Where does LeBron's finals performance rank?

ninjamilk23 · Post #1 » by **ninjamilk23** » Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:06 pm

I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

BMatt07 · Post #2 » by **BMatt07** » Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:28 pm

It's way up there.

LeBron in the Finals this year lead all players on both teams in all five major statistical categories (points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks.)

For comparisons sake, that has NEVER happened in NBA playoff history. LeBron just became the first player to do it, while coming back from a 3-1 series deficit.

That'll most likely never happen again.

Dupp · Post #3 » by **Dupp** » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:35 pm

ninjamilk23 wrote:I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

There's a lebron thread on the PC board they'll know his PER there. Maybe 34?

Probably the best individual finals performances ever given the circumstances.

Post #4 » by **Rise Against** » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:10 am

BMatt07 wrote:It's way up there.

LeBron in the Finals this year lead all players on both teams in all five major statistical categories (points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks.)

For comparisons sake, that has NEVER happened in NBA playoff history. LeBron just became the first player to do it, while coming back from a 3-1 series deficit.

That'll most likely never happen again.

Not to mention the fact that it was against arguably the best regular season team ever with the unanimous MVP on their home floor. I am still in shock. Is this real life?

BismackonLebron · Post #5 » by **BismackonLebron** » Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:21 am

Lebron played like a man possessed. I've never seen a guy that locked in for an entire series, it was spectacular basketball to watch.

kenneth9265 · Post #6 » by **kenneth9265** » Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:32 pm

For an NBA player to lead all players on both teams in all five major statistical categories (points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks.) and being the first to do it, he would Have to be #1 in the Rankings. He is the best that I have ever seen in the Finals since Michel or Magic....

Pennebaker · Post #7 » by **Pennebaker** » Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:10 am

ninjamilk23 wrote:I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

I don't have a link, but according to Real GM stats LeBron's finals PER was 33.4. The highest of his career. As a gauge, the highest of Michael Jordan's career was 34.1.

But neither LeBron or Jordan can match the two best Finals PERs of Shaquille O'Neal. 38.5 and 36.6. (Shaq might be a little bit underrated.)

These are the top 4 Finals PER marks of the last 30 some odd years.

CavsChamps · Post #8 » by **CavsChamps** » Thu Jun 23, 2016 7:43 am

LeBron is UNREAL. #OneOfTheBest

And yes, Shaq has an incredible Finals peak. lol

yoyoboy · Post #9 » by **yoyoboy** » Sat Jun 25, 2016 3:47 pm

I'm biased so of course I'm going number one, but it's really not a stretch. The last 3 games of the Finals, with his back against the wall, he posted 36 ppg, 12 rpg, 10 apg, 3 spg, and 3 bpg, while shooting on 58.5% TS. That's in 3 straight elimination games, 2 on the road, against a 73-win team. And he managed to lead the Cavs to 3 straight wins...

Dupp · Post #10 » by **Dupp** » Sat Jun 25, 2016 8:26 pm

yoyoboy wrote:I'm biased so of course I'm going number one, but it's really not a stretch. The last 3 games of the Finals, with his back against the wall, he posted 36 ppg, 12 rpg, 10 apg, 3 spg, and 3 bpg, while shooting on 58.5% TS. That's in 3 straight elimination games, 2 on the road, against a 73-win team. And he managed to lead the Cavs to 3 straight wins...

Also in those three games he kept whoever he guarded to 21% shooting!(27% their average). I think given the competition and circumstance it's the best finals ever and certainly the best 3 game stretch ever.

boileralert · Post #11 » by **boileralert** » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:38 pm

ccameron · Post #12 » by **ccameron** » Wed Oct 5, 2016 8:54 pm

Pennebaker wrote:
ninjamilk23 wrote:I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

I don't have a link, but according to Real GM stats LeBron's finals PER was 33.4. The highest of his career. As a gauge, the highest of Michael Jordan's career was 34.1.

But neither LeBron or Jordan can match the two best Finals PERs of Shaquille O'Neal. 38.5 and 36.6. (Shaq might be a little bit underrated.)

These are the top 4 Finals PER marks of the last 30 some odd years.

You forgot Wade 2006 PER 33.8. Wade 2006 vs Lebron 2016 is a really interesting comparison. Both behind by 2 games (Cavs 1-3, Heat 0-2). Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder.

Wade: 34.7 points on 47%/7.8 rebounds/3.8 assists/2.7 steals /1.0 blocks (33.8 PER)
Lebron: 29.7 points on 49%/11.3 rebounds/8.9 assists/2.6 steals/2.3 blocks (33.4 PER)

Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder. Also, despite the fact that Wade's PER is slightly higher, I think Lebron's stats are more impressive, and leading in all the major statistical categories is absolutely crazy. But just as crazy is that the second leading scorer on the Heat in 2006 was Antoine Walker at 13.8 points (Shaq only averaged 13.7 points) -- Wade averaged 21 more points than the next leading scorer on his team, whereas Lebron had Kyrie playing out of his mind. So both Lebron and Wade shouldered a enormous loads in different ways.

I'm a huge Wade fan and I rank Wade's '06 finals as one of the greatest all time, but I'm not sure Lebron doesn't take this. It's definitely up there.

yoyoboy · Post #13 » by **yoyoboy** » Thu Oct 6, 2016 12:46 am

ccameron wrote:
Pennebaker wrote:
ninjamilk23 wrote:I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

I don't have a link, but according to Real GM stats LeBron's finals PER was 33.4. The highest of his career. As a gauge, the highest of Michael Jordan's career was 34.1.

But neither LeBron or Jordan can match the two best Finals PERs of Shaquille O'Neal. 38.5 and 36.6. (Shaq might be a little bit underrated.)

These are the top 4 Finals PER marks of the last 30 some odd years.

You forgot Wade 2006 PER 33.8. Wade 2006 vs Lebron 2016 is a really interesting comparison. Both behind by 2 games (Cavs 1-3, Heat 0-2). Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder.

Wade: 34.7 points on 47%/7.8 rebounds/3.8 assists/2.7 steals /1.0 blocks (33.8 PER)
Lebron: 29.7 points on 49%/11.3 rebounds/8.9 assists/2.6 steals/2.3 blocks (33.4 PER)

Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder. Also, despite the fact that Wade's PER is slightly higher, I think Lebron's stats are more impressive, and leading in all the major statistical categories is absolutely crazy. But just as crazy is that the second leading scorer on the Heat in 2006 was Antoine Walker at 13.8 points (Shaq only averaged 13.7 points) -- Wade averaged 21 more points than the next leading scorer on his team, whereas Lebron had Kyrie playing out of his mind. So both Lebron and Wade shouldered a enormous loads in different ways.

I'm a huge Wade fan and I rank Wade's '06 finals as one of the greatest all time, but I'm not sure Lebron doesn't take this. It's definitely up there.

PER also greatly undervalues defense, where LeBron had a CLEAR edge over Wade.

Post #14 » by **zimpy27** » Thu Oct 6, 2016 1:06 am

LeBron finals performance was the best ever. Only Duncan 03, Shaq 00 and Jordan 93 are close.

Facing elimination against the 73-win warriors, drags them to win 3 straight games (2 in GSW) and has the highest per game average in every category (including both teams).

Post #15 » by **NuggetsWY** » Mon Oct 17, 2016 2:46 am

I've been a serious fan of the NBA since 1967. One thing I know is that fans always think more highly of their players than everybody else. Cavs fans want to vote LeBron as the GOAT period (at least some do). As far as how did his finals performance rank? As an individual who is the do absolutely everything guy on offense and defense? I don't care what the PER is or any other statistic. Leading the team back from a 3-1 deficit against the previous world champions leaves no doubt in my mind that this was the #1 performance of all time. My personal previous favorite was a one-game rookie Magic Johnson playing center to win it all (his performance in that entire series was great).

Lest my introductory remark be misleading, while I am not certain LeBron is #1 GOAT but for now, I'm giving him a tie with that Chicago Bull guy. I'm not expecting him to stay there though. ;-)

Pennebaker · Post #16 » by **Pennebaker** » Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:10 am

ninjamilk23 wrote:I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

Forget about PER. That doesn't measure his will in the final 3 games. Cleveland was down 3-1, remember. They had to win 3 straight games against a defending champion 73 win team in order to claim the title. This is storybook stuff.

I rank it as the greatest effort I've ever personally seen, and I've seen all of Michael's, Larry's and Magic's.

Pennebaker · Post #17 » by **Pennebaker** » Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:13 am

NuggetsWY wrote:I've been a serious fan of the NBA since 1967. I don't care what the PER is or any other statistic. Leading the team back from a 3-1 deficit against the previous world champions leaves no doubt in my mind that this was the #1 performance of all time.

Ha! We basically said the same thing back to back. Good on ya!

Pennebaker · Post #18 » by **Pennebaker** » Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:58 am

ccameron wrote:
Pennebaker wrote:
ninjamilk23 wrote:I'm having trouble finding the most accurate finals PER. Can anyone provide an accurate link where LeBron's 2016 performance rank as far a PER.

I don't have a link, but according to Real GM stats LeBron's finals PER was 33.4. The highest of his career. As a gauge, the highest of Michael Jordan's career was 34.1.

But neither LeBron or Jordan can match the two best Finals PERs of Shaquille O'Neal. 38.5 and 36.6. (Shaq might be a little bit underrated.)

These are the top 4 Finals PER marks of the last 30 some odd years.

You forgot Wade 2006 PER 33.8. Wade 2006 vs Lebron 2016 is a really interesting comparison. Both behind by 2 games (Cavs 1-3, Heat 0-2). Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder.

Wade: 34.7 points on 47%/7.8 rebounds/3.8 assists/2.7 steals /1.0 blocks (33.8 PER)
Lebron: 29.7 points on 49%/11.3 rebounds/8.9 assists/2.6 steals/2.3 blocks (33.4 PER)

Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder. Also, despite the fact that Wade's PER is slightly higher, I think Lebron's stats are more impressive, and leading in all the major statistical categories is absolutely crazy. But just as crazy is that the second leading scorer on the Heat in 2006 was Antoine Walker at 13.8 points (Shaq only averaged 13.7 points) -- Wade averaged 21 more points than the next leading scorer on his team, whereas Lebron had Kyrie playing out of his mind. So both Lebron and Wade shouldered a enormous loads in different ways.

I'm a huge Wade fan and I rank Wade's '06 finals as one of the greatest all time, but I'm not sure Lebron doesn't take this. It's definitely up there.

Well according to Real GM Wade's Finals PER in 2005-2006 was 30.5. Where did you get 33.8?

One can give LeBron the nod simply because he had less hall-of-fame help. Tyron Lue is not Pat Riley. He didn't have Hall of Fame veterans like a Shaq or a Zo or The Glove to lean on. We don't even have to measure performance.

ccameron · Post #19 » by **ccameron** » Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:02 pm

Pennebaker wrote:
ccameron wrote:
Pennebaker wrote:
I don't have a link, but according to Real GM stats LeBron's finals PER was 33.4. The highest of his career. As a gauge, the highest of Michael Jordan's career was 34.1.

But neither LeBron or Jordan can match the two best Finals PERs of Shaquille O'Neal. 38.5 and 36.6. (Shaq might be a little bit underrated.)

These are the top 4 Finals PER marks of the last 30 some odd years.

You forgot Wade 2006 PER 33.8. Wade 2006 vs Lebron 2016 is a really interesting comparison. Both behind by 2 games (Cavs 1-3, Heat 0-2). Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder.

Wade: 34.7 points on 47%/7.8 rebounds/3.8 assists/2.7 steals /1.0 blocks (33.8 PER)
Lebron: 29.7 points on 49%/11.3 rebounds/8.9 assists/2.6 steals/2.3 blocks (33.4 PER)

Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder. Also, despite the fact that Wade's PER is slightly higher, I think Lebron's stats are more impressive, and leading in all the major statistical categories is absolutely crazy. But just as crazy is that the second leading scorer on the Heat in 2006 was Antoine Walker at 13.8 points (Shaq only averaged 13.7 points) -- Wade averaged 21 more points than the next leading scorer on his team, whereas Lebron had Kyrie playing out of his mind. So both Lebron and Wade shouldered a enormous loads in different ways.

I'm a huge Wade fan and I rank Wade's '06 finals as one of the greatest all time, but I'm not sure Lebron doesn't take this. It's definitely up there.

Well according to Real GM Wade's Finals PER in 2005-2006 was 30.5. Where did you get 33.8?

One can give LeBron the nod simply because he had less hall-of-fame help. Tyron Lue is not Pat Riley. He didn't have Hall of Fame veterans like a Shaq or a Zo or The Glove to lean on. We don't even have to measure performance.

I got it from here:

http://www.espn.com/nba/playoffs/2011/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=FinalsPerformances-1

Not disagreeing with your conclusion, but I think if we are talking about who had more help, the Hall of fame players on 2006 were well past their prime, and didn't really show up in the finals. Wade arguably had less help in that series than Lebron. Perfomance wise I can se Lebron getting the nod, but not based on the narrative of having less help.

Pennebaker · Post #20 » by **Pennebaker** » Fri Nov 18, 2016 8:41 am

ccameron wrote:
Pennebaker wrote:
ccameron wrote:
You forgot Wade 2006 PER 33.8. Wade 2006 vs Lebron 2016 is a really interesting comparison. Both behind by 2 games (Cavs 1-3, Heat 0-2). Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder.

Wade: 34.7 points on 47%/7.8 rebounds/3.8 assists/2.7 steals /1.0 blocks (33.8 PER)
Lebron: 29.7 points on 49%/11.3 rebounds/8.9 assists/2.6 steals/2.3 blocks (33.4 PER)

Being down 0-2 is daunting, but facing elimination is harder. Also, despite the fact that Wade's PER is slightly higher, I think Lebron's stats are more impressive, and leading in all the major statistical categories is absolutely crazy. But just as crazy is that the second leading scorer on the Heat in 2006 was Antoine Walker at 13.8 points (Shaq only averaged 13.7 points) -- Wade averaged 21 more points than the next leading scorer on his team, whereas Lebron had Kyrie playing out of his mind. So both Lebron and Wade shouldered a enormous loads in different ways.

I'm a huge Wade fan and I rank Wade's '06 finals as one of the greatest all time, but I'm not sure Lebron doesn't take this. It's definitely up there.

Well according to Real GM Wade's Finals PER in 2005-2006 was 30.5. Where did you get 33.8?

One can give LeBron the nod simply because he had less hall-of-fame help. Tyron Lue is not Pat Riley. He didn't have Hall of Fame veterans like a Shaq or a Zo or The Glove to lean on. We don't even have to measure performance.

I got it from here:

http://www.espn.com/nba/playoffs/2011/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=FinalsPerformances-1

Not disagreeing with your conclusion, but I think if we are talking about who had more help, the Hall of fame players on 2006 were well past their prime, and didn't really show up in the finals. Wade arguably had less help in that series than Lebron. Perfomance wise I can se Lebron getting the nod, but not based on the narrative of having less help.

You forget that Shaquille O'neal was still good enough in 2006 to be All-NBA First Team. He was the only member of the Miami Heat to be on the First Team that year. Wade was All-NBA Second Team.

But LeBron was the only Cavalier on ANY All-NBA team last year... 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Kyrie and Love didn't make the cut.

So I'm confident in disputing your claim about Wade's help. LeBron didn't have All-NBA First Team help. Or 2nd team. Or 3rd team. Period. (this argument also works in favor of LeBron vs Shaq)

And the problem with using a Hollinger article from 2011, of course, is that it isn't calculating LeBron's 2016 performance at all. I don't know if people know this, but each site calculates PER slightly differently. But if RealGM ranks LeBron at 33.4 and Wade at 30.5, then I'd hazard to guess that 2011 Hollinger would've had Wade at 33.8 and LeBron at 36.7, or something like that.