ImageImageImage

Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton

Moderator: jbk1234

Do you approve or disapprove of the Collin Sexton pick?

Approve
13
68%
Disapprove
4
21%
Undecided
2
11%
 
Total votes: 19

User avatar
Mind_Odyssey
Rookie
Posts: 1,115
And1: 1,388
Joined: Jan 28, 2017
       

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#21 » by Mind_Odyssey » Sun May 5, 2019 1:17 am

I want him as Ja Morants backup.
Image
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#22 » by Stillwater » Sun May 5, 2019 1:22 pm

Mind_Odyssey wrote:I want him as Ja Morants backup.

That would never happen... Sexton would beat his ass before he let that happen. Cavs will not pick Morant unless they believe a Sexton Morant starting backcourt can work . Morant is the more explosive leaper and has a high assist rate, but he also is weak by NBA guard standards and to get those dimes has a terrible turnover rate.
Morant clearly looks like the higher upside prospect on paper but after the year 1 gradual and steady improvement of Sexton esp playing with some non starter material starters as an NBA rook... There is no way the Cavs piss away that player for an unproven (at NBA level)one at the same position unless they are getting a massive haul.
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
Revenged25
Rookie
Posts: 1,204
And1: 356
Joined: Jun 05, 2018
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#23 » by Revenged25 » Mon May 6, 2019 6:10 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Mind_Odyssey wrote:I want him as Ja Morants backup.

That would never happen... Sexton would beat his ass before he let that happen. Cavs will not pick Morant unless they believe a Sexton Morant starting backcourt can work . Morant is the more explosive leaper and has a high assist rate, but he also is weak by NBA guard standards and to get those dimes has a terrible turnover rate.
Morant clearly looks like the higher upside prospect on paper but after the year 1 gradual and steady improvement of Sexton esp playing with some non starter material starters as an NBA rook... There is no way the Cavs piss away that player for an unproven (at NBA level)one at the same position unless they are getting a massive haul.


I think Morant/Sexton backcourt would work so I would be fine with the pick for that reasoning, but we have to remember that last year when both were Freshman, Sexton was considered a top 10 pick in an extremely strong draft and Morant wasn't even projected to be drafted. In their 2nd years, Morant lit it up at the collegiate level, while Sexton struggled early but really developed as the year progressed and were lighting up NBA teams at a similar level Morant was doing to college teams.
JonFromVA
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,189
And1: 1,634
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#24 » by JonFromVA » Mon May 6, 2019 9:48 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Mind_Odyssey wrote:I want him as Ja Morants backup.

That would never happen... Sexton would beat his ass before he let that happen. Cavs will not pick Morant unless they believe a Sexton Morant starting backcourt can work . Morant is the more explosive leaper and has a high assist rate, but he also is weak by NBA guard standards and to get those dimes has a terrible turnover rate.
Morant clearly looks like the higher upside prospect on paper but after the year 1 gradual and steady improvement of Sexton esp playing with some non starter material starters as an NBA rook... There is no way the Cavs piss away that player for an unproven (at NBA level)one at the same position unless they are getting a massive haul.


I think Morant/Sexton backcourt would work so I would be fine with the pick for that reasoning, but we have to remember that last year when both were Freshman, Sexton was considered a top 10 pick in an extremely strong draft and Morant wasn't even projected to be drafted. In their 2nd years, Morant lit it up at the collegiate level, while Sexton struggled early but really developed as the year progressed and were lighting up NBA teams at a similar level Morant was doing to college teams.


Yep, they might be interested in trying a Sexton+Morant combo or just not even worrying about it until things shake out. For instance, Mark Price didn't exactly light the league on fire as a rookie, so the Cavs drafted Kevin Johnson who played very well backing up Price who broke-out his 2nd season. I wished at the time they'd just kept Johnson (and Harper), but they dealt him for Nance Sr and that worked out pretty well for both teams.

I mean as a GM you probably shouldn't be aiming for a Lillard+McCollum back-court, but you probably shouldn't turn one down either lacking a better option.

We could just draft Barrett if we land at #2, but it's just not clear at this point if we actually have a PG in Sexton.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#25 » by Stillwater » Tue May 7, 2019 1:20 am

JonFromVA wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:That would never happen... Sexton would beat his ass before he let that happen. Cavs will not pick Morant unless they believe a Sexton Morant starting backcourt can work . Morant is the more explosive leaper and has a high assist rate, but he also is weak by NBA guard standards and to get those dimes has a terrible turnover rate.
Morant clearly looks like the higher upside prospect on paper but after the year 1 gradual and steady improvement of Sexton esp playing with some non starter material starters as an NBA rook... There is no way the Cavs piss away that player for an unproven (at NBA level)one at the same position unless they are getting a massive haul.


I think Morant/Sexton backcourt would work so I would be fine with the pick for that reasoning, but we have to remember that last year when both were Freshman, Sexton was considered a top 10 pick in an extremely strong draft and Morant wasn't even projected to be drafted. In their 2nd years, Morant lit it up at the collegiate level, while Sexton struggled early but really developed as the year progressed and were lighting up NBA teams at a similar level Morant was doing to college teams.


Yep, they might be interested in trying a Sexton+Morant combo or just not even worrying about it until things shake out. For instance, Mark Price didn't exactly light the league on fire as a rookie, so the Cavs drafted Kevin Johnson who played very well backing up Price who broke-out his 2nd season. I wished at the time they'd just kept Johnson (and Harper), but they dealt him for Nance Sr and that worked out pretty well for both teams.

I mean as a GM you probably shouldn't be aiming for a Lillard+McCollum back-court, but you probably shouldn't turn one down either lacking a better option.

We could just draft Barrett if we land at #2, but it's just not clear at this point if we actually have a PG in Sexton.

Right,the way I see it, Sexton is the pg next season but obviously if they draft Ja that means only a couple of things;
1 the org moves Sexton after 1 season(doubtful) ,
2 they use Sexton off ball (mostly) which he showed good reps at.
3 they deal Clarkson at the dl and let Sexton take the 6th man role exclusively going forward.
I think it is much more likely they take Morant at 3 with Zion and Barrett taken than at 2 with Barrett on the board if they pick him at all.
The truth about it though, is I think outside of Zion who you take no matter what... the creation ability & explosiveness of Kevin Porter Jr. or the upside and freakish athletic ability of Sekou , or even the Capella like rim protection and perimeter defense of Hayes could prove to be the best fits with the current young core of Sexton,Cedi,Nance,Clarkson etc. and It would not surprise me if they took any of those 3 at 3 over Morant if they are backing Sexton completely.
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
Revenged25
Rookie
Posts: 1,204
And1: 356
Joined: Jun 05, 2018
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#26 » by Revenged25 » Tue May 7, 2019 1:26 am

Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
I think Morant/Sexton backcourt would work so I would be fine with the pick for that reasoning, but we have to remember that last year when both were Freshman, Sexton was considered a top 10 pick in an extremely strong draft and Morant wasn't even projected to be drafted. In their 2nd years, Morant lit it up at the collegiate level, while Sexton struggled early but really developed as the year progressed and were lighting up NBA teams at a similar level Morant was doing to college teams.


Yep, they might be interested in trying a Sexton+Morant combo or just not even worrying about it until things shake out. For instance, Mark Price didn't exactly light the league on fire as a rookie, so the Cavs drafted Kevin Johnson who played very well backing up Price who broke-out his 2nd season. I wished at the time they'd just kept Johnson (and Harper), but they dealt him for Nance Sr and that worked out pretty well for both teams.

I mean as a GM you probably shouldn't be aiming for a Lillard+McCollum back-court, but you probably shouldn't turn one down either lacking a better option.

We could just draft Barrett if we land at #2, but it's just not clear at this point if we actually have a PG in Sexton.

Right,the way I see it, Sexton is the pg next season but obviously if they draft Ja that means only a couple of things;
1 the org moves Sexton after 1 season(doubtful) ,
2 they use Sexton off ball (mostly) which he showed good reps at.
3 they deal Clarkson at the dl and let Sexton take the 6th man role exclusively going forward.
I think it is much more likely they take Morant at 3 with Zion and Barrett taken than at 2 with Barrett on the board if they pick him at all.
The truth about it though, is I think outside of Zion who you take no matter what... the creation ability & explosiveness of Kevin Porter Jr. or the upside and freakish athletic ability of Sekou , or even the Capella like rim protection and perimeter defense of Hayes could prove to be the best fits with the current young core of Sexton,Cedi,Nance,Clarkson etc. and It would not surprise me if they took any of those 3 at 3 over Morant if they are backing Sexton completely.


If they are picking at 3 and Morant is still on the board, I think they would get enough offers from other teams like Phoenix and Chicago that they would trade back to get a some more assets, including just a little less in salary owed to the player, to take one of the guys you listed.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#27 » by Stillwater » Tue May 7, 2019 1:41 am

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Yep, they might be interested in trying a Sexton+Morant combo or just not even worrying about it until things shake out. For instance, Mark Price didn't exactly light the league on fire as a rookie, so the Cavs drafted Kevin Johnson who played very well backing up Price who broke-out his 2nd season. I wished at the time they'd just kept Johnson (and Harper), but they dealt him for Nance Sr and that worked out pretty well for both teams.

I mean as a GM you probably shouldn't be aiming for a Lillard+McCollum back-court, but you probably shouldn't turn one down either lacking a better option.

We could just draft Barrett if we land at #2, but it's just not clear at this point if we actually have a PG in Sexton.

Right,the way I see it, Sexton is the pg next season but obviously if they draft Ja that means only a couple of things;
1 the org moves Sexton after 1 season(doubtful) ,
2 they use Sexton off ball (mostly) which he showed good reps at.
3 they deal Clarkson at the dl and let Sexton take the 6th man role exclusively going forward.
I think it is much more likely they take Morant at 3 with Zion and Barrett taken than at 2 with Barrett on the board if they pick him at all.
The truth about it though, is I think outside of Zion who you take no matter what... the creation ability & explosiveness of Kevin Porter Jr. or the upside and freakish athletic ability of Sekou , or even the Capella like rim protection and perimeter defense of Hayes could prove to be the best fits with the current young core of Sexton,Cedi,Nance,Clarkson etc. and It would not surprise me if they took any of those 3 at 3 over Morant if they are backing Sexton completely.


If they are picking at 3 and Morant is still on the board, I think they would get enough offers from other teams like Phoenix and Chicago that they would trade back to get a some more assets, including just a little less in salary owed to the player, to take one of the guys you listed.

Theoretically yes... but if the offers are not enough you just take the guy on top of your board whether its Ja or somebody else.
A lot of these high lottery trades fail pretty badly. I would demand 2 future 1sts for the 3rd pick if Zion and Barrett go 1,2. with the drop off in immediate impact high ceiling options after those 3 being pretty significant. But imo can get just as good long term value in the 3 I mentioned..
I wouldn't be upset at all if we take Morant he is an elite pg prospect, but also don't think you can keep drafting the same position year after year and expect to improve without Philly type tanking.
Really seems like only way they take Morant at 2 and keep him with no intention of trading Sexton is if they don't see anyone else close to the same level player including Barrett and feel Sexton is more than capable of playing off ball. At 3 though it becomes more reasonable if they see Sexton as the 6th man going forward..
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
JonFromVA
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,189
And1: 1,634
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#28 » by JonFromVA » Tue May 7, 2019 2:56 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Right,the way I see it, Sexton is the pg next season but obviously if they draft Ja that means only a couple of things;
1 the org moves Sexton after 1 season(doubtful) ,
2 they use Sexton off ball (mostly) which he showed good reps at.
3 they deal Clarkson at the dl and let Sexton take the 6th man role exclusively going forward.
I think it is much more likely they take Morant at 3 with Zion and Barrett taken than at 2 with Barrett on the board if they pick him at all.
The truth about it though, is I think outside of Zion who you take no matter what... the creation ability & explosiveness of Kevin Porter Jr. or the upside and freakish athletic ability of Sekou , or even the Capella like rim protection and perimeter defense of Hayes could prove to be the best fits with the current young core of Sexton,Cedi,Nance,Clarkson etc. and It would not surprise me if they took any of those 3 at 3 over Morant if they are backing Sexton completely.


If they are picking at 3 and Morant is still on the board, I think they would get enough offers from other teams like Phoenix and Chicago that they would trade back to get a some more assets, including just a little less in salary owed to the player, to take one of the guys you listed.

Theoretically yes... but if the offers are not enough you just take the guy on top of your board whether its Ja or somebody else.
A lot of these high lottery trades fail pretty badly. I would demand 2 future 1sts for the 3rd pick if Zion and Barrett go 1,2. with the drop off in immediate impact high ceiling options after those 3 being pretty significant. But imo can get just as good long term value in the 3 I mentioned..
I wouldn't be upset at all if we take Morant he is an elite pg prospect, but also don't think you can keep drafting the same position year after year and expect to improve without Philly type tanking.
Really seems like only way they take Morant at 2 and keep him with no intention of trading Sexton is if they don't see anyone else close to the same level player including Barrett and feel Sexton is more than capable of playing off ball. At 3 though it becomes more reasonable if they see Sexton as the 6th man going forward..


The trade back opportunities should be there if GM's value the top-3 picks like fans and the draft pundits do. We do have a recent precedent as Dallas is giving up the ~#9 pick in this draft to trade up from 5 to 3 to get Doncic which led to them trading Dennis Smith Jr (the #9 pick the previous year).

But last year's draft was considered pretty good through the first 8 picks (until MPjr got hurt), so, asking for another 1st would make sense; but IMO so would just drafting Morant and letting things shake out. If we actually focus on player development, maybe we can start raising the value of players on our team rather than destroying it.

We can hope Collin learns how to run the point, but we shouldn't count on it. If we don't draft (or trade for) another PG, we at the very least need a wing who can help create offense; or we may be forced to start Delly in the back-court.

Otoh, if we don't want give our #1 to Atlanta next season, we will need a certain level of incompetency ...
Revenged25
Rookie
Posts: 1,204
And1: 356
Joined: Jun 05, 2018
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#29 » by Revenged25 » Tue May 7, 2019 4:29 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
The trade back opportunities should be there if GM's value the top-3 picks like fans and the draft pundits do. We do have a recent precedent as Dallas is giving up the ~#9 pick in this draft to trade up from 5 to 3 to get Doncic which led to them trading Dennis Smith Jr (the #9 pick the previous year).

But last year's draft was considered pretty good through the first 8 picks (until MPjr got hurt), so, asking for another 1st would make sense; but IMO so would just drafting Morant and letting things shake out. If we actually focus on player development, maybe we can start raising the value of players on our team rather than destroying it.

We can hope Collin learns how to run the point, but we shouldn't count on it. If we don't draft (or trade for) another PG, we at the very least need a wing who can help create offense; or we may be forced to start Delly in the back-court.

Otoh, if we don't want give our #1 to Atlanta next season, we will need a certain level of incompetency ...


I think that either RJ or Morant would be good for getting a 2nd creator in the backcourt with Sexton, so I would be happy with either, but I also wouldn't be opposed to trading back and picking up a top 3 protected 2020 1st either if we can get a guy like Hunter, Porter Jr, Sekou, Capella, Hayes, etc. At a minimum if Zion and RJ were #1 and #2 picks and we have #3, we draft Morant no matter what and then go from there. If we get a trade offer with a guy we like, then we make the trade, if we don't then we keep Morant and work it out.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#30 » by Stillwater » Tue May 7, 2019 8:19 pm

^ I get the logic you both are suggesting, but the Cavs will have to be higher on somebody else than Morrant to trade back which seems pretty unlikely without significant offers,regardless of Ja's fit here and said player they are higher on if that is the case probably wouldn't be in play more than 1 pick later(Barrett) so I guess it comes down to just how bad PHO or CHI want Ja if one of them is sitting there at 4th. If either offered their own unprotected 2020 esp if it was PHO who projects to be worse than CHI being in the west I would trade back 1 spot and take Barrett, if that's who they love but with offers pouring in when Cavs are sitting at #2 I would not trade back to 4 unless PHO was the one sitting at 3 where they might over pick White or Garland where Barrett falls to 4.
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
Revenged25
Rookie
Posts: 1,204
And1: 356
Joined: Jun 05, 2018
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#31 » by Revenged25 » Tue May 7, 2019 10:16 pm

Stillwater wrote:^ I get the logic you both are suggesting, but the Cavs will have to be higher on somebody else than Morrant to trade back which seems pretty unlikely without significant offers,regardless of Ja's fit here and said player they are higher on if that is the case probably wouldn't be in play more than 1 pick later(Barrett) so I guess it comes down to just how bad PHO or CHI want Ja if one of them is sitting there at 4th. If either offered their own unprotected 2020 esp if it was PHO who projects to be worse than CHI being in the west I would trade back 1 spot and take Barrett, if that's who they love but with offers pouring in when Cavs are sitting at #2 I would not trade back to 4 unless PHO was the one sitting at 3 where they might over pick White or Garland where Barrett falls to 4.


I personally think Barrett is good enough to take at #2 over Morant personally, so that idea isn't where I was thinking about it. I was basing it off of your original comment where if the Cavs were at #3, Zion & RJ go #1 and #2, you could see the Cavs taking someone other than Morant at #3 based on fit on the team. My idea is you take Morant at #3 because of his level as a prospect regardless compared to the others regardless, then if Phoenix or Chicago who are picking after us really want Morant and one of those players you feel are a better fit are still on the board, you have them make that pick for you and then send Morant for that player and either a top 3-5 protected 2020 1st or a young player that might just need a change or scenery like Josh Jackson.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#32 » by Stillwater » Tue May 7, 2019 10:22 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:^ I get the logic you both are suggesting, but the Cavs will have to be higher on somebody else than Morrant to trade back which seems pretty unlikely without significant offers,regardless of Ja's fit here and said player they are higher on if that is the case probably wouldn't be in play more than 1 pick later(Barrett) so I guess it comes down to just how bad PHO or CHI want Ja if one of them is sitting there at 4th. If either offered their own unprotected 2020 esp if it was PHO who projects to be worse than CHI being in the west I would trade back 1 spot and take Barrett, if that's who they love but with offers pouring in when Cavs are sitting at #2 I would not trade back to 4 unless PHO was the one sitting at 3 where they might over pick White or Garland where Barrett falls to 4.


I personally think Barrett is good enough to take at #2 over Morant personally, so that idea isn't where I was thinking about it. I was basing it off of your original comment where if the Cavs were at #3, Zion & RJ go #1 and #2, you could see the Cavs taking someone other than Morant at #3 based on fit on the team. My idea is you take Morant at #3 because of his level as a prospect regardless compared to the others regardless, then if Phoenix or Chicago who are picking after us really want Morant and one of those players you feel are a better fit are still on the board, you have them make that pick for you and then send Morant for that player and either a top 3-5 protected 2020 1st or a young player that might just need a change or scenery like Josh Jackson.

Yeah other than Zion,Barrett and Ja, nobody in this draft besides starter ceiling prospects like Culver who they would not want more than Ja are going to provide a high level of impact out of the gate really, and so I think with Ja there at 3 they don't trade him they take him...unless they are secretly higher on the long term impact of a Sekou or somebody else where maybe trading down 1 spot and 1 spot only makes sense except the team wanting Ja is unlikely to give up 2 future firsts which is the price I would expect them to ask and the price unlikely to be offered.
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
JonFromVA
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,189
And1: 1,634
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#33 » by JonFromVA » Wed May 8, 2019 3:47 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Stillwater wrote:^ I get the logic you both are suggesting, but the Cavs will have to be higher on somebody else than Morrant to trade back which seems pretty unlikely without significant offers,regardless of Ja's fit here and said player they are higher on if that is the case probably wouldn't be in play more than 1 pick later(Barrett) so I guess it comes down to just how bad PHO or CHI want Ja if one of them is sitting there at 4th. If either offered their own unprotected 2020 esp if it was PHO who projects to be worse than CHI being in the west I would trade back 1 spot and take Barrett, if that's who they love but with offers pouring in when Cavs are sitting at #2 I would not trade back to 4 unless PHO was the one sitting at 3 where they might over pick White or Garland where Barrett falls to 4.


I personally think Barrett is good enough to take at #2 over Morant personally, so that idea isn't where I was thinking about it. I was basing it off of your original comment where if the Cavs were at #3, Zion & RJ go #1 and #2, you could see the Cavs taking someone other than Morant at #3 based on fit on the team. My idea is you take Morant at #3 because of his level as a prospect regardless compared to the others regardless, then if Phoenix or Chicago who are picking after us really want Morant and one of those players you feel are a better fit are still on the board, you have them make that pick for you and then send Morant for that player and either a top 3-5 protected 2020 1st or a young player that might just need a change or scenery like Josh Jackson.

Yeah other than Zion,Barrett and Ja, nobody in this draft besides starter ceiling prospects like Culver who they would not want more than Ja are going to provide a high level of impact out of the gate really, and so I think with Ja there at 3 they don't trade him they take him...unless they are secretly higher on the long term impact of a Sekou or somebody else where maybe trading down 1 spot and 1 spot only makes sense except the team wanting Ja is unlikely to give up 2 future firsts which is the price I would expect them to ask and the price unlikely to be offered.


The Cavs ticket office can't coast on season ticket sales from when LeBron was on the team, they will want a top rookie to get fans excited and help sell tickets and Dan loves to make a splash. So, even trading back a couple of spots to get a player we like and getting a couple of future #1's might be something Dan would reject. Or maybe he decides he wants to rebuild this team around work-ethic and it's an easy decision. Just hard to know with this group.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#34 » by Stillwater » Wed May 8, 2019 9:48 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
I personally think Barrett is good enough to take at #2 over Morant personally, so that idea isn't where I was thinking about it. I was basing it off of your original comment where if the Cavs were at #3, Zion & RJ go #1 and #2, you could see the Cavs taking someone other than Morant at #3 based on fit on the team. My idea is you take Morant at #3 because of his level as a prospect regardless compared to the others regardless, then if Phoenix or Chicago who are picking after us really want Morant and one of those players you feel are a better fit are still on the board, you have them make that pick for you and then send Morant for that player and either a top 3-5 protected 2020 1st or a young player that might just need a change or scenery like Josh Jackson.

Yeah other than Zion,Barrett and Ja, nobody in this draft besides starter ceiling prospects like Culver who they would not want more than Ja are going to provide a high level of impact out of the gate really, and so I think with Ja there at 3 they don't trade him they take him...unless they are secretly higher on the long term impact of a Sekou or somebody else where maybe trading down 1 spot and 1 spot only makes sense except the team wanting Ja is unlikely to give up 2 future firsts which is the price I would expect them to ask and the price unlikely to be offered.


The Cavs ticket office can't coast on season ticket sales from when LeBron was on the team, they will want a top rookie to get fans excited and help sell tickets and Dan loves to make a splash. So, even trading back a couple of spots to get a player we like and getting a couple of future #1's might be something Dan would reject. Or maybe he decides he wants to rebuild this team around work-ethic and it's an easy decision. Just hard to know with this group.


They won't sell many tickets anyway this upcoming season until they start winning drafting anyone besides Zion so... I think it's a given they will take whatever assets they can get to build a winning team long term. Building it on work ethic alone isn't enough either...has to be elite upside to go that route imo. One thing is for sure, if they care more about work ethic and love of the game than elite upside there is a strong chance they over pick Culver for fit which I hope they do not unless sitting at 6.
I want Kevin Porter or Sekou at 4 if Barrett,Zion and Ja are off the board. But I'm not trading down for 1 of them without getting a significant haul meaning at least 2 1st rounders and at least 1 being a 90% likely high lottery 2020.
If they trade down a couple spots for Culver or Hunter if they are interested in the safe high floor options with Barrett or Ja sitting there they better get more assets than 2 lottery picks or it isn't worth it.
IDK to me it is always a crap shoot and I like all of these prospects to some extent but if you are passing on a surer thing you have to ask a hefty price even if doing so nets you a better team longterm.
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
JonFromVA
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,189
And1: 1,634
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#35 » by JonFromVA » Thu May 9, 2019 12:21 am

Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Yeah other than Zion,Barrett and Ja, nobody in this draft besides starter ceiling prospects like Culver who they would not want more than Ja are going to provide a high level of impact out of the gate really, and so I think with Ja there at 3 they don't trade him they take him...unless they are secretly higher on the long term impact of a Sekou or somebody else where maybe trading down 1 spot and 1 spot only makes sense except the team wanting Ja is unlikely to give up 2 future firsts which is the price I would expect them to ask and the price unlikely to be offered.


The Cavs ticket office can't coast on season ticket sales from when LeBron was on the team, they will want a top rookie to get fans excited and help sell tickets and Dan loves to make a splash. So, even trading back a couple of spots to get a player we like and getting a couple of future #1's might be something Dan would reject. Or maybe he decides he wants to rebuild this team around work-ethic and it's an easy decision. Just hard to know with this group.


They won't sell many tickets anyway this upcoming season until they start winning drafting anyone besides Zion so... I think it's a given they will take whatever assets they can get to build a winning team long term. Building it on work ethic alone isn't enough either...has to be elite upside to go that route imo. One thing is for sure, if they care more about work ethic and love of the game than elite upside there is a strong chance they over pick Culver for fit which I hope they do not unless sitting at 6.
I want Kevin Porter or Sekou at 4 if Barrett,Zion and Ja are off the board. But I'm not trading down for 1 of them without getting a significant haul meaning at least 2 1st rounders and at least 1 being a 90% likely high lottery 2020.
If they trade down a couple spots for Culver or Hunter if they are interested in the safe high floor options with Barrett or Ja sitting there they better get more assets than 2 lottery picks or it isn't worth it.
IDK to me it is always a crap shoot and I like all of these prospects to some extent but if you are passing on a surer thing you have to ask a hefty price even if doing so nets you a better team longterm.


Oh, I think Morant would get fans excited, and probably Barrett as well. Not insta-sellout before they even see the floor, but they'd sell tickets.

You know Dan loves a crap shoot, but after getting burned by Bennett and almost by Wiggins - it's understandable that work ethic and love of the game are being emphasized.

The biggest danger in any trade down scenario is that the future picks just suck. If we can get the player we want and get additional assets, obviously that's a no brainer; but short of that we'd better be very confident those future picks will pay off.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#36 » by Stillwater » Thu May 9, 2019 2:25 am

JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
The Cavs ticket office can't coast on season ticket sales from when LeBron was on the team, they will want a top rookie to get fans excited and help sell tickets and Dan loves to make a splash. So, even trading back a couple of spots to get a player we like and getting a couple of future #1's might be something Dan would reject. Or maybe he decides he wants to rebuild this team around work-ethic and it's an easy decision. Just hard to know with this group.


They won't sell many tickets anyway this upcoming season until they start winning drafting anyone besides Zion so... I think it's a given they will take whatever assets they can get to build a winning team long term. Building it on work ethic alone isn't enough either...has to be elite upside to go that route imo. One thing is for sure, if they care more about work ethic and love of the game than elite upside there is a strong chance they over pick Culver for fit which I hope they do not unless sitting at 6.
I want Kevin Porter or Sekou at 4 if Barrett,Zion and Ja are off the board. But I'm not trading down for 1 of them without getting a significant haul meaning at least 2 1st rounders and at least 1 being a 90% likely high lottery 2020.
If they trade down a couple spots for Culver or Hunter if they are interested in the safe high floor options with Barrett or Ja sitting there they better get more assets than 2 lottery picks or it isn't worth it.
IDK to me it is always a crap shoot and I like all of these prospects to some extent but if you are passing on a surer thing you have to ask a hefty price even if doing so nets you a better team longterm.


Oh, I think Morant would get fans excited, and probably Barrett as well. Not insta-sellout before they even see the floor, but they'd sell tickets.

You know Dan loves a crap shoot, but after getting burned by Bennett and almost by Wiggins - it's understandable that work ethic and love of the game are being emphasized.

The biggest danger in any trade down scenario is that the future picks just suck. If we can get the player we want and get additional assets, obviously that's a no brainer; but short of that we'd better be very confident those future picks will pay off.

exactly they rarely pay off... esp when you are giving up a immediate impact player to the team you are getting a pick from.
I would not trade down at all in most circumstances at #3 I would just take the guy who makes the most sense if Ja or Barrett or somebody else. AT 2 swap with whoever is at 3 esp if its the guy you wanted anyway makes a little more sense esp if the team is the Suns who have remained bad for so long with no expectation of a 1 yr flip
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
JonFromVA
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,189
And1: 1,634
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#37 » by JonFromVA » Thu May 9, 2019 3:37 am

Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
They won't sell many tickets anyway this upcoming season until they start winning drafting anyone besides Zion so... I think it's a given they will take whatever assets they can get to build a winning team long term. Building it on work ethic alone isn't enough either...has to be elite upside to go that route imo. One thing is for sure, if they care more about work ethic and love of the game than elite upside there is a strong chance they over pick Culver for fit which I hope they do not unless sitting at 6.
I want Kevin Porter or Sekou at 4 if Barrett,Zion and Ja are off the board. But I'm not trading down for 1 of them without getting a significant haul meaning at least 2 1st rounders and at least 1 being a 90% likely high lottery 2020.
If they trade down a couple spots for Culver or Hunter if they are interested in the safe high floor options with Barrett or Ja sitting there they better get more assets than 2 lottery picks or it isn't worth it.
IDK to me it is always a crap shoot and I like all of these prospects to some extent but if you are passing on a surer thing you have to ask a hefty price even if doing so nets you a better team longterm.


Oh, I think Morant would get fans excited, and probably Barrett as well. Not insta-sellout before they even see the floor, but they'd sell tickets.

You know Dan loves a crap shoot, but after getting burned by Bennett and almost by Wiggins - it's understandable that work ethic and love of the game are being emphasized.

The biggest danger in any trade down scenario is that the future picks just suck. If we can get the player we want and get additional assets, obviously that's a no brainer; but short of that we'd better be very confident those future picks will pay off.

exactly they rarely pay off... esp when you are giving up a immediate impact player to the team you are getting a pick from.
I would not trade down at all in most circumstances at #3 I would just take the guy who makes the most sense if Ja or Barrett or somebody else. AT 2 swap with whoever is at 3 esp if its the guy you wanted anyway makes a little more sense esp if the team is the Suns who have remained bad for so long with no expectation of a 1 yr flip


A PG is exactly what the Suns need though so you'd better believe Ja is going to struggle for a while before gift wrapping him to Phoenix.
Stillwater
General Manager
Posts: 9,906
And1: 2,540
Joined: Jun 15, 2017
   

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#38 » by Stillwater » Thu May 9, 2019 4:32 am

JonFromVA wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Oh, I think Morant would get fans excited, and probably Barrett as well. Not insta-sellout before they even see the floor, but they'd sell tickets.

You know Dan loves a crap shoot, but after getting burned by Bennett and almost by Wiggins - it's understandable that work ethic and love of the game are being emphasized.

The biggest danger in any trade down scenario is that the future picks just suck. If we can get the player we want and get additional assets, obviously that's a no brainer; but short of that we'd better be very confident those future picks will pay off.

exactly they rarely pay off... esp when you are giving up a immediate impact player to the team you are getting a pick from.
I would not trade down at all in most circumstances at #3 I would just take the guy who makes the most sense if Ja or Barrett or somebody else. AT 2 swap with whoever is at 3 esp if its the guy you wanted anyway makes a little more sense esp if the team is the Suns who have remained bad for so long with no expectation of a 1 yr flip


A PG is exactly what the Suns need though so you'd better believe Ja is going to struggle for a while before gift wrapping him to Phoenix.

Yep... I actually think Cavs swapping 3 for 5 & 9 if ATL really wants Barrett is somewhat reasonable if for some reason Cavs are not that high on Barrett over Sekou & Porter 1 or both of which should be there or someone else like Culver isn't a bad settle to pick up another lottery pick...but ATL would have to be pretty high on Barrett or somebody else as well.
In that scenario getting Sekou at 4 and picking up Bol or maybe Garland if he slides at 9 would be pretty solid.
AT the end of the day though just drafting RJ seems more likely
water aint the mirror unless you steal it
2019 REALGM draft contest winner
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 22,388
And1: 7,844
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#39 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:11 pm

The 25 Best Starts from NBA's Best Young Stars and Prospects

19. Collin Sexton, Cleveland Cavaliers

Image

Collin Sexton's future with the Cleveland Cavaliers is not without issue. He is more of an off-guard than a principal playmaker, but he hasn't flashed the stopping power to match. He's more energetic defending the ball than credited for, but he doesn't have the size to prevent bigger assignments from rising up and firing over him or the length to recover when players get by him.

Darius Garland and Kevin Porter Jr. only complicate Sexton's place. How do the Cavaliers juggle them long-term? Can they play them together? Can they assemble an average defense around even two of them?

Cleveland can figure out the macro matters later. Amassing talent is the priority now, and Sexton gives this team a potent, yet still underrated, offensive weapon.

It is officially time to declare him a good three-point shooter. He has followed up his 40.2 percent success rate from deep last season with a 42.2 percent clip on greater volume this year.
His off-the-bounce jumper is a project, but he has the off-guard element down. He's averaging 1.58 points per spot-up opportunity—the highest mark in the league among 156 players who have churned through 20 or more such possessions.

Don't call this a small-sample happy accident. It's not. Sexton finished in the 76th percentile of spot-up efficiency as a rookie and only improved as the season went on.


Doubting the variance in his offense is fair. He doesn't get to the line a ton, isn't a dependable finisher on drives and has an iffy in-between game. He'll need to polish a floater or step-back to be more than an ancillary option.

Bankable secondary scorers are valuable, though. That Sexton can play off the rest of the offense is arguably more useful to the Cavs as they navigate the next stages of their rebuild with Garland and Porter.
Bleacher Report
JonFromVA
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,189
And1: 1,634
Joined: Dec 08, 2009
     

Re: Fanbase Rookie Approval Rating: Collin Sexton 

Post#40 » by JonFromVA » Wed Nov 13, 2019 10:03 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:
The 25 Best Starts from NBA's Best Young Stars and Prospects

19. Collin Sexton, Cleveland Cavaliers

Image

Collin Sexton's future with the Cleveland Cavaliers is not without issue. He is more of an off-guard than a principal playmaker, but he hasn't flashed the stopping power to match. He's more energetic defending the ball than credited for, but he doesn't have the size to prevent bigger assignments from rising up and firing over him or the length to recover when players get by him.

Darius Garland and Kevin Porter Jr. only complicate Sexton's place. How do the Cavaliers juggle them long-term? Can they play them together? Can they assemble an average defense around even two of them?

Cleveland can figure out the macro matters later. Amassing talent is the priority now, and Sexton gives this team a potent, yet still underrated, offensive weapon.

It is officially time to declare him a good three-point shooter. He has followed up his 40.2 percent success rate from deep last season with a 42.2 percent clip on greater volume this year.
His off-the-bounce jumper is a project, but he has the off-guard element down. He's averaging 1.58 points per spot-up opportunity—the highest mark in the league among 156 players who have churned through 20 or more such possessions.

Don't call this a small-sample happy accident. It's not. Sexton finished in the 76th percentile of spot-up efficiency as a rookie and only improved as the season went on.


Doubting the variance in his offense is fair. He doesn't get to the line a ton, isn't a dependable finisher on drives and has an iffy in-between game. He'll need to polish a floater or step-back to be more than an ancillary option.

Bankable secondary scorers are valuable, though. That Sexton can play off the rest of the offense is arguably more useful to the Cavs as they navigate the next stages of their rebuild with Garland and Porter.
Bleacher Report


What is a "start" in this context?

Collin seems underrated at 19 given how high they've rated some of the rookies and peers who've proven far less ... but whatever ... bleacherreport.

Interesting looking back at this thread, I don't even see a mention of Garland; but we could effectively substitute the name Garland for Morant and that'd work.

Return to Cleveland Cavaliers