When will Paxson surrender?

theawakening · Post #1 » by **theawakening** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:12 pm

Watching this game against the middling Hawks makes it fairly obvious that the problems that have blighted the first half of the season are still bedeviling the Bulls. What's more concerning is that the Bulls' defense should be placed on a milk carton now in hopes of it turning up somewhere.

Considering how poor the East is, the Bulls will always be in the playoff hunt. Does this mean that Paxson will always persist with the status quo in hopes of a Bulls recovery or will he declare the youth movement soon?
C'mon, Paxson, the writing is on the wall: it's time to surrender.

Post #2 » by **AshyLarrysDiaper** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:16 pm

Sit the old fellers cuz they suck, not because we're surrendering our playoff ambitions.

jax98 · Post #3 » by **jax98** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:21 pm

Who says Paxson isn't looking around?

So many posters sound like Paxson was the wrong guy for the GM job, yet he made moves that gave us 3 years worth of playoff competition. We're having an off-year, and everyone looks to put the blame somewhere. Why is it so important to divide blame on this team? There hasn't been a player or coach on the Bulls who has been perfect this year, so if you must blame, blame everyone.

IMO, had our core been hitting their shots, we'd had a .500+ record. That just hasn't happened due to slumps and minor injuries.

Sh*t happens.

bre9 · Post #4 » by **bre9** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:26 pm

He might as well give up play all the guys on the roster so they can develop faster and even call curry back from the d league so whe can see how he play. Hope we get a nice draft pick.

Post #5 » by **dougthonus** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:29 pm

The team has been disappointing, but largely because they have played badly. The personnel on this team were expected to compete for a deep playoff run / title. I can't complain about how Paxson has run the team given that level of expectations to start the season.

So the real question will be now that things have fallen off what does he do. Does he panic and make a bad move? Does he stay the course? Does he make a good move? We'll need to really wait until next season to really see how he can fix the team. Mid season fixes aren't usually advisable for me.

theawakening · Post #6 » by **theawakening** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:13 pm

dougthonus wrote:The team has been disappointing, but largely because they have played badly. The personnel on this team were expected to compete for a deep playoff run / title. I can't complain about how Paxson has run the team given that level of expectations to start the season.

So the real question will be now that things have fallen off what does he do. Does he panic and make a bad move? Does he stay the course? Does he make a good move? We'll need to really wait until next season to really see how he can fix the team. Mid season fixes aren't usually advisable for me.

I think I need to clarify here. My post was not aimed at Paxson or critical of him. What I meant was that he should surrender the current aim to make the playoffs again with these veterans and give way to the younger players. He assembled a great roster via the draft that made incremental progress every year. If anything, the players and their lack of mental fortitude have failed him, the organization, and the fans.

Post #7 » by **suckfish** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:25 pm

So the real question will be now that things have fallen off what does he do. Does he panic and make a bad move? Does he stay the course? Does he make a good move? We'll need to really wait until next season to really see how he can fix the team. Mid season fixes aren't usually advisable for me.

I think we all want him to do what he said he would do once he believed the season was a wash. That being the youngsters receiving plenty of regular playing time, although I don't think the season is a wash just yet, I sure do hope Pax thinks so.

I tend to agree that no quick fix will do the job nor will a good midseason deal occur. The only positives that come of remainder of this season results in giving Tyrus, Joakim and Gray PT while trying to make some small alterations both with the roster and on the basketball side of things.

Being pressured into a quick move will most likely outcome in making things worse, deals cannot be made for the sake of making deals, no matter how bad it gets.

Post #8 » by **Tommy Udo 6** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:34 pm

The key is to see how Paxson reacts to cleaning up the mess.

To me, the major blunder was the signing of Ben Wallace followed by the coddling of Ben Wallace. Obvious entitlements for Ben - who clearly did not earn them - seems to have broken the spirit of the team.

There was no "leader" to steady the team. The team is a team of complimentary role players - but no leader.

In wallace, Paxson thought he was signing a leader.

He couldnt have been more wrong.

We probably cannot right the ship as long as Ben is on it.

DanTown8587 · Post #9 » by **DanTown8587** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:48 pm

This team has some issues when they need to look for a stop or a bucket, just like in the NY game last week. With that being said, if you could trade Gordon for a draft pick/young player I would. The team would be better off missing the playoffs and developing some young talent than it would making a run to the back end of the playoffs. I mean, do you have any confidence this team would do any damage against Boston, Cleveland or Detroit?

Post #10 » by **DASMACKDOWN** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:54 pm

bulls6 wrote:The key is to see how Paxson reacts to cleaning up the mess.

To me, the major blunder was the signing of Ben Wallace followed by the coddling of Ben Wallace. Obvious entitlements for Ben - who clearly did not earn them - seems to have broken the spirit of the team.

There was no "leader" to steady the team. The team is a team of complimentary role players - but no leader.

In wallace, Paxson thought he was signing a leader.

He couldnt have been more wrong.

We probably cannot right the ship as long as Ben is on it.

In reality, everything going downhill can be related to Wallace. It was the emergence of Luol Deng and Gordon last year that got us to 49 wins. Ben played a small part of that but was generally disappointing.

And then when you consider how Tyson Chandler has played who is basically twice the player Ben Wallace is right now, it makes things even worse.

If Paxson NEVER had Ben Wallace, we would be a much better team right now.

hard49 · Post #11 » by **hard49** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:59 pm

What a bunch of *******!!!! You guys are 5 games out of homecourt advantage and you want to play for draft position?

jax98 · Post #12 » by **jax98** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:06 pm

hard49 wrote:What a bunch of *******!!!! You guys are 5 games out of homecourt advantage and you want to play for draft position?

+1

The playoffs aren't unrealistic. Especially in the Eastern Conference. Boylan so far has us at 5-4, with more open offense. 2 of the losses has come in OT, and 2 have been ones where the players didn't capture the opprtunities they were presented (Knicks game in general, 3rd quarter today)

bagsboy · Post #13 » by **bagsboy** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:13 pm

Warning.....if you blame Pax they will lock this thread.

Post #14 » by **dougthonus** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:14 pm

I don't think most people want to play for draft position or tank.

I think most people feel that our veterans are not getting it done, and we need to get in our more recent draftees so that we can find out whether they can help us or not. Many of us, including myself, believe that an influx of minutes for Tyrus, Noah, and Gray and a reduction of minutes for Wallace (and to some extent Nocioni) would dramatically improve our record and player development at the same time.

jax98 · Post #15 » by **jax98** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:57 pm

I looked up the minute distribution for the top 10 picks in the 2006 NBA Draft.

1. Andrea Bargnani (Toronto Raptors)

1st season: 25.1 MPG
2nd season: 23.2 MPG

2. LaMarcus Aldridge (Portland Trailblazers)

1st season: 22.1 MPG
2nd season: 34.2 MPG

3. Adam Morrison (Charlotte Bobcats)

1st season: 29.8 MPG
(Injured this year)

4. Tyrus Thomas (Chicago Bulls)

1st season: 13.4 MPG
2nd season: 17.0 MPG

5. Shelden Williams (Atlanta Hawks)

1st season: 18.7 MPG
2nd season: 12.4 MPG

6. Brandon Roy (Portland Trailblazers)

1st season: 35.4 MPG
2nd season: 36.4 MPG

7. Randy foye (Minnesota Timberwolves)

1st season: 22.9 MPG
(Injured this year)

8. Rudy Gay (Memphis Grizzlies)

1st season: 27.0 MPG
2nd season: 36.7 MPG

9. Patrick O'Bryant (Golden State Warriors)

1st season: 7.4 MPG
2nd season: 4.5 MPG

10. Saer Sene (Seattle Supersonics)

1st season: 6.0 MPG
2nd season: 4.1 MPG

On top of that we have JJ Redick (11th), Hilton Armstrong (12th), Thabo Sefolosha 13th), Ronnie Brewer (14th), Rodney Carney (16th), Shawne Williams (17th) and several other 1st- and 2nd rounders averagin over 10 minutes a game over their 2-year career.

Teams draft players because they want them to become contributors for them. So I can't help but wonder why we aren't giving Tyrus Thomas more minutes? Doug touched on this subject when he said the veterans were the ones who were supposed to take us far, but they haven't played up to expectations.

IMO, you play young players to develop them and get them ready for the big stage. With a season under his belt as well as playoff experience, there's little logic to why we don't play Tyrus more.

ikeziskash · Post #16 » by **ikeziskash** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 12:10 am

Doug,
What's wrong with a midseason trade exactly?