Zach LaVine's impending Free Agency

[Am2626]

I have no expectations for this team. If we make playoffs then LaVine should stay. If we miss playoffs, for 5 years in a row, under LaVine, then it's officially time for LaVine and Chicago Bulls to part ways. We'll see.

This is a horrible take.

If the Bulls don’t make the playoffs this year then something terribly went wrong. Unless there are major injuries not making the playoffs is a massive fail and this team will then need to blow everything up. That scenario is extremely unlikely.

[coldfish]

Bobby Marks's latest article, saying Lavine & Beal are the headliners and only stars of the next FA class.
https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/32039279/nba-free-agency-2022-superstars-trades-teams-watch

A once star-studded free-agent class consisting of Kevin Durant, Stephen Curry, Jimmy Butler and perhaps Kawhi Leonard, is now led by Zach LaVine and perhaps Bradley Beal.

"Because next offseason is average at best in talent, I am expecting the trade market to be extremely active during the regular season," a Western Conference general manager told ESPN.

Better make sure this kid is locked up, because there won't be a replacement for a long while. I wouldn't try to save a few bucks here and risk Lavine finding another city more appealing.

Just to note, there are few teams with max capspace next year.

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/263908/Pistons-Magic-Spurs-Only-Three-Teams-Projected-To-Have-2022-Cap-Space

IMO, the moves over the last month have pretty much put to bed the idea of Zach leaving. The only question is if he gets the full max or if he gives a discount. I used to be pretty worried about this potential but not any more.

[DuckIII]

The only way Lavine does not get a max deal with the Bulls (assuming no career threatening injury) is if he chooses to take a smaller deal to help with team building. Which he won’t do. He will ask for the max, the Bulls will quickly hand him the paperwork to sign, and that will be the end of it. There will be no controversy, no delay, no negotiating through the media.

[Redemption Bong]

Seems naive to think Lavine might not ask out whether or not he signs a max deal.

I think if he signs and the team starts 2022-2023 off on a bad note he can easily force his way off the team. Signing a max deal doesn't preclude a star from asking out.

[DuckIII]

Seems naive to think Lavine might not ask out whether or not he signs a max deal.

I think if he signs and the team starts 2022-2023 off on a bad note he can easily force his way off the team. Signing a max deal doesn't preclude a star from asking out.

Obviously.

P.S. I don’t see anyone saying otherwise so I don’t know what “naive” opinion to which you are responding. When people say they don’t think he’ll “leave” they mean in free agency in 2022.

[dice]

The only way Lavine does not get a max deal with the Bulls (assuming no career threatening injury) is if he chooses to take a smaller deal to help with team building. Which he won’t do. He will ask for the max, the Bulls will quickly hand him the paperwork to sign, and that will be the end of it. There will be no controversy, no delay, no negotiating through the media.

he may well take a slight melo/knicks discount (which melo rightfully got dragged for)

[dice]

I have no expectations for this team. If we make playoffs then LaVine should stay. If we miss playoffs, for 5 years in a row, under LaVine, then it's officially time for LaVine and Chicago Bulls to part ways. We'll see.

This is a horrible take.

If the Bulls don’t make the playoffs this year then something terribly went wrong. Unless there are major injuries not making the playoffs is a massive fail and this team will then need to blow everything up. That scenario is extremely unlikely.

it's not only not extremely unlikely, it may not even be unlikely. the bulls are projected as a .500 team. and they have to be a 6 seed to avoid a play-in

[Am2626]

This is a horrible take.

If the Bulls don’t make the playoffs this year then something terribly went wrong. Unless there are major injuries not making the playoffs is a massive fail and this team will then need to blow everything up. That scenario is extremely unlikely.

it's not only not extremely unlikely, it may not even be unlikely. the bulls are projected as a .500 team. and they have to be a 6 seed to avoid a play-in

That’s not what I meant. This team has too much talent not to finish in the top 8 record wise. Yes they could lose in the play in and not make the playoffs that way but I don’t see this team sitting on the outside trying to sneak in the playoffs. That would be really bad. Also I don’t see how this is just a .500 team with the additions they made. This team should win between 45-50 games in a conference that has a lot of parity and then some really bad teams at the bottom.

[Stratmaster]

Im sorry, I just don't see why ZLV would need to be convinced to re-sign. It should be the other way around. The guy has never even strung together a 4 game win streak as The Guy (or even before he became The Guy). He should be convincing Chicago that they need him. I'm not opposed to paying him, but he's never been a winning athlete once in his life. Presently, he's a juiced-up Monta Ellis/Kevin Martin. Its not like there are a plethora of teams vying for his services, especially at what will be his enormous price tag

Juiced-up Monta Ellis/Kevin Martin PRESENTLY? Just ridiculous. Zach was on another planet from them this season and this olympic run. 50.7/41.9/84.9 splits are absurd. There is a reason the entire league flipped on him this past season and even his greatest skeptics were advocating for him making the All Star Team in a hyper competitive conference at the guard position.

So where would he go, and why? to do what? I just find all of this talk to be absolutely hilarious & ironic. Not only has this dude never excelled in the playoffs, but he's never even BEEN to the playoffs, and he's more than halfway through his 20s. He's also made everyone around neutral-or-worse throughout the overwhelmingly vast majority of his on-court career.

You just described Devin Booker prior to this year. Guess the Suns shouldn't have maxed him out.

Notice, I said a *JUICED-UP* Monta, which is an apt comparison for him, especially regarding his positive/negative effect on his teammates. It's not a knock, Monta was a great player, but he wasn't a winner & played low-IQ ball, as does ZLV

Also, Booker was always a MUCH more cerebral, restrained, disciplined player than Zach LaVine. It was very easy to imagine surrounding him with length, brains, & athleticism, and having it being successful

For as good as he's gotten, ZLV still plays very reckless, sloppy basketball, is still a mediocre ball-handler, poor decision maker, undisciplined on defense, and overall a sub-par IQ player in general (if we are comparing him to other star players)

I have read some bad takes on here about Zach... but your takes just reek of bias. You may as well have just said "For as good as he's gotten, I hate him and hec sucks".

Do you own any Jimmy Butler jerseys?

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[Stratmaster]

Also, the off-season moves that they made were not made to appease Zach freaking LaVine LOL. They literally went out & got talented players... ...... you know, like every single other competent front office does. DDR & Ball were arguably the two best FAs from this recent class, so the Bulls went out & signed them, and it's really that simple.

Yes they were. There are different ways to build a team. If AK were willing to throw all that money and all those assets to build a team around Ball, DDR and Vuc without someone like Lavine in the fold, it would evidence gross incompetence. The only reason any of this was done (except Ball) on that urgent timeline is because Lavine was already on the roster, had a huge season, and was only a year away from restricted free agency. No way DDR in particular gets that huge overpay without Lavine here.

Obviously Zach needs to hold up his end of the bargain by playing good basketball, but no one is “bending over backwards” for Lavine. He’s a max contract player in the NBA. That market is already set unless he blows out a knee.

Even if he’s not “the guy” in your eyes, which is fair, the Bulls are in a position in which they still need to retain him as an asset. So your differing opinion of his quality, which has flecks of factual merit nestled into a variety of contextual flaws, is ultimately irrelevant. He has to be retained for the good of the team no matter what you think of him as an individual player.

DDR wasn't an overpay, at least not if you've been watching him consistently over the past couple years. He's better now than he was a few years ago & is still relatively young in contemporary NBA years (and has adopted a low physical impact style of play)

Obviously they signed those guys to add to what they already have in ZLV/Vooch/etc, but they didn't do it to desperately "appease" Zach LaVine. He's a career loser that no NBA front office would go out of their way to overly appease/cater to unless they were absolutely desperate & had zero assets/capital to operate with

They should and probably will retain him, but acting like he's this solidified franchise centrepiece that they are bending over backwards to make happy is absurd imo

Who is the best player on the Chicago Bulls?

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[Stratmaster]

Notice, I said a *JUICED-UP* Monta, which is an apt comparison for him, especially regarding his positive/negative effect on his teammates. It's not a knock, Monta was a great player, but he wasn't a winner & played low-IQ ball, as does ZLV

It is a knock. Acting like Zach is some mildly better version of a player and is just up one tier in a similar category to a player who never came close to the performance Zach had last season is wrong.

Also, Booker was always a MUCH more cerebral, restrained, disciplined player than Zach LaVine. It was very easy to imagine surrounding him with length, brains, & athleticism, and having it being successful

Interesting. I am sure this MUCH more cerebral restrained disciplined player had way less turnovers than Zach in the three seasons prior to this one when he was paired with Chris Paul.

17-18 Booker's Turnovers Per Game: 3.6 vs. LaVine's Turnovers Per Game: 1.8 (Zach did play eight less minutes but was also coming off the ACL)
18-19 Booker's Turnovers Per Game: 4.1 vs. LaVine's Turnovers Per Game: 3.4
19-20 Booker's Turnovers Per Game: 3.8 vs. LaVine's Turnovers Per Game: 3.4

Help me lord, I can't even see straight I am so blinded by Booker's cerebral, restrained, disciplined play.

You are talking out of your butt. You said something ridiculous and now you are doubling down on it, based on whatever idea you have of Devin Booker before this season. And you are the one who over extended yourself by saying MUCH. Facts>Hyperbole.

He is just a hater. I expect he has been since day 1 and just can't handle being so wrong.

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[Stratmaster]

It would be pretty shocking to see them not offer a max deal.

It would mean the season was a disaster.

It's crazy to think that a guy with zero playoff experience and one all star appearance is poised to be the highest paid Chicago Bull ever.
You think back to how hard Scottie and Horace had to battle to get paid and they had won some titles already!

He's really right where Butler was when they decided to bail out on him vs paying him.
Paxson is still in the house somewhere too. He picked him over the Jimmy Butler experience.

I hope this is a no brainer after Zach leads us deep into the Eastern Conference Finals vs the Nets.
Like multiple teams are in the hunt after they see some playoff Lavine.

The comparison to where JB was at the same stage doesn't really hold weight. JB was a premier NBA two-way wing, the most valuable & coveted player archetype in modern basketball, and he had relatively ample playoff experience & was a career winner.

Zach LaVine is a career-losing, one-way, net negative (until very recently) shooting guard, who is a very poor defender, has never even sniffed a post-season, and who blew out an ACL a few yrs back

Paying/building around JB was a no-brainer, and that trade that Paxson opted to do instead, was a scandalous disaster that subsequently got the GarPax reign of terror completely dismantled & wiped away.

Paying Zach LaVine isn't exactly a no-brainer. It's a very difficult decision to have to make

Also, Paxson is nowhere near the house. They literally gave him some fake title so that he could keep collecting a courtesy paycheck. Big corporations do it all the time. There has been nothing whatsoever to suggest that he has any say in anything or is even in the loop on any decision-making. He's a goner & hasn't been seen since he was relieved of his duties, and I highly doubt will ever be seen again, especially after the old man croaks

Lol. Never mind my first question. I just got the answer.

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[Stratmaster]

It’s a no-brainer for the people running this team. If you think we are not giving Zach a max offer after the moves made this Summer you are in denial.

I really hated the trade, and always wanted to keep Jimmy.

I do like Zach though, and questioning whether he’s a max player is quite simply moronic. There’s literally no way to sugarcoat that take, or to describe it any other way.

Yes, he’s not as good as some stars, but it’s also a function of the market. Questioning him being max when also considering the market means you’re simply not paying attention. Every team in the league would happily max out Zach (as someone here already said).

The part of this (and most arguments here) is the "compared to what" portion. Do we want to pay Zach the max? What's our alternative?

Let him walk? If we did, what better player(s) would we be signing with that money?

Trade him this season? Maybe. For who?

As for whether Zach is "worth the max", a young guy who made the allstar team, with future appearances likely, who has no attitude issues, and is just entering his prime, is a bit of a no brainer.

But... we lost Jimmy when we traded for him.

5 years from now, Zach Lavine, one of the most likeable stars in the NBA, will still be hated by a core group of Butler fans. The other players like him. He has really never said a selfish or harsh word about anyone but himself.

The reaction from some is a dysfunctional and disgusting example of petty human personality flaws.

Has anyone ever explained to them that Lavine didn't orchestrate that trade? He wasn't one of the GM's involved?

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[DuckIII]

The only way Lavine does not get a max deal with the Bulls (assuming no career threatening injury) is if he chooses to take a smaller deal to help with team building. Which he won’t do. He will ask for the max, the Bulls will quickly hand him the paperwork to sign, and that will be the end of it. There will be no controversy, no delay, no negotiating through the media.

he may well take a slight melo/knicks discount (which melo rightfully got dragged for)

Why would a player get “rightfully dragged” for taking a little less money to help with team building?

[dice]

The only way Lavine does not get a max deal with the Bulls (assuming no career threatening injury) is if he chooses to take a smaller deal to help with team building. Which he won’t do. He will ask for the max, the Bulls will quickly hand him the paperwork to sign, and that will be the end of it. There will be no controversy, no delay, no negotiating through the media.

he may well take a slight melo/knicks discount (which melo rightfully got dragged for)

Why would a player get “rightfully dragged” for taking a little less money to help with team building?

because it's more optics than genuinely helping. and when a team is over the cap, there is no team building benefit other than helping management avoid luxury tax

[SaNdMiRkS]

I really hated the trade, and always wanted to keep Jimmy.

I do like Zach though, and questioning whether he’s a max player is quite simply moronic. There’s literally no way to sugarcoat that take, or to describe it any other way.

Yes, he’s not as good as some stars, but it’s also a function of the market. Questioning him being max when also considering the market means you’re simply not paying attention. Every team in the league would happily max out Zach (as someone here already said).

The part of this (and most arguments here) is the "compared to what" portion. Do we want to pay Zach the max? What's our alternative?

Let him walk? If we did, what better player(s) would we be signing with that money?

Trade him this season? Maybe. For who?

As for whether Zach is "worth the max", a young guy who made the allstar team, with future appearances likely, who has no attitude issues, and is just entering his prime, is a bit of a no brainer.

But... we lost Jimmy when we traded for him.

5 years from now, Zach Lavine, one of the most likeable stars in the NBA, will still be hated by a core group of Butler fans. The other players like him. He has really never said a selfish or harsh word about anyone but himself.

The reaction from some is a dysfunctional and disgusting example of petty human personality flaws.

Has anyone ever explained to them that Lavine didn't orchestrate that trade? He wasn't one of the GM's involved?

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I wouldn't classify ZLV as one of the most likable NBA players by a long shot, at least not amongst fans. Contrarily, he's one of the easiest guys to dislike in the league over the past 5 yrs. There's a reason why, despite the 1%er athleticism/highlight reels & the fact that he plays for the most recognizable sports brand on the planet, that ppl still have disdain for him, and it isn't just the losing records:

He's a great looking trust fund kid with utterly unattainable, alien genetic traits, who typically has played ZERO defense & has historically played pretty dumb/sloppy basketball in general...and on top of all of that, he's a bit of a bland/vanilla outward personality. That's basically the blueprint for a dislikable person lol. The average clock-punching pleb individual sports fan can't relate to any of that

Also, Bulls fans have every right to resent him/hold disdain for him. I'm not implying that it's healthy behaviour, and of course, Bulls fans are the gold (red?) standard when it comes to unhealthy/miserable dispositions & mindsets throughout sports fandom, but when your team trades away a beloved fan favourite Chicago folk hero, who is on the rise & in his prime & has a deep connection to the city/brand/fans, for a package centred around a one-way career loser coming off of a blown ACL, 9 times out of 10, it won't end well.

That trade was a complete nightmare, from top to bottom, no matter which way anyone slices it, and it ultimately lead to the the longest-tenured, most toxic, filthy FO in the NBA being canned & dismembered, finally. There was no reason whatsoever for that trade to go down; it was done solely to appease the collective egos (or lack thereof) of GarPax, and to protect Fred f****ng Hoiberg. No other reason(s)

And to be frank, Zach LaVine being on the Bulls & having individual success (and hopefully being poised to have team success going forward) still feels.....'off'. There's still the Paxson stink on him due to the way in which he was brought in, and how @$$-backwards that trade was for everyone involved (minus Paxson & his posse of dunces...although it lead to him losing his job, but that was years later). You can tell that he knows how fans view him/have viewed him, and I'm sure he understands completely

IMO It's going to take ample playoff success as a positive two-way player for the entire Bulls fanbase to universally come around, and I'm not so sure ZLV is capable of being that guy, but we'll see

[Fantastik_Goat]

The part of this (and most arguments here) is the "compared to what" portion. Do we want to pay Zach the max? What's our alternative?

Let him walk? If we did, what better player(s) would we be signing with that money?

Trade him this season? Maybe. For who?

As for whether Zach is "worth the max", a young guy who made the allstar team, with future appearances likely, who has no attitude issues, and is just entering his prime, is a bit of a no brainer.

But... we lost Jimmy when we traded for him.

5 years from now, Zach Lavine, one of the most likeable stars in the NBA, will still be hated by a core group of Butler fans. The other players like him. He has really never said a selfish or harsh word about anyone but himself.

The reaction from some is a dysfunctional and disgusting example of petty human personality flaws.

Has anyone ever explained to them that Lavine didn't orchestrate that trade? He wasn't one of the GM's involved?

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

I wouldn't classify ZLV as one of the most likable NBA players by a long shot, at least not amongst fans. Contrarily, he's one of the easiest guys to dislike in the league over the past 5 yrs. There's a reason why, despite the 1%er athleticism/highlight reels & the fact that he plays for the most recognizable sports brand on the planet, that ppl still have disdain for him, and it isn't just the losing records:

He's a great looking trust fund kid with utterly unattainable, alien genetic traits, who typically has played ZERO defense & has historically played pretty dumb/sloppy basketball in general...and on top of all of that, he's a bit of a bland/vanilla outward personality. That's basically the blueprint for a dislikable person lol. The average clock-punching pleb individual sports fan can't relate to any of that

Also, Bulls fans have every right to resent him/hold disdain for him. I'm not implying that it's healthy behaviour, and of course, Bulls fans are the gold (red?) standard when it comes to unhealthy/miserable dispositions & mindsets throughout sports fandom, but when your team trades away a beloved fan favourite Chicago folk hero, who is on the rise & in his prime & has a deep connection to the city/brand/fans, for a package centred around a one-way career loser coming off of a blown ACL, 9 times out of 10, it won't end well.

That trade was a complete nightmare, from top to bottom, no matter which way anyone slices it, and it ultimately lead to the the longest-tenured, most toxic, filthy FO in the NBA being canned & dismembered, finally. There was no reason whatsoever for that trade to go down; it was done solely to appease the collective egos (or lack thereof) of GarPax, and to protect Fred f****ng Hoiberg. No other reason(s)

And to be frank, Zach LaVine being on the Bulls & having individual success (and hopefully being poised to have team success going forward) still feels.....'off'. There's still the Paxson stink on him due to the way in which he was brought in, and how @$$-backwards that trade was for everyone involved (minus Paxson & his posse of dunces...although it lead to him losing his job, but that was years later). You can tell that he knows how fans view him/have viewed him, and I'm sure he understands completely

IMO It's going to take ample playoff success as a positive two-way player for the entire Bulls fanbase to universally come around, and I'm not so sure ZLV is capable of being that guy, but we'll see

You really hate Zach Lavine a lot and it’s kind of sad.

[Stratmaster]

The part of this (and most arguments here) is the "compared to what" portion. Do we want to pay Zach the max? What's our alternative?

Let him walk? If we did, what better player(s) would we be signing with that money?

Trade him this season? Maybe. For who?

As for whether Zach is "worth the max", a young guy who made the allstar team, with future appearances likely, who has no attitude issues, and is just entering his prime, is a bit of a no brainer.

But... we lost Jimmy when we traded for him.

5 years from now, Zach Lavine, one of the most likeable stars in the NBA, will still be hated by a core group of Butler fans. The other players like him. He has really never said a selfish or harsh word about anyone but himself.

The reaction from some is a dysfunctional and disgusting example of petty human personality flaws.

Has anyone ever explained to them that Lavine didn't orchestrate that trade? He wasn't one of the GM's involved?

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

I wouldn't classify ZLV as one of the most likable NBA players by a long shot, at least not amongst fans. Contrarily, he's one of the easiest guys to dislike in the league over the past 5 yrs. There's a reason why, despite the 1%er athleticism/highlight reels & the fact that he plays for the most recognizable sports brand on the planet, that ppl still have disdain for him, and it isn't just the losing records:

He's a great looking trust fund kid with utterly unattainable, alien genetic traits, who typically has played ZERO defense & has historically played pretty dumb/sloppy basketball in general...and on top of all of that, he's a bit of a bland/vanilla outward personality. That's basically the blueprint for a dislikable person lol. The average clock-punching pleb individual sports fan can't relate to any of that

Also, Bulls fans have every right to resent him/hold disdain for him. I'm not implying that it's healthy behaviour, and of course, Bulls fans are the gold (red?) standard when it comes to unhealthy/miserable dispositions & mindsets throughout sports fandom, but when your team trades away a beloved fan favourite Chicago folk hero, who is on the rise & in his prime & has a deep connection to the city/brand/fans, for a package centred around a one-way career loser coming off of a blown ACL, 9 times out of 10, it won't end well.

That trade was a complete nightmare, from top to bottom, no matter which way anyone slices it, and it ultimately lead to the the longest-tenured, most toxic, filthy FO in the NBA being canned & dismembered, finally. There was no reason whatsoever for that trade to go down; it was done solely to appease the collective egos (or lack thereof) of GarPax, and to protect Fred f****ng Hoiberg. No other reason(s)

And to be frank, Zach LaVine being on the Bulls & having individual success (and hopefully being poised to have team success going forward) still feels.....'off'. There's still the Paxson stink on him due to the way in which he was brought in, and how @$$-backwards that trade was for everyone involved (minus Paxson & his posse of dunces...although it lead to him losing his job, but that was years later). You can tell that he knows how fans view him/have viewed him, and I'm sure he understands completely

IMO It's going to take ample playoff success as a positive two-way player for the entire Bulls fanbase to universally come around, and I'm not so sure ZLV is capable of being that guy, but we'll see

Lol. Ok brother. Just keep looking like you have no clue.

Chris Paul, Durant, LBJ, DDR, and the entire Olympic team disagree.

There isn't a single reason to hate on Zach Lavine other than Jimmy Butler.

He has become an average defender, and you act like this is a league where more than 10 percent of the players actually put forth real defensive effort in the regular season. Particularly scorers. There are only a few players who are high scorers who play aggressive defense and it is usually bigs. Even your boy Jimmy rarely does both at the same time. He picks his spots.

Other than questioning his defense, the rest of your post is pure bunk.

I noticed when trying to explain why Zach Lavine is not likable, you spent most of your time blasting the old front office and crying about Jimmy's trade.

You ever been to a game? The fans love Zach Lavine.

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[DuckIII]

he may well take a slight melo/knicks discount (which melo rightfully got dragged for)

Why would a player get “rightfully dragged” for taking a little less money to help with team building?

because it's more optics than genuinely helping. and when a team is over the cap, there is no team building benefit other than helping management avoid luxury tax

Then so what? The only person harmed in that situation is the player himself. So what is the reason for criticism?

[DuckIII]

The part of this (and most arguments here) is the "compared to what" portion. Do we want to pay Zach the max? What's our alternative?

Let him walk? If we did, what better player(s) would we be signing with that money?

Trade him this season? Maybe. For who?

As for whether Zach is "worth the max", a young guy who made the allstar team, with future appearances likely, who has no attitude issues, and is just entering his prime, is a bit of a no brainer.

But... we lost Jimmy when we traded for him.

5 years from now, Zach Lavine, one of the most likeable stars in the NBA, will still be hated by a core group of Butler fans. The other players like him. He has really never said a selfish or harsh word about anyone but himself.

The reaction from some is a dysfunctional and disgusting example of petty human personality flaws.

Has anyone ever explained to them that Lavine didn't orchestrate that trade? He wasn't one of the GM's involved?

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

I wouldn't classify ZLV as one of the most likable NBA players by a long shot, at least not amongst fans. Contrarily, he's one of the easiest guys to dislike in the league over the past 5 yrs. There's a reason why, despite the 1%er athleticism/highlight reels & the fact that he plays for the most recognizable sports brand on the planet, that ppl still have disdain for him, and it isn't just the losing records:

He's a great looking trust fund kid with utterly unattainable, alien genetic traits, who typically has played ZERO defense & has historically played pretty dumb/sloppy basketball in general...and on top of all of that, he's a bit of a bland/vanilla outward personality. That's basically the blueprint for a dislikable person lol. The average clock-punching pleb individual sports fan can't relate to any of that

Also, Bulls fans have every right to resent him/hold disdain for him. I'm not implying that it's healthy behaviour, and of course, Bulls fans are the gold (red?) standard when it comes to unhealthy/miserable dispositions & mindsets throughout sports fandom, but when your team trades away a beloved fan favourite Chicago folk hero, who is on the rise & in his prime & has a deep connection to the city/brand/fans, for a package centred around a one-way career loser coming off of a blown ACL, 9 times out of 10, it won't end well.

That trade was a complete nightmare, from top to bottom, no matter which way anyone slices it, and it ultimately lead to the the longest-tenured, most toxic, filthy FO in the NBA being canned & dismembered, finally. There was no reason whatsoever for that trade to go down; it was done solely to appease the collective egos (or lack thereof) of GarPax, and to protect Fred f****ng Hoiberg. No other reason(s)

And to be frank, Zach LaVine being on the Bulls & having individual success (and hopefully being poised to have team success going forward) still feels.....'off'. There's still the Paxson stink on him due to the way in which he was brought in, and how @$$-backwards that trade was for everyone involved (minus Paxson & his posse of dunces...although it lead to him losing his job, but that was years later). You can tell that he knows how fans view him/have viewed him, and I'm sure he understands completely

IMO It's going to take ample playoff success as a positive two-way player for the entire Bulls fanbase to universally come around, and I'm not so sure ZLV is capable of being that guy, but we'll see