Trade Ideas (Part III)

[Stillwater]

ATL has one of it not the worst rosters in the league and that's not going to change overnight. When Thomas enters free agency he'll almost be 30 years old. It's a pretty safe bet Thomas won't want any part of playing for one of the worst teams in the league.

maybe, but they are probably one of the few teams in the league that would give him a decent contract even if it's not the max.
We would be doing them a favor taking Schroder off their hands imo. He is the one piece that keep them above the bottom 5.

Hawks have a new GM who's building the team wirh young players and draft picks, he let Millsap leave for less than a max deal in terms of money and years, there is no way he reverses course by taking on a broken IT and with him being a free agent. There is no value in this trade.
Dennis is perfect to lead the tank.

What you propose is no favor, so you can keep it.

There again, never said I thought ATL was in full tank mode,but if they were they would be wise to get rid of Schroder.
They will not be bad enough for a top 3 pick with Schroder there.
Maybe IT4 doesn't make sense to you, but you will never be a legitimate contender without a full tank and an injured IT4 gets you just that next season. Then you can either continue to tank and let him walk or you can sign him to lead your young core with the top 3 pick you just used having tanked with It4 out and Schroder gone, and use that to fast forward your road to relevance adding another marquee player in FA that wants to play with IT4 and your stud rookie.
I'm done, it's not that difficult to understand the logic here and fast forward is what ATL always does, & if you are right they are committed to the young player movement, they better learn how to draft better than Prince in the lottery.

[jayu70]

maybe, but they are probably one of the few teams in the league that would give him a decent contract even if it's not the max.
We would be doing them a favor taking Schroder off their hands imo. He is the one piece that keep them above the bottom 5.

Hawks have a new GM who's building the team wirh young players and draft picks, he let Millsap leave for less than a max deal in terms of money and years, there is no way he reverses course by taking on a broken IT and with him being a free agent. There is no value in this trade.
Dennis is perfect to lead the tank.

What you propose is no favor, so you can keep it.

There again, never said I thought ATL was in full tank mode,but if they were they would be wise to get rid of Schroder.
They will not be bad enough for a top 3 pick with Schroder there.
Maybe IT4 doesn't make sense to you, but you will never be a legitimate contender without a full tank and an injured IT4 gets you just that next season. Then you can either continue to tank and let him walk or you can sign him to lead your young core with the top 3 pick you just used having tanked with It4 out and Schroder gone, and use that to fast forward your road to relevance adding another marquee player in FA that wants to play with IT4 and your stud rookie.
I'm done, it's not that difficult to understand the logic here and fast forward is what ATL always does, & if you are right they are committed to the young player movement, they better learn how to draft better than Prince in the lottery.

it's not that difficult to understand...
Again, IF Atlanta is full on tanking and decides to move Dennis, they can get a better offer than a FA injured IT.
How is IT gonna recruit another FA when he'll be a FA himself, he'll have to prove he can play and be effective for a portion of this year, IT's recruiting power had the Boston lure and banners behind him, not the same in ATl. Atlanta has not been a FA destination and IT won't change that.
The Hawks have not been in the lottery for the past 10 years, so they've had exactly 1 lottery pick via trading Teague. By all accounts, that draft was so weak that 2nd round pick Malcolm Brogden won rookie of the year. Who should the Hawks have taken at #12?

[jbk1234]

It would have to be IT & swap rights for Schroeder and I'm not sure he's worth it. But that would be the trade that would be close enough for both teams to think about it. Atlanta wouldn't re-sign IT. They'd try to rehab his trade value & flip him.

I'm personally tired of PGs who can't defend the position.

[Dupp]

Yeah they don't exist just just accept having the 4th best offensive point guard in the NBA

[jbk1234]

Yeah they don't exist just just accept having the 4th best offensive point guard in the NBA

I think Beverly, Kemba, Conley, Wall, et. al. would take exception with that claim.

[Stillwater]

Hawks have a new GM who's building the team wirh young players and draft picks, he let Millsap leave for less than a max deal in terms of money and years, there is no way he reverses course by taking on a broken IT and with him being a free agent. There is no value in this trade.
Dennis is perfect to lead the tank.

What you propose is no favor, so you can keep it.

There again, never said I thought ATL was in full tank mode,but if they were they would be wise to get rid of Schroder.
They will not be bad enough for a top 3 pick with Schroder there.
Maybe IT4 doesn't make sense to you, but you will never be a legitimate contender without a full tank and an injured IT4 gets you just that next season. Then you can either continue to tank and let him walk or you can sign him to lead your young core with the top 3 pick you just used having tanked with It4 out and Schroder gone, and use that to fast forward your road to relevance adding another marquee player in FA that wants to play with IT4 and your stud rookie.
I'm done, it's not that difficult to understand the logic here and fast forward is what ATL always does, & if you are right they are committed to the young player movement, they better learn how to draft better than Prince in the lottery.

it's not that difficult to understand...
Again, IF Atlanta is full on tanking and decides to move Dennis, they can get a better offer than a FA injured IT.
How is IT gonna recruit another FA when he'll be a FA himself, he'll have to prove he can play and be effective for a portion of this year, IT's recruiting power had the Boston lure and banners behind him, not the same in ATl. Atlanta has not been a FA destination and IT won't change that.
The Hawks have not been in the lottery for the past 10 years, so they've had exactly 1 lottery pick via trading Teague. By all accounts, that draft was so weak that 2nd round pick Malcolm Brogden won rookie of the year. Who should the Hawks have taken at #12?

whatever the only reason you took a senior at 12 was because you were trying to get a player ready to compete immediately and remain in mediocrity.SOS
ATL has never been a contender in all those years they have been just good enough to not ever get a good pick.
there were plenty of players in that draft that were overlooked not only by ATL but many other teams. Dejounte Murray & Pat McCaw were the biggest snubs you passed on for Bembry( a jr) at 21 leaving ZIzic and Siakim on the board.
you should have taken Baldwin or Murray at 12 imo and Siakim, Zizic or Zubac @ 21.
then you would have been in position in 2017 to trade down and take Bolden & Ojeleye instead of 1 high energy pf at 19.
ATL has no idea how to draft players. Collins should be good, but not good enough to take you anywhere farther then you have been already.
Don't want an all star coming off injury because you can do better? I doubt it.

[kg01]

There again, never said I thought ATL was in full tank mode,but if they were they would be wise to get rid of Schroder.
They will not be bad enough for a top 3 pick with Schroder there.
Maybe IT4 doesn't make sense to you, but you will never be a legitimate contender without a full tank and an injured IT4 gets you just that next season. Then you can either continue to tank and let him walk or you can sign him to lead your young core with the top 3 pick you just used having tanked with It4 out and Schroder gone, and use that to fast forward your road to relevance adding another marquee player in FA that wants to play with IT4 and your stud rookie.
I'm done, it's not that difficult to understand the logic here and fast forward is what ATL always does, & if you are right they are committed to the young player movement, they better learn how to draft better than Prince in the lottery.

it's not that difficult to understand...
Again, IF Atlanta is full on tanking and decides to move Dennis, they can get a better offer than a FA injured IT.
How is IT gonna recruit another FA when he'll be a FA himself, he'll have to prove he can play and be effective for a portion of this year, IT's recruiting power had the Boston lure and banners behind him, not the same in ATl. Atlanta has not been a FA destination and IT won't change that.
The Hawks have not been in the lottery for the past 10 years, so they've had exactly 1 lottery pick via trading Teague. By all accounts, that draft was so weak that 2nd round pick Malcolm Brogden won rookie of the year. Who should the Hawks have taken at #12?

whatever the only reason you took a senior at 12 was because you were trying to get a player ready to compete immediately and remain in mediocrity.SOS
ATL has never been a contender in all those years they have been just good enough to not ever get a good pick.
there were plenty of players in that draft that were overlooked not only by ATL but many other teams. Dejounte Murray & Pat McCaw were the biggest snubs you passed on for Bembry( a jr) at 21 leaving ZIzic and Siakim on the board.
you should have taken Baldwin or Murray at 12 imo and Siakim, Zizic or Zubac @ 21.
then you would have been in position in 2017 to trade down and take Bolden & Ojeleye instead of 1 high energy pf at 19.
ATL has no idea how to draft players. Collins should be good, but not good enough to take you anywhere farther then you have been already.
Don't want an all star coming off injury because you can do better? I doubt it.

You're combining some valid opinions on the Hawks (poor drafting, mediocrity-driven) with some incomplete thoughts. You have to remember they have a new direction as of this offseason so there's a lot of TBD in their direction going forward.

IOW, I don't think it's fair to lump Ferry and Budz' misguided efforts to just maintain playoff appearances onto Schlenk's tenure.

And there could be better offers for Dennis. Basically anything that includes a 1st would be better than a guy who's hurt and who's not going to attract any FA's to ATL and who the Hawks clearly aren't going to want to re-sign. People seem to forget that Thomas as just aiight before the last 1.5 years. He's not an established star really. Meaning, he could quite easily go back to being an upper-middle class man's Nate Robinson.

[Stillwater]

it's not that difficult to understand...
Again, IF Atlanta is full on tanking and decides to move Dennis, they can get a better offer than a FA injured IT.
How is IT gonna recruit another FA when he'll be a FA himself, he'll have to prove he can play and be effective for a portion of this year, IT's recruiting power had the Boston lure and banners behind him, not the same in ATl. Atlanta has not been a FA destination and IT won't change that.
The Hawks have not been in the lottery for the past 10 years, so they've had exactly 1 lottery pick via trading Teague. By all accounts, that draft was so weak that 2nd round pick Malcolm Brogden won rookie of the year. Who should the Hawks have taken at #12?

whatever the only reason you took a senior at 12 was because you were trying to get a player ready to compete immediately and remain in mediocrity.SOS
ATL has never been a contender in all those years they have been just good enough to not ever get a good pick.
there were plenty of players in that draft that were overlooked not only by ATL but many other teams. Dejounte Murray & Pat McCaw were the biggest snubs you passed on for Bembry( a jr) at 21 leaving ZIzic and Siakim on the board.
you should have taken Baldwin or Murray at 12 imo and Siakim, Zizic or Zubac @ 21.
then you would have been in position in 2017 to trade down and take Bolden & Ojeleye instead of 1 high energy pf at 19.
ATL has no idea how to draft players. Collins should be good, but not good enough to take you anywhere farther then you have been already.
Don't want an all star coming off injury because you can do better? I doubt it.

You're combining some valid opinions on the Hawks (poor drafting, mediocrity-driven) with some incomplete thoughts. You have to remember they have a new direction as of this offseason so there's a lot of TBD in their direction going forward.

IOW, I don't think it's fair to lump Ferry and Budz' misguided efforts to just maintain playoff appearances onto Schlenk's tenure.

And there could be better offers for Dennis. Basically anything that includes a 1st would be better than a guy who's hurt and who's not going to attract any FA's to ATL and who the Hawks clearly aren't going to want to re-sign. People seem to forget that Thomas as just aiight before the last 1.5 years. He's not an established star really. Meaning, he could quite easily go back to being an upper-middle class man's Nate Robinson.

If ATL makes the determination in their Physical that he will recover , then I think they would pay up to resign him.
If they do not feel he will without surgery ( like I think) then sure they are less likely to do it , esp if they have had interest from other teams for Schroder, but if not this way they get their tank on full.
I'm sure you can get a late first and absorb some bad contracts to get rid of him , but my idea gives you at minimum a chance at jump starting the relevance factor in 18-19 in tank mode for 1 season 17-18 not having any pg on your roster for the majority of it. I don't see them trading Schroder and not getting back a pg of some form, so why not trade for one that was an mvp candidate over keeping a decent one that doesn't have that in his game or trading him for a lesser one and a draft pick that will just get you a role player? If they think Schroder still has more in him, then of course they don't do it, if not I don't think they pass up the op to bring in IT4 who when given the lead dog role proved his value 1000 times over last season.
btw I don't know why IT4 wouldn't help you get another legit FA , but even if he didn't it's a better option than trying to get 1 without him.

[kg01]

whatever the only reason you took a senior at 12 was because you were trying to get a player ready to compete immediately and remain in mediocrity.SOS
ATL has never been a contender in all those years they have been just good enough to not ever get a good pick.
there were plenty of players in that draft that were overlooked not only by ATL but many other teams. Dejounte Murray & Pat McCaw were the biggest snubs you passed on for Bembry( a jr) at 21 leaving ZIzic and Siakim on the board.
you should have taken Baldwin or Murray at 12 imo and Siakim, Zizic or Zubac @ 21.
then you would have been in position in 2017 to trade down and take Bolden & Ojeleye instead of 1 high energy pf at 19.
ATL has no idea how to draft players. Collins should be good, but not good enough to take you anywhere farther then you have been already.
Don't want an all star coming off injury because you can do better? I doubt it.

You're combining some valid opinions on the Hawks (poor drafting, mediocrity-driven) with some incomplete thoughts. You have to remember they have a new direction as of this offseason so there's a lot of TBD in their direction going forward.

IOW, I don't think it's fair to lump Ferry and Budz' misguided efforts to just maintain playoff appearances onto Schlenk's tenure.

And there could be better offers for Dennis. Basically anything that includes a 1st would be better than a guy who's hurt and who's not going to attract any FA's to ATL and who the Hawks clearly aren't going to want to re-sign. People seem to forget that Thomas as just aiight before the last 1.5 years. He's not an established star really. Meaning, he could quite easily go back to being an upper-middle class man's Nate Robinson.

If ATL makes the determination in their Physical that he will recover , then I think they would pay up to resign him.
If they do not feel he will without surgery ( like I think) then sure they are less likely to do it , esp if they have had interest from other teams for Schroder, but if not this way they get their tank on full.
I'm sure you can get a late first and absorb some bad contracts to get rid of him , but my idea gives you at minimum a chance at jump starting the relevance factor in 18-19 in tank mode for 1 season 17-18 not having any pg on your roster for the majority of it. I don't see them trading Schroder and not getting back a pg of some form, so why not trade for one that was an mvp candidate over keeping a decent one that doesn't have that in his game or trading him for a lesser one and a draft pick that will just get you a role player? If they think Schroder still has more in him, then of course they don't do it, if not I don't think they pass up the op to bring in IT4 who when given the lead dog role proved his value 1000 times over last season.
btw I don't know why IT4 wouldn't help you get another legit FA , but even if he didn't it's a better option than trying to get 1 without him.

I hear you, man. So far, Schlenk (ATL GM) has been preaching 'no bad contracts' or w/e. I believe, due to the state of the team/franchise, they'd have to overpay to keep Thomas. An overpay would be an awful deal IMHO which is why I doubt they'd do it.

I think Thomas' status as an MVP candidate was more of a nod to the Selltics' team overall. He'd never be that here. Not right now anyway. So, I tend to reject the idea that we'd be adding an MVP-level player if we traded Dennis for him. I also hesitate at the idea that Thomas has 'proven his worth'. I'd say the collective in BOS has proven their worth. That's also why I believe Thomas wouldn't move the meter free agent-wise in ATL. He alone didn't attract guys to BOS, the state of their team is what's enticing.

We're better off forging our rebuild from the ground up. The only short-cut here is if Lebron suddenly realizes he was actually born in Atlanta.

[Stillwater]

https://cavsnation.com/cavs-rumors-brooklyn-pick-wont-be-traded-according-to-adrian-wojnarowski/
for what it's worth , I doubt they move it either unless a really solid player on a multi year contract is offered up to us.
https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6946513
Bulls get Cavs 2020 2nd rounder from Portland.
small trade idea to get an upgrade in Grant as a 2nd or 3rd pg who can play and defend both guard positions. Also an under rated floor general who played pg in college and up'd his 3p% to 36% last season (although in limited numbers).
he is a pass first unselfish guard ( never used that way in NY or CHI )that can defend (at least better than Calderon,IT4 and Rose).
I think Bulls would do this with Payne out and not really in their plans anyway, Felder would be a decent long term backup to Dunn or whomever they draft,if Dunn doesn't have a good year. Felder is better than Payne. Tavares fills out their roster & could fit into their rebuild, we don't need him with Zizic here.

[jbk1234]

https://cavsnation.com/cavs-rumors-brooklyn-pick-wont-be-traded-according-to-adrian-wojnarowski/
for what it's worth , I doubt they move it either unless a really solid player on a multi year contract is offered up to us.
https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6946513
Bulls get Cavs 2020 2nd rounder from Portland.
small trade idea to get an upgrade in Grant as a 2nd or 3rd pg who can play and defend both guard positions. Also an under rated floor general who played pg in college and up'd his 3p% to 36% last season (although in limited numbers).
he is a pass first unselfish guard ( never used that way in NY or CHI )that can defend (at least better than Calderon,IT4 and Rose).
I think Bulls would do this with Payne out and not really in their plans anyway, Felder would be a decent long term backup to Dunn or whomever they draft,if Dunn doesn't have a good year. Felder is better than Payne. Tavares fills out their roster & could fit into their rebuild, we don't need him with Zizic here.

I'd rather dump Frye, who is expiring, at this point.

[Stillwater]

https://cavsnation.com/cavs-rumors-brooklyn-pick-wont-be-traded-according-to-adrian-wojnarowski/
for what it's worth , I doubt they move it either unless a really solid player on a multi year contract is offered up to us.
https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6946513
Bulls get Cavs 2020 2nd rounder from Portland.
small trade idea to get an upgrade in Grant as a 2nd or 3rd pg who can play and defend both guard positions. Also an under rated floor general who played pg in college and up'd his 3p% to 36% last season (although in limited numbers).
he is a pass first unselfish guard ( never used that way in NY or CHI )that can defend (at least better than Calderon,IT4 and Rose).
I think Bulls would do this with Payne out and not really in their plans anyway, Felder would be a decent long term backup to Dunn or whomever they draft,if Dunn doesn't have a good year. Felder is better than Payne. Tavares fills out their roster & could fit into their rebuild, we don't need him with Zizic here.

I'd rather dump Frye, who is expiring, at this point.

yeah I figure we will eventually move Frye if we can get a good return,but I get the feeling they will want to retain him for his high % shooting from 3.
It would be pretty solid to get a player like Grant for the price of 2 players who may be cut before the regular season anyway. Tavares would probably be offered to be re-signed to the open 2-way deal as one of those has been given to Holland former Charge player if Tavares is not traded or just released being he is non-guaranteed, and then Felder would just be waived , unless they could renegotiate his deal that I think is partially guaranteed and turn it into a 2-way contract.
The other idea I had included Frye and Felder for Delly , but I am not sure Bucks would want either.

[Stillwater]

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6947014
Wolves get Detroit's 2018 first unprotected.
This is based on the Wiggins refusal to sign his extension in Minnesota. If he does,obviously no deal.
This gets us Bradley and a developmental big.

[jbk1234]

Also posted on the T&T board.

Cavs out: IT, Shump, Frye, & RJ, & Cavs2018 1st
Cavs in: Melo

NY out: Melo
NY in: IT, Shump, Frye, & RJ, & Cavs2018 1st

Why for the Cavs: They need a consolidation trade. The addition of Melo allows the Cavs to engage some creative line ups and replace Kyrie's lost offense. Instead of watching our bench get outscored, our second unit can actually outscore the opponent. Cavs still need a starting PG after this but they've got enough depth elsewhere to make that happen.

Why for NY: Of the $26 million you're getting back, $16 million is in expiring contracts, and Shump's $10 million only goes on for an additional year if he opts in. If he doesn't, you've got $26 million in expiring contracts. Get a low-cost look at IT. Flip him at the deadline, or keep him if you like, plus the first.

[Stillwater]

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6947202
If Cavs are keeping the Nets pick they can give up their own 2018 first in this deal to get Bledsoe.

[Stillwater]

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6947805
Spurs get Cavs 2018 first unprotected & Philly's 2018 second round draft pick from Cleveland or Brooklyn (more favorable)
& the rights to Mathias Lessort.
Philly gets Cavs 2019 second round draft pick from Minnesota or L.A. Lakers (less favorable)& the rights to Oliver Hanlan
Cavs get rid of Frye and Felder for Dejoute Murray (Lebrons little buddy) and the usually 1 dimensional spot up ( knock down)shooter Stauskas , who has also shown some flashes of being able to score off the dribble despite his less than stellar foot speed but is dead weight on Philly.
This deal would be before the deadline w/ Lauvergne not being able to be traded until december.

or this one can be done right now:
https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6947817
Spurs get a solid offensive center , a savvy vet and a high level defensive sf. + Cavs 2018 unprotected and Philly's 2019 second round draft pick from Milwaukee or Sacramento (more favorable) or the rights to Mathias Lessort.
Philly gets a huge asset in Green & the expiring of Frye who is golden as a locker room guy & Cavs 2019 second round draft pick from Minnesota or L.A. Lakers (less favorable)
Cavs get a huge asset in Murray. + get rid of Frye and RJ. & still have the Nets pick.

[BucksPackers]

If we gave you Middleton and Monroe for Shump/Frye and that nets pick would you guys do it. Just curious. Not sure we would but want that feeling from the cavs fan base.

IT
JR
MIds
Bron
Love

bench
Monroe
TT
Crowder
Rose
ect

[jbk1234]

If we gave you Middleton and Monroe for Shump/Frye and that nets pick would you guys do it. Just curious. Not sure we would but want that feeling from the cavs fan base.

IT
JR
MIds
Bron
Love

bench
Monroe
TT
Crowder
Rose
ect

Many fans would. Gilbert wouldn't w/o a guaranteed from LBJ (which wouldn't be coming).

For me personally, I'd want to see Middleton play more because he looked pretty cashed at the end of last season. If he wasn't fully recovered, that's one thing. If he was and that's the player he is now, I wouldn't. Either way, we can't take back Monroe if that's all the salary we'd be sending out.

[Stillwater]

If we gave you Middleton and Monroe for Shump/Frye and that nets pick would you guys do it. Just curious. Not sure we would but want that feeling from the cavs fan base.

IT
JR
MIds
Bron
Love

bench
Monroe
TT
Crowder
Rose
ect

doesn't work for starters ;
Due to Cleveland being over the cap and having a post-trade Team Salary over the Tax Threshold, the 25% trade rule is invoked. Cleveland could not receive more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did not happen here.
I want no part of Monroe on the Cavs and so we would be getting a back up big and a sg/sf for giving up a stretch 5 and the only guard in outr line up outside of Smith that can defend anyone and giving up the Nets pick for that?
No .

[Stillwater]

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6948364
Nets pick & It4 to Dallas for Dennis Smith Jr. ,Narlens Noel & Dallas' 2018 first unprotected.