2023-24 Regular Season

[toooskies]

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[JujitsuFlip]

[JujitsuFlip]

On the brightside, in theory the Cavs should win their next 3 games to be on a 3 game win streak headed to Paris.

[JonFromVA]

On the brightside, in theory the Cavs should win their next 3 games to be on a 3 game win streak headed to Paris.

Let's see if we can pull off a 30+ assist game with Mitchell and LeVert back in the rotation.

[JujitsuFlip]

On the brightside, in theory the Cavs should win their next 3 games to be on a 3 game win streak headed to Paris.

Let's see if we can pull off a 30+ assist game with Mitchell and LeVert back in the rotation.

I doubt it, those guys games are predicated on isolation. However the next 3 games are against some of the worst teams in the NBA so maybe the leads will be so large, they will be able to sit out the end of games, to inflate the assist numbers a bit.

[jbk1234]

On the brightside, in theory the Cavs should win their next 3 games to be on a 3 game win streak headed to Paris.

Let's see if we can pull off a 30+ assist game with Mitchell and LeVert back in the rotation.

I don't see LeVert's inclusion as particularly helpful in that regard.

[toooskies]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

[ijspeelman]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

I think we are asking Strus to take too many threes that he's willing to take, but not comfortable making.

Max Strus is still shooting 42.9% on wide open threes which is in elite company, but only 17.2% of his threes are wide open. Another guy shooting 42.9% on wide open threes is DFS, but they account for 48.6% of his attempts.

Strus' open threes: 36.4% (29.7% of diet)
tight threes: 22.8% (19.4% of diet)
very tight: 0% (0.7 of diet)

The efficiency is similar to his years in Miami, but the profile of his diet is skewed towards a movement shooter which I don't think Strus is at heart. I don't blame the Cavs for treating Strus as such, especially with Garland out. Defenses care about Strus' shooting, efficient or not, and its been opening up the floor when he's moving. I assume when Garland comes back, Strus' diet should stray a little back to set shot shooter, but they'll continue to let him fling up some on the move

[ijspeelman]

Just an addendum:

Before Garland's absence, Strus was shooting 47.7% on wide open threes and it was surprisingly less of his diet (15%). Strus also shot 30.3% of his threes on open shots and at an efficiency of 37.1%.

I still think the eye test points towards him shooting many more movement threes since Garland's absence, but that would need to be hand tracked and I don't feel like watching all 274 three point Strus shots this year to find out (again)

[JujitsuFlip]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

You haven't liked either guy since they put pen to paper, mainly because their names weren't Naz Reid and Christian Wood lol

I'd really have to see where those guys volume shooting 3s and opening up the floor was a negative, efficient or otherwise. Not saying it is or isn't just would need proof that was the case. Even so, i would tell both guys to continue shooting because that's what they were brought here to do.

[ijspeelman]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

You haven't liked either guy since they put pen to paper, mainly because their names weren't Naz Reid and Christian Wood lol

I'd really have to see where those guys volume shooting 3s and opening up the floor was a negative, efficient or otherwise. Not saying it is or isn't just would need proof that was the case. Even so, i would tell both guys to continue shooting because that's what they were brought here to do.

Niang so far has been disappointing to me, but we've got more than half the season for regression to the mean

[JujitsuFlip]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

You haven't liked either guy since they put pen to paper, mainly because their names weren't Naz Reid and Christian Wood lol

I'd really have to see where those guys volume shooting 3s and opening up the floor was a negative, efficient or otherwise. Not saying it is or isn't just would need proof that was the case. Even so, i would tell both guys to continue shooting because that's what they were brought here to do.

Niang so far has been disappointing to me, but we've got more than half the season for regression to the mean

I mean, it's hard to pinpoint December and say hey look these 2 guys suck.

Wanna know a cool stat? Strus and Niang are the only 2 Cavs to play in every game this season. Sometimes the best ability, is availability.

For reference, games missed in December by Cavs players, of a possible 13.

Rubio: 13
TJ: 13
Mobley: 11
Garland: 7
LeVert: 5
Mitchell: 4
Merrill: 2 (3 DNP - CD as well)
Wade: 1

[ijspeelman]

You haven't liked either guy since they put pen to paper, mainly because their names weren't Naz Reid and Christian Wood lol

I'd really have to see where those guys volume shooting 3s and opening up the floor was a negative, efficient or otherwise. Not saying it is or isn't just would need proof that was the case. Even so, i would tell both guys to continue shooting because that's what they were brought here to do.

Niang so far has been disappointing to me, but we've got more than half the season for regression to the mean

I mean, it's hard to pinpoint December and say hey look these 2 guys suck.

Wanna know a cool stat? Strus and Niang are the only 2 Cavs to play in every game this season. Sometimes the best ability, is availability.

For reference, games missed in December by Cavs players, of a possible 13.

Rubio: 13
TJ: 13
Mobley: 11
Garland: 7
LeVert: 5
Mitchell: 4
Merrill: 2 (3 DNP - CD as well)
Wade: 1

I like availability, but Niang has been well below replacement level thus far through his games and I'm not convinced spreading out his minutes versus playing him would have made us worse.

However, I still think he can bounce back as he's shooting so much worse than his norm and he's been a model of consistency from deep throughout his career

I am more concerned with how his defense will look in a playoff setting at this point. I think the Cavs done a good job hiding him and to his credit, he doesn't really allow players to blow by him bc he uses his body to push them out of the lane (which either works or fairly results in a foul).

For comparisons sake, Love has shot nearly as poorly (but 2% higher from deep), but I actually think he may be more useful defensively. I feel like this requires some explanation so I'll say that we'd use a similar coverage to hide Love, but he'd be a better help defender at the rim by drawing charges and occasional fast hands. Love is much worse laterally (which is saying something when comparing him to Niang), but its rare to see Niang switched and would be similar to Love's frequency.

Basically, Niang has to starting shooting >~38% from deep for him to be more valuable than Love imo

[JonFromVA]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

Better spacing can lead to improved efficiency, but everything has to be in place such that the driving lanes open up and the defense is forced to either permit the layup, the lob, or the wide open 3.

Certainly, I've seen other teams exploit our defense at times by pulling Allen away from the rim with a P&R and then plopping whoever is being guarded by our worst help defenders in the corners, but even JBB doesn't let them get away with that indefinitely.

It's problematic that our best shooters do not provide much rim protection and our best help defenders do not generate much gravity.

We can overcome this with ball movement and player movement and potentially create a great shot whenever and wherever the defense misses a step or makes a mistake, but not if our key players are stopping the ball or not moving and setting screens without it.

I believe there's a leap of faith involved that our roleplayers have shown they're ready to make, but that our primary ball handlers and our coach have not.

Expending all that energy on both ends of the floor doesn't come for free. Our roster was built to stagger the minutes of our core-4, but that requires those guys to play long stretches where their energy is going to wane. So, I don't think we can actually do this without first re-thinking our rotations so everyone can play hard when they're on the floor.

[JujitsuFlip]

Niang so far has been disappointing to me, but we've got more than half the season for regression to the mean

I mean, it's hard to pinpoint December and say hey look these 2 guys suck.

Wanna know a cool stat? Strus and Niang are the only 2 Cavs to play in every game this season. Sometimes the best ability, is availability.

For reference, games missed in December by Cavs players, of a possible 13.

Rubio: 13
TJ: 13
Mobley: 11
Garland: 7
LeVert: 5
Mitchell: 4
Merrill: 2 (3 DNP - CD as well)
Wade: 1

I like availability, but Niang has been well below replacement level thus far through his games and I'm not convinced spreading out his minutes versus playing him would have made us worse.

However, I still think he can bounce back as he's shooting so much worse than his norm and he's been a model of consistency from deep throughout his career

I am more concerned with how his defense will look in a playoff setting at this point. I think the Cavs done a good job hiding him and to his credit, he doesn't really allow players to blow by him bc he uses his body to push them out of the lane (which either works or fairly results in a foul).

For comparisons sake, Love has shot nearly as poorly (but 2% higher from deep), but I actually think he may be more useful defensively. I feel like this requires some explanation so I'll say that we'd use a similar coverage to hide Love, but he'd be a better help defender at the rim by drawing charges and occasional fast hands. Love is much worse laterally (which is saying something when comparing him to Niang), but its rare to see Niang switched and would be similar to Love's frequency.

Basically, Niang has to starting shooting >~38% from deep for him to be more valuable than Love imo

The difference is Love didn't want to be here.

Also, Niang didn't just forget how to shoot a basketball. The guy shot 40%+ on 2 different teams over 5 consecutive seasons. At some point, you look at the coach and see how he is misusing the pieces provided to him. Not saying Koby would ever put the bottle down to do that but it is a logical step in the assessment process.

I don't think Niang will play more than his career average 14 MPG in the playoffs under Jb, so i think his defense is less of an issue. He'll either be all way outta the rotation or his minutes severely limited, his defense was always gonna be in question.

I guarantee the Cavs could trade him and he would bounce right back to being an efficient volume shooter on a different team. This isn't the first time under Jb that guys are completely underwhelming. There are only a few archetypes that thrive under Jb and if guys do not fit into that mold they ride the bench until their contract expires, they are traded, or worse yet they have an outburst and are exiled from the team (at least like 4 instances of this).

[JonFromVA]

Strus and Niang both shot ~30% from three in December. Not quite Kevin-Love-getting-benched levels of a slump, but very disappointing.

Strus continues to take lots of contested threes and shoot terribly on them. His TS% is down to 53%, well below league average.

I continue to believe that chasing spacing at the expense of efficiency is totally backwards.

You haven't liked either guy since they put pen to paper, mainly because their names weren't Naz Reid and Christian Wood lol

I'd really have to see where those guys volume shooting 3s and opening up the floor was a negative, efficient or otherwise. Not saying it is or isn't just would need proof that was the case. Even so, i would tell both guys to continue shooting because that's what they were brought here to do.

Niang so far has been disappointing to me, but we've got more than half the season for regression to the mean

I like to see guys trying to expand their role, but it's not always going to be pretty and some of them will need to be dialed back if the roster gets healthier; but ideally some won't.

[ijspeelman]

I mean, it's hard to pinpoint December and say hey look these 2 guys suck.

Wanna know a cool stat? Strus and Niang are the only 2 Cavs to play in every game this season. Sometimes the best ability, is availability.

For reference, games missed in December by Cavs players, of a possible 13.

Rubio: 13
TJ: 13
Mobley: 11
Garland: 7
LeVert: 5
Mitchell: 4
Merrill: 2 (3 DNP - CD as well)
Wade: 1

I like availability, but Niang has been well below replacement level thus far through his games and I'm not convinced spreading out his minutes versus playing him would have made us worse.

However, I still think he can bounce back as he's shooting so much worse than his norm and he's been a model of consistency from deep throughout his career

I am more concerned with how his defense will look in a playoff setting at this point. I think the Cavs done a good job hiding him and to his credit, he doesn't really allow players to blow by him bc he uses his body to push them out of the lane (which either works or fairly results in a foul).

For comparisons sake, Love has shot nearly as poorly (but 2% higher from deep), but I actually think he may be more useful defensively. I feel like this requires some explanation so I'll say that we'd use a similar coverage to hide Love, but he'd be a better help defender at the rim by drawing charges and occasional fast hands. Love is much worse laterally (which is saying something when comparing him to Niang), but its rare to see Niang switched and would be similar to Love's frequency.

Basically, Niang has to starting shooting >~38% from deep for him to be more valuable than Love imo

The difference is Love didn't want to be here.

Also, Niang didn't just forget how to shoot a basketball. The guy shot 40%+ on 2 different teams over 5 consecutive seasons. At some point, you look at the coach and see how he is misusing the pieces provided to him. Not saying Koby would ever put the bottle down to do that but it is a logical step in the assessment process.

I don't think Niang will play more than his career average 14 MPG in the playoffs under Jb, so i think his defense is less of an issue. He'll either be all way outta the rotation or his minutes severely limited, his defense was always gonna be in question.

I guarantee the Cavs could trade him and he would bounce right back to being an efficient volume shooter on a different team. This isn't the first time under Jb that guys are completely underwhelming. There are only a few archetypes that thrive under Jb and if guys do not fit into that mold they ride the bench until their contract expires, they are traded, or worse yet they have an outburst and are exiled from the team (at least like 4 instances of this).

I agree that Niang could easily bounce back. He's getting similar shots to his previous teams so I wouldn't blame JB... ball just isn't falling

And nothing we can do above Love not wanting to be here, just decided to use him as an example since its the role Niang is fitting in

[JujitsuFlip]

I like availability, but Niang has been well below replacement level thus far through his games and I'm not convinced spreading out his minutes versus playing him would have made us worse.

However, I still think he can bounce back as he's shooting so much worse than his norm and he's been a model of consistency from deep throughout his career

I am more concerned with how his defense will look in a playoff setting at this point. I think the Cavs done a good job hiding him and to his credit, he doesn't really allow players to blow by him bc he uses his body to push them out of the lane (which either works or fairly results in a foul).

For comparisons sake, Love has shot nearly as poorly (but 2% higher from deep), but I actually think he may be more useful defensively. I feel like this requires some explanation so I'll say that we'd use a similar coverage to hide Love, but he'd be a better help defender at the rim by drawing charges and occasional fast hands. Love is much worse laterally (which is saying something when comparing him to Niang), but its rare to see Niang switched and would be similar to Love's frequency.

Basically, Niang has to starting shooting >~38% from deep for him to be more valuable than Love imo

The difference is Love didn't want to be here.

Also, Niang didn't just forget how to shoot a basketball. The guy shot 40%+ on 2 different teams over 5 consecutive seasons. At some point, you look at the coach and see how he is misusing the pieces provided to him. Not saying Koby would ever put the bottle down to do that but it is a logical step in the assessment process.

I don't think Niang will play more than his career average 14 MPG in the playoffs under Jb, so i think his defense is less of an issue. He'll either be all way outta the rotation or his minutes severely limited, his defense was always gonna be in question.

I guarantee the Cavs could trade him and he would bounce right back to being an efficient volume shooter on a different team. This isn't the first time under Jb that guys are completely underwhelming. There are only a few archetypes that thrive under Jb and if guys do not fit into that mold they ride the bench until their contract expires, they are traded, or worse yet they have an outburst and are exiled from the team (at least like 4 instances of this).

I agree that Niang could easily bounce back. He's getting similar shots to his previous teams so I wouldn't blame JB... ball just isn't falling

And nothing we can do above Love not wanting to be here, just decided to use him as an example since its the role Niang is fitting in

I've watched a grand total of 2 games this season, both times the thing that stood out was CPJ.

I would have to watch Niang's Utah days vs his Philly days vs now to really determine if the looks he's getting are the same.

[toooskies]

I've watched a grand total of 2 games this season

Thank you for this information.

[JujitsuFlip]

I've watched a grand total of 2 games this season

Thank you for this information.

You coulda asked Jon, he'll tell ya lol

It's not my fault the NBA considers someone 4 hours from the arena "in-market", sorry not driving a nearly 500 mile round trip on a work night to watch a Cavs game in person.

I've watched hundreds of NBA games this season, the NBA just blacks out games for paying customers on the streaming service they provide.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯