Breaking: Manny Suspended 50 games for + test

[Snakebites]

Jesus H. Christmas.

Not directly relevant to the Tigers per se, but seems like its a huge enough topic in the sport that its worth having a thread.

I always figured this whole steroid thing went a lot deeper than thus far has been indicated (even though indications were it went pretty deep). Sucks to be the Dodgers atm, shelling 20+ million this year to a guy who is now suspended for a 3rd of the time he's being paid that.

A few questions here for the posters at large:

1) Is anybody surprised that Manny used steroids?

2) Is anybody surprised that Manny is still using steroids?

3) Are their any Tigers, current or recently departed (in last 5 years) who you think probably used steroids, besides Sheffield, whose name was linked to steroids before he ever even got here?

4) What percentage of established position players would you guess are using steroids?

[Liqourish]

I was out to lunch when it I found out. ESPN reported it and I was stunned. Not that he did it, but that he was trying to shift blame onto his doctor. Of course they started talking about the HoF and the tainted steroid era and it just seems like there are two sides. The first side wants to defend the players and the other side wants to try and salvage the respect of the game.

As for your questions

1. I don't think any objective (non-Manny fan) is shocked that he has used steroids.

2. I don't know if he intended to keep taking them. Sounds like there was miscommunication between him and a doctor. But, he knew what he was taking, and he knew what was banned by MLB. He has no one to blame but himself.

3. Pudge Rodriguez, obviously. I have doubts about Maggs. Don't ask me why, but when he was coming back from that knee surgery, I started to have doubts. I have no proof and maybe he wasn't. It's just a doubt in my mind. Sheff, of course. I can't really think of any other Tigers that I think have used steroids. Who knows?

4. I dunno. I don't like how everyone (players, experts, reporters) are justifying what Bonds, Sosa, McGwire, A-Rod and now Manny have done by saying "everyone does it". I don't think every player does it. I doubt most of them do it. I just think it appears worse than it is because of the big names involved.

[Snakebites]

Ah yes, I completely forgot about Pudge being mentioned by Canseco.

Maggs is a guy I'd definitely suspect from our current team. It seems to be particularly common in aging players and/or players dealing with injuries (at least based on recent guys who got nabbed).

I guess I'm a little more pessimistic, though. I suspect that steroids is a problem that has been absolutely rampant for a considerable number of years and that most players (particularly successful ones) have at least experimented with illegal enhancing substances.

List of alleged violators, some of which have been confirmed, and this is only the big names:

Clemens
Bonds
Giambi
Sheffield
Sosa
McGwire
A-Rod
Manny
Pudge
Canseco
Pettite
Juan Gonzalez
Palmiero
Tejada
Caminiti
Kevin Brown
Gagne
Mo Vaughn
Bret Boone
Magglio

And I may even be missing a few.

Even if we assume some of the ones that are just alleged are false, thats an awfully long list of guys all of whom have been all stars, and some of which would otherwise be first ballot hall of famers. A damning list by anyone's count, and makes me suspect there are more out there.

[Liqourish]

Well we knew there were at least 107 that tested positive, I'm assuming most of them are big named guys. But I still don't think it reaches everyone. I'm not saying only a handful of players did it, I'm sure hundreds have, but when you have thousands of players in and out of the majors... it's wrong to dismiss an entire era over a minority, no matter who's in that minority. At least in my opinion.

[m23uza1hem36]

Not shocking, I've suspected he has for multiple years now.

However, the timing of this coming out is very bad, bad for baseball and bad for it's fan. Even though we've become accustomed to players using steroids and steroid allegations, I'd figure A-Rod would be the last "big" name to be caught and be confronted in what is known as the steroid era.

He knew what he was using (Manny) and shouldn't blame his doctors the "I didn't know" excuse is just plain dumb especially when it's a drug like the one Manny is being linked too, a guy doesn't take a female drug on accident. Come on Manny? The public isn't dumb.

As for former Tigers and/or current Tigers that have used steroids, I'd give you Pudge & Maggs for sure, it is something that players were using when they aged in order to keep a job. However, I hold nothing against A-Rod, Manny, Pudge, Maggs, etc because even though not all players have used steroids; the majority of those who market baseball and are the stars of baseball have used steroids.

It's time MLB ends this, ends the steroid era. It's just disgusting...

Also,I know multiple people in real life who use steroids & they just don't know what these things will do to their bodies...

There should be more public awareness to this and I believe public high schools should in fact adopt random drug testing (maybe just once or twice a year?) because the root of all of this is in high school because it's very easy to get away with.

[ElectricMayhem]

It's awesome how Granderson is part of a program promoting body-building the right way and making sure people stay away from steroids. It's nice to have someone who is the antithesis of the steroid era succeeding while people are still doing it.