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OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins

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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#361 » by Jeffster81 » Tue May 4, 2021 4:54 am

Stratmaster wrote:Unless Dalton completely outplays him in training camp and preseason which is highly unlikely; or unless Fields just can't absorb the offense quickly enough, which from what I have heard is also highly unlikely, Fields should start game 1.

And I am the guy that preaches bringing rookies along slowly. But that is in basketball.

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One thing to consider is that the Bears will be starting a rookie LT in Jenkins. Do you want to put your prize QB out there not knowing how Jenkins will fare? I'm cool with Dalton starting until the Bears are convince that Jenkins can protect Fields.

The most pressurized athlete in Chicago is not Justin Fields, it's the guy whose job is it to protect Justin Fields. That's Tevin Jenkins. Need to know he can handle job before putting Fields on the field.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#362 » by CjayC » Tue May 4, 2021 5:32 am

On a happy note, I like this min breakdown. It's highlights of course, but just imagine the what our offense could do with the threat of a deep ball.

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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#363 » by Dominater » Tue May 4, 2021 8:17 am

TheSuzerain wrote:
CobyWhite0 wrote:According to this article, QBs nowadays are much better off being "thrown to the wolves" as rookies

https://www.ganggreennation.com/2018/8/6/17655388/how-rookie-year-playing-time-impacts-a-qbs-future-chances-of-success-new-york-jets-sam-darnold

That's a case of correlation and not causation.

Pat Mahomes, the best QB in football right now, didn't play as a rookie until a throw-away week 17 game. Aaron Rodgers held a clipboard for 3 years. Tom Brady was behind Bledsoe. Carson Palmer, who was a #1 overall pick and looking pretty damn elite until he had that big injury, didn't play as a rookie. The list goes on.

I know there are lots of examples where rookies looked good too, but it's not a bad thing if they can be bought in slowly.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#364 » by ThreeMileAllan » Tue May 4, 2021 8:36 am

For the love of GOD, can someone post another picture in this thread so I don't have to see Mac Jones tubby gut everytime I load up Tapatalk?

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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#365 » by Bluewaterheaven » Tue May 4, 2021 11:47 am

DJhitek wrote:If Fields is better, and I mean even marginally better, than he should start. My only reservation is Matt Nagy, and that is something that won’t change anytime soon. I don’t think he is the dude because he simply does not value an identity and running the ball.


Marginally better in camp does not necessarily mean marginally better on game day. I want Fields to succeed. I wan to see how the line is performing first. Let Dalton be the pin cushion while Fields learns. The last thing we need is for Fields to go out and get sacked 6 times a game.

However, if the Line is performing well, and Dalton isn't Fields should be in by Game 4. He is a phenomenal talent. I want him to be our Aaron Rodgers and be her for 16+ years.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#366 » by Bluewaterheaven » Tue May 4, 2021 11:52 am

Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.


He dropped because of Seizures as well. There are at least two teams who are known to have mixed feelings about Fields due to the seizures and how head trauma can make them worse.

I don't think its an issue though.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#367 » by dougthonus » Tue May 4, 2021 12:08 pm

dice wrote:
TheSuzerain wrote:
CobyWhite0 wrote:According to this article, QBs nowadays are much better off being "thrown to the wolves" as rookies

https://www.ganggreennation.com/2018/8/6/17655388/how-rookie-year-playing-time-impacts-a-qbs-future-chances-of-success-new-york-jets-sam-darnold

That's a case of correlation and not causation.

exactly. there's really no way of knowing whether they guy who starts from day 1 and succeeds did so because he got the early exposure or because he was GOOD ENOUGH to handle the early exposure and learn/grow. every case is different


The historical opinion has just as little evidence to support it. Maybe the QB position is just so different, but what other position in the NFL do you think would learn better by watching rather than doing? You have something like 6-7 months to look at game film and and other stuff, what more watching do you think is truly beneficial here? Especially since not starting you also won't get full reps with the 1st time offense and actually develop chemistry with guys you will play with?

The idea that it is better to start your QB from day one is a far more logical conclusion than he will be better and more prepared and less likely to fail if he waits longer and doesn't play at all. His skills are far more likely to get rusty by sitting rather than improve. I can't imagine any athletic activity that you have practiced for over a decade is going to get better by taking a year off and watching someone else do it. The whole concept is absurd on the surface. The only reason anyone buys into it at all is that it is conventional wisdom.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#368 » by dougthonus » Tue May 4, 2021 12:12 pm

Stratmaster wrote:Unless Dalton completely outplays him in training camp and preseason which is highly unlikely; or unless Fields just can't absorb the offense quickly enough, which from what I have heard is also highly unlikely, Fields should start game 1.

And I am the guy that preaches bringing rookies along slowly. But that is in basketball.


I think it makes little sense to bring rookies along slowly in any sport. Maybe in MLB because you have an actual league they play in, and they are getting reps every day and move up as they prove they are able to handle the level of competition.

QB is a little unique in that it isn't as practical to bring a QB in and let them play half a game as it is to bring an NBA rookie in and let him play 18 minutes.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#369 » by Michael Jackson » Tue May 4, 2021 12:25 pm

dougthonus wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:Unless Dalton completely outplays him in training camp and preseason which is highly unlikely; or unless Fields just can't absorb the offense quickly enough, which from what I have heard is also highly unlikely, Fields should start game 1.

And I am the guy that preaches bringing rookies along slowly. But that is in basketball.


I think it makes little sense to bring rookies along slowly in any sport. Maybe in MLB because you have an actual league they play in, and they are getting reps every day and move up as they prove they are able to handle the level of competition.

QB is a little unique in that it isn't as practical to bring a QB in and let them play half a game as it is to bring an NBA rookie in and let him play 18 minutes.



With a QB you risk career ending injury at a much higher rate than a PG or really most other positions on a football field too. They try to maim QB’s. They also tend to get a lot of reps in practice if they are being groomed but I think the risk of injury is the prime factor. QB is also supposed to be a leader, hard to do without paying some dues.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#370 » by sco » Tue May 4, 2021 12:26 pm

Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.

IMO, we have Dwayne Haskins to thank. Dude was such a bust, he tainted NFL GM's against OSU QB's.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#371 » by dougthonus » Tue May 4, 2021 12:26 pm

Michael Jackson wrote:With a QB you risk career ending injury at a much higher rate than a PG or really most other positions on a football field too. They try to maim QB’s. They also tend to get a lot of reps in practice if they are being groomed but I think the risk of injury is the prime factor. QB is also supposed to be a leader, hard to do without paying some dues.


I've never heard the risk of injury being the reason. It has always been being beaten down mentally and never recovering because their skills weren't ready.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#372 » by fleet » Tue May 4, 2021 1:20 pm

Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.


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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#373 » by Chicago-Bull-E » Tue May 4, 2021 1:26 pm

Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.


You could say this about anyone the Bears drafted at 11. If they weren't drafted 1st, then they 'dropped' down to 11, so all players drafted at 11 likely had some imperfections.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#374 » by patryk7754 » Tue May 4, 2021 1:41 pm

dougthonus wrote:
patryk7754 wrote:Leno has been cut. At the least this gets us under the cap with the ability to keep hicks. Hopefully some more moves are made


NFL cap seems difficult for me to understand as I'm not an expert in it, but sure feels like there isn't much room to do anything else.

just an updat: itll be a post june 1 cut. I think that means they'll save 9m instead of about 6. Also, I meant that in a addition to cutting Leno they make more moves like contract adjustments to add a couple mill in cap cuz there are still some needs that need to be addressed.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#375 » by Michael Jackson » Tue May 4, 2021 1:43 pm

dougthonus wrote:
Michael Jackson wrote:With a QB you risk career ending injury at a much higher rate than a PG or really most other positions on a football field too. They try to maim QB’s. They also tend to get a lot of reps in practice if they are being groomed but I think the risk of injury is the prime factor. QB is also supposed to be a leader, hard to do without paying some dues.


I've never heard the risk of injury being the reason. It has always been being beaten down mentally and never recovering because their skills weren't ready.



Those things are vitally important no doubt and having confidence broken is a steep uphill climb for a QB. That being said I can think of no other position that is attacked with force that is meant to remove a player from the game than QB (outside of fighting sports of course). QB’s are at risk and a young QB who isn’t used to the speed of the game is going to get killed more than say a young lineman. Now the lineman might get burnt on every play but he won’t get his bones broken by Ray Lewis off of his blindside. It is pure speculation but if you spend for an asset you want to make sure the asset is ready and doesn’t get hurt early on I a QB. Obviously the co fine CEU factor plays in for everyone and more so for a QB. If Fields came out with Patrick Williams confidence well... fields woukd have been the wrong choice.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#376 » by dougthonus » Tue May 4, 2021 1:45 pm

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:
Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.


You could say this about anyone the Bears drafted at 11. If they weren't drafted 1st, then they 'dropped' down to 11, so all players drafted at 11 likely had some imperfections.


If you look at the top QBs in the NFL (in order of pick, not eliteness):
Murray - 1st
Mayfield - 1st
Herbert - 6th
Allen - 7th
Mahomes - 10th
Roethlisberger - 11th
Watson - 12th
Rodgers - 24th
Jackson - 32nd
Brees - 32nd (though 2nd rounder in this draft)
Wilson - 3rd rounder
Dak - 4th rounder
Brady - 7th rounder

Most great QBs are 1st rounders and had 1st round pedigree, but it certainly isn't weird to find a franchise QB outside the top 5 picks.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#377 » by fleet » Tue May 4, 2021 1:53 pm

Bluewaterheaven wrote:
Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.


He dropped because of Seizures as well. There are at least two teams who are known to have mixed feelings about Fields due to the seizures and how head trauma can make them worse.

I don't think its an issue though.

All Ive picked up is that he has a throwing motion hitch that needs to be straightened out and footwork
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#378 » by Michael Jackson » Tue May 4, 2021 2:46 pm

Bluewaterheaven wrote:
Sinistar6 wrote:I am really excited but I am starting to have some anxiety about this pick. I can not believe the only reason he dropped is because of team needs and other QBs excelling. This has been a top 2 QB in his class since high school. Did Zack Wilson really have that great of a year and pro day and does Trey Lance really have that much upside? JF ran a 4.4 40... his metrics on deep throws is off the charts, he had success at a Blue chip college, toughness leader etc. why did he drop? IMO no news about Fields is good news until the season starts. I realize this is delusional just not really used to these things happening in Chitown sports.


He dropped because of Seizures as well. There are at least two teams who are known to have mixed feelings about Fields due to the seizures and how head trauma can make them worse.

I don't think its an issue though.



What are his seizure issues? I am assuming they aren't major because he wouldn't pass a physical if they were, but I can understand a team being worried about that. He could take a bad shot and have to retire, which is the case for anyone but the probability goes up in his case potentially.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#379 » by mlitney01 » Tue May 4, 2021 2:49 pm

dougthonus wrote:
Stratmaster wrote:Unless Dalton completely outplays him in training camp and preseason which is highly unlikely; or unless Fields just can't absorb the offense quickly enough, which from what I have heard is also highly unlikely, Fields should start game 1.

And I am the guy that preaches bringing rookies along slowly. But that is in basketball.


I think it makes little sense to bring rookies along slowly in any sport. Maybe in MLB because you have an actual league they play in, and they are getting reps every day and move up as they prove they are able to handle the level of competition.

QB is a little unique in that it isn't as practical to bring a QB in and let them play half a game as it is to bring an NBA rookie in and let him play 18 minutes.


I could see an argument for bringing them along slowly. Firstly, the big difference between college and NFL is the speed of the game. Players are bigger, stronger, and faster. In practices, Fields will be going against an NFL defense. While it may not be the same type of defense he would face in a game, he will still become more comfortable with the types of players he will be facing.

We also have some big changes on the O-line. As many others have said, let Dalton take the hits until those big boys can figure out their role and the line solidifies.

My biggest fear is that Fields goes in early and gets injured, losing valuable time in his first few years. Both of my previous points will help to quell that threat.
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Re: OT: Bears Talk - Justin Fields era begins 

Post#380 » by Susan » Tue May 4, 2021 4:23 pm

ThreeMileAllan wrote:For the love of GOD, can someone post another picture in this thread so I don't have to see Mac Jones tubby gut everytime I load up Tapatalk?

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