2021-22 regular season thread

[JonFromVA]

I suppose we should thank Kevin for his brain dead pass that ignited that sequence.

You don't see much defense in a scrimmage for the fans ... yet Evan was impressive. I'd give kudos to Darius and Lauri too but they will be defended better than that.

Too bad they didn't show more of the game rather than the chatter boxes.

[jbk1234]

KPJ talking mess
https://kingjamesgospel.com/2021/10/02/cavs-former-guard-kevin-porter-jr-bashes-cleveland-former-team/

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[toooskies]

KPJ talking mess
https://kingjamesgospel.com/2021/10/02/cavs-former-guard-kevin-porter-jr-bashes-cleveland-former-team/

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I mean, nothing posted in that article seemed out-of-line. It's cold and occasionally snowy in Cleveland. The Cavs literally didn't play him last year before we decided to dump him, so not having basketball being an escape or not being utilized or "nurtured" is totally accurate.

[JonFromVA]

KPJ talking mess
https://kingjamesgospel.com/2021/10/02/cavs-former-guard-kevin-porter-jr-bashes-cleveland-former-team/

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I mean, nothing posted in that article seemed out-of-line. It's cold and occasionally snowy in Cleveland. The Cavs literally didn't play him last year before we decided to dump him, so not having basketball being an escape or not being utilized or "nurtured" is totally accurate.

Agreed, I wasn't especially offended, but it would had shown a little maturity if he took some responsibility for his own actions.

[jbk1234]

KPJ talking mess
https://kingjamesgospel.com/2021/10/02/cavs-former-guard-kevin-porter-jr-bashes-cleveland-former-team/

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I mean, nothing posted in that article seemed out-of-line. It's cold and occasionally snowy in Cleveland. The Cavs literally didn't play him last year before we decided to dump him, so not having basketball being an escape or not being utilized or "nurtured" is totally accurate.

The Cavs took a chance on him in the draft, dealt with him flipping over his car at 3:00 a.m. (with drugs and a gun in the vehicle), an online suicide threat, and who knows what else. They didn't trade him until he called the African-American GM a slave owner.

The Cavs provided that young man with a ton of chances, and if his takeaway from his experience is that he wasn't nurtured enough, then I don't know what that portends for his future.

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[toooskies]

KPJ talking mess
https://kingjamesgospel.com/2021/10/02/cavs-former-guard-kevin-porter-jr-bashes-cleveland-former-team/

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I mean, nothing posted in that article seemed out-of-line. It's cold and occasionally snowy in Cleveland. The Cavs literally didn't play him last year before we decided to dump him, so not having basketball being an escape or not being utilized or "nurtured" is totally accurate.

The Cavs took a chance on him in the draft, dealt with him flipping over his car at 3:00 a.m. (with drugs and a gun in the vehicle), an online suicide threat, and who knows what else. They didn't trade him until he called the African-American GM a slave owner.

The Cavs provided that young man with a ton of chances, and if his takeaway from his experience is that he wasn't nurtured enough, then I don't know what that portends for his future.

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There's really no need for him to remind the Houston media that he had problems before he got there. I'm sure he's trying to put those events in the rearview mirror. Remember these are media interviews, not sessions with his therapist.

[LivingLegend]

I suppose that the important thing is that Sexton eventually gets it regardless of why.

That said, Sexton really didn't make an effort to get his teammates involved until he started hearing Garland's footsteps. He's never made an effort on the defensive end and it shouldn't take his next contract being at risk to get there.

I just struggle with the idea that a core guy can be satisfied with just getting buckets in the paint, and doing little else, while his team only wins 20 games three seasons in a row. It shouldn't have taken external incentives for him to do the things that were necessary to win more.

We need to cut everyone a little slack, though. We are dealing with a pandemic and there are limits what a player like Collin can do in an empty gym working by himself and even in the best of times there's no fixed time line for a young player to figure things out.

If he gets it now, and his on the court behavior changes (which has yet to happen), it will be water under the bridge. But it is disconcerting that it takes external incentives for him to focus on things that would result on the team performing better and possibly winning more. I'm not in his head but I'd hope he'd rather score less and win more than the other way around.

Welp, after watching last nights preseason game, I think we can expect more of the same this season lol This team is going to be awful.

The one thing I noticed with our NBA worst offense, is that they try and try and try soooooo hard on offense to get a good look. It required 6 passes, 2 screens, ect just for them to get a good shot attempt. Too much going on. Too many chances for turnovers because we dont just take the open shot when its there, nobody outside of DG can create a shot attempt for themselves off dribble so it leads to a bunch of over passing and contested shot taking.

Im I wrong? Am I the only one who sees that? I dont know if there is a word for it but they just work SO hard on offense each possession with running plays, passing 5x and all of this 'timing' P&R plays for them to get a easy bucket. They dont score easy buckets. Everything they do on offense looks stressed and difficult.

Watching the Bulls, they just freely pass it 2-3x with confidence, take a open shot and make them. The Cavs dribble the ball up court, get into their set, set 2 screens, swing the ball around and eventually wind up in the situation where either Sexton/Garland have to 1) dump it off and hopefully not turn it over in the process to a big man for a contested dunk/layup OR 2) have to do a floater or mid range jumper.

Its just.....the same as it was last year. This offense needs simplification, more of a 'go down the court and start launching shots if your open' instead of 'lets run all of this action off ball and hope nobody turns it over in the process'

Darius Garland literally still passes up 5-8 open 3s per game early in the shot clock when he doesnt have a defender within 3 feet of him because he is too worried about running the play behind him. SHOOT THE BALL. There is more over thinking going on in this offense than there is just playing basketball and taking a shot if your open

[JonFromVA]

We need to cut everyone a little slack, though. We are dealing with a pandemic and there are limits what a player like Collin can do in an empty gym working by himself and even in the best of times there's no fixed time line for a young player to figure things out.

If he gets it now, and his on the court behavior changes (which has yet to happen), it will be water under the bridge. But it is disconcerting that it takes external incentives for him to focus on things that would result on the team performing better and possibly winning more. I'm not in his head but I'd hope he'd rather score less and win more than the other way around.

Welp, after watching last nights preseason game, I think we can expect more of the same this season lol This team is going to be awful.

The one thing I noticed with our NBA worst offense, is that they try and try and try soooooo hard on offense to get a good look. It required 6 passes, 2 screens, ect just for them to get a good shot attempt. Too much going on. Too many chances for turnovers because we dont just take the open shot when its there, nobody outside of DG can create a shot attempt for themselves off dribble so it leads to a bunch of over passing and contested shot taking.

Im I wrong? Am I the only one who sees that? I dont know if there is a word for it but they just work SO hard on offense each possession with running plays, passing 5x and all of this 'timing' P&R plays for them to get a easy bucket. They dont score easy buckets. Everything they do on offense looks stressed and difficult.

Watching the Bulls, they just freely pass it 2-3x with confidence, take a open shot and make them. The Cavs dribble the ball up court, get into their set, set 2 screens, swing the ball around and eventually wind up in the situation where either Sexton/Garland have to 1) dump it off and hopefully not turn it over in the process to a big man for a contested dunk/layup OR 2) have to do a floater or mid range jumper.

Its just.....the same as it was last year. This offense needs simplification, more of a 'go down the court and start launching shots if your open' instead of 'lets run all of this action off ball and hope nobody turns it over in the process'

Darius Garland literally still passes up 5-8 open 3s per game early in the shot clock when he doesnt have a defender within 3 feet of him because he is too worried about running the play behind him. SHOOT THE BALL. There is more over thinking going on in this offense than there is just playing basketball and taking a shot if your open

I saw it as as combination of bad floor spacing and over-sharing.


There are worse problems than over-sharing ...

[LivingLegend]

If he gets it now, and his on the court behavior changes (which has yet to happen), it will be water under the bridge. But it is disconcerting that it takes external incentives for him to focus on things that would result on the team performing better and possibly winning more. I'm not in his head but I'd hope he'd rather score less and win more than the other way around.

Welp, after watching last nights preseason game, I think we can expect more of the same this season lol This team is going to be awful.

The one thing I noticed with our NBA worst offense, is that they try and try and try soooooo hard on offense to get a good look. It required 6 passes, 2 screens, ect just for them to get a good shot attempt. Too much going on. Too many chances for turnovers because we dont just take the open shot when its there, nobody outside of DG can create a shot attempt for themselves off dribble so it leads to a bunch of over passing and contested shot taking.

Im I wrong? Am I the only one who sees that? I dont know if there is a word for it but they just work SO hard on offense each possession with running plays, passing 5x and all of this 'timing' P&R plays for them to get a easy bucket. They dont score easy buckets. Everything they do on offense looks stressed and difficult.

Watching the Bulls, they just freely pass it 2-3x with confidence, take a open shot and make them. The Cavs dribble the ball up court, get into their set, set 2 screens, swing the ball around and eventually wind up in the situation where either Sexton/Garland have to 1) dump it off and hopefully not turn it over in the process to a big man for a contested dunk/layup OR 2) have to do a floater or mid range jumper.

Its just.....the same as it was last year. This offense needs simplification, more of a 'go down the court and start launching shots if your open' instead of 'lets run all of this action off ball and hope nobody turns it over in the process'

Darius Garland literally still passes up 5-8 open 3s per game early in the shot clock when he doesnt have a defender within 3 feet of him because he is too worried about running the play behind him. SHOOT THE BALL. There is more over thinking going on in this offense than there is just playing basketball and taking a shot if your open

I saw it as as combination of bad floor spacing and over-sharing.


There are worse problems than over-sharing ...

Over sharing is a product of a overly complex offense being ran by a bunch of guys who dont have great passing ability. Thats how you get 22 turnovers. These guys need to go out and play freely, not worry about executing a 5 step play every single trip down the floor. Overthinking leads to being slow and mistake prone, which is exactly where this team is at.

We dont need to walk the ball up court and run a designed play every single trip down the floor. They need so much to go right just to score a basket.

[jbk1234]

Welp, after watching last nights preseason game, I think we can expect more of the same this season lol This team is going to be awful.

The one thing I noticed with our NBA worst offense, is that they try and try and try soooooo hard on offense to get a good look. It required 6 passes, 2 screens, ect just for them to get a good shot attempt. Too much going on. Too many chances for turnovers because we dont just take the open shot when its there, nobody outside of DG can create a shot attempt for themselves off dribble so it leads to a bunch of over passing and contested shot taking.

Im I wrong? Am I the only one who sees that? I dont know if there is a word for it but they just work SO hard on offense each possession with running plays, passing 5x and all of this 'timing' P&R plays for them to get a easy bucket. They dont score easy buckets. Everything they do on offense looks stressed and difficult.

Watching the Bulls, they just freely pass it 2-3x with confidence, take a open shot and make them. The Cavs dribble the ball up court, get into their set, set 2 screens, swing the ball around and eventually wind up in the situation where either Sexton/Garland have to 1) dump it off and hopefully not turn it over in the process to a big man for a contested dunk/layup OR 2) have to do a floater or mid range jumper.

Its just.....the same as it was last year. This offense needs simplification, more of a 'go down the court and start launching shots if your open' instead of 'lets run all of this action off ball and hope nobody turns it over in the process'

Darius Garland literally still passes up 5-8 open 3s per game early in the shot clock when he doesnt have a defender within 3 feet of him because he is too worried about running the play behind him. SHOOT THE BALL. There is more over thinking going on in this offense than there is just playing basketball and taking a shot if your open

I saw it as as combination of bad floor spacing and over-sharing.


There are worse problems than over-sharing ...

Over sharing is a product of a overly complex offense being ran by a bunch of guys who dont have great passing ability. Thats how you get 22 turnovers. These guys need to go out and play freely, not worry about executing a 5 step play every single trip down the floor. Overthinking leads to being slow and mistake prone, which is exactly where this team is at.

We dont need to walk the ball up court and run a designed play every single trip down the floor. They need so much to go right just to score a basket.

You tend to overshare when you don't have enough guys who can shoot and your floor spacing sucks. Both Garland and Sexton are probably going to end up launching more 3s, but it kind of sucks that our best two dribble drive guys are also our best shooters. Hopefully, Lauri starts to fire away.

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[JonFromVA]

I saw it as as combination of bad floor spacing and over-sharing.


There are worse problems than over-sharing ...

Over sharing is a product of a overly complex offense being ran by a bunch of guys who dont have great passing ability. Thats how you get 22 turnovers. These guys need to go out and play freely, not worry about executing a 5 step play every single trip down the floor. Overthinking leads to being slow and mistake prone, which is exactly where this team is at.

We dont need to walk the ball up court and run a designed play every single trip down the floor. They need so much to go right just to score a basket.

You tend to overshare when you don't have enough guys who can shoot and your floor spacing sucks. Both Garland and Sexton are probably going to end up launching more 3s, but it kind of sucks that our best two dribble drive guys are also our best shooters. Hopefully, Lauri starts to fire away.

There's also the issue of practice time if we are actually trying to do something new on offense, albeit Chicago's offense seemed to be running just fine.

Still, one of the complaints with our offense last season was it was too simplistic, so if they want to invest in addressing that I'd rather see them stick to the plan and suffer the growing pains.

[LivingLegend]

I saw it as as combination of bad floor spacing and over-sharing.


There are worse problems than over-sharing ...

Over sharing is a product of a overly complex offense being ran by a bunch of guys who dont have great passing ability. Thats how you get 22 turnovers. These guys need to go out and play freely, not worry about executing a 5 step play every single trip down the floor. Overthinking leads to being slow and mistake prone, which is exactly where this team is at.

We dont need to walk the ball up court and run a designed play every single trip down the floor. They need so much to go right just to score a basket.

You tend to overshare when you don't have enough guys who can shoot and your floor spacing sucks. Both Garland and Sexton are probably going to end up launching more 3s, but it kind of sucks that our best two dribble drive guys are also our best shooters. Hopefully, Lauri starts to fire away.

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Yeah, at least from last night I just saw more of the same. Reluctance to shoot the 3 unless they are wiiiiiide open. Garland especially. Just pull the dam trigger man. Again, it just feel likes they have to try way too hard to score and too much passing. Its like everyone is trying to set the next guy up for a assist--just shoot it.

[jbk1234]

Over sharing is a product of a overly complex offense being ran by a bunch of guys who dont have great passing ability. Thats how you get 22 turnovers. These guys need to go out and play freely, not worry about executing a 5 step play every single trip down the floor. Overthinking leads to being slow and mistake prone, which is exactly where this team is at.

We dont need to walk the ball up court and run a designed play every single trip down the floor. They need so much to go right just to score a basket.

You tend to overshare when you don't have enough guys who can shoot and your floor spacing sucks. Both Garland and Sexton are probably going to end up launching more 3s, but it kind of sucks that our best two dribble drive guys are also our best shooters. Hopefully, Lauri starts to fire away.

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Yeah, at least from last night I just saw more of the same. Reluctance to shoot the 3 unless they are wiiiiiide open. Garland especially. Just pull the dam trigger man. Again, it just feel likes they have to try way too hard to score and too much passing. Its like everyone is trying to set the next guy up for a assist--just shoot it.

I mean I don't really want to adopt a Blazers offense, nor do I want Garland going full Kyrie. He's a good PG. A really good PG. I don't want him becoming a shoot first guy because those teams have pretty hard ceilings.

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[jbk1234]

Over sharing is a product of a overly complex offense being ran by a bunch of guys who dont have great passing ability. Thats how you get 22 turnovers. These guys need to go out and play freely, not worry about executing a 5 step play every single trip down the floor. Overthinking leads to being slow and mistake prone, which is exactly where this team is at.

We dont need to walk the ball up court and run a designed play every single trip down the floor. They need so much to go right just to score a basket.

You tend to overshare when you don't have enough guys who can shoot and your floor spacing sucks. Both Garland and Sexton are probably going to end up launching more 3s, but it kind of sucks that our best two dribble drive guys are also our best shooters. Hopefully, Lauri starts to fire away.

There's also the issue of practice time if we are actually trying to do something new on offense, albeit Chicago's offense seemed to be running just fine.

Still, one of the complaints with our offense last season was it was too simplistic, so if they want to invest in addressing that I'd rather see them stick to the plan and suffer the growing pains.

I mean the Bulls have traded for Vuc, Ball, and DeRozan in the last 6 months,, after starting with LaVine. They won't struggle on the offensive end.

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[LivingLegend]

You tend to overshare when you don't have enough guys who can shoot and your floor spacing sucks. Both Garland and Sexton are probably going to end up launching more 3s, but it kind of sucks that our best two dribble drive guys are also our best shooters. Hopefully, Lauri starts to fire away.

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Yeah, at least from last night I just saw more of the same. Reluctance to shoot the 3 unless they are wiiiiiide open. Garland especially. Just pull the dam trigger man. Again, it just feel likes they have to try way too hard to score and too much passing. Its like everyone is trying to set the next guy up for a assist--just shoot it.

I mean I don't really want to adopt a Blazers offense, nor do I want Garland going full Kyrie. He's a good PG. A really good PG. I don't want him becoming a shoot first guy because those teams have pretty hard ceilings.

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He might need to be that guy until another SF/PF/C on this teams shows they can score 20+ per game and demand the defenses attention--we dont get that then this team might never score more than 100 points in a game this season.

Garlands ability to create his own looks is too good to muzzle just because we dont want a score first PG. There are 2 players on this roster who can create their own shot and hes one of them, let him score.

[jbk1234]

Yeah, at least from last night I just saw more of the same. Reluctance to shoot the 3 unless they are wiiiiiide open. Garland especially. Just pull the dam trigger man. Again, it just feel likes they have to try way too hard to score and too much passing. Its like everyone is trying to set the next guy up for a assist--just shoot it.

I mean I don't really want to adopt a Blazers offense, nor do I want Garland going full Kyrie. He's a good PG. A really good PG. I don't want him becoming a shoot first guy because those teams have pretty hard ceilings.

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He might need to be that guy until another SF/PF/C on this teams shows they can score 20+ per game and demand the defenses attention--we dont get that then this team might never score more than 100 points in a game this season.

Garlands ability to create his own looks is too good to muzzle just because we dont want a score first PG. There are 2 players on this roster who can create their own shot and hes one of them, let him score.

Sexton is already ridiculously high usage. If Garland starts firing up a bunch of shots as well, we're not going to be running any type of real offense. We didn't trade for Lauri for his defense. Mobley needs real touches if he's going to develop.

I'm reconciled with what our inability to add wing depth and size means in terms of our record this season. I'd rather they get use to playing the right way so that when the time comes to trade a lottery pick and/or prospect for a real plug and play guy at the wing, it pays dividends.

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[toooskies]

Ultimately if we're going to start Okoro/Mobley/Allen, our spacing is going to be terrible with the starting unit. If we need to play the rookie in the starting lineup, we need Allen or Okoro to come off the bench and start Markkanen or Cedi. Mobley/Okoro are 1 for 10 from behind the arc.

Also interesting that Lamar Stevens seemed to get the 10th man minutes against Atlanta, but that doesn't help our spacing at all.

[JonFromVA]

Ultimately if we're going to start Okoro/Mobley/Allen, our spacing is going to be terrible with the starting unit. If we need to play the rookie in the starting lineup, we need Allen or Okoro to come off the bench and start Markkanen or Cedi. Mobley/Okoro are 1 for 10 from behind the arc.

Also interesting that Lamar Stevens seemed to get the 10th man minutes against Atlanta, but that doesn't help our spacing at all.

popcornmachine doesn't bother tracking pre-season games, but I suspect their gameflows would have supported your observation. It looked to me too that Mobley at C opened things up in this game, but there's also the Rubio effect, and getting Collin off the floor (who was ball stopping AND being too careless).

JBB admitted he's just experimenting with lineups at this point.

[Harper4Ferry?]

Former Cavs Shannon Brown and Darius Miles made the news, as they were arrested in some conspiracy to commit fraud vs the insurance plan by submitting false claims.

[jbk1234]

Ultimately if we're going to start Okoro/Mobley/Allen, our spacing is going to be terrible with the starting unit. If we need to play the rookie in the starting lineup, we need Allen or Okoro to come off the bench and start Markkanen or Cedi. Mobley/Okoro are 1 for 10 from behind the arc.

Also interesting that Lamar Stevens seemed to get the 10th man minutes against Atlanta, but that doesn't help our spacing at all.

But this is the same problem we have in terms of depth with sending Sexton to the bench. Who are we starting in place of Okoro and Allen?

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