Cavs rumored to be discussing TT/Deandre Jordan swap

Post #1 » by **jbk1234** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:15 am

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-trade-rumors-should-cavs-clippers-consider-tristan-thompson-for-deandre-jordan/

Not sure how I feel about this honestly. Jordan's a bit of a dinosaur in the current iteration of the NBA. He looks pretty bad without CP3. I'm not even sure we'd start him. TT can at least switch on the PNR.

Stillwater · Post #2 » by **Stillwater** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:20 am

I could see something like this happening :https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6969577
definitely would not be good with TT and Frye for Jordan but would consider moving Shumps defense for Williams offense to make the deal work. Jordan has looked bad without a good pg, but I think with Wade and maybe with IT he would look like his old self again.
We would have to move 2 players minimum to get him though so I'm not so sure this is feasible for a likely rental. we still need a pg more than anything.

LEO MESSI · Post #3 » by **LEO MESSI** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:21 am

"The Cavs would probably be unwilling to part with this year's Brooklyn pick, but they do have their own first-rounder that they could potentially include. Another possibility would be that the cash equalizer from Cleveland could be Jae Crowder, who has struggled to find a role with the Cavs but could allow the Clippers to play versatile small-ball lineups with Griffin at center."

Post #4 » by **jbk1234** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:24 am

LEO MESSI wrote:"The Cavs would probably be unwilling to part with this year's Brooklyn pick, but they do have their own first-rounder that they could potentially include. Another possibility would be that the cash equalizer from Cleveland could be Jae Crowder, who has struggled to find a role with the Cavs but could allow the Clippers to play versatile small-ball lineups with Griffin at center."

If we have to include Crowder, I'd definitely pass. TT should be back by the end of the month.

Stillwater · Post #5 » by **Stillwater** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:26 am

no matter how you slice it Jordan is not that much better overall that TT, and TT plays better defense outside the paint which is not something to take lightly despite Jordan having the clear edge at the rim. I think wed'e pass on this without getting Williams as well.

LEO MESSI · Post #6 » by **LEO MESSI** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 3:43 am

- Own pick
- Jae Crowder
- TT

For Jordan

I wouldn't mind. Love would benefit a lot with this move.

Post #7 » by **jbk1234** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 5:00 am

LEO MESSI wrote:- Own pick
- Jae Crowder
- TT

For Jordan

I wouldn't mind. Love would benefit a lot with this move.

I just don't know that he can stay on the floor against the Warriors. I'd like to get TT back on the floor and see how it goes.

Post #8 » by **jbk1234** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 7:20 am

The more I think about it, the more I think that the Cavs should offer no more than their pick & TT. The market for Jordan is going to be really, really soft.

The following teams won't trade for him as an expiring: Celtics*, Pistons, Philly, Miami, Charlotte, Brooklyn**, Atlanta, Chicago, Golden State, N.O., Denver, OKC, Utah, Memphis, Sacramento & Dallas. They're either set at center, set as a team, or just entering a rebuild.

The following teams might trade for him but would have to send back a big man on a long term contract:
Cavs (TT)
Raptors (JV+ matching contracts)
Pacers (Big Al & filler but what do they do with Turner/Sabonis?)
NY (Noah)
Wizards (Gortat + matching contracts)
Bucks (Henson + matching contracts)
Orlando (Bizmack)
Rockets (Ryno & maybe Capela)
Wolves (Dieng + Shabazz)
Lakers (Brook)
Suns (Monroe)

Raptors are capped out, don't have their first, and aren't going offer any value after JV & filler. They've already got Ibaka and it's a bad fit.
Pacers trading for Jordan is a real stretch given their current roster & ability to retain FAs. I don't see them attaching value to Big Al beyond journeyman filler.
The Knicks are capped out and would have to trade two unprotected picks with Noah (which might be worth it for the Knicks) but they're 10-8 and on the upswing.
Wizards are capped out, would start with Mahinmi but would have to settle on Gortat. Maybe they'd offer Gortat & Oubre but in order to retain Jordan after this season they'd be in the luxury tax forever. It would probably Gortat, a scrub & their pick.
Bucks can't trade a first for a while because of Bledsoe. They're capped out. Maybe the Clippers can pry Bragdon or Parker out of them but the Clippers would have to eat Delly & Henson.
The Magic could be players if the Clippers will take back Biz's deal. But the sweetener won't be their 1st or Isaac. Henny got fired after that Ibaka trade.
Rockets are intriguing but the problem for the Clippers is that Capela needs to get paid. Blake, Gallo, Ryno, Rivers, & Capela leaves you in the tax for years and it will take incentive for another team to take those guys. Also the Rockets are playing really well.
The Wolves are intriguing but the value is meh & you just made a conference rival better than you for all of Blake's career.
Lakers have Brook who is expiring. But the problem again is the sweetener. Neither Igram nor Ball are good shooters. How much do they hand over for a player who takes up a max slot & creates roster construction issues?
Suns are a good fit & have Monroe but how much do they add when they could just sign him this summer if he's interested in playing there?

The market is going to be really soft for Jordan unless Ainge decides to trade Hayward and I don't think that's going to happen.

Stillwater · Post #9 » by **Stillwater** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 1:10 pm

Well we can't just swap the 2 players ,salaries are too far apart .
I don't like the idea of trading an overpaid player for one that is very overpaid and offers little else besides an uptick in rim protection.
If the Cavs are legitimately interested it will also be us getting back someone else as well, or us involved in a multi team trade getting us a PG and the 3rd team getting Jordan.

Dupp · Post #10 » by **Dupp** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 6:30 pm

I actually think TT is pretty well done so DJ is a major upgrade imo. He does everything better than Thompson really. Some things way better.

Stillwater · Post #11 » by **Stillwater** » Sat Nov 25, 2017 7:03 pm

Dupp wrote:I actually think TT is pretty well done so DJ is a major upgrade imo. He does everything better than Thompson really. Some things way better.

Too expensive for a big with player option this summer his lateral speed is poor compared to TTop and could not do the switching we employ.
Yeah the rim protection is an upgrade and if Thompson has some worse injury than reported maybe. But I think we could get a deal done for the cheaper Dedmon with similar skills and have more options for deals getting a PG shipping TT
If Isaiah has a set back

camillepd · Post #12 » by **camillepd** » Sun Nov 26, 2017 12:40 am

Cavs should target the Knicks Kyle O Quinn.

Post #13 » by **jbk1234** » Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:13 am

Dupp wrote:I actually think TT is pretty well done so DJ is a major upgrade imo. He does everything better than Thompson really. Some things way better.

Jordan doesn't guard perimeter players better away from the basket nor is he better in the high PNR.

Dupp · Post #14 » by **Dupp** » Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:25 am

jbk1234 wrote:
Dupp wrote:I actually think TT is pretty well done so DJ is a major upgrade imo. He does everything better than Thompson really. Some things way better.

Jordan doesn't guard perimeter players better away from the basket nor is he better in the high PNR.

I thought DJ was statistically pretty good on these areas. Maybe that we more last year but I thought it was an asset of his.

Like I said TT is done he didn’t impress at any of his strengths last finals or any time since.

Post #15 » by **jbk1234** » Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:40 am

Dupp wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Dupp wrote:I actually think TT is pretty well done so DJ is a major upgrade imo. He does everything better than Thompson really. Some things way better.

Jordan doesn't guard perimeter players better away from the basket nor is he better in the high PNR.

I thought DJ was statistically pretty good on these areas. Maybe that we more last year but I thought it was an asset of his.

Like I said TT is done he didn’t impress at any of his strengths last finals or any time since.

I'd like to see a bigger sample size with TT. The entire team was flat & disjointed in October. The Warriors threw three bodies at TT to keep him off the boards in the Finals. That's three bodies that aren't on other players.

Truthful1 · Post #16 » by **Truthful1** » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:30 am

I cannot believe the love for TT on here. TT for Deandre Jordan is a trade you make all day, every day, and twice on Sunday. Cavs desperately need a shot blocker and defensive presence in the middle. TT is horrible, offensively and defensively. Not to mention he is over paid by about $10 million a year. I guess some people forgot the last two finals when he got owned by Bogut and Pachulia. TT and Shumpert for Jordan will do. To get rid of TT and Shumps contracts would be a blessing for the Cavs.

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Stillwater · Post #17 » by **Stillwater** » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:00 am

Truthful1 wrote:I cannot believe the love for TT on here. TT for Deandre Jordan is a trade you make all day, every day, and twice on Sunday. Cavs desperately need a shot blocker and defensive presence in the middle. TT is horrible, offensively and defensively. Not to mention he is over paid by about $10 million a year. I guess some people forgot the last two finals when he got owned by Bogut and Pachulia. TT and Shumpert for Jordan will do. To get rid of TT and Shumps contracts would be a blessing for the Cavs.

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He would play better with us than he has this year in la, but the 24 mil PO this summer makes trading for him unlikely. He does offer better rim protection but I think the overall defensive impact compared to losing TT and Shump would not be a positive value return.
TT straight up is not doable so unless they want to send back Williams with DJ for those 2 I don't see it happening.
We definitely are not parting with the Nets pick for him.

wallsfamily · Post #18 » by **wallsfamily** » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:34 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Truthful1 wrote:I cannot believe the love for TT on here. TT for Deandre Jordan is a trade you make all day, every day, and twice on Sunday. Cavs desperately need a shot blocker and defensive presence in the middle. TT is horrible, offensively and defensively. Not to mention he is over paid by about $10 million a year. I guess some people forgot the last two finals when he got owned by Bogut and Pachulia. TT and Shumpert for Jordan will do. To get rid of TT and Shumps contracts would be a blessing for the Cavs.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

He would play better with us than he has this year in la, but the 24 mil PO this summer makes trading for him unlikely. He does offer better rim protection but I think the overall defensive impact compared to losing TT and Shump would not be a positive value return.
TT straight up is not doable so unless they want to send back Williams with DJ for those 2 I don't see it happening.
We definitely are not parting with the Nets pick for him.

The Lebron effect as well as pnr dives would more than makeup for it as great a rebounder Tristan is Jordan is even better with unreal athleticism. Not to mention picks by Jordan on Curry with IT will have a little more lasting effect Old school trick pick the shooters shooting arm early it will reward you late.

Stillwater · Post #19 » by **Stillwater** » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:00 pm

wallsfamily wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Truthful1 wrote:I cannot believe the love for TT on here. TT for Deandre Jordan is a trade you make all day, every day, and twice on Sunday. Cavs desperately need a shot blocker and defensive presence in the middle. TT is horrible, offensively and defensively. Not to mention he is over paid by about $10 million a year. I guess some people forgot the last two finals when he got owned by Bogut and Pachulia. TT and Shumpert for Jordan will do. To get rid of TT and Shumps contracts would be a blessing for the Cavs.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

He would play better with us than he has this year in la, but the 24 mil PO this summer makes trading for him unlikely. He does offer better rim protection but I think the overall defensive impact compared to losing TT and Shump would not be a positive value return.
TT straight up is not doable so unless they want to send back Williams with DJ for those 2 I don't see it happening.
We definitely are not parting with the Nets pick for him.

The Lebron effect as well as pnr dives would more than makeup for it as great a rebounder Tristan is Jordan is even better with unreal athleticism. Not to mention picks by Jordan on Curry with IT will have a little more lasting effect Old school trick pick the shooters shooting arm early it will reward you late.

good points, it will be interesting to see which direction the Cavs ultimately decide to go,but l believe it is unlikely they will move Thompson and another good player for an upgrade at the center position, maybe Thompson alone , but that isn't enough salary being moved for DJ.
The only other possible option there is attaching Frye's expiring with TTop for DJ as the only return from LAC but given the offense that Frye gives off the bench which is difficult to replace, I don't see it without the return providing the same or better which is not something DJ offers.
I think the Cavs are going another direction to be honest, probably move Thompson for a true pg that defends better than our current options. Then sign a rim protector / enforcer for chump change before the deadline for Playoff eligibility.

Post #20 » by **jbk1234** » Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:50 pm

Truthful1 wrote:I cannot believe the love for TT on here. TT for Deandre Jordan is a trade you make all day, every day, and twice on Sunday. Cavs desperately need a shot blocker and defensive presence in the middle. TT is horrible, offensively and defensively. Not to mention he is over paid by about $10 million a year. I guess some people forgot the last two finals when he got owned by Bogut and Pachulia. TT and Shumpert for Jordan will do. To get rid of TT and Shumps contracts would be a blessing for the Cavs.

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Here's my response - outside of the first round, when has DeAndre Jordan ever showed up big in a playoff series for the Clippers? What has Gasol done against the Warriors?

Frankly, I think guys like Noel & Capela who can protect the rim, and switch out to guard Durant on the perimeter, are far more valuable against the Warriors. If everyone is going to be singularly focused on the Warriors, at least show me a big man they haven't figured out.