraculous leap in his ballhandling, vision and passing.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#167 » by WindyCityBorn » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:49 pm

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weneeda2guard wrote:
FranchisePlayer wrote:
It WAS a mindless shot to take. Way too deep and from a player 0-4 for the night until then. It was a classic Lavine-low-bb-IQ shot.

I know we have been in tank and terrible mode so long that we forget how real life basketball teams operate

But stars carry teams. And if we want any shot of having any success for the rest of the season and going forward, this team has to go forward understanding that this is a 2 star team now and everyone else needs to fall in their roles. Stars score stars take big shots. I dont care if lavine was 0-7. Game coming down to the wire, vs a good team making a run on us to steal the game from us I want the ball in my 2 stars hands early and often and I want my stars taking nearly all of the big shots unless it's heavily contested which lavine was not.

I dont want satoransky taking my big shots. I dont want Troy brown Jr taking my big shots. I dont care If they are 3-4 from 3. Things change in closing minutes. And if we want any shot in hell of being a playoff team now and in the future , we need lavine and Vucevic to be stars.

Let me also say, I'm sorry but lauri has had his shot. You can blame everyone else but this is on him. He didn't take advantage of his opportunity that he had for more than 3 seasons. Now he is either going to be a role player here or moved.


Well, I'm sorry to say this but you and many other posters have one distinctive, serious misunderstanding. That is, I hope it's a misunderstanding, otherwise this kind of targeting is pretty lame. I see ZOMG has also had to explain the same thing lately.

My post had n-o-t-h-i-n-g t-o d-o w-i-t-h L-a-u-r-i. That last paragraph of yours was unnecessary. Just because Lauri's my favorite player and I post a lot about him, doesn't mean the only objective in my every post is to refer to him. This is some weird obsession a lot of you guys have in your heads now.

Last night I would've preferred the guy you detest, Satoransky, to take clutch shots. He was hot, hot like Kate Upton dressed in wet t-shirt at noon in July by the pool.

Let's be clear of one other thing: Zach made a lucky shot, good for him. But seriously, he didn't carry the Bulls in this game. His performance was very average, nothing like a performance of a "star". You're setting the bar really low if you really thought that was the case. If you referred to him as an ASG player generally speaking, fine. I think going with the hot hand in a single game is better tactics but to each his own, I guess.

No matter how you slice it, to me that was a poorly judged low percentage shot.


Lucky shot from a guy shooting over 40 percent on 3s that routinely hits more difficult 3s than that all the time. Yeah not biased at all....
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#168 » by DuckIII » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:52 pm

Fastbrk4brkfast wrote:
DuckIII wrote:1. Nice seeing Lauri looking to drive and post up.

2. Zach recently has been a little more “old Zach” than I’d like to see.

3. I hated the Coby White pick. But then I saw some things I liked last year that I thought he could build on. Not sure where the “blame” falls for this season, but one thing was pretty clear: He wasn’t missed. Granted it’s only 1 game but he really has been hurting us this year.


Hypothesis: 2021 Zach + painkillers = 2018 Zach


I’m not worried about it. Yet. Just pointing out something I’ve been seeing in recent games.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#169 » by drosestruts » Mon Apr 5, 2021 5:56 pm

Nice to get a win with the new roster. I at no point felt comfortable with any of our leads. The team has proven capable of going on a run, but i think maintaining a lead is still the next step for this team. I do think Vuc helps as he seems capable of getting buckets easier. You don't need to do too much to set him up and he's capable of scoring on his own in a variety of ways. His simple one-dribble step-back jumper in the 4th is the type of thing I'm talking about.

I like what Valentine has provided over the past couple games and think it's a lot to expect more from a bench guy. I do think when Temple comes back the odd man out is looking to be White, which is kind of shocking. I think a bench unit of:

Temple / Brown / Valentine / Markkanen / Theis has enough ball-handling and passing that we don't need to continue trying to make Coby something he isn't. I see Brown as Coby's biggest competition for minutes right now, but Brown is providing more on defense and in the hustle category.

Loved that rather than chase that looseball with Kyrie TBJ quickly assessed where kyrie would be able to flip the ball back to and positioned himself to pick it off. A play the looks real simple on TV but in the moment takes a lot of awareness and recognition.


Would love to see this team go on a mini-run. Don't think we're good enough yet to really look at any of these upcoming games as for sure wins, but I do think we're good enough to feasibly win each of them.

Zach still doesn't look 100% and the up-coming back-to-backs have me worried about how his ankle will hold up.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#170 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Apr 5, 2021 6:00 pm

DuckIII wrote:It’s interesting how people see things differently. The Lavine shot at the end of the game was not a problem at all. There were only 3 seconds on the shot clock.

But he ad other shots in the game, and in the last few games frankly, that I did find problematic from a shot quality/shot clock perspective. Shots more reminiscent of the Lavine or years prior who seemed to feel the need to do everything himself.

But the late game shot wasn’t one of them.


It definitely was, if you include and since you have to include all the useless ball pounding he did before taking the shot. Why?

If someone would've passed him the ball with 4 secs. left, I can sympathize Lavine feeling like it's a live hand grenade and he has to take the shot, now. Then I would feel differently.

But now, prior to taking that shot, he just very casually kept pounding the ball and not even trying to move forward although he had 7 friggin seconds to do so and improve chances of that ball going in. Maybe his legs were tired, maybe he didn't check the shot clock... but the pic is pretty telling.

If you settle for that tough shot so early, you obviously have to have a clue to run the clock down even more. He made a poor judgment when he didn't. It's not like we're talking about this the first time. Was there a game which we lost when he shot 5 secs. left in the clock and missed?

And if the original idea wasn't to settle for a shot that deep, why not advance with the ball? He had time and options. No. He decided to try and make the headlines with hero ball.

Poor judgment in either case.

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MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#171 » by FriedRise » Mon Apr 5, 2021 6:59 pm

MGB8 wrote:
ChiCitySPORTS#1 wrote:
FriedRise wrote:Next 5: Indiana, Toronto, Atlanta, Minnesota, Memphis. All on the road and 2 sets of back to backs.

It’d be nice to get at least 3 wins from this stretch, especially against Indiana, Atlanta, and Toronto. We can make up some serious ground in the Standings if we can get those games.


This new team should be favored to win all those games. With the expectation of them winning all those games. No margin left anymore


??? Memphis and Atlanta are good teams this season, and Indiana and Toronto on the same tier.

Only Minnesota is really worse - and they have more raw talent. The Bulls will be lucky to get 3 wins out of that.

Compressed end of season, too - BD needs to be very smart and careful with minutes, and use the bench heavily.


Yes, this is where rotations, lineups, and minutes distribution will matter a ton. For a week or two, it was clear that BD was experimenting with various lineups and combination of guys, but I think we now have a pretty clear idea of who should be paired with who and what combination works, which should be limited, etc.

I wanna see him take more control of the game. If we're starting to give up a major lead, call a timeout and change things up. Identify the weak links and they can sit on the bench. If a call is questionable or if one of your top guys is imploring you to review, challenge it. Also, I think we can afford to play Vooch more than 30mpg. He was playing 34mpg in Orlando - a losing team - and we need him to share the floor with Zach as much as possible to create chemistry.

The interesting thing will be how he handles Coby. He'll be out for a while due to the COVID protocol, but I still see him playing too much hero ball which just doesn't bode well for that second unit. I guess he'll look better when the ball goes in the basket, but right now I still prefer him playing offball next to a playmaker like Val.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#172 » by DJhitek » Mon Apr 5, 2021 7:12 pm

Much needed win, still not sure any of these piece fit but maybe the team needs more time to find out what works and what doesn’t.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#173 » by kodo » Mon Apr 5, 2021 7:25 pm

FranchisePlayer wrote:
DuckIII wrote:It’s interesting how people see things differently. The Lavine shot at the end of the game was not a problem at all. There were only 3 seconds on the shot clock.

But he ad other shots in the game, and in the last few games frankly, that I did find problematic from a shot quality/shot clock perspective. Shots more reminiscent of the Lavine or years prior who seemed to feel the need to do everything himself.

But the late game shot wasn’t one of them.


It definitely was, if you include and since you have to include all the useless ball pounding he did before taking the shot. Why?

If someone would've passed him the ball with 4 secs. left, I can sympathize Lavine feeling like it's a live hand grenade and he has to take the shot, now. Then I would feel differently.

But now, prior to taking that shot, he just very casually kept pounding the ball and not even trying to move forward although he had 7 friggin seconds to do so and improve chances of that ball going in. Maybe his legs were tired, maybe he didn't check the shot clock... but the pic is pretty telling.

If you settle for that tough shot so early, you obviously have to have a clue to run the clock down even more. He made a poor judgment when he didn't. It's not like we're talking about this the first time. Was there a game which we lost when he shot 5 secs. left in the clock and missed?

And if the original idea wasn't to settle for a shot that deep, why not advance with the ball? He had time and options. No. He decided to try and make the headlines with hero ball.

Poor judgment in either case.


He got the ball with 7 seconds left.
He ran a P&R with Vucevic; Brooklyn responded by doubling Lavine.
Vuc rolls to the rim when this happens, dragging Lavine's man with him but leaving his man w/ Lavine on the semi-mismatch.
4 seconds left, Lavine with a "big" on him opts to shoot an open long 3 over driving into the bigger defender or attempting a difficult pass to Vuc with the defender fronting.

There was nothing wrong here.

I don't understand what you mean by running the clock out, it wasn't an end of game situation. There was 1:24 left.

Lavine tried to run plays twice this possession with Vuc. What he was doing was an exact mirror of what just happened seconds ago, if he did the exact same thing (which led to the initial failed possession) he would have been an idiot.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#174 » by R3AL1TY » Mon Apr 5, 2021 7:42 pm

FranchisePlayer wrote:
DuckIII wrote:It’s interesting how people see things differently. The Lavine shot at the end of the game was not a problem at all. There were only 3 seconds on the shot clock.

But he ad other shots in the game, and in the last few games frankly, that I did find problematic from a shot quality/shot clock perspective. Shots more reminiscent of the Lavine or years prior who seemed to feel the need to do everything himself.

But the late game shot wasn’t one of them.


It definitely was, if you include and since you have to include all the useless ball pounding he did before taking the shot. Why?

If someone would've passed him the ball with 4 secs. left, I can sympathize Lavine feeling like it's a live hand grenade and he has to take the shot, now. Then I would feel differently.

But now, prior to taking that shot, he just very casually kept pounding the ball and not even trying to move forward although he had 7 friggin seconds to do so and improve chances of that ball going in. Maybe his legs were tired, maybe he didn't check the shot clock... but the pic is pretty telling.

If you settle for that tough shot so early, you obviously have to have a clue to run the clock down even more. He made a poor judgment when he didn't. It's not like we're talking about this the first time. Was there a game which we lost when he shot 5 secs. left in the clock and missed?

And if the original idea wasn't to settle for a shot that deep, why not advance with the ball? He had time and options. No. He decided to try and make the headlines with hero ball.

Poor judgment in either case.

Image


Yea, I don't like when Zach take this long to make a move just to take a deep, difficult shot. If he makes it, we forget about it, but when he misses it stings more like costing a game. Then again, one can argue we wouldn't complain if it's Steph or Klay taking this shot. Zach is shooting 42% from deep this year, so the risk is worth it. But I still think BD should see to it at times that when Zach or even Coby go iso for certain plays, stress to them to go for a high percentage shot or to draw a foul, especially if they are in the lead.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#175 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Apr 5, 2021 7:47 pm

kodo wrote:
FranchisePlayer wrote:
DuckIII wrote:It’s interesting how people see things differently. The Lavine shot at the end of the game was not a problem at all. There were only 3 seconds on the shot clock.

But he ad other shots in the game, and in the last few games frankly, that I did find problematic from a shot quality/shot clock perspective. Shots more reminiscent of the Lavine or years prior who seemed to feel the need to do everything himself.

But the late game shot wasn’t one of them.


It definitely was, if you include and since you have to include all the useless ball pounding he did before taking the shot. Why?

If someone would've passed him the ball with 4 secs. left, I can sympathize Lavine feeling like it's a live hand grenade and he has to take the shot, now. Then I would feel differently.

But now, prior to taking that shot, he just very casually kept pounding the ball and not even trying to move forward although he had 7 friggin seconds to do so and improve chances of that ball going in. Maybe his legs were tired, maybe he didn't check the shot clock... but the pic is pretty telling.

If you settle for that tough shot so early, you obviously have to have a clue to run the clock down even more. He made a poor judgment when he didn't. It's not like we're talking about this the first time. Was there a game which we lost when he shot 5 secs. left in the clock and missed?

And if the original idea wasn't to settle for a shot that deep, why not advance with the ball? He had time and options. No. He decided to try and make the headlines with hero ball.

Poor judgment in either case.


He got the ball with 7 seconds left.
He ran a P&R with Vucevic; Brooklyn responded by doubling Lavine.
Vuc rolls to the rim when this happens, dragging Lavine's man with him but leaving his man w/ Lavine on the semi-mismatch.
4 seconds left, Lavine with a "big" on him opts to shoot an open long 3 over driving into the bigger defender or attempting a difficult pass to Vuc with the defender fronting.

There was nothing wrong here.

I don't understand what you mean by running the clock out, it wasn't an end of game situation. There was 1:24 left.

Lavine tried to run plays twice this possession with Vuc. What he was doing was an exact mirror of what just happened seconds ago, if he did the exact same thing (which led to the initial failed possession) he would have been an idiot.


I think an All-Star, a gifted scorer, can see other options than only a) pass to center b) try from really deep. Why not get closer to the basket with his athleticism? Pretty limited view if he really thought that was the best choice. There doesn't have to be anything "wrong" here; this is my opinion but I'm fairly certain I'm not the only one critical of that play.

I mean if you lead by 7 points, 1:24 left and you decide to go for a low percentage shot, do it when the shot clock is closer to zero. Leave less time for the opposing team. Just a basic principle to be followed, even if you think 1:24 is not even near of an end of game.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#176 » by NewKnicks » Mon Apr 5, 2021 7:49 pm

Knicks Fan here.

In my opinion (not that most of you care), the Bulls should go for the hard tank immediately. They're not that far from getting close to the top 5 in one of the best drafts in recent memory. Making the playoffs this year won't accomplish anything. Tank the remaining games on the schedule, and get in the running for another potential future All-Star.

Could you imagine a team of Vuc, Lavine, Williams, Lauri and one of Suggs, Cade, Mobley, Green or Kominga? Potentially 3 All-Stars for years to come, and another really talented young player in Williams.

That team alone could potentially compete with the top teams in the East.

Just my stupid little opinion from afar.

Good luck guys. I was born in Chicago, so the Bulls are my second team behind the Knicks.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#177 » by weneeda2guard » Mon Apr 5, 2021 7:59 pm

FranchisePlayer wrote:
weneeda2guard wrote:
FranchisePlayer wrote:
It WAS a mindless shot to take. Way too deep and from a player 0-4 for the night until then. It was a classic Lavine-low-bb-IQ shot.

I know we have been in tank and terrible mode so long that we forget how real life basketball teams operate

But stars carry teams. And if we want any shot of having any success for the rest of the season and going forward, this team has to go forward understanding that this is a 2 star team now and everyone else needs to fall in their roles. Stars score stars take big shots. I dont care if lavine was 0-7. Game coming down to the wire, vs a good team making a run on us to steal the game from us I want the ball in my 2 stars hands early and often and I want my stars taking nearly all of the big shots unless it's heavily contested which lavine was not.

I dont want satoransky taking my big shots. I dont want Troy brown Jr taking my big shots. I dont care If they are 3-4 from 3. Things change in closing minutes. And if we want any shot in hell of being a playoff team now and in the future , we need lavine and Vucevic to be stars.

Let me also say, I'm sorry but lauri has had his shot. You can blame everyone else but this is on him. He didn't take advantage of his opportunity that he had for more than 3 seasons. Now he is either going to be a role player here or moved.


Well, I'm sorry to say this but you and many other posters have one distinctive, serious misunderstanding. That is, I hope it's a misunderstanding, otherwise this kind of targeting is pretty lame. I see ZOMG has also had to explain the same thing lately.

My post had n-o-t-h-i-n-g t-o d-o w-i-t-h L-a-u-r-i. That last paragraph of yours was unnecessary. Just because Lauri's my favorite player and I post a lot about him, doesn't mean the only objective in my every post is to refer to him. This is some weird obsession a lot of you guys have in your heads now.

Last night I would've preferred the guy you detest, Satoransky, to take clutch shots. He was hot, hot like Kate Upton dressed in wet t-shirt at noon in July by the pool.

Let's be clear of one other thing: Zach made a lucky shot, good for him. But seriously, he didn't carry the Bulls in this game. His performance was very average, nothing like a performance of a "star". You're setting the bar really low if you really thought that was the case. If you referred to him as an ASG player generally speaking, fine. I think going with the hot hand in a single game is better tactics but to each his own, I guess.

No matter how you slice it, to me that was a poorly judged low percentage shot.

Well for starters I don't "detest" satoransky don't know where that idea came from. He played well yesterday but my point remains the same. If we want any shot of having a successful season and success moving forward then roles need to be defined and this is a 2 star team with everyone else needing to fall in line. If we fail that burden will be placed on lavine and Vuc until another star gets here. If we succeed they need to be given credit. As Stacy King says big time players make big time plays and as well as any role player is playing things get tense and pressure mounts when it's under 2 min in a game. At that time stars take over. It is not low bbiq for a star to put the responsibility on himself to gut out a win. And the shot clock running out has already been factored here. I respect stars who take that shot not run away from it.

I dont care about a hot hand from a role player. Because being able to take and make those shots at those moments is what separate stars from the role players unless your in a unique position with a reputation like a Robert Horry. Other than that your stars take over.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#178 » by weneeda2guard » Mon Apr 5, 2021 8:12 pm

NewKnicks wrote:Knicks Fan here.

In my opinion (not that most of you care), the Bulls should go for the hard tank immediately. They're not that far from getting close to the top 5 in one of the best drafts in recent memory. Making the playoffs this year won't accomplish anything. Tank the remaining games on the schedule, and get in the running for another potential future All-Star.

Could you imagine a team of Vuc, Lavine, Williams, Lauri and one of Suggs, Cade, Mobley, Green or Kominga? Potentially 3 All-Stars for years to come, and another really talented young player in Williams.

That team alone could potentially compete with the top teams in the East.

Just my stupid little opinion from afar.

Good luck guys. I was born in Chicago, so the Bulls are my second team behind the Knicks.

I respect the opinion but as has been argued to nauseum around here, tanking just not that cut throat and dry. It's just a lot of factors that come into play and no way to control it. First you have to get players to adhere to it. Sure maybe guys like lavine and Vucevic say whatever but why would lauri, coby, valentine, Troy brown Jr, temple etc guys on contract years , just stop playing for a rookie to come in and be a savior and heck potentially take one of their jobs?

It's great to think of in theory but we still around here crying because hoiberg player Sean Kilpatrick, lol Sean Kilpatrick! Not a all star not a even a 6th man of the year candidate, a guy who not even in the league right now and blaming the organization for a guy who is g league level coming in and playing his butt off........which is what he was supposed to do! Who could factor in that guy coming in and hurting your tank?

Then if you do all the right "tank" things you could still end up striking out. You as a knick fan should know this more than anyone you all stealth tanked last year and ended up with a 8th pick lol. We actually competed some last year and got 4th. All the luck or unlucky of the lottery balls. Tank is always sold on the "hope" of the best players coming into the draft but it's always winners and losers. So now we tank further build losing in the franchise then end up with a pick below 4th, which we don't have the rights to anymore, now what?

It's just too risky better to just do the best we can, if we end up missing the playoffs and get a top 4 pick so be it. If not then so be it but attempting to purposely tank is useless at this point.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#179 » by AshyLarrysDiaper » Mon Apr 5, 2021 8:27 pm

We’re past the point of a hard tank. We’ve already lost too much ground to DET-ORL-CLE and the politics won’t allow it post-Vuc trade.

But what we can do is climb (ie descend) to the 7th best lottery odds, especially if we drop the Toronto game.

If that’s still within reach in the final weeks of the season, I’d be all for selectively resting vets.
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Re: PG: Finally! 

Post#180 » by NewKnicks » Mon Apr 5, 2021 9:15 pm

weneeda2guard wrote:
NewKnicks wrote:Knicks Fan here.

In my opinion (not that most of you care), the Bulls should go for the hard tank immediately. They're not that far from getting close to the top 5 in one of the best drafts in recent memory. Making the playoffs this year won't accomplish anything. Tank the remaining games on the schedule, and get in the running for another potential future All-Star.

Could you imagine a team of Vuc, Lavine, Williams, Lauri and one of Suggs, Cade, Mobley, Green or Kominga? Potentially 3 All-Stars for years to come, and another really talented young player in Williams.

That team alone could potentially compete with the top teams in the East.

Just my stupid little opinion from afar.

Good luck guys. I was born in Chicago, so the Bulls are my second team behind the Knicks.

I respect the opinion but as has been argued to nauseum around here, tanking just not that cut throat and dry. It's just a lot of factors that come into play and no way to control it. First you have to get players to adhere to it. Sure maybe guys like lavine and Vucevic say whatever but why would lauri, coby, valentine, Troy brown Jr, temple etc guys on contract years , just stop playing for a rookie to come in and be a savior and heck potentially take one of their jobs?

It's great to think of in theory but we still around here crying because hoiberg player Sean Kilpatrick, lol Sean Kilpatrick! Not a all star not a even a 6th man of the year candidate, a guy who not even in the league right now and blaming the organization for a guy who is g league level coming in and playing his butt off........which is what he was supposed to do! Who could factor in that guy coming in and hurting your tank?

Then if you do all the right "tank" things you could still end up striking out. You as a knick fan should know this more than anyone you all stealth tanked last year and ended up with a 8th pick lol. We actually competed some last year and got 4th. All the luck or unlucky of the lottery balls. Tank is always sold on the "hope" of the best players coming into the draft but it's always winners and losers. So now we tank further build losing in the franchise then end up with a pick below 4th, which we don't have the rights to anymore, now what?

It's just too risky better to just do the best we can, if we end up missing the playoffs and get a top 4 pick so be it. If not then so be it but attempting to purposely tank is useless at this point.


I respect your opinion as well, and understand that the draft is a crapshoot. I'm not suggesting any further tanking, only for the remaining 20 games or so.

If I'm the front office, I could give a crap what Lauri, Coby and especially Valentine and Troy Brown think. Who gives a f*ck about their opinions. I would only care about Vuc and Lavine, no one else.

Do what's best for the franchise. I get it that it's a very dynamic situation and in the end you can't control the outcome, but you could make the odds a lot better by adding a ton more ping pong balls. This draft is too strong to not consider it.

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