Kyrie asked to be traded (UPDATED)

[gflem]

There should be an easy solution that work's for everybody here. Why not just replace Thomas with Tatum and the Laker's pick?

Celtic fans head explode when they read your post. Waaaaaay too much imo, and I am a Cavs fan. I would happily take it but it aint happening. One or the other is too much according to Celtic fans. We will know in a few days one way or the other unless both teams agree to extend the deadline for okaying the deal. IF that happens then we know there will likely be more to the deal than originally agreed upon.

[illmatic24]

There should be an easy solution that work's for everybody here. Why not just replace Thomas with Tatum and the Laker's pick?

Because there's no reason Boston would ever do that. You only have four posts and you might already be the worst poster I've ever seen.

This whole thing is kind of silly. I really doubt IT misses half the season. Nobody was predicting that before this trade happened. Just add in another Boston first or the Clippers first and call it a deal. If the Cavs need more than that, Boston should and will walk away and simply deal with the consequences. Which probably won't be that bad. It's not like Thomas is going to sit out the season and sulk all year long in a contract year. Crowder might but that's not unusual behavior for him.

[Stillwater]

There should be an easy solution that work's for everybody here. Why not just replace Thomas with Tatum and the Laker's pick?

Because there's no reason Boston would ever do that. You only have four posts and you might already be the worst poster I've ever seen.

This whole thing is kind of silly. I really doubt IT misses half the season. Nobody was predicting that before this trade happened. Just add in another Boston first or the Clippers first and call it a deal. If the Cavs need more than that, Boston should and will walk away and simply deal with the consequences. Which probably won't be that bad. It's not like Thomas is going to sit out the season and sulk all year long in a contract year. Crowder might but that's not unusual behavior for him.

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

[Jakeopp]

If IT4 will miss the majority of the season needing surgery they will either not come to an agreement , or Boston will give up lakers pick call it deal or to lesser extent if they value that pick that much give up Tatum or Brown along with Rozier and take back Zizic & a salary dump.
But if IT4 can play in 120 days or something as the outside timeline without surgery maybe we take back Rozier for Felder and they give us a future early 2nd or something much more simple.
My main concern is if because the surgery was not done earlier,has his condition worsened enough (maybe since the Boston doctors exams and the info that was initially reported in the trade proposal )so that he may never return to form,even with the surgery. if so, he is of little value and cannot be included in this trade.Then they likely void the deal and move on or if Ainge is that motivated to get KI knowing he would be taking back a digruntled injured worse than he thought pg so he sends out 1 of his 2 sf not named Hayward and lives with & still aslo includes Rozier and a filler

The Lakers pick has nearly as much value as the Nets pick. It's not on the table, and neither are Brown or Tatum. Keep dreaming though.

[Stillwater]

If IT4 will miss the majority of the season needing surgery they will either not come to an agreement , or Boston will give up lakers pick call it deal or to lesser extent if they value that pick that much give up Tatum or Brown along with Rozier and take back Zizic & a salary dump.
But if IT4 can play in 120 days or something as the outside timeline without surgery maybe we take back Rozier for Felder and they give us a future early 2nd or something much more simple.
My main concern is if because the surgery was not done earlier,has his condition worsened enough (maybe since the Boston doctors exams and the info that was initially reported in the trade proposal )so that he may never return to form,even with the surgery. if so, he is of little value and cannot be included in this trade.Then they likely void the deal and move on or if Ainge is that motivated to get KI knowing he would be taking back a digruntled injured worse than he thought pg so he sends out 1 of his 2 sf not named Hayward and lives with & still aslo includes Rozier and a filler

The Lakers pick has nearly as much value as the Nets pick. It's not on the table, and neither are Brown or Tatum. Keep dreaming though.

you have no idea how bad Ainge wants Ki

[Patsfan1081]

There should be an easy solution that work's for everybody here. Why not just replace Thomas with Tatum and the Laker's pick?

Because there's no reason Boston would ever do that. You only have four posts and you might already be the worst poster I've ever seen.

This whole thing is kind of silly. I really doubt IT misses half the season. Nobody was predicting that before this trade happened. Just add in another Boston first or the Clippers first and call it a deal. If the Cavs need more than that, Boston should and will walk away and simply deal with the consequences. Which probably won't be that bad. It's not like Thomas is going to sit out the season and sulk all year long in a contract year. Crowder might but that's not unusual behavior for him.

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

Thomas is playing for his next contract, prob why he didn't want to have surgery. If the trade is negated then he has no choice then to play out his last year in Boston the best he can. He's not done though, there was the question wether or not he'd be ready to start the year, not miss half the season. That being said does Boston offer up the Nets pick if Thomas was perfectly healthy? Most likely not the difference between Thomas and Irving isn't a top five pick, Crowder, and a decent center prospect. At the most Boston adds next years Clippers pick or Rozier, they're not doing a deal without Thomas in it.

[Stillwater]

Because there's no reason Boston would ever do that. You only have four posts and you might already be the worst poster I've ever seen.

This whole thing is kind of silly. I really doubt IT misses half the season. Nobody was predicting that before this trade happened. Just add in another Boston first or the Clippers first and call it a deal. If the Cavs need more than that, Boston should and will walk away and simply deal with the consequences. Which probably won't be that bad. It's not like Thomas is going to sit out the season and sulk all year long in a contract year. Crowder might but that's not unusual behavior for him.

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

Thomas is playing for his next contract, prob why he didn't want to have surgery. If the trade is negated then he has no choice then to play out his last year in Boston the best he can. He's not done though, there was the question wether or not he'd be ready to start the year, not miss half the season. That being said does Boston offer up the Nets pick if Thomas was perfectly healthy? Most likely not the difference between Thomas and Irving isn't a top five pick, Crowder, and a decent center prospect. At the most Boston adds next years Clippers pick or Rozier, they're not doing a deal without Thomas in it.

If the Cavs are just trying to milk a 2nd rounder because IT won't be ready by training camp than ok maybe IT4 will swallow his pride in a contract yr and play for you again whenever that is that he can eventually return to the court,
But the fact is they are apparently wanting Tatum or Brown now which practically proves to me that IT4 has to have surgery and cannot be included in this deal. They would not be asking for those 2 without that being the case.

[Patsfan1081]

If IT4 will miss the majority of the season needing surgery they will either not come to an agreement , or Boston will give up lakers pick call it deal or to lesser extent if they value that pick that much give up Tatum or Brown along with Rozier and take back Zizic & a salary dump.
But if IT4 can play in 120 days or something as the outside timeline without surgery maybe we take back Rozier for Felder and they give us a future early 2nd or something much more simple.
My main concern is if because the surgery was not done earlier,has his condition worsened enough (maybe since the Boston doctors exams and the info that was initially reported in the trade proposal )so that he may never return to form,even with the surgery. if so, he is of little value and cannot be included in this trade.Then they likely void the deal and move on or if Ainge is that motivated to get KI knowing he would be taking back a digruntled injured worse than he thought pg so he sends out 1 of his 2 sf not named Hayward and lives with & still aslo includes Rozier and a filler

If I'm Ainge I walk away. The Nets pick is the best pick you will get plus you get Crowder and Zizic. Your free to find a better deal elsewhere if you can. It's only going to get worse for you the longer you wait

Yeah Boston can't walk away,the decision is up to Cleveland only.
Granted if Ainge plays hardball and actually did think he gave accurate information regarding IT4's condition and that's why the trade included a lottery pick, and refuses to give up more even with new info on IT4's timeline, then The Cavs will void the deal if it's true IT4 will miss most if not all of the season.

They won't likely get a high lottery pick unless they deal with Phoenix (who has a pg) or ATL (who has a pg). But there are plenty of teams such as Milwaukee, Dallas etc that we could get a deal we like who have assets & players that they would consider moving if KI is their missing piece.
I think Boston misrepresented how bad IT4 was.
If it turns out IT4's timeline is just pushed back without surgery but the med examiners determined he will heal fine in time just longer than Boston docs projected for the 2nd half of the season, the Cavs probably are just asking for another asset in picks so they can combine the pick(s) with a salary dump to get an upgrade to Rose.
Not that unreasonable to ask, whether they get it or not is another story.
The Cavs got a solid 3 & D player in Crowder and a potential #1 pick (could be as low as 6) but still valuable. & they got an under rated young center.
But the entire deal was hinged on IT4 being able to compete with the Cav's for a championship even if he wasn't the "prize" of the trade , so you almost have to believe they would not have done this deal knowing IT4 was not going to be ready until after the all star break or something similar and want compensation for the misrepresentation by Ainge.
The other possibility here is IT4 is much worse now than when Boston examined him(aggravated it further possibly trying to work out or something) and so it brings an entire new set of circumstances to any deal with Boston.
Boston does not want to lose KI and bring back an injured player who is worse than they thought if that proves to be true, so I think they would be wise to add a couple 2nd rounders and Rozier at minimum taking back somebody like Jefferson as a veteran presence for his young core.
I don't believe the Cavs would deny that,unless IT4 will need surgery to recover to full strength and be available to them only if he were to sign with them in fa which would never had been agreed a pon by Cleveland had they known that up front even with as much other assets as they got in return.

Where are people reading that Thomas could miss most if not all the season? That hasn't been reported anywhere. The issue with Thomas's hip is he didn't want to get surgery, so there's the possibilities of issues popping up down the line. Even if he changes his mind and decides on surgery now the timeline for rehab wouldn't be most of the season. As for another trade, what made Boston appealing is the had other teams draft picks, add Kyrie to Pheonix or Atlanta and you're adding to their win total also. Middleton and Brogdan are both pretty intriguing bot neither will be stars, while the Nets pick isn't a sure thing there could be a couple of star player coming out of the draft, especially now that Bagley reclassified.

[Patsfan1081]

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

Thomas is playing for his next contract, prob why he didn't want to have surgery. If the trade is negated then he has no choice then to play out his last year in Boston the best he can. He's not done though, there was the question wether or not he'd be ready to start the year, not miss half the season. That being said does Boston offer up the Nets pick if Thomas was perfectly healthy? Most likely not the difference between Thomas and Irving isn't a top five pick, Crowder, and a decent center prospect. At the most Boston adds next years Clippers pick or Rozier, they're not doing a deal without Thomas in it.

If the Cavs are just trying to milk a 2nd rounder because IT won't be ready by training camp than ok maybe IT4 will swallow his pride in a contract yr and play for you again whenever that is that he can eventually return to the court,
But the fact is they are apparently wanting Tatum or Brown now which practically proves to me that IT4 has to have surgery and cannot be included in this deal. They would not be asking for those 2 without that being the case.

They were asking for those two befor the trade happen , all the rumors going around had them interested in Porzingis, Tatum, or Jackson, but teams deemed them untoucheable. Also Thomas was suggested by doctors to have surgery two months ago but he decided on letting the injury heal naturally. Surgery isn't the only option, from what I've read Thomas just isn't at the point where he can start jogging yet and Cavs management thought he was farther along in his rehab. If there was even a hint that Thomas would miss the whole season I guarentee the trade would have been already nixed by now.

[Stillwater]

If I'm Ainge I walk away. The Nets pick is the best pick you will get plus you get Crowder and Zizic. Your free to find a better deal elsewhere if you can. It's only going to get worse for you the longer you wait

Yeah Boston can't walk away,the decision is up to Cleveland only.
Granted if Ainge plays hardball and actually did think he gave accurate information regarding IT4's condition and that's why the trade included a lottery pick, and refuses to give up more even with new info on IT4's timeline, then The Cavs will void the deal if it's true IT4 will miss most if not all of the season.

They won't likely get a high lottery pick unless they deal with Phoenix (who has a pg) or ATL (who has a pg). But there are plenty of teams such as Milwaukee, Dallas etc that we could get a deal we like who have assets & players that they would consider moving if KI is their missing piece.
I think Boston misrepresented how bad IT4 was.
If it turns out IT4's timeline is just pushed back without surgery but the med examiners determined he will heal fine in time just longer than Boston docs projected for the 2nd half of the season, the Cavs probably are just asking for another asset in picks so they can combine the pick(s) with a salary dump to get an upgrade to Rose.
Not that unreasonable to ask, whether they get it or not is another story.
The Cavs got a solid 3 & D player in Crowder and a potential #1 pick (could be as low as 6) but still valuable. & they got an under rated young center.
But the entire deal was hinged on IT4 being able to compete with the Cav's for a championship even if he wasn't the "prize" of the trade , so you almost have to believe they would not have done this deal knowing IT4 was not going to be ready until after the all star break or something similar and want compensation for the misrepresentation by Ainge.
The other possibility here is IT4 is much worse now than when Boston examined him(aggravated it further possibly trying to work out or something) and so it brings an entire new set of circumstances to any deal with Boston.
Boston does not want to lose KI and bring back an injured player who is worse than they thought if that proves to be true, so I think they would be wise to add a couple 2nd rounders and Rozier at minimum taking back somebody like Jefferson as a veteran presence for his young core.
I don't believe the Cavs would deny that,unless IT4 will need surgery to recover to full strength and be available to them only if he were to sign with them in fa which would never had been agreed a pon by Cleveland had they known that up front even with as much other assets as they got in return.

Where are people reading that Thomas could miss most if not all the season? That hasn't been reported anywhere. The issue with Thomas's hip is he didn't want to get surgery, so there's the possibilities of issues popping up down the line. Even if he changes his mind and decides on surgery now the timeline for rehab wouldn't be most of the season. As for another trade, what made Boston appealing is the had other teams draft picks, add Kyrie to Pheonix or Atlanta and you're adding to their win total also. Middleton and Brogdan are both pretty intriguing bot neither will be stars, while the Nets pick isn't a sure thing there could be a couple of star player coming out of the draft, especially now that Bagley reclassified.

9 months to full recovery on the outside takes him out until the finals, not exactly a good value trade for Cleveland and too much risk if in fact they did this deal on the premise he was recovering well without surgery and would be ready by training camp or soon after.
There’s nothing “minimally invasive” about hip arthroscopy surgery. The tools and devices used to get into the joint can cause severe and permanent injury to the ligaments, muscles, and fascia around the joint. Although some patients recover enough to return to "normal" activities after 3 months, that does not apply to running and jumping,cutting and landing from a jump etc and most patients require 6-7 months of physical therapy minimum to return to sports related activities .
No matter how you slice it if we are eating his contract Boston has to give us a significant add on,otherwise Ainge's only real option is probably to reconcile with IT4 hope he agrees and maybe they will have him by the playoffs.
I don't see any reconciliation given how he was gut punched in a deal for a player of the same position, so not many options for Boston here.

[jbk1234]

Thomas is playing for his next contract, prob why he didn't want to have surgery. If the trade is negated then he has no choice then to play out his last year in Boston the best he can. He's not done though, there was the question wether or not he'd be ready to start the year, not miss half the season. That being said does Boston offer up the Nets pick if Thomas was perfectly healthy? Most likely not the difference between Thomas and Irving isn't a top five pick, Crowder, and a decent center prospect. At the most Boston adds next years Clippers pick or Rozier, they're not doing a deal without Thomas in it.

If the Cavs are just trying to milk a 2nd rounder because IT won't be ready by training camp than ok maybe IT4 will swallow his pride in a contract yr and play for you again whenever that is that he can eventually return to the court,
But the fact is they are apparently wanting Tatum or Brown now which practically proves to me that IT4 has to have surgery and cannot be included in this deal. They would not be asking for those 2 without that being the case.

They were asking for those two befor the trade happen , all the rumors going around had them interested in Porzingis, Tatum, or Jackson, but teams deemed them untoucheable. Also Thomas was suggested by doctors to have surgery two months ago but he decided on letting the injury heal naturally. Surgery isn't the only option, from what I've read Thomas just isn't at the point where he can start jogging yet and Cavs management thought he was farther along in his rehab. If there was even a hint that Thomas would miss the whole season I guarentee the trade would have been already nixed by now.

Thomas was shut down in late May. It's late August and he can't even jog. There's definitely a hint that he'll miss the season. Three months of recovery & PT should've produced better results. He'll probably need surgery and be out for the season.

[illmatic24]

There should be an easy solution that work's for everybody here. Why not just replace Thomas with Tatum and the Laker's pick?

Because there's no reason Boston would ever do that. You only have four posts and you might already be the worst poster I've ever seen.

This whole thing is kind of silly. I really doubt IT misses half the season. Nobody was predicting that before this trade happened. Just add in another Boston first or the Clippers first and call it a deal. If the Cavs need more than that, Boston should and will walk away and simply deal with the consequences. Which probably won't be that bad. It's not like Thomas is going to sit out the season and sulk all year long in a contract year. Crowder might but that's not unusual behavior for him.

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

You really think he would just sit out the whole year in a contract year because his feelings are hurt? Nonsense. The money is uber important to him as noted by all the brinks truck comments that he made. He wants that mega contract. The only reason he wouldn't play this season is if he had to have surgery for some reason and if he couldn't play at all because of it. And he's not going to get surgery done out of spite either. He'll avoid surgery and do whatever he can to play as much as possible at the highest level possible. No matter what team he's playing for.

[jbk1234]

Because there's no reason Boston would ever do that. You only have four posts and you might already be the worst poster I've ever seen.

This whole thing is kind of silly. I really doubt IT misses half the season. Nobody was predicting that before this trade happened. Just add in another Boston first or the Clippers first and call it a deal. If the Cavs need more than that, Boston should and will walk away and simply deal with the consequences. Which probably won't be that bad. It's not like Thomas is going to sit out the season and sulk all year long in a contract year. Crowder might but that's not unusual behavior for him.

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

You really think he would just sit out the whole year in a contract year because his feelings are hurt? Nonsense. The money is uber important to him as noted by all the brinks truck comments that he made. He wants that mega contract. The only reason he wouldn't play this season is if he had to have surgery for some reason and if he couldn't play at all because of it. And he's not going to get surgery done out of spite either. He'll avoid surgery and do whatever he can to play as much as possible at the highest level possible. No matter what team he's playing for.

You're ignoring the very real possibility that he gets the surgery because he has to.

[Sactowndog]

Yeah Boston can't walk away,the decision is up to Cleveland only.
Granted if Ainge plays hardball and actually did think he gave accurate information regarding IT4's condition and that's why the trade included a lottery pick, and refuses to give up more even with new info on IT4's timeline, then The Cavs will void the deal if it's true IT4 will miss most if not all of the season.

They won't likely get a high lottery pick unless they deal with Phoenix (who has a pg) or ATL (who has a pg). But there are plenty of teams such as Milwaukee, Dallas etc that we could get a deal we like who have assets & players that they would consider moving if KI is their missing piece.
I think Boston misrepresented how bad IT4 was.
If it turns out IT4's timeline is just pushed back without surgery but the med examiners determined he will heal fine in time just longer than Boston docs projected for the 2nd half of the season, the Cavs probably are just asking for another asset in picks so they can combine the pick(s) with a salary dump to get an upgrade to Rose.
Not that unreasonable to ask, whether they get it or not is another story.
The Cavs got a solid 3 & D player in Crowder and a potential #1 pick (could be as low as 6) but still valuable. & they got an under rated young center.
But the entire deal was hinged on IT4 being able to compete with the Cav's for a championship even if he wasn't the "prize" of the trade , so you almost have to believe they would not have done this deal knowing IT4 was not going to be ready until after the all star break or something similar and want compensation for the misrepresentation by Ainge.
The other possibility here is IT4 is much worse now than when Boston examined him(aggravated it further possibly trying to work out or something) and so it brings an entire new set of circumstances to any deal with Boston.
Boston does not want to lose KI and bring back an injured player who is worse than they thought if that proves to be true, so I think they would be wise to add a couple 2nd rounders and Rozier at minimum taking back somebody like Jefferson as a veteran presence for his young core.
I don't believe the Cavs would deny that,unless IT4 will need surgery to recover to full strength and be available to them only if he were to sign with them in fa which would never had been agreed a pon by Cleveland had they known that up front even with as much other assets as they got in return.

Where are people reading that Thomas could miss most if not all the season? That hasn't been reported anywhere. The issue with Thomas's hip is he didn't want to get surgery, so there's the possibilities of issues popping up down the line. Even if he changes his mind and decides on surgery now the timeline for rehab wouldn't be most of the season. As for another trade, what made Boston appealing is the had other teams draft picks, add Kyrie to Pheonix or Atlanta and you're adding to their win total also. Middleton and Brogdan are both pretty intriguing bot neither will be stars, while the Nets pick isn't a sure thing there could be a couple of star player coming out of the draft, especially now that Bagley reclassified.

9 months to full recovery on the outside takes him out until the finals, not exactly a good value trade for Cleveland and too much risk if in fact they did this deal on the premise he was recovering well without surgery and would be ready by training camp or soon after.
There’s nothing “minimally invasive” about hip arthroscopy surgery. The tools and devices used to get into the joint can cause severe and permanent injury to the ligaments, muscles, and fascia around the joint. Although some patients recover enough to return to "normal" activities after 3 months, that does not apply to running and jumping,cutting and landing from a jump etc and most patients require 6-7 months of physical therapy minimum to return to sports related activities .
No matter how you slice it if we are eating his contract Boston has to give us a significant add on,otherwise Ainge's only real option is probably to reconcile with IT4 hope he agrees and maybe they will have him by the playoffs.
I don't see any reconciliation given how he was gut punched in a deal for a player of the same position, so not many options for Boston here.

No way this request is happening. Just rescind the trade already and be done with it. You got more than you should have for one of the worst defensive guards in the NBA.

[Sactowndog]

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

You really think he would just sit out the whole year in a contract year because his feelings are hurt? Nonsense. The money is uber important to him as noted by all the brinks truck comments that he made. He wants that mega contract. The only reason he wouldn't play this season is if he had to have surgery for some reason and if he couldn't play at all because of it. And he's not going to get surgery done out of spite either. He'll avoid surgery and do whatever he can to play as much as possible at the highest level possible. No matter what team he's playing for.

You're ignoring the very real possibility that he gets the surgery because he has to.

Even if he gets the surgery. He is where he's at because of Brad and his hard work. This can be reconciled. Time to move on. Make the trade with Phoenix. It makes both our draft picks more valuable.

[Fidel Sarcasmo]

The way I see it, is the center piece of this deal was the Brooklyn unprotected. The rest is just cap filler. Cavs FO is trying to make this trade look like Brooklyn pick is frosting on the cake. the brooklyn pick is the cake and the frosting together. Jae+IT is capfill. That's the reality. It's pure speculation on my part, but If Milwakee was offering Malcum Brogdon, Kris Middleton and a middling 1st round pick for Boston's brooklyn unprotected this year, DA would laugh it off. But that's just me. I would assume with the Draft being loaded this year, others would feel the same. This isn't to deminish Brogdon's successful rookie year or Middleton who is a great player also, But everyone saw how much leverage the Celtics had this year at the draft. That's negotiating power right there. Long rant cut short, Cleveland will never sniff another asset even close to the brooklyn pick if they void. My call? C's stand pat, Cleveland's bluff gets called, Trade goes through. And that's with full understanding of the level of damage control we'd have to do with IT.

[illmatic24]

He will never play for Boston again as long as he is alive there was no one in this deal more slighted than he was being traded for a player of the same position not to mention there has to be significantly longer recovery expected as the Cavs were expecting him to be ready for training camp or soon after according to what Boston was spewing despite us knowing he was hurt ,when they agreed to this deal whether he got worse in between the time the Boston examiners had inconclusive but optimistic reports that were passed on to Cleveland by Boston & whether Boston knew he aggravated worse after the Boston exam but didn't say etc are all yet to be seen.
He could have just found out that his recovery time will cost him most of this season anyway without surgery with a lesser chance of ever returning to form ,so he will be motivated given this to opt to have the surgery(his choice not any teams) and so he would miss the entire regular season but return to form and prove himself worthy of a contract again in workouts next summer.
The prognosis for this issue is not good without surgery.The Cav's probably knew that, but they were also probably led to believe his condition was not as bad as originally thought in May according to the timeline Boston was spewing.
Too much what ifs too know, but my take is he is done,and cannot be part of this deal without a significant replacement for him in the deal.

You really think he would just sit out the whole year in a contract year because his feelings are hurt? Nonsense. The money is uber important to him as noted by all the brinks truck comments that he made. He wants that mega contract. The only reason he wouldn't play this season is if he had to have surgery for some reason and if he couldn't play at all because of it. And he's not going to get surgery done out of spite either. He'll avoid surgery and do whatever he can to play as much as possible at the highest level possible. No matter what team he's playing for.

You're ignoring the very real possibility that he gets the surgery because he has to.

I don't think anyone ever thought he needed surgery until he got to Cleveland for his physical. And they haven't even come out and said that he definitely needs it. That's just quite a coincidence that every doctor who saw him thought rehab would be perfectly fine until he got to Cleveland. If anything, I think Cleveland's doctors think he might be out until early 2018 or something compared to Boston's doctors who think he might be ready to roll by sometime in November or December. But I can't see him getting surgery done at this point either way. He's rehabbing and playing this season in his contract year.

[jbk1234]

You really think he would just sit out the whole year in a contract year because his feelings are hurt? Nonsense. The money is uber important to him as noted by all the brinks truck comments that he made. He wants that mega contract. The only reason he wouldn't play this season is if he had to have surgery for some reason and if he couldn't play at all because of it. And he's not going to get surgery done out of spite either. He'll avoid surgery and do whatever he can to play as much as possible at the highest level possible. No matter what team he's playing for.

You're ignoring the very real possibility that he gets the surgery because he has to.

I don't think anyone ever thought he needed surgery until he got to Cleveland for his physical. And they haven't even come out and said that he definitely needs it. That's just quite a coincidence that every doctor who saw him thought rehab would be perfectly fine until he got to Cleveland. If anything, I think Cleveland's doctors think he might be out until early 2018 or something compared to Boston's doctors who think he might be ready to roll by sometime in November or December. But I can't see him getting surgery done at this point either way. He's rehabbing and playing this season in his contract year.

After three months of rest and PT he can't even jog, and you're telling me the Cleveland doctors were the first ones to conclude that he'd need surgery? Go sell that wooden nickle elsewhere.

[jbk1234]

This isn't a good sign for the trade going through. If the Cavs don't even have an ask out there, my read is they're really down on IT's hip and are considering scrapping the entire trade.

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[jbk1234]

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