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Lavine ranking amongst SGs

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dice
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Re: Lavine ranking amongst SGs 

Post#21 » by dice » Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:34 am

Wonderboy12 wrote:Lavine is finally going to have a competent pg this year. People don’t understand how bad Sato is. That guy was probably the worst point guard in the entire league last year and he was starting. Defenses literally ignored him.

lavine improved by leaps and bounds as a scorer playing next to sato. but that reality doesn't fit your perverse agenda...

it's also pretty remarkable how much worse the bulls did when zach and coby were on the floor together as opposed to zach and the league's worst point guard

2020/21:

zach/coby 1201 minutes, -2.5 points per 100
zach/sato 704 minutes, +4.4 points per 100 possessions

2019/20:

zach/sato 1623 minutes, -1.5
zach/coby 746 minutes, -10.8

because sato is better than coby at just about everything
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Re: Lavine ranking amongst SGs 

Post#22 » by heir_jordan22 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:55 am

He's probably 7th or 8th if Butler and George are considered SGs.

1. Harden

2-5. Beal, George, Butler, Thompson (pick your flavor for the order. Beal is the best scorer, klay is the best shooter, Butler is the best defender, George is the best playmaker, but they're all good at everything.)

6. Mitchell

7/8. Booker/Lavine
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Re: Lavine ranking amongst SGs 

Post#23 » by GoBlue72391 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 5:25 am

PlayerUp wrote:We essentially have 3 players in the Top 40 in the NBA but nobody in the Top 20 among all NBA players.

DeRozan, Vucevic, Lavine are around 7th overall in the NBA at their positions.

I think Zach is both firmly within the top 20 players overall and top 5 SGs. To simplify it, he's considerably better than most outsiders believe him to be, but he's also not quite as good as some Bulls fans believe him to be (yet).

He's just a playoff performance away from gaining mainstream credibility, which is really the catalyst that propels good but under-the-radar players into national prominence. Put a guy like Donovan Mitchell or Jaylen Brown in Zach's shoes of having never been on a team good enough to make the playoffs and they would be pretty slept on too.
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Re: Lavine ranking amongst SGs 

Post#24 » by GoBlue72391 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 5:28 am

heir_jordan22 wrote:He's probably 7th or 8th if Butler and George are considered SGs.

1. Harden

2-5. Beal, George, Butler, Thompson (pick your flavor for the order. Beal is the best scorer, klay is the best shooter, Butler is the best defender, George is the best playmaker, but they're all good at everything.)

6. Mitchell

7/8. Booker/Lavine

It also depends on if we're basing it off overall careers or the most recent season. If it's the latter, then Zach is better than both PG and Jimmy and roughly equal to Beal, Mitchell, and Booker.
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Re: Lavine ranking amongst SGs 

Post#25 » by heir_jordan22 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:31 am

GoBlue72391 wrote:
heir_jordan22 wrote:He's probably 7th or 8th if Butler and George are considered SGs.

1. Harden

2-5. Beal, George, Butler, Thompson (pick your flavor for the order. Beal is the best scorer, klay is the best shooter, Butler is the best defender, George is the best playmaker, but they're all good at everything.)

6. Mitchell

7/8. Booker/Lavine

It also depends on if we're basing it off overall careers or the most recent season. If it's the latter, then Zach is better than both PG and Jimmy and roughly equal to Beal, Mitchell, and Booker.


Mitchell is the second only to Harden in the playoffs and I domt think you can put him on the same level as Beal because Beal is a better defender and has no scored 30+ppg in back to back seasons and attempts significantly more FTs because he's stronger around the basket.

That's why I put him with Booker.
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Re: Lavine ranking amongst SGs 

Post#26 » by sco » Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:49 pm

heir_jordan22 wrote:
GoBlue72391 wrote:
heir_jordan22 wrote:He's probably 7th or 8th if Butler and George are considered SGs.

1. Harden

2-5. Beal, George, Butler, Thompson (pick your flavor for the order. Beal is the best scorer, klay is the best shooter, Butler is the best defender, George is the best playmaker, but they're all good at everything.)

6. Mitchell

7/8. Booker/Lavine

It also depends on if we're basing it off overall careers or the most recent season. If it's the latter, then Zach is better than both PG and Jimmy and roughly equal to Beal, Mitchell, and Booker.


Mitchell is the second only to Harden in the playoffs and I domt think you can put him on the same level as Beal because Beal is a better defender and has no scored 30+ppg in back to back seasons and attempts significantly more FTs because he's stronger around the basket.

That's why I put him with Booker.

Position rankings in today's position-less basketball are very hard as roles are so different, even in the same position:

Harden is their PG...he may be listed at SG because he's taller than Kyrie or he guards the opponent SG.
Butler is their combo PG/PF

They are also backward-looking. Thompson is 2 years of horrid injuries away from being great, for example. Zach has improved every off-season.
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