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It's something that comes up in every game thread, so we might as well give it the attention it deserves.

Yesterday we lost to the Jazz largely because we were too small. John Collins was having his way with every defender put on him. Williams wasn't sharp on defense and was invisible on the glass. Tucker, though somewhat productive, isn't a PF and also wasn't able to slow Collins down.

One option we didn't explore was Jalen Smith who had a momentum-changing block on Collins in the third quarter.

Last season, Billy's most productive player was Andre Drummond. It's well documented how many times Billy chose to play a struggling Vuc over Drummond, but at least there were plausible reasons: Drummond shrunk the floor, he couldn't really play with Vuc, etc. Those excuses don't exist with Smith. Through six games, he has been our best three-point shooter, shooting a blistering 50% on great volume. He's also our best interior defender and our second-best shot blocker. Because he can shoot and because he is relatively mobile, he can play with Vuc against other teams that play big. Utah was playing big.

Per 36, Smith is having an All-Star-like impact: 26 ppg, 13.4 RPG, great shooting, 24 PER. Despite his great play, Billy is playing him 13.8 mpg. It seems clear that Billy doesn't like playing with size, but at this point, it's just another example of bad coaching. He's not only failing to play one of our most productive players, but he's also failing to play and develop one of our younger players who we have locked up to a long-term deal.

You have to wonder what the Bulls FO is thinking as they watch these games and see the same things that all of us see.

He should be our starting PF, or pushing Phillips out of the rotation, but unfortunately our lack of bigs don't give us that luxury. AK needs to get creative and trade off one of our guards to give us that depth.

The Bulls have a knack for shoehorning guys into positions they shouldn't play and it's getting pretty old. We found that out the hard way with Lauri, and I think we're seeing it with Pat Williams. If we still think Pat is our PF, fine, but go out and get an actual backup center because literally no one thinks Vuc has that locked down.

I agree that the coaching needs to be more flexible and willing to experiment. Playing Smith at the 4 is something they should be willing to try even if it doesn't work.

It issue with Smith minutes comes down to two things IMO. Vuc isn't playing bad at all. Yeah his defense still sucks but there's not much to complain about so far compared to last season.

Smith isn't a 4, he's a 5. Carlisle used him as a backup 5 as well. His mobility and rim protection is being a bit overrated. The Pacers of all teams yanked him from the rotation in the playoffs because of his defense.

I noted something about this on twitter. Joe Cowley said Smith isn't in good enough shape to play a ton of minutes. That might be true, but hard to imagine he's in such bad shape that he couldn't play 20 minutes.

Billy misusing/under using an effective bigman? Oh my stars!

This isn't that shocking, but still extremely annoying.

Is it possible that the Bulls professional coaching staff and management knows something we casual fans don't?

Could it be that Smith is excelling precisely because of his limited minutes? And that giving him extended minutes would only expose him to poor play and developing bad habits?

As Doug noted, he might not be in great shape. Maybe him getting in shape is the carrot they're dangling to get more minutes.



Nah. Billy must be a moron.

It would be one thing if the roleplayers were so damn good Billy can't find minutes (the OKC problem), but Terry-Phillips-THT and you might as well throw Patrick in there, collectively have been awful.

Bulls under AK have always been played to some kind of philosophical vision instead of just putting our best players out there.

Please people stop saying play Smith at the 4.

He isn't a 4.

2weekswithpay wrote:I agree that the coaching needs to be more flexible and willing to experiment. Playing Smith at the 4 is something they should be willing to try even if it doesn't work.

It issue with Smith minutes comes down to two things IMO. Vuc isn't playing bad at all. Yeah his defense still sucks but there's not much to complain about so far compared to last season.

Smith isn't a 4, he's a 5. Carlisle used him as a backup 5 as well. His mobility and rim protection is being a bit overrated. The Pacers of all teams yanked him from the rotation in the playoffs because of his defense.

Pacers fans said he was a better 4 then 5 actually.

Last night was a GREAT tank loss-so keep it up Billy. Smith could easily absorb Phillips' minutes and play 8 minutes/night with Vuc

dougthonus wrote:I noted something about this on twitter. Joe Cowley said Smith isn't in good enough shape to play a ton of minutes. That might be true, but hard to imagine he's in such bad shape that he couldn't play 20 minutes.

Why isn't he in shape?

HomoSapien wrote:It's something that comes up in every game thread, so we might as well give it the attention it deserves.

Yesterday we lost to the Jazz largely because we were too small. John Collins was having his way with every defender put on him. Williams wasn't sharp on defense and was invisible on the glass. Tucker, though somewhat productive, isn't a PF and also wasn't able to slow Collins down.

One option we didn't explore was Jalen Smith who had a momentum-changing block on Collins in the third quarter.

Last season, Billy's most productive player was Andre Drummond. It's well documented how many times Billy chose to play a struggling Vuc over Drummond, but at least there were plausible reasons: Drummond shrunk the floor, he couldn't really play with Vuc, etc. Those excuses don't exist with Smith. Through six games, he has been our best three-point shooter, shooting a blistering 50% on great volume. He's also our best interior defender and our second-best shot blocker. Because he can shoot and because he is relatively mobile, he can play with Vuc against other teams that play big. Utah was playing big.

Per 36, Smith is having an All-Star-like impact: 26 ppg, 13.4 RPG, great shooting, 24 PER. Despite his great play, Billy is playing him 13.8 mpg. It seems clear that Billy doesn't like playing with size, but at this point, it's just another example of bad coaching. He's not only failing to play one of our most productive players, but he's also failing to play and develop one of our younger players who we have locked up to a long-term deal.

You have to wonder what the Bulls FO is thinking as they watch these games and see the same things that all of us see.

i agree

_txchilibowl_ wrote:Is it possible that the Bulls professional coaching staff and management knows something we casual fans don't?

Could it be that Smith is excelling precisely because of his limited minutes? And that giving him extended minutes would only expose him to poor play and developing bad habits?

As Doug noted, he might not be in great shape. Maybe him getting in shape is the carrot they're dangling to get more minutes.



Nah. Billy must be a moron.

no. and then correct on your last statement

Smith isn't a natural four, but there should definitely be a stretch of minutes where he plays alongside Vucevic. This will not be a Vucevic/Drummond situation. Smith is someone who should be able to slide to the four more naturally than Drummond.

Dan Z wrote:

dougthonus wrote:I noted something about this on twitter. Joe Cowley said Smith isn't in good enough shape to play a ton of minutes. That might be true, but hard to imagine he's in such bad shape that he couldn't play 20 minutes.

Why isn't he in shape?

No idea, just something Cowley said.

dougthonus wrote:

Dan Z wrote:

dougthonus wrote:I noted something about this on twitter. Joe Cowley said Smith isn't in good enough shape to play a ton of minutes. That might be true, but hard to imagine he's in such bad shape that he couldn't play 20 minutes.

Why isn't he in shape?

No idea, just something Cowley said.

IMO, Billy is just used to Vuc not getting winded and sweaty because he doesn't run the floor or move on defense. When guys like Smith or Drummond are out of breath for doing those things he just assumes they are out of shape.

DuallyNoted wrote:

_txchilibowl_ wrote:Is it possible that the Bulls professional coaching staff and management knows something we casual fans don't?

Could it be that Smith is excelling precisely because of his limited minutes? And that giving him extended minutes would only expose him to poor play and developing bad habits?

As Doug noted, he might not be in great shape. Maybe him getting in shape is the carrot they're dangling to get more minutes.



Nah. Billy must be a moron.

no. and then correct on your last statement

Thank you for making my point for me....

I really want to see what a starting line-up of Giddey, Ayo, Zach, Pat and Smith could do. I think we'd gain more on defense than we'd lose on offense. And a bench line-up of Ball, Coby, Matas, Phillips, Vuc would provide more offensive punch.

_txchilibowl_ wrote:Is it possible that the Bulls professional coaching staff and management knows something we casual fans don't?

Could it be that Smith is excelling precisely because of his limited minutes? And that giving him extended minutes would only expose him to poor play and developing bad habits?

As Doug noted, he might not be in great shape. Maybe him getting in shape is the carrot they're dangling to get more minutes.



Nah. Billy must be a moron.

Billy has never played consistently with size. Its not just Smith. He doesn't like to play big. Not surprising, the Bulls worse 5 man lineups feature - Giddey-Lavine-Coby. Its also the lineup they play the most. I think substituting Smith for Coby or Lavine in these lineups for more minutes would probably make the Bulls a better team.

Ultimately management needs to trade either Coby or Zach for a forward with size and skill and the team needs to play more consistently with size. I think Smith is probably a career backup. But on this team, he deserves more time.

HomoSapien wrote:It's something that comes up in every game thread, so we might as well give it the attention it deserves.

Yesterday we lost to the Jazz largely because we were too small. John Collins was having his way with every defender put on him. Williams wasn't sharp on defense and was invisible on the glass. Tucker, though somewhat productive, isn't a PF and also wasn't able to slow Collins down.

One option we didn't explore was Jalen Smith who had a momentum-changing block on Collins in the third quarter.

Last season, Billy's most productive player was Andre Drummond. It's well documented how many times Billy chose to play a struggling Vuc over Drummond, but at least there were plausible reasons: Drummond shrunk the floor, he couldn't really play with Vuc, etc. Those excuses don't exist with Smith. Through six games, he has been our best three-point shooter, shooting a blistering 50% on great volume. He's also our best interior defender and our second-best shot blocker. Because he can shoot and because he is relatively mobile, he can play with Vuc against other teams that play big. Utah was playing big.

Per 36, Smith is having an All-Star-like impact: 26 ppg, 13.4 RPG, great shooting, 24 PER. Despite his great play, Billy is playing him 13.8 mpg. It seems clear that Billy doesn't like playing with size, but at this point, it's just another example of bad coaching. He's not only failing to play one of our most productive players, but he's also failing to play and develop one of our younger players who we have locked up to a long-term deal.

You have to wonder what the Bulls FO is thinking as they watch these games and see the same things that all of us see.

This is very well put. If i could say one thing that give Donovan the benefit of the doubt, he doesn't have many options in the front court so maybe he feels the need to ration his bigs. But that still doesn't justify his lack of minutes. As our roster is right now, I best starting lineup is probably Giddey/Lavine/Williams/Smith/Vuc