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I know it was posted in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own thread.

Muzbar wrote:I know it was posted in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own thread.

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Funny enough, I just woke up from an unusually vivid dream. Bulls were playing the Knicks in the playoffs and threw out a lineup of:

Pg - Giddey
Sg - Flowers
Sf - Buzelis
Pf - Essengue
C - Kessler

No clue how we got there but the guys were flying (literally?) and dunking everything so it was fun lol. Dream aside, Flowers is a pretty talented kid. Clippers fans and writers seem to agree that he was their best young prospect and couldn't believe he was let go. I'll definitely be keeping tabs on him, he has a pretty entertaining game and in my fan fiction he cracks the rotation next season

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Kuro wrote:

Muzbar wrote:I know it was posted in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own thread.

Read on Twitter

Funny enough, I just woke up from an unusually vivid dream. Bulls were playing the Knicks in the playoffs and threw out a lineup of:

Pg - Giddey
Sg - Flowers
Sf - Buzelis
Pf - Essengue
C - Kessler

No clue how we got there but the guys were flying (literally?) and dunking everything so it was fun lol. Dream aside, Flowers is a pretty talented kid. Clippers fans and writers seem to agree that he was their best young prospect and couldn't believe he was let go. I'll definitely be keeping tabs on him, he has a pretty entertaining game and in my fan fiction he cracks the rotation next season

Sent from my SM-S936U1 using RealGM mobile app

Yeah melatonin does that to me too.

sco wrote:

Kuro wrote:

Muzbar wrote:I know it was posted in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own thread.

Read on Twitter

Funny enough, I just woke up from an unusually vivid dream. Bulls were playing the Knicks in the playoffs and threw out a lineup of:

Pg - Giddey
Sg - Flowers
Sf - Buzelis
Pf - Essengue
C - Kessler

No clue how we got there but the guys were flying (literally?) and dunking everything so it was fun lol. Dream aside, Flowers is a pretty talented kid. Clippers fans and writers seem to agree that he was their best young prospect and couldn't believe he was let go. I'll definitely be keeping tabs on him, he has a pretty entertaining game and in my fan fiction he cracks the rotation next season

Sent from my SM-S936U1 using RealGM mobile app

Yeah melatonin does that to me too.

Take a bit of a THC break and the dreams start getting a bit wonky

Sent from my SM-S936U1 using RealGM mobile app

Kuro wrote:

sco wrote:

Kuro wrote:Funny enough, I just woke up from an unusually vivid dream. Bulls were playing the Knicks in the playoffs and threw out a lineup of:

Pg - Giddey
Sg - Flowers
Sf - Buzelis
Pf - Essengue
C - Kessler

No clue how we got there but the guys were flying (literally?) and dunking everything so it was fun lol. Dream aside, Flowers is a pretty talented kid. Clippers fans and writers seem to agree that he was their best young prospect and couldn't believe he was let go. I'll definitely be keeping tabs on him, he has a pretty entertaining game and in my fan fiction he cracks the rotation next season

Sent from my SM-S936U1 using RealGM mobile app

Yeah melatonin does that to me too.

Take a bit of a THC break and the dreams start getting a bit wonky

Sent from my SM-S936U1 using RealGM mobile app

I stopped smoking pot and now I'm having lucid dreams every so often. The other night, I had a dream where I was playing one of those basketball games you find at arcades, the one where you try to score as much as possible within an allotted time. I was playing against some comically obese dude and I didn't make a single basket. I was so embarrassed that I flew away, but the guy followed me and tried to scoop out my eyeball with a spoon.

oh yeah, kinda like the signing. 20-year-old with some potential upside.

Indomitable wrote:https://www.nba.com/draft/2024/prospects/trentyn-flowers

I don't know anything about Flowers and his development since the draft, but that profile makes it sound like he absolutely sucks.

It says he can knock down 3s based on a super tiny sample (10 of 28 from 3) that also doesn't actually look good, it mentions that he had 31 TOs compared to only 13 assists, it adds that he's a bad free throw shooter and oh yeah...he also sucks on defense.

Andi Obst wrote:

Indomitable wrote:https://www.nba.com/draft/2024/prospects/trentyn-flowers

I don't know anything about Flowers and his development since the draft, but that profile makes it sound like he absolutely sucks.

It says he can knock down 3s based on a super tiny sample (10 of 28 from 3) that also doesn't actually look good, it mentions that he had 31 TOs compared to only 13 assists, it adds that he's a bad free throw shooter and oh yeah...he also sucks on defense.

He has the measureable and has just turned 20. This is the type of player to sign for long term development.

He did shot 42.9% in the G league. Admittedly on low volume.

NBA Combine results
Athleticism and combine performance
Vertical Jump: He had the highest max vertical leap at the combine with 42 inches, and his standing vertical was 34.5 inches.
Scoring: In his first scrimmage, he scored 12 points in 17 minutes on 5-of-5 shooting, including a notable dunk.
Transition Play: He was particularly effective in transition, driving to the basket and finishing strong.
Shooting: He demonstrated the ability to hit open three-pointers, though his overall shot consistency was still a question mark.
Areas for development
Decision-making: His assist-to-turnover ratio showed a need for better decision-making.
Shooting consistency: Some analysts noted that while he has a smooth jump shot, it can be inconsistent in-game.
Defensive consistency: While he showed some defensive competitiveness at the combine, he needs to continue to add functional strength to his frame to defend at the NBA level.
Overall impact
Flowers' strong showing at the combine, particularly in the athletic testing and scrimmages, gave his draft stock a boost and led to him being viewed as a potential lottery pick.
Despite some weaknesses, his combination of size, athleticism, and unique skill set led to a strong overall impression from scouts

He is flawed but an ideal project. There is a lot of raw talent there. Still potential will only go so far. If he is not lazy. There is a chance to catch lightning in the bottle.

It is a 2 way contract.

Good. Flowers is a young, skilled, athletic player with serious upside.

It's interesting to think of strategy when signing 2-way guys. To be sure, the odds of getting a valuable NBA player out of a 2-way signing is very small.

Perhaps the predominate idea is to sign guys with good NBA size and athleticism who were largely ignored in the draft and try to develop them. However, let's look at the guys that started out in the G-League who are now making at least $5,000,000 on an NBA contract. Why $5,000,000? Completely arbitrary.

Alex Caruso
Austin Reaves
Max Strus
Caleb Martin
Duncan Robinson
Gabe Vincent
Naz Reid
Derrick Jones, Jr.

Most of these players don't really fit that archetype. I wonder if it is better to go after players that might have the potential to be role players -- even super role players.

Evil_Headband wrote:It's interesting to think of strategy when signing 2-way guys. To be sure, the odds of getting a valuable NBA player out of a 2-way signing is very small.

Perhaps the predominate idea is to sign guys with NBA size and athleticism who were largely ignored in the draft and try to develop them. However, let's look at the guys that started out in the G-League who are now making at least $5,000,000 on an NBA contract. Why $5,000,000? Completely arbitrary.

Alex Caruso
Austin Reaves
Max Strus
Caleb Martin
Duncan Robinson
Gabe Vincent
Naz Reid
Derrick Jones, Jr.

Most of these players don't really fit that archetype. I wonder if it is better to go after players that might have the potential to be role players -- even super role players.

Apparently the strategy is to sign with the Heat. 5 of those 8 players (Jones, Robinson, Martin, Strus, Vincent) didn't gain value until they went to Miami. The Heat are just in a league of their own when it comes to scouting undrafted players and utilizing them.

Outside of that, I think you're right. You're asking teams to find NBA caliber players who weren't selected after the 45-60th picks in the draft, which is already a 98% dead zone for NBA talent.

It's a **** ton of luck and just finding players who can be complimentary in small doses.

Red Larrivee wrote:

Evil_Headband wrote:It's interesting to think of strategy when signing 2-way guys. To be sure, the odds of getting a valuable NBA player out of a 2-way signing is very small.

Perhaps the predominate idea is to sign guys with NBA size and athleticism who were largely ignored in the draft and try to develop them. However, let's look at the guys that started out in the G-League who are now making at least $5,000,000 on an NBA contract. Why $5,000,000? Completely arbitrary.

Alex Caruso
Austin Reaves
Max Strus
Caleb Martin
Duncan Robinson
Gabe Vincent
Naz Reid
Derrick Jones, Jr.

Most of these players don't really fit that archetype. I wonder if it is better to go after players that might have the potential to be role players -- even super role players.

Apparently the strategy is to sign with the Heat. 5 of those 8 players (Jones, Robinson, Martin, Strus, Vincent) didn't gain value until they went to Miami. The Heat are just in a league of their own when it comes to scouting undrafted players and utilizing them.

Outside of that, I think you're right. You're asking teams to find NBA caliber players who weren't selected after the 45-60th picks in the draft, which is already a 98% dead zone for NBA talent.

It's a **** ton of luck and just finding players who can be complimentary in small doses.

Struss was initially and then tore acl. He was highly regarded by the Bulls

8 years on and the next time we get a rotation caliber player from a two-way contract will be the first time.

Indomitable wrote:

Andi Obst wrote:

Indomitable wrote:https://www.nba.com/draft/2024/prospects/trentyn-flowers

I don't know anything about Flowers and his development since the draft, but that profile makes it sound like he absolutely sucks.

It says he can knock down 3s based on a super tiny sample (10 of 28 from 3) that also doesn't actually look good, it mentions that he had 31 TOs compared to only 13 assists, it adds that he's a bad free throw shooter and oh yeah...he also sucks on defense.

He has the measureable and has just turned 20. This is the type of player to sign for long term development.

He did shot 42.9% in the G league. Admittedly on low volume.

NBA Combine results
Athleticism and combine performance
Vertical Jump: He had the highest max vertical leap at the combine with 42 inches, and his standing vertical was 34.5 inches.
Scoring: In his first scrimmage, he scored 12 points in 17 minutes on 5-of-5 shooting, including a notable dunk.
Transition Play: He was particularly effective in transition, driving to the basket and finishing strong.
Shooting: He demonstrated the ability to hit open three-pointers, though his overall shot consistency was still a question mark.
Areas for development
Decision-making: His assist-to-turnover ratio showed a need for better decision-making.
Shooting consistency: Some analysts noted that while he has a smooth jump shot, it can be inconsistent in-game.
Defensive consistency: While he showed some defensive competitiveness at the combine, he needs to continue to add functional strength to his frame to defend at the NBA level.
Overall impact
Flowers' strong showing at the combine, particularly in the athletic testing and scrimmages, gave his draft stock a boost and led to him being viewed as a potential lottery pick.
Despite some weaknesses, his combination of size, athleticism, and unique skill set led to a strong overall impression from scouts

He is flawed but an ideal project. There is a lot of raw talent there. Still potential will only go so far. If he is not lazy. There is a chance to catch lightning in the bottle.

It is a 2 way contract.

Of all the 2-way players the Bulls have signed, Flowers, I think, has the most potential and as you said he's only 20 years old. These are the types of guys you should be giving 2-way contracts to.