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Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion.

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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#221 » by KGdaBom » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:48 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
If we wanted to move up to the #1 spot, only giving up Nance is a no brainer no matter how much we like him. He's a high value big that can back-up both PF and C for us, but moving up to #1 if there was someone they wanted it needs to be done.

Now if they moved up to #1 the only options are Edwards and Wiseman, maybe an off chance of Avdija. I don't think Ball would even be in the discussion.

Thanks for the reply. Regarding Ball you and I may see him as being a terrible choice, but many supposedly brilliant minds see him in a tier by himself as the best prospect in the draft. Wolves have D'Angelo Russell who I believe most unbiased observers would consider superior to Sexton and Garland and they still think we should draft him #1. To me that's the biggest benefit of trading down so we don't draft him #1 :lol: .
I think people underrate Nance, but maybe I'm missing something. His stats are superb. Isn't his defense pretty good too or am I wrong about that? Can he defend the perimeter?


Oh Russell is definitely better than Sexton and Garland at this point, though I do have high hopes for Sexton surpassing him. Also I think the reason a lot of people still want the T'Wolves to draft Ball is that Russell can also play off-ball and with Ball's size they would have more than enough to not be destroyed defensively. I definitely don't see Ball as this tier alone player personally. I think he's vastly overrated after playing in a subpar league where he didn't even bother trying to play defense and the fact that he has the Ball family name and the hype that it seems to bring.

People definitely underrate Nance and I think he could even be a starting PF for a lot of teams, but he's also 27 and by the time that Love is off the books and our young core of players would be ready to start really competing he'll already be 30 and might not fit the timeline perfectly. So I wouldn't trade Nance for just scraps like people on T&T like to think he's worth, heck I don't know if I would even trade him for a late lotto pick in this draft, but for the right deal and scenario I don't think anyone on the team should be considered off-limits even Sexton who I'm super high on. Granted I would only trade Sexton if it was a key factor in getting a guy like Ben Simmons without having to gut the rest of the young core and future assets.

I like your reasoning. Nance's timeline that people like to talk about works out pretty well for the Wolves. He's 27 and I believe KAT and Russell are both 25. Wonder if the Wolves could keep #1 and pry Nance away from you with 17 and some sweeterner thrown in.
If Avdija could make his FTs I would actually draft him #1, but right now I got Wiseman and Okongwu above him. Trading down with you would almost certainly mean Wiseman is gone and with Nance we should probably go a different direction than Okongwu.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#222 » by Revenged25 » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:53 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Thanks for the reply. Regarding Ball you and I may see him as being a terrible choice, but many supposedly brilliant minds see him in a tier by himself as the best prospect in the draft. Wolves have D'Angelo Russell who I believe most unbiased observers would consider superior to Sexton and Garland and they still think we should draft him #1. To me that's the biggest benefit of trading down so we don't draft him #1 :lol: .
I think people underrate Nance, but maybe I'm missing something. His stats are superb. Isn't his defense pretty good too or am I wrong about that? Can he defend the perimeter?


Oh Russell is definitely better than Sexton and Garland at this point, though I do have high hopes for Sexton surpassing him. Also I think the reason a lot of people still want the T'Wolves to draft Ball is that Russell can also play off-ball and with Ball's size they would have more than enough to not be destroyed defensively. I definitely don't see Ball as this tier alone player personally. I think he's vastly overrated after playing in a subpar league where he didn't even bother trying to play defense and the fact that he has the Ball family name and the hype that it seems to bring.

People definitely underrate Nance and I think he could even be a starting PF for a lot of teams, but he's also 27 and by the time that Love is off the books and our young core of players would be ready to start really competing he'll already be 30 and might not fit the timeline perfectly. So I wouldn't trade Nance for just scraps like people on T&T like to think he's worth, heck I don't know if I would even trade him for a late lotto pick in this draft, but for the right deal and scenario I don't think anyone on the team should be considered off-limits even Sexton who I'm super high on. Granted I would only trade Sexton if it was a key factor in getting a guy like Ben Simmons without having to gut the rest of the young core and future assets.

I like your reasoning. Nance's timeline that people like to talk about works out pretty well for the Wolves. He's 27 and I believe KAT and Russell are both 25. Wonder if the Wolves could keep #1 and pry Nance away from you with 17 and some sweeterner thrown in.
If Avdija could make his FTs I would actually draft him #1, but right now I got Wiseman and Okongwu above him. Trading down with you would almost certainly mean Wiseman is gone and with Nance we should probably go a different direction than Okongwu.


Maybe the Cavs would trade Nance for #17, but I wouldn't. I'd want at a minimum around pick 10-13 for him in this draft. Plus with a lot of teams expected to want to sell picks this year, I wouldn't be surprised if a pick in the 18-22 range is available for just straight cash considerations.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#223 » by KGdaBom » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:55 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Oh Russell is definitely better than Sexton and Garland at this point, though I do have high hopes for Sexton surpassing him. Also I think the reason a lot of people still want the T'Wolves to draft Ball is that Russell can also play off-ball and with Ball's size they would have more than enough to not be destroyed defensively. I definitely don't see Ball as this tier alone player personally. I think he's vastly overrated after playing in a subpar league where he didn't even bother trying to play defense and the fact that he has the Ball family name and the hype that it seems to bring.

People definitely underrate Nance and I think he could even be a starting PF for a lot of teams, but he's also 27 and by the time that Love is off the books and our young core of players would be ready to start really competing he'll already be 30 and might not fit the timeline perfectly. So I wouldn't trade Nance for just scraps like people on T&T like to think he's worth, heck I don't know if I would even trade him for a late lotto pick in this draft, but for the right deal and scenario I don't think anyone on the team should be considered off-limits even Sexton who I'm super high on. Granted I would only trade Sexton if it was a key factor in getting a guy like Ben Simmons without having to gut the rest of the young core and future assets.

I like your reasoning. Nance's timeline that people like to talk about works out pretty well for the Wolves. He's 27 and I believe KAT and Russell are both 25. Wonder if the Wolves could keep #1 and pry Nance away from you with 17 and some sweeterner thrown in.
If Avdija could make his FTs I would actually draft him #1, but right now I got Wiseman and Okongwu above him. Trading down with you would almost certainly mean Wiseman is gone and with Nance we should probably go a different direction than Okongwu.


Maybe the Cavs would trade Nance for #17, but I wouldn't. I'd want at a minimum around pick 10-13 for him in this draft. Plus with a lot of teams expected to want to sell picks this year, I wouldn't be surprised if a pick in the 18-22 range is available for just straight cash considerations.

You are wise to not trade him for #17. Hopefully for my Wolves sake the Cavs management is not as wise as you. :D
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#224 » by Stillwater » Fri Sep 11, 2020 5:59 pm

Revenged25 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Oh Russell is definitely better than Sexton and Garland at this point, though I do have high hopes for Sexton surpassing him. Also I think the reason a lot of people still want the T'Wolves to draft Ball is that Russell can also play off-ball and with Ball's size they would have more than enough to not be destroyed defensively. I definitely don't see Ball as this tier alone player personally. I think he's vastly overrated after playing in a subpar league where he didn't even bother trying to play defense and the fact that he has the Ball family name and the hype that it seems to bring.

People definitely underrate Nance and I think he could even be a starting PF for a lot of teams, but he's also 27 and by the time that Love is off the books and our young core of players would be ready to start really competing he'll already be 30 and might not fit the timeline perfectly. So I wouldn't trade Nance for just scraps like people on T&T like to think he's worth, heck I don't know if I would even trade him for a late lotto pick in this draft, but for the right deal and scenario I don't think anyone on the team should be considered off-limits even Sexton who I'm super high on. Granted I would only trade Sexton if it was a key factor in getting a guy like Ben Simmons without having to gut the rest of the young core and future assets.

I like your reasoning. Nance's timeline that people like to talk about works out pretty well for the Wolves. He's 27 and I believe KAT and Russell are both 25. Wonder if the Wolves could keep #1 and pry Nance away from you with 17 and some sweeterner thrown in.
If Avdija could make his FTs I would actually draft him #1, but right now I got Wiseman and Okongwu above him. Trading down with you would almost certainly mean Wiseman is gone and with Nance we should probably go a different direction than Okongwu.


Maybe the Cavs would trade Nance for #17, but I wouldn't. I'd want at a minimum around pick 10-13 for him in this draft. Plus with a lot of teams expected to want to sell picks this year, I wouldn't be surprised if a pick in the 18-22 range is available for just straight cash considerations.

right nobody is giving a player like LNJ for a mid 1st in this draft ...not too mention the CLE ties with his Dad and it just seems absolutley impossible to justify moving him for anything less than some rediculous offer that would never come.
teams like Denver and Portland will probably pick intl stash options but their picks are definitely for sale and orgs like Miami Boston Toronto and LAL are also definitley not going to want rookies from a weak draft on Guaranteed deals so they will stash or pass too
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#225 » by KGdaBom » Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:23 pm

Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:I like your reasoning. Nance's timeline that people like to talk about works out pretty well for the Wolves. He's 27 and I believe KAT and Russell are both 25. Wonder if the Wolves could keep #1 and pry Nance away from you with 17 and some sweeterner thrown in.
If Avdija could make his FTs I would actually draft him #1, but right now I got Wiseman and Okongwu above him. Trading down with you would almost certainly mean Wiseman is gone and with Nance we should probably go a different direction than Okongwu.


Maybe the Cavs would trade Nance for #17, but I wouldn't. I'd want at a minimum around pick 10-13 for him in this draft. Plus with a lot of teams expected to want to sell picks this year, I wouldn't be surprised if a pick in the 18-22 range is available for just straight cash considerations.

right nobody is giving a player like LNJ for a mid 1st in this draft ...not too mention the CLE ties with his Dad and it just seems absolutley impossible to justify moving him for anything less than some rediculous offer that would never come.
teams like Denver and Portland will probably pick intl stash options but their picks are definitely for sale and orgs like Miami Boston Toronto and LAL are also definitley not going to want rookies from a weak draft on Guaranteed deals so they will stash or pass too

As Revenged25 and I agreed it would not be wise for Cleveland to trade Nance for #17, but I was intending some kind of sweetener to that deal. So we all agree. Where are you on Nance as the price to move up from 5 to 1? Revenged thought you would have to do it. What do you think?
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#226 » by Stillwater » Sat Sep 12, 2020 2:59 am

KGdaBom wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
Maybe the Cavs would trade Nance for #17, but I wouldn't. I'd want at a minimum around pick 10-13 for him in this draft. Plus with a lot of teams expected to want to sell picks this year, I wouldn't be surprised if a pick in the 18-22 range is available for just straight cash considerations.

right nobody is giving a player like LNJ for a mid 1st in this draft ...not too mention the CLE ties with his Dad and it just seems absolutley impossible to justify moving him for anything less than some rediculous offer that would never come.
teams like Denver and Portland will probably pick intl stash options but their picks are definitely for sale and orgs like Miami Boston Toronto and LAL are also definitley not going to want rookies from a weak draft on Guaranteed deals so they will stash or pass too

As Revenged25 and I agreed it would not be wise for Cleveland to trade Nance for #17, but I was intending some kind of sweetener to that deal. So we all agree. Where are you on Nance as the price to move up from 5 to 1? Revenged thought you would have to do it. What do you think?

I wouldnt bother trading up because the difference between Edwards and Okoro and Vassell really aint that great.I might do it if the cost was Garland but not Nance
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#227 » by KGdaBom » Sat Sep 12, 2020 3:18 am

Stillwater wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Stillwater wrote:right nobody is giving a player like LNJ for a mid 1st in this draft ...not too mention the CLE ties with his Dad and it just seems absolutley impossible to justify moving him for anything less than some rediculous offer that would never come.
teams like Denver and Portland will probably pick intl stash options but their picks are definitely for sale and orgs like Miami Boston Toronto and LAL are also definitley not going to want rookies from a weak draft on Guaranteed deals so they will stash or pass too

As Revenged25 and I agreed it would not be wise for Cleveland to trade Nance for #17, but I was intending some kind of sweetener to that deal. So we all agree. Where are you on Nance as the price to move up from 5 to 1? Revenged thought you would have to do it. What do you think?

I wouldnt bother trading up because the difference between Edwards and Okoro and Vassell really aint that great.I might do it if the cost was Garland but not Nance

Thanks for the reply.
IMO only a fool would be going for Edwards. Wiseman is the prize man :D . Just my opinion. Edwards probably doesn't suck.
Garland is still young. He has a chance to turn his career around, but I wouldn't be willing to gamble the #1 pick on that. I think Nance is about fair both ways. That's just me.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#228 » by Stillwater » Sat Sep 12, 2020 6:46 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:As Revenged25 and I agreed it would not be wise for Cleveland to trade Nance for #17, but I was intending some kind of sweetener to that deal. So we all agree. Where are you on Nance as the price to move up from 5 to 1? Revenged thought you would have to do it. What do you think?

I wouldnt bother trading up because the difference between Edwards and Okoro and Vassell really aint that great.I might do it if the cost was Garland but not Nance

Thanks for the reply.
IMO only a fool would be going for Edwards. Wiseman is the prize man :D . Just my opinion. Edwards probably doesn't suck.
Garland is still young. He has a chance to turn his career around, but I wouldn't be willing to gamble the #1 pick on that. I think Nance is about fair both ways. That's just me.

well this draft has a lot of boom bust options and WIseman is raw but has elite measureables to build on,Edwards is overrated because he also is raw from a decision tree standpoint, but make no mistake his handles and finishing ability are superb. I think the odds are increasing Ball is who the Wolves take because DLo can opperate next to a highly efficient playmaker better than people think
Thanks to isolation and becoming one with the darkness of self I have
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where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#229 » by KGdaBom » Sat Sep 12, 2020 7:25 pm

Stillwater wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
Stillwater wrote:I wouldnt bother trading up because the difference between Edwards and Okoro and Vassell really aint that great.I might do it if the cost was Garland but not Nance

Thanks for the reply.
IMO only a fool would be going for Edwards. Wiseman is the prize man :D . Just my opinion. Edwards probably doesn't suck.
Garland is still young. He has a chance to turn his career around, but I wouldn't be willing to gamble the #1 pick on that. I think Nance is about fair both ways. That's just me.

well this draft has a lot of boom bust options and WIseman is raw but has elite measureables to build on,Edwards is overrated because he also is raw from a decision tree standpoint, but make no mistake his handles and finishing ability are superb. I think the odds are increasing Ball is who the Wolves take because DLo can opperate next to a highly efficient playmaker better than people think

I fully agree that Edwards has potential, but Wiseman has POTENTIAL.

I will throw a brick through my TV and go jump off a bridge if the Wolves draft Ball. However, I will wait 24 hours in the hope that we just drafted him to trade him and will pull off a deal like when we drafted Mayo and then traded him for Love and Mike Miller.


Ball's shot is BROKEN beyond any hope of repair. He's also got below average athleticism and shows no interest in playing defense. Sure he has good ball handling skills and rebounds well for the PG position, but that's not enough to overcome his flaws.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#230 » by jbk1234 » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:01 pm

KGdaBom wrote:Hey Cavs fans. A wolves fan stopping by to get your thoughts on something. If you had the #1 pick who would you want. My personal nightmare is that we are going to draft Ball. That idea scares me so much that I'm hoping we trade down far enough to assure he is gone LOL.
Many brilliant basketball minds are saying Ball is by far the best prospect in this draft. You have Garland and Sexton. Sexton impressed the hell out of me last year with his volume and efficiency of scoring. Garland had a pretty brutal year. Neither is a pass first PG. Would you want Ball? Would you want Edwards or perhaps the much more versatile Wiseman to move on from Drummond?

If we are going to trade back a while ago somebody came to our board suggesting #1 for Larry Nance Jr and #5. Some people on our board thought we would be getting ripped off in that deal. I don't! I see Nance as an ideal PF for us. Can shoot 3s, can pass, defend the Rim and Perimeter. At #5 one of Okongwu or Avdija will be available. Since we'd have Nance Avdija would be preferable. Perhaps we go for Vassell. There's not a lot of downside to that deal and IMO Nance is a heck of a lot better than DeAndre Hunter who it was rumored we would accept to trade down to #6.

I'm asking for your best honest opinions and I know it's hard to do because we are all biased. Myself very much included. Would that be too much to give, too little or just right.


I'd want Wiseman, Okongwu, or Vassell. I suspect one of the three will be there at No. 5. I wouldn't trade Nance to grab Wiseman though. If none of the guys I want are there at No. 5, that means Edwards and/or Ball fell and I'm waiting by the phone to trade back in that scenario.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#231 » by Stillwater » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:17 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Thanks for the reply.
IMO only a fool would be going for Edwards. Wiseman is the prize man :D . Just my opinion. Edwards probably doesn't suck.
Garland is still young. He has a chance to turn his career around, but I wouldn't be willing to gamble the #1 pick on that. I think Nance is about fair both ways. That's just me.

well this draft has a lot of boom bust options and WIseman is raw but has elite measureables to build on,Edwards is overrated because he also is raw from a decision tree standpoint, but make no mistake his handles and finishing ability are superb. I think the odds are increasing Ball is who the Wolves take because DLo can opperate next to a highly efficient playmaker better than people think

I fully agree that Edwards has potential, but Wiseman has POTENTIAL.

I will throw a brick through my TV and go jump off a bridge if the Wolves draft Ball. However, I will wait 24 hours in the hope that we just drafted him to trade him and will pull off a deal like when we drafted Mayo and then traded him for Love and Mike Miller.


Ball's shot is BROKEN beyond any hope of repair. He's also got below average athleticism and shows no interest in playing defense. Sure he has good ball handling skills and rebounds well for the PG position, but that's not enough to overcome his flaws.

yeah his shot is broken and hes pretty much a chucker last season in a weak league... so the jury is still out if he can fix it , but I would not be surprised if the Wolves see a scenario where him and Dlo can play together even though Edwards is the better fit as is, and WIseman has higher upside
Id take Edwards or maybe reach a little on Okongwu if I really didnt like the offers to trade down if sitting at 1 as the Wolves gm
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#232 » by KGdaBom » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:47 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Hey Cavs fans. A wolves fan stopping by to get your thoughts on something. If you had the #1 pick who would you want. My personal nightmare is that we are going to draft Ball. That idea scares me so much that I'm hoping we trade down far enough to assure he is gone LOL.
Many brilliant basketball minds are saying Ball is by far the best prospect in this draft. You have Garland and Sexton. Sexton impressed the hell out of me last year with his volume and efficiency of scoring. Garland had a pretty brutal year. Neither is a pass first PG. Would you want Ball? Would you want Edwards or perhaps the much more versatile Wiseman to move on from Drummond?

If we are going to trade back a while ago somebody came to our board suggesting #1 for Larry Nance Jr and #5. Some people on our board thought we would be getting ripped off in that deal. I don't! I see Nance as an ideal PF for us. Can shoot 3s, can pass, defend the Rim and Perimeter. At #5 one of Okongwu or Avdija will be available. Since we'd have Nance Avdija would be preferable. Perhaps we go for Vassell. There's not a lot of downside to that deal and IMO Nance is a heck of a lot better than DeAndre Hunter who it was rumored we would accept to trade down to #6.

I'm asking for your best honest opinions and I know it's hard to do because we are all biased. Myself very much included. Would that be too much to give, too little or just right.


I'd want Wiseman, Okongwu, or Vassell. I suspect one of the three will be there at No. 5. I wouldn't trade Nance to grab Wiseman though. If none of the guys I want are there at No. 5, that means Edwards and/or Ball fell and I'm waiting by the phone to trade back in that scenario.

I have Wiseman and Okongwu 1-2 in this draft so we are thinking a lot alike. I like Vassell 6th. However if you would draft Wiseman why not trade Nance? Drummond, Wiseman, Love and Nance is a bit of overkill. I guess you can let Drummond walk.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#233 » by jbk1234 » Sat Sep 12, 2020 10:06 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Hey Cavs fans. A wolves fan stopping by to get your thoughts on something. If you had the #1 pick who would you want. My personal nightmare is that we are going to draft Ball. That idea scares me so much that I'm hoping we trade down far enough to assure he is gone LOL.
Many brilliant basketball minds are saying Ball is by far the best prospect in this draft. You have Garland and Sexton. Sexton impressed the hell out of me last year with his volume and efficiency of scoring. Garland had a pretty brutal year. Neither is a pass first PG. Would you want Ball? Would you want Edwards or perhaps the much more versatile Wiseman to move on from Drummond?

If we are going to trade back a while ago somebody came to our board suggesting #1 for Larry Nance Jr and #5. Some people on our board thought we would be getting ripped off in that deal. I don't! I see Nance as an ideal PF for us. Can shoot 3s, can pass, defend the Rim and Perimeter. At #5 one of Okongwu or Avdija will be available. Since we'd have Nance Avdija would be preferable. Perhaps we go for Vassell. There's not a lot of downside to that deal and IMO Nance is a heck of a lot better than DeAndre Hunter who it was rumored we would accept to trade down to #6.

I'm asking for your best honest opinions and I know it's hard to do because we are all biased. Myself very much included. Would that be too much to give, too little or just right.


I'd want Wiseman, Okongwu, or Vassell. I suspect one of the three will be there at No. 5. I wouldn't trade Nance to grab Wiseman though. If none of the guys I want are there at No. 5, that means Edwards and/or Ball fell and I'm waiting by the phone to trade back in that scenario.

I have Wiseman and Okongwu 1-2 in this draft so we are thinking a lot alike. I like Vassell 6th. However if you would draft Wiseman why not trade Nance? Drummond, Wiseman, Love and Nance is a bit of overkill. I guess you can let Drummond walk.
Drummond and Love shouldn't be factoring into it tbh. Hopefully, the Cavs will allow Drummond to expire and talk to him about coming back as a situational starter/bench player for a couple of years. I don't expect Drummond to be receptive to that, but it's where the league is headed.

I like Love and I think he's crazy underrated due to what he doesn't bring, but he's at a point in his career where you don't trade the younger guy so you can keep him. Also, Love and Nance are just fine together.

I want to keep Nance for the same reason you want to trade for him. He's a good player on a very reasonable contract who is young enough to build with.

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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#234 » by KGdaBom » Sat Sep 12, 2020 11:55 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
I'd want Wiseman, Okongwu, or Vassell. I suspect one of the three will be there at No. 5. I wouldn't trade Nance to grab Wiseman though. If none of the guys I want are there at No. 5, that means Edwards and/or Ball fell and I'm waiting by the phone to trade back in that scenario.

I have Wiseman and Okongwu 1-2 in this draft so we are thinking a lot alike. I like Vassell 6th. However if you would draft Wiseman why not trade Nance? Drummond, Wiseman, Love and Nance is a bit of overkill. I guess you can let Drummond walk.
Drummond and Love shouldn't be factoring into it tbh. Hopefully, the Cavs will allow Drummond to expire and talk to him about coming back as a situational starter/bench player for a couple of years. I don't expect Drummond to be receptive to that, but it's where the league is headed.

I like Love and I think he's crazy underrated due to what he doesn't bring, but he's at a point in his career where you don't trade the younger guy so you can keep him. Also, Love and Nance are just fine together.

I want to keep Nance for the same reason you want to trade for him. He's a good player on a very reasonable contract who is young enough to build with.

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Most people don't realize how good Nance is, but if we traded for Nance I'm sure Wiseman will be gone at 5 and having Nance would make me switch gears from Okongwu to a different player. Probably Vassell. Avdija if available, but probably gone also.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#235 » by jbk1234 » Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:58 am

KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:I have Wiseman and Okongwu 1-2 in this draft so we are thinking a lot alike. I like Vassell 6th. However if you would draft Wiseman why not trade Nance? Drummond, Wiseman, Love and Nance is a bit of overkill. I guess you can let Drummond walk.
Drummond and Love shouldn't be factoring into it tbh. Hopefully, the Cavs will allow Drummond to expire and talk to him about coming back as a situational starter/bench player for a couple of years. I don't expect Drummond to be receptive to that, but it's where the league is headed.

I like Love and I think he's crazy underrated due to what he doesn't bring, but he's at a point in his career where you don't trade the younger guy so you can keep him. Also, Love and Nance are just fine together.

I want to keep Nance for the same reason you want to trade for him. He's a good player on a very reasonable contract who is young enough to build with.

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Most people don't realize how good Nance is, but if we traded for Nance I'm sure Wiseman will be gone at 5 and having Nance would make me switch gears from Okongwu to a different player. Probably Vassell. Avdija if available, but probably gone also.
I mean only 4 teams are picking ahead of you at 5. Both Ball and Edwards would have to fall for that scenario to play out. Frankly, I'd prefer trade back if that were the case, but I suspect that the Cavs take Ball.

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It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#236 » by KGdaBom » Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:18 am

jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Drummond and Love shouldn't be factoring into it tbh. Hopefully, the Cavs will allow Drummond to expire and talk to him about coming back as a situational starter/bench player for a couple of years. I don't expect Drummond to be receptive to that, but it's where the league is headed.

I like Love and I think he's crazy underrated due to what he doesn't bring, but he's at a point in his career where you don't trade the younger guy so you can keep him. Also, Love and Nance are just fine together.

I want to keep Nance for the same reason you want to trade for him. He's a good player on a very reasonable contract who is young enough to build with.

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Most people don't realize how good Nance is, but if we traded for Nance I'm sure Wiseman will be gone at 5 and having Nance would make me switch gears from Okongwu to a different player. Probably Vassell. Avdija if available, but probably gone also.
I mean only 4 teams are picking ahead of you at 5. Both Ball and Edwards would have to fall for that scenario to play out. Frankly, I'd prefer trade back if that were the case, but I suspect that the Cavs take Ball.

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My completely hypothetical scenario is the Cavs trade up to 1 and send the Wolves 5 and Nance. The Cavs Select Wiseman or Ball it doesn't really matter which one. Warriors take the one not taken by the Bulls. Charlotte takes Edwards or Avdija and the Bulls take the one not taken. Okongwu is still available, but now that the Wolves have Nance he isn't much of a need so the Wolves take Vassell. Neither Edwards or Ball fell to the Cavs original #5 spot.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#237 » by Stillwater » Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:24 am

KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Most people don't realize how good Nance is, but if we traded for Nance I'm sure Wiseman will be gone at 5 and having Nance would make me switch gears from Okongwu to a different player. Probably Vassell. Avdija if available, but probably gone also.
I mean only 4 teams are picking ahead of you at 5. Both Ball and Edwards would have to fall for that scenario to play out. Frankly, I'd prefer trade back if that were the case, but I suspect that the Cavs take Ball.

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My completely hypothetical scenario is the Cavs trade up to 1 and send the Wolves 5 and Nance. The Cavs Select Wiseman or Ball it doesn't really matter which one. Warriors take the one not taken by the Bulls. Charlotte takes Edwards or Avdija and the Bulls take the one not taken. Okongwu is still available, but now that the Wolves have Nance he isn't much of a need so the Wolves take Vassell. Neither Edwards or Ball fell to the Cavs original #5 spot.

Dude they are not trading LNJ so they can draft anyone in this draft lol
Thanks to isolation and becoming one with the darkness of self I have
now harnessed a semi- permanent hypnagogic state of consciousness
where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
There's Mud in the moonshine- Stillwater
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#238 » by KGdaBom » Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:53 am

Stillwater wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:I mean only 4 teams are picking ahead of you at 5. Both Ball and Edwards would have to fall for that scenario to play out. Frankly, I'd prefer trade back if that were the case, but I suspect that the Cavs take Ball.

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My completely hypothetical scenario is the Cavs trade up to 1 and send the Wolves 5 and Nance. The Cavs Select Wiseman or Ball it doesn't really matter which one. Warriors take the one not taken by the Bulls. Charlotte takes Edwards or Avdija and the Bulls take the one not taken. Okongwu is still available, but now that the Wolves have Nance he isn't much of a need so the Wolves take Vassell. Neither Edwards or Ball fell to the Cavs original #5 spot.

Dude they are not trading LNJ so they can draft anyone in this draft lol

Probably not that's why I said totally hypothetical, but the original responder when I asked about the ideal made this reply.
If we wanted to move up to the #1 spot, only giving up Nance is a no brainer no matter how much we like him. He's a high value big that can back-up both PF and C for us, but moving up to #1 if there was someone they wanted it needs to be done.
None of us are the GMs for either teams. All we can do is speculate.It's fun to speculate. Nance and 5 is to me just about right. Doesn't favor either team much IMO. Most of the people on the Wolves board don't think Nance is worth the trade back. I disagree.
I think the Cavs have been doing Nance Dirty. He doesn't seem to get the respect from Cavs management that I think he's due.
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#239 » by Stillwater » Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:59 am

KGdaBom wrote:
Stillwater wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:My completely hypothetical scenario is the Cavs trade up to 1 and send the Wolves 5 and Nance. The Cavs Select Wiseman or Ball it doesn't really matter which one. Warriors take the one not taken by the Bulls. Charlotte takes Edwards or Avdija and the Bulls take the one not taken. Okongwu is still available, but now that the Wolves have Nance he isn't much of a need so the Wolves take Vassell. Neither Edwards or Ball fell to the Cavs original #5 spot.

Dude they are not trading LNJ so they can draft anyone in this draft lol

Probably not that's why I said totally hypothetical, but the original responder when I asked about the ideal made this reply.
If we wanted to move up to the #1 spot, only giving up Nance is a no brainer no matter how much we like him. He's a high value big that can back-up both PF and C for us, but moving up to #1 if there was someone they wanted it needs to be done.
None of us are the GMs for either teams. All we can do is speculate.It's fun to speculate. Nance and 5 is to me just about right. Doesn't favor either team much IMO. Most of the people on the Wolves board don't think Nance is worth the trade back. I disagree.
I think the Cavs have been doing Nance Dirty. He doesn't seem to get the respect from Cavs management that I think he's due.

He has been playing out of position a lot to cover for the lack of sf depth and he has done a decent job off the bench , but yes he should be a starter either next to Love or a heavy reserve back up to Love based on his overall defensive chops. I also love the passing ability which is what most who are not paying attn probably dont realize.
btw of course its hypothetical never thought it wasnt but imo their is absolute no chance they trade someone as good as he is on the deal he is to move up in this weak draft esp knowing his ties to the org are more than one generation
Thanks to isolation and becoming one with the darkness of self I have
now harnessed a semi- permanent hypnagogic state of consciousness
where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
There's Mud in the moonshine- Stillwater
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Re: Cavaliers 2020 Draft Discussion. 

Post#240 » by jbk1234 » Sun Sep 13, 2020 3:04 am

KGdaBom wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:Most people don't realize how good Nance is, but if we traded for Nance I'm sure Wiseman will be gone at 5 and having Nance would make me switch gears from Okongwu to a different player. Probably Vassell. Avdija if available, but probably gone also.
I mean only 4 teams are picking ahead of you at 5. Both Ball and Edwards would have to fall for that scenario to play out. Frankly, I'd prefer trade back if that were the case, but I suspect that the Cavs take Ball.

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My completely hypothetical scenario is the Cavs trade up to 1 and send the Wolves 5 and Nance. The Cavs Select Wiseman or Ball it doesn't really matter which one. Warriors take the one not taken by the Bulls. Charlotte takes Edwards or Avdija and the Bulls take the one not taken. Okongwu is still available, but now that the Wolves have Nance he isn't much of a need so the Wolves take Vassell. Neither Edwards or Ball fell to the Cavs original #5 spot.
I get the proposal. As a fan, I'm good with any one of Wiseman, Vassell, or Okenugwa. As a fan, I'm good with trading back if they're off the board because that will mean Ball and/or Edwards fell to us. It is only possible that 4 players will be off the board. Either one of the three I want will be there, or one of two highly rated guys will have fallen to us and the phone will start ringing. I see no need to part with Nance to trade up.

As an organization, the Cavs were rumored to be interested in Ball six months ago so they might keep the pick if he feel to them (even though I'd want them to squeeze a future first out of the Knicks). Presently, they're rumored to be looking to trade the pick for win-now talent. I'd put the chances of them trading up as slim.

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It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.

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