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Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion

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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#81 » by Michael Jackson » Thu May 20, 2021 10:38 pm

Wingy wrote:
This is complete conjecture, but I think AK may not even see Vuc as the #2 guy...and he may not have any delusions about ever competing for a title w/this particular core. It may just be the start of his "program" with the Bulls. Make some noise. Be seen, and show we're trying to win. Be relevant in player minds again. Of course while we have Zach/Vuc, hope you get crazy lucky finding a gem, hitting on the picks we do have, etc.



I kind of think this is right. They are giving the franchise a facelift, and mediocre is the first step (sadly) I doubt AK was thinking boy Vuc solves all our problems we can contend if we can just get... Ball or whoever. You have to have a decent showing to attract any talent. He is tickling Zach's nut sack by getting him "some" help, trying to change that image. I can easily see him flipping Vuc in the right deal, I doubt he is married to him. He just needed to get a car that had 4 wheels on it to even enter the race and worry about upgrades later. Maybe not though maybe AK really thinks Vuc is the cats ass...
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#82 » by fleet » Thu May 20, 2021 10:42 pm

Repeat 3-peat wrote:There is a lot of smoke around Ball to Chicago. If he isn't a Bull, it would not be a case of 'lack of trying' on the Bulls end.

Probably a day one move during free agency.

new smoke or the same smoke lingering from the deadline?
Brad Biggs wrote:Fields was in the bottom third of the league in too many key statistical metrics for the Bears to commit to the idea of trading down from the first pick for a bundle of future assets and then building around him.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#83 » by Michael Jackson » Thu May 20, 2021 10:46 pm

fleet wrote:
Repeat 3-peat wrote:There is a lot of smoke around Ball to Chicago. If he isn't a Bull, it would not be a case of 'lack of trying' on the Bulls end.

Probably a day one move during free agency.

new smoke or the same smoke lingering from the deadline?



Smoke from 2 years ago is still lingering I think. Ball to Chicago has been a narrative for a long time. There have been multiple opportunities and it hasn't happened so I'll believe it when I see it.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#84 » by fleet » Thu May 20, 2021 10:48 pm

the Knicks will have more money to spend (yes?) anyway, willingness is another story. I fully expect to be outbid by somebody. If you wanted to predict where Ball goes, it is always to the money. Unless S&T scenarios exist. The Pels weren’t impressed with us before.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#85 » by WindyCityBorn » Thu May 20, 2021 11:29 pm

Repeat 3-peat wrote:There is a lot of smoke around Ball to Chicago. If he isn't a Bull, it would not be a case of 'lack of trying' on the Bulls end.

Probably a day one move during free agency.


I really hope so. I don't want our season to depend on Coby's development.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#86 » by WindyCityBorn » Thu May 20, 2021 11:30 pm

Michael Jackson wrote:
fleet wrote:
Repeat 3-peat wrote:There is a lot of smoke around Ball to Chicago. If he isn't a Bull, it would not be a case of 'lack of trying' on the Bulls end.

Probably a day one move during free agency.

new smoke or the same smoke lingering from the deadline?



Smoke from 2 years ago is still lingering I think. Ball to Chicago has been a narrative for a long time. There have been multiple opportunities and it hasn't happened so I'll believe it when I see it.


Um AK literally tried to acquire him at the trade deadline, but we didn't have the assets they wanted. So more like two months.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#87 » by waffle » Thu May 20, 2021 11:30 pm

I have quite a bit of faith in AK. Fingers crossed he can pull something off.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#88 » by WindyCityBorn » Thu May 20, 2021 11:34 pm

fleet wrote:the Knicks will have more money to spend (yes?) anyway, willingness is another story. I fully expect to be outbid by somebody. If you wanted to predict where Ball goes, it is always to the money. Unless S&T scenarios exist. The Pels weren’t impressed with us before.


I can't see the Knicks giving much more than we would offer and if he wants to come here we can work out a S&T. We wanted a first for Lauri a the deadline, but I don't think we would ask for that in a sign and trade this Summer.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#89 » by WindyCityBorn » Thu May 20, 2021 11:37 pm

Michael Jackson wrote:
Wingy wrote:
This is complete conjecture, but I think AK may not even see Vuc as the #2 guy...and he may not have any delusions about ever competing for a title w/this particular core. It may just be the start of his "program" with the Bulls. Make some noise. Be seen, and show we're trying to win. Be relevant in player minds again. Of course while we have Zach/Vuc, hope you get crazy lucky finding a gem, hitting on the picks we do have, etc.



I kind of think this is right. They are giving the franchise a facelift, and mediocre is the first step (sadly) I doubt AK was thinking boy Vuc solves all our problems we can contend if we can just get... Ball or whoever. You have to have a decent showing to attract any talent. He is tickling Zach's nut sack by getting him "some" help, trying to change that image. I can easily see him flipping Vuc in the right deal, I doubt he is married to him. He just needed to get a car that had 4 wheels on it to even enter the race and worry about upgrades later. Maybe not though maybe AK really thinks Vuc is the cats ass...


AK is no fool. He wants to make us respectable again as soon as possible. He doesn't want to depend on lottery balls and players panning out 3 to 5 years later. He straight up said he never wants to draft as high as 4 again although I'm sure he would take it this Summer. Making the playoffs next season (top 6) and having Zach and Vuc be all-stars would be a major step forward the Bulls credibility.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#90 » by jump » Fri May 21, 2021 4:24 am

I think the Knicks will end up with Lowry. That'll give us a good shot at Ball, if we still want him.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#91 » by Am2626 » Fri May 21, 2021 5:06 am

sco wrote:I thought I'd take a shot at a centralized discussion thread for FA PG's next season because there are so many similar threads.

Let's start with our needs:

IMO our biggest 2 needs are:
1) Ability to not only efficiently distribute the ball, but also effectively do so - which means want a guy who can dribble or pass a guy open for a good shot vs. a guy who just passes to an open guy, and do so without a ton of unforced TO's.

2) Defend quick PG's.

Do I care if he can get his own shot - sure, but honestly, with Zach and Vuc, I'm less concerned about it. Also, if we are starting Williams next season, I'd much rather he get the 3rd option shots.

The better options I saw discussed:

Ball - he's a name with hype, and he's had a good season. IMO, he's good, but not great at my 2 items above and he's gonna cost $20-$25M/yr, but he's got upside. I've seen improvement and he's got upside...I like that in a PG.

Graham - odd man out in Cha. Showed he's a decent, but not elite playmaker and his defense seems average. He'll be cheaper and still has upside.

Nunn - he seems like a SG playing next Butler, the team's real PG - not sure how good of a defender he is.

Conley - probably the best at my 1 and 2. he's old and not too durable and unless Utah blows-up, doubt he's going anywhere.

Lowry - also good at 1 and 2. he'll be available, but expensive. he's also old and not durable.

Dragic - like Nunn, seems more like a SG on Mia. Also old.

Dinwiddie - I think he is an ok, but not great playmaker. Seems like a good defender. Obviously he's coming off an injury, but his price might reflect the risk.

Rose - he's improved as a playmaker over the years and is probably still an average defender. Also on the older side, but might come at a reasonable price. Obviously would be a fan fave, but not sure if Zach would like losing the limelight.

Schröder - not sure he's more than average as a playmaker. I think he's a good defender. His price will also be $20M-$25M, but he knows Billy's system, and did well in OKC.

McConnell - he strikes me as the best value play if we are only focused on my 1 & 2. He seems like an average playmaker, but really good defender.

Rubio - A trade target who may have upside after a bad year in Minny.

Other guys I wouldn't love or hate:

Payton

Payne

Ntilikina

Dunn

Caruso

Mills


I think winning is the most important thing for Zach so I don’t see Rose’s popularity being an issue. LaVine’s career has been completely based on being on losing teams. He is dying to see success and the playoffs. I think he would welcome any guy that can help him get there.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#92 » by Michael Jackson » Fri May 21, 2021 12:29 pm

WindyCityBorn wrote:
Michael Jackson wrote:
Wingy wrote:
This is complete conjecture, but I think AK may not even see Vuc as the #2 guy...and he may not have any delusions about ever competing for a title w/this particular core. It may just be the start of his "program" with the Bulls. Make some noise. Be seen, and show we're trying to win. Be relevant in player minds again. Of course while we have Zach/Vuc, hope you get crazy lucky finding a gem, hitting on the picks we do have, etc.



I kind of think this is right. They are giving the franchise a facelift, and mediocre is the first step (sadly) I doubt AK was thinking boy Vuc solves all our problems we can contend if we can just get... Ball or whoever. You have to have a decent showing to attract any talent. He is tickling Zach's nut sack by getting him "some" help, trying to change that image. I can easily see him flipping Vuc in the right deal, I doubt he is married to him. He just needed to get a car that had 4 wheels on it to even enter the race and worry about upgrades later. Maybe not though maybe AK really thinks Vuc is the cats ass...


AK is no fool. He wants to make us respectable again as soon as possible. He doesn't want to depend on lottery balls and players panning out 3 to 5 years later. He straight up said he never wants to draft as high as 4 again although I'm sure he would take it this Summer. Making the playoffs next season (top 6) and having Zach and Vuc be all-stars would be a major step forward the Bulls credibility.



I for one agree with this attack too. We surely will never attract any talent in the current landscape of the NBA as a bad team as we have seen for decades now. You have to be a middling team at the minimum to even be in the discussion. This franchise has done everything to change their perception and I think they have done well considering where it was just over a year ago going into the lock down.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#93 » by Michael Jackson » Fri May 21, 2021 12:32 pm

WindyCityBorn wrote:
Michael Jackson wrote:
fleet wrote:new smoke or the same smoke lingering from the deadline?



Smoke from 2 years ago is still lingering I think. Ball to Chicago has been a narrative for a long time. There have been multiple opportunities and it hasn't happened so I'll believe it when I see it.


Um AK literally tried to acquire him at the trade deadline, but we didn't have the assets they wanted. So more like two months.



That was just the latest though. Ball to Chicago rumors go all the way back to the first mid season trade attempts between NOP and LAL for AD. It was also rumored in that summer when the sign and trade for AD did happen. If it has been the Bulls side, Balls side or both, there has been plenty of talk of Lonzo to Chicago for a while under different scenarios.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#94 » by sco » Fri May 21, 2021 1:16 pm

Watching Mike James on the Nets the other day...he might be a sneaky good add.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#95 » by Almost Retired » Fri May 21, 2021 1:25 pm

Maybe the Draft, even a 2nd Rounder, could give us some help. After scanning several Mock Draft site there are likely to be some PGs or Combo Guards that might be worth bringing in for Personal workouts. This is such a deep draft that some of the 2nd rounders available have late 1st round potential. Guys that MIGHT or are probable to drop into the 2nd round include Joel Ayayi of Gonzaga. Chris Duarte of Oregon. Sharife Cooper from Auburn. David Duke of Providence. Juhann Begarin from France. RJ Nembhard of TCU. Daishen Nix of Ignite. Marcus Zegarowski of Creighton. David Johnson of Louisville. Marcus Garrett of Kansas. Nah'Shon Hyland of VCU. Miles McBride of WVA. Tre Mann of Florida. Rokas Jokubaitis from Europe. Max Abmas of Oral Roberts. Not all of them are going to be NBA material obviously. But you fly them in 3 or 4 at a time and evaluate them. See which ones have worked on their game since March Madness ended. See which ones didn't get to show their whole game in college due to the system they played in. I guarantee there is a gem in there somewhere. A few of these guys might go in the late 1st. But that could push guys like Ayo Dosunmu to the top of the 2nd Round.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#96 » by sco » Fri May 21, 2021 1:28 pm

Almost Retired wrote:Maybe the Draft, even a 2nd Rounder, could give us some help. After scanning several Mock Draft site there are likely to be some PGs or Combo Guards that might be worth bringing in for Personal workouts. This is such a deep draft that some of the 2nd rounders available have late 1st round potential. Guys that MIGHT or are probable to drop into the 2nd round include Joel Ayayi of Gonzaga. Chris Duarte of Oregon. Sharife Cooper from Auburn. David Duke of Providence. Juhann Begarin from France. RJ Nembhard of TCU. Daishen Nix of Ignite. Marcus Zegarowski of Creighton. David Johnson of Louisville. Marcus Garrett of Kansas. Nah'Shon Hyland of VCU. Miles McBride of WVA. Tre Mann of Florida. Rokas Jokubaitis from Europe. Max Abmas of Oral Roberts. Not all of them are going to be NBA material obviously. But you fly them in 3 or 4 at a time and evaluate them. See which ones have worked on their game since March Madness ended. See which ones didn't get to show their whole game in college due to the system they played in. I guarantee there is a gem in there somewhere. A few of these guys might go in the late 1st. But that could push guys like Ayo Dosunmu to the top of the 2nd Round.

Not opposed to someone to replace Dotson on 2-way from draft.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#97 » by sco » Tue May 25, 2021 5:21 pm

I'm still thinking the Knicks won't keep Rose, Quickley and also get Ball. I would be happy to take whoever the odd man out there is.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#98 » by Am2626 » Tue May 25, 2021 6:10 pm

sco wrote:I'm still thinking the Knicks won't keep Rose, Quickley and also get Ball. I would be happy to take whoever the odd man out there is.


Yeah it wouldn’t make sense to have that many PG on your roster. Any of those 3 guys would be a welcome addition to the Bulls next year.
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#99 » by sco » Tue May 25, 2021 8:39 pm

Am2626 wrote:
sco wrote:I'm still thinking the Knicks won't keep Rose, Quickley and also get Ball. I would be happy to take whoever the odd man out there is.


Yeah it wouldn’t make sense to have that many PG on your roster. Any of those 3 guys would be a welcome addition to the Bulls next year.

If we operate over the cap, do folks think we can get Rose for the MLE? He had a good season, but that should be enough, right?
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Re: Free Agent/Trade For PG Discussion 

Post#100 » by HomoSapien » Tue May 25, 2021 9:31 pm

How about Bryn Forbes as an option? Not the creator we're seeking, but he's a lights out shooter and has been somewhat flying under the radar till yesterday's game. He'll definitely opt out looking for a payday, but I'm skeptical he'll get it. If you sign him, you'll have to depend on LaVine being a bigger distributor, but Forbes' shooting would create a ton of space for him and Vuc.
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