PG: It's getting ugly out there

[Ice Man]

Our bigs aren't the problem, our guards get stuck on screens and leave our bigs to play two on one. Sato, Coby, and PWill all find it hard to stick with a guy and get through screens.

As you can likely tell, I agree. I would also add that it's not just the failure to fight through screens, it's also a lack of help for the bigs when they step up to help. (Now I sound like Stacey, but in this instance I believe that he is correct.)

[mtron32]

Our bigs aren't the problem, our guards get stuck on screens and leave our bigs to play two on one. Sato, Coby, and PWill all find it hard to stick with a guy and get through screens.

As you can likely tell, I agree. I would also add that it's not just the failure to fight through screens, it's also a lack of help for the bigs when they step up to help. (Now I sound like Stacey, but in this instance I believe that he is correct.)

Troy Brown jr I'm not worried about at all, that dude knows how to move. Arch, if he was 5 inches taller would be another one. Is PWill playing SF for us right now? He may need to slide to PF.

[HOTCARL_o]

Our bigs aren't the problem, our guards get stuck on screens and leave our bigs to play two on one. Sato, Coby, and PWill all find it hard to stick with a guy and get through screens.

As you can likely tell, I agree. I would also add that it's not just the failure to fight through screens, it's also a lack of help for the bigs when they step up to help. (Now I sound like Stacey, but in this instance I believe that he is correct.)

Troy Brown jr I'm not worried about at all, that dude knows how to move. Arch, if he was 5 inches taller would be another one. Is PWill playing SF for us right now? He may need to slide to PF.

I like PWill more at the 4 than at the 3, I thought he played it well when Lauri was injured

[Stratmaster]

Gafford outscored Lauri, Pat, and Coby combined tonight.

Yeah but it doesn't matter because our coach refused to play him and our fans labeled him a bust because of a 3 game stretch as a rookie.

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[drosestruts]

Bulls basketball....woof

I was so excited after the trade deadline. We flipped 1/3 of our roster and brought in some real talent. What's crazier is that I feel like Vuc, Theis and Brown have all been playing well for us. It's the guys that were here before that have just cratered.

Zach rolled his ankle and based on his play I'm still not convinced he's healthy.

Sato, Coby, Lauri and Williams have all been well covered in these threads - but they've just completely disappeared.

I feel like Valentine had like two good games post-All-star break, then he too fell off a cliff.

It's just frustrating to watch the same rotations with the same issues game after game and the coaching staff make no adjustments.

If guys like Williams, Coby and Lauri are providing nothing for us on offense, we might as well play Archi, Green and Aminu who are all probably better defenders.

The Bulls and Lauri seem to be mutually done with each other. I think it's an open secret the Bulls tried to move him at the deadline, their were rumors about trades with both Washington and New Orleans concerning Lauri. His 4 years here, from an organization standpoint, have been an absolute **** show so I'm sure he's ready to move on as well. I get the idea of trying to continue playing him to give our bench a boost and to maintain value for a sign & trade, but it's just not working. At least not with the current rotations.

Speaking of rotations. Whatever it is we're doing, it's not working. For the sake of my sanity, I'd like to see us mix things up.

Starters: Archi / LaVine / Williams / Theis / Vuc

Bench: Sato / White / Brown / Young / Markkanen

I resisted the urge the get too drastic with the changes. When Temple returns I'd be tempted to put him in the starting lineup of Williams, bump Williams to the bench to replace Brown or White.

I like the idea of having Archi and Theis' scrappiness and defense in the starting unit alongside Vuc and LaVine.

[ATRAIN53]

Only 1 FTA and 2 Personal Fouls from our "Big Man"

5/31 from 3 point range.

Coby is the scoring punch we need. The kid knows how to put the ball in the basket if you just let him play his game.
Don't give me this BS about how he can't be a PG or paly defense. It's a position-less NBA these days when you have 7 footers jacking up 5-10 3's a game. I hate it, that guy should be feasting at the line & living off put backs.

They have racked his confidence yanking him from the starting role and and now he's recovering from COVID. Put him back out there as a starter and tell him to shoot the ball. He's a talent we're lucky to have. We need his 10-20 PPG badly!!!

[SfBull]

Now the Bulls need to think about beginning the tanking mode.

[Stratmaster]

It hasn't been said but Zach has not been the same since AS break. I know he has been hurt but other than that 50 point game, he just hasn't been impressive.

Last 9 games per ESPN: 24 pts, 44 FG%, 33 3pt%, 75 FT%.


The rest of the team hasn't been helping so It's not all on him but star players lead, he's not leading (anymore).

In his last 6 games he is averaging 27 points 9 assists and 6 rebounds while playing 37 mpg with this 6 games being in a 9 day span. In the last 5 calendar days he has played 148 nba minutes and has been asked to be PG, scoring star, defensive stopper, leader, and add in hitting the boards. All while trying to heal a bad ankle.

Lavine ain't the issue, and he can't win. You say he needs to lead. When he leads the next guy says he has to stop playing hero ball.

Lavine is the only thing keeping Billy from looking like he should be coaching in high school.

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[dougthonus]

Our bigs aren't the problem, our guards get stuck on screens and leave our bigs to play two on one. Sato, Coby, and PWill all find it hard to stick with a guy and get through screens.

It's almost as if we shouldn't run a defense that forces our guards to fight through screens and should hedge, switch, blitz, zone, or go under screens instead, or you know, literally any defensive system except the one we are running.

[Stratmaster]

It hasn't been said but Zach has not been the same since AS break. I know he has been hurt but other than that 50 point game he just hasn't been impressive.

Last 9 games per ESPN: 24 pts, 44 FG%, 33 3pt%, 75 FT%.


The rest of the team hasn't been helping so It's not all on him but star players lead, he's not leading (anymore).

IKR? Like those are bad stats for a 9 game condensed schedule on a team with 3 new rotation players including a new starting center.

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[SfBull]

The 2 PGs on the team were collectively 3/13 8 Points 4 Assists 5 Turnovers, PG continues to be the most obvious concern.

The Defense isn't really getting better as the players get used to one another.

He's just a rookie, but god damn PWill has been useless in the last few game stretch. 2 points in the last 2 games despite playing oer 50 minutes is head scratching.

This team is not complete yet, AK needs to pull some rabbits out of hats in the offseason to fix the glaring holes otherwise this teams ceiling is a less talented version of the Jimmy Butler bulls.

With 53 games played it's time for evaluating that AK screwed the 4# pick,he should have drafted Haliburton.I was wrong about PWill being a steal,not really a bust yet but increasingly looking like a bench role player, hopefully good.

[Stratmaster]

Zach has played 149 nba minutes... in 5 days

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So? Football/soccer players play 90min with 1 game. And it is much harder sport for your stamina. How bad fatigue baskeball players have? I play semi seriosly 12h football every week expect now with covid. After that i play still basketball, hockey and do martial arts.

If i play 1 hour without break basketball my fatigue don`t go down. I know it is not NBA but those guys don`t run that much.

Lol. Ok

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[coldfish]

A few months ago, the team was fun to watch. They moved the ball well, they started helping on defense, etc. The record wasn't great but it was over 0.500 for the stretch. I thought that just a little more talent and the team could be a definite playoff team.

Instead, we have now wrecked both the offense and the defense. They really aren't fun to watch right now. In the last 3 games, the team has played consistently terrible basketball. Only Zach hitting a bunch of high degree of difficulty shots for a half broke that up.

Everyone is having fun going after their personal pet peeve and they are all just about right but the big picture is really terrible for Chicago right now.

Pat is starting to really be concerning. The Bulls may be in the process of having blown something like 10 consecutive first round picks. No franchise can overcome drafting that terribly.

[MrSparkle]

It hasn't been said but Zach has not been the same since AS break. I know he has been hurt but other than that 50 point game, he just hasn't been impressive.

Last 9 games per ESPN: 24 pts, 44 FG%, 33 3pt%, 75 FT%.


The rest of the team hasn't been helping so It's not all on him but star players lead, he's not leading (anymore).

In his last 6 games he is averaging 27 points 9 assists and 6 rebounds while playing 37 mpg with this 6 games being in a 9 day span. In the last 5 calendar days he has played 148 nba minutes and has been asked to be PG, scoring star, defensive stopper, leader, and add in hitting the boards. All while trying to heal a bad ankle.

Lavine ain't the issue, and he can't win. You say he needs to lead. When he leads the next guy says he has to stop playing hero ball.

Lavine is the only thing keeping Billy from looking like he should be coaching in high school.

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Isn’t Sato kind of making the Bulls look HS? You were adamant on starting him and playing him more minutes, and I of course see some positives (obviously system defense, switching, and a much better passer than Coby), but I’ve seen a major drop in spacing, which if you ask me is the biggest difference since February: we used to shoot the ball pretty well. He has one good game every 5, which atleast in Coby’s case meant 20+ points semi-regularly. Coby’s game has nose-dived since moving to the bench, playing less with Zach. Sato’s game has floundered since starting. I thought it was a bit of a knee-jerk move, doing it right before the deadline, but “I got it.” Just saying, I don’t think I like it. Would’ve preferred to keep the green lambs try to keep the game close at the top, and have the vets stabilize off bench.

[Stratmaster]

Gafford outscored Lauri, Pat, and Coby combined tonight.

I want to talk more about this topic. We were getting killed by opposing bigs, dealt our starting and backup centers, brought two new bigs into the rotation, and we continue to get killed by opposing bigs. Meanwhile, our former starting center's new team rarely gets abused by opposing bigs. It['s a bad team, and he is nothing special, but his team doesn't lose because it gets bullied inside.

If I were Bulls management, I would look very hard at why after I shuffled personnel nothing appears to have changed.

Amen.

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[Stratmaster]

Coby White
6 Points
2-8 FG
0-4 3FG
3 Turnovers

Tomas Satoranksy
2 Points
1-5 FG
3 Turnovers

We have a few issues but our point guard play is absolutely horrific. It's almost beyond belief.

That trades were incomplete, that's the reason why we won't make the playoffs, if AK had got Ball we'd be in a much better situation.First priority during offseason is getting a decent pg trading Coby,Sato and Valentine if possible.

Yes the trades are incomplete. And if it weren’t already blindingly obvious, the post-trade era has reinforced even more that this team is desperately and absurdly in need of playmaking and defense from either the point guard spot or in the form of the more rare point forward.

But this was known, right? The problem is that when the trade was made we knew it was incomplete and due to the expenditure/restriction of multiple trade assets (effectively WCJ and 4 consecutive first round picks due to league rules), the margin for error was narrowing. But now that margin for error looks absolutely razor thin.

Moreover, this crappy team will not convince Lavine to stay, which was a primary motivation for urgency as well.

A very real path is unfolding in which we:

(1) traded out of a ridiculously loaded draft;

(2) traded two first round picks;

(3) traded a lottery pick player who though struggling as a Bull certainly was talented and capable;

(3) further devalued the value of Lauri and Coby via benchings (depending on your perspective);

(4) lose Lavine for nothing; and

(5) in exchange get two full seasons of a 30-something Vuc.

And then start a rebuild from there.

Basically we need: (a) Williams to become a star, if he can even do that with his mindset, much faster than should be expected; or (b) the 2021 pick to not convey and we land a lottery stud; or (c) a gift from heaven in trade or free agency.

The walls are closing in on AK’s strategy.

What we need... is a coach with a clue.

I absolutely believe the Bulls have >.500 talent. Vuc, Lavine and Theis, with any level of competency around them, should get you most of the way to .500.

Billy is still clinging to the idea that Coby and PWill have to play 25 mpg. Take those 2 off the court and I swear the Bulls become a .500 team even with Brown, Arch, and Lauri taking their minutes. You can't have 25 minutes, (including starting in PWill's case) giving you absolutely nothing on the court, or worse yet (in Coby's case) tearing down any progress you have made and any lead you have built.

From there you add a defensive stopper at PG and a quality starting SF. They don't have to be all-stars. They just have to be competent.

The only reason we all are on the ledge, and need to be, is because it is highly unlikely Billy is going anywhere any time soon.

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[Stratmaster]

Zach has played 149 nba minutes... in 5 days

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So? Football/soccer players play 90min with 1 game. And it is much harder sport for your stamina. How bad fatigue baskeball players have? I play semi seriosly 12h football every week expect now with covid. After that i play still basketball, hockey and do martial arts.

If i play 1 hour without break basketball my fatigue don`t go down. I know it is not NBA but those guys don`t run that much.

Must be trolling, Bball is extremely hard on the body in relation to soccer

And soccer teams play what? 34 or 38 games a season?

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[Ice Man]

When he leads the next guy says he has to stop playing hero ball.

Heads Zach loses, tails Zach loses.

For the opposite effect, listen to Stacey. Two days ago he was crowing during Zach's 50 point first half, about how Zach came out of the gate scoring and that's what Zach needs to do, not be passive while waiting to get his teammates shots. Last night, Stacey was going on about how Zach was laying back and setting up other players, and "that's the Zach that I like."

The man is a born salesman. You want a convertible, the convertible is the best car. You don't want a convertible, well Stacey never much cared for them. They are impractical.

[MrSparkle]

Now the Bulls need to think about beginning the tanking mode.

Do they need to think? Cause if I didn’t follow the Bulls and I looked at the record since trade deadline, you’d have me believe the Bulls are driving a fleet of tanks into Lake Michigan.

[Stratmaster]

As you can likely tell, I agree. I would also add that it's not just the failure to fight through screens, it's also a lack of help for the bigs when they step up to help. (Now I sound like Stacey, but in this instance I believe that he is correct.)

Troy Brown jr I'm not worried about at all, that dude knows how to move. Arch, if he was 5 inches taller would be another one. Is PWill playing SF for us right now? He may need to slide to PF.

I like PWill more at the 4 than at the 3, I thought he played it well when Lauri was injured

Right now I don't like PWill at any position, at any time, in any game. He has been horrible and it doesn't matter whether you call him a 3, a 4 or a 12. He still is non existent offensively. This is what happens when a rookie who isn't ready gets handed a starting job and entitlement minutes.

If the Bulls make a change at the starting 4 there is no way Pat has earned the spot over Vuc (with Theis in the middle), Lauri or Thad.

Besides, the Bulls don't have another 3 on the entire roster that I see. That's the only reason I haven't broken into the UC with a sign saying "you're an idiot Billy" for putting PWill on the court.

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