ImageImageImage

Trade Ideas (Part III)

Moderator: jbk1234

jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1541 » by jbk1234 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:58 am

JonFromVA wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Yep, that's what I've read, but it could work if there was another team involved.

Boston gets Drummond:
3rd team gets: some of all of Boston's TPE
Cavs get: player earning <= TPE from 3rd team and other filler from Boston if necessary


That's not going to work. Boston still needs to match which means they still need to send out $22M in salary. If you're suggesting that Boston also go way into the tax by absorbing roughly that amount in contracts from a third team, and then creating a TPE of that size for the Cavs, I'm not seeing the incentive on Boston's part.


They can send out some or all of their TPE and whatever other filler they want to smooth the books. In a 3-way deal, the aggregate incoming/outgoing just has to work out. The 3rd team ends up with a TPE.


Maybe this is just getting wires crossed in how we're communicating but you can't actually trade a TPE. You can use a TPE by taking on even more salary. But the Celtics would have to send out $23M to trade for Drummond. Some of that $23M could got a third team, who in turn, could send back equal contracts that fit into Boston's TPE, but the initial obstacle of Boston having $23M in contracts it's okay with sending out remains.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1542 » by Stillwater » Thu Feb 18, 2021 1:15 am

Boston aint getting him unless the buyout becomes the only option
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
Harper4Ferry?
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,991
And1: 40
Joined: Jun 29, 2002

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1543 » by Harper4Ferry? » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:10 am

The league is most certainly going to flag any Boston TPE for Drummond trade. It's not big enough to take him back, and it would be clear circumvention if they traded for someone(Porter, DeRozan, Hield, Aldridge, etc) and immediately spun him off to us.


That was ESPN Pelton speculation, anyways.
"Boston would have to get there by acquiring a player making a similar salary (Otto Porter Jr. of the Chicago Bulls would work) using the exception and then flipping him for Drummond -- a move the NBA might not be inclined to allow, depending on how quickly the two trades occurred in sequence."
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1544 » by jbk1234 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:26 am

Harper4Ferry? wrote:The league is most certainly going to flag any Boston TPE for Drummond trade. It's not big enough to take him back, and it would be clear circumvention if they traded for someone(Porter, DeRozan, Hield, Aldridge, etc) and immediately spun him off to us.


That was ESPN Pelton speculation, anyways.
"Boston would have to get there by acquiring a player making a similar salary (Otto Porter Jr. of the Chicago Bulls would work) using the exception and then flipping him for Drummond -- a move the NBA might not be inclined to allow, depending on how quickly the two trades occurred in sequence."
I'd take OPJ and just cut the Celtics out.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
JonFromVA
Head Coach
Posts: 7,113
And1: 2,175
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1545 » by JonFromVA » Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:06 pm

Harper4Ferry? wrote:The league is most certainly going to flag any Boston TPE for Drummond trade. It's not big enough to take him back, and it would be clear circumvention if they traded for someone(Porter, DeRozan, Hield, Aldridge, etc) and immediately spun him off to us.


That was ESPN Pelton speculation, anyways.
"Boston would have to get there by acquiring a player making a similar salary (Otto Porter Jr. of the Chicago Bulls would work) using the exception and then flipping him for Drummond -- a move the NBA might not be inclined to allow, depending on how quickly the two trades occurred in sequence."


I'm not sure why that would be considered circumvention. A team can look at a trade as consecutive 2-way deals, while another team involved can look at it as a 3-way. And the Celtics might need to be involved if the Bulls don't want Drummond, but something else in the deal for Porter Jr (given he's an expiring too).
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1546 » by Stillwater » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:44 pm

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7400611
so moving away from the Dre talk I have a Ball to CLE with Diengs expiring, Love to Memphis & Brooks to NOP with Utah 21 first owned by Mem to NOP as a sweetener even though its like 25-30 range
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1547 » by jbk1234 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:42 am

Stillwater wrote:https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7400611
so moving away from the Dre talk I have a Ball to CLE with Diengs expiring, Love to Memphis & Brooks to NOP with Utah 21 first owned by Mem to NOP as a sweetener even though its like 25-30 range
Memphis blocks the Cavs number after this. Plus, we've been legitimately starved of spacing since Love went down. I think Ball is very underrated league wide because people hate dealing with Klutch. We should offer seconds and expiring filler. Alternatively, Griffin drafted Cedi and he's on a very team friendly deal if they're looking to play their young guards.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1548 » by Stillwater » Fri Feb 19, 2021 2:31 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7400611
so moving away from the Dre talk I have a Ball to CLE with Diengs expiring, Love to Memphis & Brooks to NOP with Utah 21 first owned by Mem to NOP as a sweetener even though its like 25-30 range
Memphis blocks the Cavs number after this. Plus, we've been legitimately starved of spacing since Love went down. I think Ball is very underrated league wide because people hate dealing with Klutch. We should offer seconds and expiring filler. Alternatively, Griffin drafted Cedi and he's on a very team friendly deal if they're looking to play their young guards.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Memphis would definitely consider trading an expiring abd d books for love wtf lol
If anything they might have to throw in the late first from utah who currently has the best record in the NBA... but now that i see ball signed with klutch in Sept i would not want him anywhere near this roster. They need to trade all klutch sports clients and move away from overpriced pie filling
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1549 » by jbk1234 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 3:29 pm

Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7400611
so moving away from the Dre talk I have a Ball to CLE with Diengs expiring, Love to Memphis & Brooks to NOP with Utah 21 first owned by Mem to NOP as a sweetener even though its like 25-30 range
Memphis blocks the Cavs number after this. Plus, we've been legitimately starved of spacing since Love went down. I think Ball is very underrated league wide because people hate dealing with Klutch. We should offer seconds and expiring filler. Alternatively, Griffin drafted Cedi and he's on a very team friendly deal if they're looking to play their young guards.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Memphis would definitely consider trading an expiring abd d books for love wtf lol
If anything they might have to throw in the late first from utah who currently has the best record in the NBA... but now that i see ball signed with klutch in Sept i would not want him anywhere near this roster. They need to trade all klutch sports clients and move away from overpriced pie filling


Kevin Love doesn't have positive trade value right now. He won't have positive trade value this summer either unless he gets on the court, plays well, and plays in at least 80% of the remaining games.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1550 » by Stillwater » Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:40 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Memphis blocks the Cavs number after this. Plus, we've been legitimately starved of spacing since Love went down. I think Ball is very underrated league wide because people hate dealing with Klutch. We should offer seconds and expiring filler. Alternatively, Griffin drafted Cedi and he's on a very team friendly deal if they're looking to play their young guards.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Memphis would definitely consider trading an expiring abd d books for love wtf lol
If anything they might have to throw in the late first from utah who currently has the best record in the NBA... but now that i see ball signed with klutch in Sept i would not want him anywhere near this roster. They need to trade all klutch sports clients and move away from overpriced pie filling


Kevin Love doesn't have positive trade value right now. He won't have positive trade value this summer either unless he gets on the court, plays well, and plays in at least 80% of the remaining games.

I disagree, as it has been out of an abundance of caution on his part and likely preservation and prevention on the part of the org him being out basically since week one of the season for a calf strain...so he probably has more trade value as a returning to the court player in the next month fully healthy than one who has played all season through injury like Sexton and Garland are doing and had been pushing himself to be injured again on a non contender.
I think if he can come back in the next couple games play well and attract some interest , then he should be moved. I know it is not good for this team as constructed to not have someone like him out there, but he is not going to be here anyway whenever they actually figure out who is worth building with.
But after all that Ball signing with Klutch kills my interest so whatever the case may be with KLoves current trade value, all Klutch clients beyond their rookie deals are overpaid imo and team building killers
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1551 » by jbk1234 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:53 pm

Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Memphis would definitely consider trading an expiring abd d books for love wtf lol
If anything they might have to throw in the late first from utah who currently has the best record in the NBA... but now that i see ball signed with klutch in Sept i would not want him anywhere near this roster. They need to trade all klutch sports clients and move away from overpriced pie filling


Kevin Love doesn't have positive trade value right now. He won't have positive trade value this summer either unless he gets on the court, plays well, and plays in at least 80% of the remaining games.

I disagree, as it has been out of an abundance of caution on his part and likely preservation and prevention on the part of the org him being out basically since week one of the season for a calf strain...so he probably has more trade value as a returning to the court player in the next month fully healthy than one who has played all season through injury like Sexton and Garland are doing and had been pushing himself to be injured again on a non contender.
I think if he can come back in the next couple games play well and attract some interest , then he should be moved. I know it is not good for this team as constructed to not have someone like him out there, but he is not going to be here anyway whenever they actually figure out who is worth building with.
But after all that Ball signing with Klutch kills my interest so whatever the case may be with KLoves current trade value, all Klutch clients beyond their rookie deals are overpaid imo and team building killers


Setting aside the Ball/Klutch thing, Kevin Love does not currently have positive trade value. It's not rational to pretend that he does. He's simply missed too many games over the last four years for another team to value him as a $30M player for the remainder of this season and two more after this one. He's going to have to get on the court and play well in at least 80% of the remaining games for there even to be a market for him that doesn't involve the Cavs attaching at least one first round pick.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1552 » by Stillwater » Fri Feb 19, 2021 8:04 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Kevin Love doesn't have positive trade value right now. He won't have positive trade value this summer either unless he gets on the court, plays well, and plays in at least 80% of the remaining games.

I disagree, as it has been out of an abundance of caution on his part and likely preservation and prevention on the part of the org him being out basically since week one of the season for a calf strain...so he probably has more trade value as a returning to the court player in the next month fully healthy than one who has played all season through injury like Sexton and Garland are doing and had been pushing himself to be injured again on a non contender.
I think if he can come back in the next couple games play well and attract some interest , then he should be moved. I know it is not good for this team as constructed to not have someone like him out there, but he is not going to be here anyway whenever they actually figure out who is worth building with.
But after all that Ball signing with Klutch kills my interest so whatever the case may be with KLoves current trade value, all Klutch clients beyond their rookie deals are overpaid imo and team building killers


Setting aside the Ball/Klutch thing, Kevin Love does not currently have positive trade value. It's not rational to pretend that he does. He's simply missed too many games over the last four years for another team to value him as a $30M player for the remainder of this season and two more after this one. He's going to have to get on the court and play well in at least 80% of the remaining games for there even to be a market for him that doesn't involve the Cavs attaching at least one first round pick.

yeah the expiring of Dieng and a overpaid starter is not positive value either beyond cap savings as outgoing in exchange for what KLove brings to the Griz. If you think KLove is going to have any more value than he does simply by being older I cant understand that.
Nobody needs to see him play to know what he brings. anyone can see his injuries have been minor and not things he could not have played through had the org wanted him too
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1553 » by jbk1234 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 8:06 pm

Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:I disagree, as it has been out of an abundance of caution on his part and likely preservation and prevention on the part of the org him being out basically since week one of the season for a calf strain...so he probably has more trade value as a returning to the court player in the next month fully healthy than one who has played all season through injury like Sexton and Garland are doing and had been pushing himself to be injured again on a non contender.
I think if he can come back in the next couple games play well and attract some interest , then he should be moved. I know it is not good for this team as constructed to not have someone like him out there, but he is not going to be here anyway whenever they actually figure out who is worth building with.
But after all that Ball signing with Klutch kills my interest so whatever the case may be with KLoves current trade value, all Klutch clients beyond their rookie deals are overpaid imo and team building killers


Setting aside the Ball/Klutch thing, Kevin Love does not currently have positive trade value. It's not rational to pretend that he does. He's simply missed too many games over the last four years for another team to value him as a $30M player for the remainder of this season and two more after this one. He's going to have to get on the court and play well in at least 80% of the remaining games for there even to be a market for him that doesn't involve the Cavs attaching at least one first round pick.

yeah the expiring of Dieng and a overpaid starter is not positive value either beyond cap savings as outgoing in exchange for what KLove brings to the Griz. If you think KLove is going to have any more value than he does simply by being older I cant understand that.
Nobody needs to see him play to know what he brings


Even if I allow myself to venture over into some fantasy land where Love currently has neutral trade value, the Grizzlies are the deepest team in the NBA at Love's position. But if you don't trust me on this, put it up on the T&T board and see how it goes.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1554 » by Stillwater » Fri Feb 19, 2021 8:14 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Setting aside the Ball/Klutch thing, Kevin Love does not currently have positive trade value. It's not rational to pretend that he does. He's simply missed too many games over the last four years for another team to value him as a $30M player for the remainder of this season and two more after this one. He's going to have to get on the court and play well in at least 80% of the remaining games for there even to be a market for him that doesn't involve the Cavs attaching at least one first round pick.

yeah the expiring of Dieng and a overpaid starter is not positive value either beyond cap savings as outgoing in exchange for what KLove brings to the Griz. If you think KLove is going to have any more value than he does simply by being older I cant understand that.
Nobody needs to see him play to know what he brings


Even if I allow myself to venture over into some fantasy land where Love currently has neutral trade value, the Grizzlies are the deepest team in the NBA at Love's position. But if you don't trust me on this, put it up on the T&T board and see how it goes.

they are? how so? Anderson I guess but he is more of a point forward at the 3, Clarke is a small ball 5 , JJJ is versatile enough to play either forward position and center, I guess if you are counting Jontay and Tillman I get it, but they are not NBA players yet.
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1555 » by Stillwater » Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:45 pm

Be interested to see if KPJ goes off against the Charge next friday. Its going to be televised too.
Personally hope Altman watches it if he does.. still cant let it go how good this kid is going to be and how easily they
let him go i dont even care how much sht he has done off the court to justify it, it still aint justifiable to me
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1556 » by jbk1234 » Sat Feb 20, 2021 1:03 pm

Stillwater wrote:Be interested to see if KPJ goes off against the Charge next friday. Its going to be televised too.
Personally hope Altman watches it if he does.. still cant let it go how good this kid is going to be and how easily they
let him go i dont even care how much sht he has done off the court to justify it, it still aint justifiable to me
We're done with that subject.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1557 » by Stillwater » Sat Feb 20, 2021 1:52 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Be interested to see if KPJ goes off against the Charge next friday. Its going to be televised too.
Personally hope Altman watches it if he does.. still cant let it go how good this kid is going to be and how easily they
let him go i dont even care how much sht he has done off the court to justify it, it still aint justifiable to me
We're done with that subject.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Ok but why it isnt a subject worth discussing on here is beyond comprehension when the cavs org that made the decision are the same people still making decisions about this team. Its not even about what could have been but just how many more seemingly ward cleverish choices Altman is prepared to make in the name of building a culture. Makes me wonder what kind of a man is he really that he cant forgive or ask for it himself.
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
jbk1234
Forum Mod - Cavs
Forum Mod - Cavs
Posts: 41,407
And1: 23,842
Joined: Dec 22, 2010
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1558 » by jbk1234 » Sat Feb 20, 2021 6:36 pm

Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Be interested to see if KPJ goes off against the Charge next friday. Its going to be televised too.
Personally hope Altman watches it if he does.. still cant let it go how good this kid is going to be and how easily they
let him go i dont even care how much sht he has done off the court to justify it, it still aint justifiable to me
We're done with that subject.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Ok but why it isnt a subject worth discussing on here is beyond comprehension when the cavs org that made the decision are the same people still making decisions about this team. Its not even about what could have been but just how many more seemingly ward cleverish choices Altman is prepared to make in the name of building a culture. Makes me wonder what kind of a man is he really that he cant forgive or ask for it himself.
Because you're not capable of discussing it rationally, you put 100% of the blame on the organization, and you even go down conspiracy roads where things have been publicly reported aren't true, while things that haven't been reported at all *probably* happened.

For what I would think are obvious reasons, this angers nearly every Cavs fan who visits the forum and then I end up having to lock threads before the conversation ends up with people getting suspended.

Moderating is an unpaid position and this is the T&T thread.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
Stillwater
RealGM
Posts: 14,582
And1: 3,526
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1559 » by Stillwater » Sat Feb 20, 2021 8:30 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:We're done with that subject.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Ok but why it isnt a subject worth discussing on here is beyond comprehension when the cavs org that made the decision are the same people still making decisions about this team. Its not even about what could have been but just how many more seemingly ward cleverish choices Altman is prepared to make in the name of building a culture. Makes me wonder what kind of a man is he really that he cant forgive or ask for it himself.
Because you're not capable of discussing it rationally, you put 100% of the blame on the organization, and you even go down conspiracy roads where things have been publicly reported aren't true, while things that haven't been reported at all *probably* happened.

For what I would think are obvious reasons, this angers nearly every Cavs fan who visits the forum and then I end up having to lock threads before the conversation ends up with people getting suspended.

Moderating is an unpaid position and this is the T&T thread.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

got it. I understand that completely , fyi not everything the org is telling us likely is true if it is, I would eat crow but there is no accountability for them only for the player they got rid of. I accept his actions had everything to do with it, I do not accept those actions were not justifiable by him given the circumstances. If people want to trust the org that fine, I dont trust any large corps
SUNDOWN BRINGS A WELCOME CHANGE TO EVERYTHING THAT'S HIDING

Fischella wrote "There are easily 40-50 dudes with higher ceilings than Juzang in this class"
AdonalFoyle4Prez
Starter
Posts: 2,489
And1: 245
Joined: Jul 14, 2006

Re: Trade Ideas (Part III) 

Post#1560 » by AdonalFoyle4Prez » Tue Mar 9, 2021 8:56 pm

Would you guys do a Wiseman + Oubre (Expiring) for Andre Drummond?

Return to Cleveland Cavaliers