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Re-signing TT?

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Re-signing TT? 

Post#1 » by jbk1234 » Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:05 pm

Again, I'm not a fan of this.

https://www.si.com/nba/cavaliers/nba-amico/kevin-love-larry-nance-tristan-thompson-cleveland

It's time to move on. It has been for a couple of years. I'd gladly take him back as a bench big who played hard, was a good example to young guys, and a good locker room presence, but not at starter money. Honestly, if TT was worth the money Klutch was asking for, the Cavs wouldn't even be in the conversation. He'd go make it playing for a good team. But he can't. He's not worth the money he's asking for and he's unlikely to get it even from a bad team.

It is very, very easy to screw up your payroll as a bad mid-market team. Cap space is the one asset you can control.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#2 » by Revenged25 » Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:11 pm

jbk1234 wrote:Again, I'm not a fan of this.

https://www.si.com/nba/cavaliers/nba-amico/kevin-love-larry-nance-tristan-thompson-cleveland

It's time to move on. It has been for a couple of years. I'd gladly take him back as a bench big who played hard, was a good example to young guys, and a good locker room presence, but not at starter money. Honestly, if TT was worth the money Klutch was asking for, the Cavs wouldn't even be in the conversation. He'd go make it playing for a good team. But he can't. He's not worth the money he's asking for and he's unlikely to get it even from a bad team.

It is very, very easy to screw up your payroll as a bad mid-market team. Cap space is the one asset you can control.


If this is a 1 year deal, which is what every other article I've read is what TT is looking for, then I'd be fine paying him even above his market for 1 year if we don't draft Wiseman or Okongwu. If we do draft one of them then TT will have to make due with the MLE from another team. For a multi-year deal I wouldn't give him more than Nance but at that price TT could possibly be a good trade asset as although he's overpaid at $17 mil, at $11 mil AAV he's great value for what he brings as a starter/bench player with his defense, rebounding, and energy.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#3 » by Stillwater » Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:41 am

hell no please dont do this...
Thanks to isolation and becoming one with the darkness of self I have
now harnessed a semi- permanent hypnagogic state of consciousness
where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#4 » by jbk1234 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:02 am

Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Again, I'm not a fan of this.

https://www.si.com/nba/cavaliers/nba-amico/kevin-love-larry-nance-tristan-thompson-cleveland

It's time to move on. It has been for a couple of years. I'd gladly take him back as a bench big who played hard, was a good example to young guys, and a good locker room presence, but not at starter money. Honestly, if TT was worth the money Klutch was asking for, the Cavs wouldn't even be in the conversation. He'd go make it playing for a good team. But he can't. He's not worth the money he's asking for and he's unlikely to get it even from a bad team.

It is very, very easy to screw up your payroll as a bad mid-market team. Cap space is the one asset you can control.


If this is a 1 year deal, which is what every other article I've read is what TT is looking for, then I'd be fine paying him even above his market for 1 year if we don't draft Wiseman or Okongwu. If we do draft one of them then TT will have to make due with the MLE from another team. For a multi-year deal I wouldn't give him more than Nance but at that price TT could possibly be a good trade asset as although he's overpaid at $17 mil, at $11 mil AAV he's great value for what he brings as a starter/bench player with his defense, rebounding, and energy.
I mean if it's a reasonable one-year deal, then that's another potential trade asset at the deadline. But really, if it's anything other than that, it's a mistake.


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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#5 » by Revenged25 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:09 am

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:Again, I'm not a fan of this.

https://www.si.com/nba/cavaliers/nba-amico/kevin-love-larry-nance-tristan-thompson-cleveland

It's time to move on. It has been for a couple of years. I'd gladly take him back as a bench big who played hard, was a good example to young guys, and a good locker room presence, but not at starter money. Honestly, if TT was worth the money Klutch was asking for, the Cavs wouldn't even be in the conversation. He'd go make it playing for a good team. But he can't. He's not worth the money he's asking for and he's unlikely to get it even from a bad team.

It is very, very easy to screw up your payroll as a bad mid-market team. Cap space is the one asset you can control.


If this is a 1 year deal, which is what every other article I've read is what TT is looking for, then I'd be fine paying him even above his market for 1 year if we don't draft Wiseman or Okongwu. If we do draft one of them then TT will have to make due with the MLE from another team. For a multi-year deal I wouldn't give him more than Nance but at that price TT could possibly be a good trade asset as although he's overpaid at $17 mil, at $11 mil AAV he's great value for what he brings as a starter/bench player with his defense, rebounding, and energy.
I mean if it's a reasonable one-year deal, then that's another potential trade asset at the deadline. But really, if it's anything other than that, it's a mistake.


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Doesn't even need to be a "reasonable" 1 year deal. 1yr at 17 mil again works just fine too if we are using it simply as a trade chip for other teams to clear cap space ahead of '21 FA
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#6 » by jbk1234 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:15 am

Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
If this is a 1 year deal, which is what every other article I've read is what TT is looking for, then I'd be fine paying him even above his market for 1 year if we don't draft Wiseman or Okongwu. If we do draft one of them then TT will have to make due with the MLE from another team. For a multi-year deal I wouldn't give him more than Nance but at that price TT could possibly be a good trade asset as although he's overpaid at $17 mil, at $11 mil AAV he's great value for what he brings as a starter/bench player with his defense, rebounding, and energy.
I mean if it's a reasonable one-year deal, then that's another potential trade asset at the deadline. But really, if it's anything other than that, it's a mistake.


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Doesn't even need to be a "reasonable" 1 year deal. 1yr at 17 mil again works just fine too if we are using it simply as a trade chip for other teams to clear cap space ahead of '21 FA
Except, as we learned last year, contending teams aren't in a position to send out a bunch of pieces to match salaries to trade for an expiring $18M deal. You cut the number of teams interested in half.

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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#7 » by Revenged25 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:37 am

jbk1234 wrote:
Revenged25 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:I mean if it's a reasonable one-year deal, then that's another potential trade asset at the deadline. But really, if it's anything other than that, it's a mistake.


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Doesn't even need to be a "reasonable" 1 year deal. 1yr at 17 mil again works just fine too if we are using it simply as a trade chip for other teams to clear cap space ahead of '21 FA
Except, as we learned last year, contending teams aren't in a position to send out a bunch of pieces to match salaries to trade for an expiring $18M deal. You cut the number of teams interested in half.

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There also weren't any top FAs in this offseason. For 2021 there are a ton. I mean if Drummond is at 28 mil, Tristan is at 17-18 mil, and Exum is at 9 mil, that provides various price points for where teams are comfortable at unloading players to clear cap for the '21 FA class.

Take Memphis for example. They have a great core of Ja/JJJ/Clarke and can naturally get down to about ~80 mil in guaranteed contracts for the '21 offseason. But if they could move Jonas's 14 mil and Kyle Anderson's or Tyus Jones' 9 mil, they'd be sitting at around 65 mil in guaranteed salaries and could make a move for both Giannis and another big time player or multiple better role players around them. The ability to fit salaries, especially if all it does is cost Gilbert a little extra in tax for a season, makes a lot of sense even if a trade doesn't get made for TT as it provides more options.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#8 » by jbk1234 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:39 am

I think part of me is nervous about having too many guys in contract years on a rebuilding team, again.

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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#9 » by JonFromVA » Fri Aug 21, 2020 6:03 pm

I just hope that if we make Tristan an offer, it's a market-based deal this time around such that if he plays well, he'd actually be tradeable for assets. In that case, I'd prefer a multi-year deal. Actual talent at good value is easier to trade for value than an expiring where you're typically forced to absorb a bad deal.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#10 » by jbk1234 » Sun Aug 23, 2020 5:00 am

JonFromVA wrote:I just hope that if we make Tristan an offer, it's a market-based deal this time around such that if he plays well, he'd actually be tradeable for assets. In that case, I'd prefer a multi-year deal. Actual talent at good value is easier to trade for value than an expiring where you're typically forced to absorb a bad deal.
The thing about players on expiring contracts, is that you don't have to trade them. You can just let them walk. I like TT, but it's time to move on IMO. He wants to get paid, he won't like coming off the bench. There's no S&T with his Birds Rights in the offering like Klutch was hoping. We've been dealing with that dynamic for a while.

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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#11 » by JonFromVA » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:23 am

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:I just hope that if we make Tristan an offer, it's a market-based deal this time around such that if he plays well, he'd actually be tradeable for assets. In that case, I'd prefer a multi-year deal. Actual talent at good value is easier to trade for value than an expiring where you're typically forced to absorb a bad deal.
The thing about players on expiring contracts, is that you don't have to trade them. You can just let them walk. I like TT, but it's time to move on IMO. He wants to get paid, he won't like coming off the bench. There's no S&T with his Birds Rights in the offering like Klutch was hoping. We've been dealing with that dynamic for a while.


Of course they're hoping there's another big offer coming from the Cavs, but if they're even considering returning its because they realize his alternatives look shaky. Money will be tight and demand low.

And if he returns it will be with knowledge that he'll be coming off the bench (assuming Drummond returns).

If he returns I want him on a favorable deal; not just a deal which let's him get paid until Covid is over.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#12 » by jbk1234 » Wed Sep 9, 2020 5:27 pm

It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#13 » by JonFromVA » Wed Sep 9, 2020 6:27 pm

I'll take Tristan back at an affordable/tradeable price. His performance has been inconsistent and his next contract should reflect that. A few years ago, I'd argue he at least had a defined value as the guy you could put on an Al Horford in the playoffs and neutralize him, but these days? Who cares about Horford. You can have Tristan switch on guards, but about all you can say is that at least he'll try to contest their shot, and not many teams care about offensive rebounding.

I'm just not sure he'd want to come back to us on a cheap deal.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#14 » by jbk1234 » Wed Sep 9, 2020 10:17 pm

JonFromVA wrote:I'll take Tristan back at an affordable/tradeable price. His performance has been inconsistent and his next contract should reflect that. A few years ago, I'd argue he at least had a defined value as the guy you could put on an Al Horford in the playoffs and neutralize him, but these days? Who cares about Horford. You can have Tristan switch on guards, but about all you can say is that at least he'll try to contest their shot, and not many teams care about offensive rebounding.

I'm just not sure he'd want to come back to us on a cheap deal.
The problem is there are approximately 10 matchups league wide where TT just takes the L as a starter. Love actually defends bigger post players better.

Opposing bigs who play center-field defensively kill us because TT provides zero spacing and rolls to the rim to secure the rebound before the shot goes up.

Nothing about the box numbers surprised me tbh. Our defense rarely improves when Love comes off the floor.

So what is a team-friendly contract for a guy who is a situational starter on a good team? Is there any chance that TT will be happy with that? Who is he taking minutes from? It's time to wish him well IMO.

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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#15 » by JonFromVA » Wed Sep 9, 2020 11:53 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:I'll take Tristan back at an affordable/tradeable price. His performance has been inconsistent and his next contract should reflect that. A few years ago, I'd argue he at least had a defined value as the guy you could put on an Al Horford in the playoffs and neutralize him, but these days? Who cares about Horford. You can have Tristan switch on guards, but about all you can say is that at least he'll try to contest their shot, and not many teams care about offensive rebounding.

I'm just not sure he'd want to come back to us on a cheap deal.
The problem is there are approximately 10 matchups league wide where TT just takes the L as a starter. Love actually defends bigger post players better.

Opposing bigs who play center-field defensively kill us because TT provides zero spacing and rolls to the rim to secure the rebound before the shot goes up.

Nothing about the box numbers surprised me tbh. Our defense rarely improves when Love comes off the floor.

So what is a team-friendly contract for a guy who is a situational starter on a good team? Is there any chance that TT will be happy with that? Who is he taking minutes from? It's time to wish him well IMO.


He'd potentially be taking minutes from Jordan Bell, Dean Wade, or a draft-pick (tbd) and in exchange making some of the existing players happy.

Tristan won't like a low-ball offer, but I'm not sure he'll get better.

But TT did lead the team in 3pt% (among players with more than 4 attempts)... :lol:
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#16 » by jbk1234 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:32 am

JonFromVA wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:I'll take Tristan back at an affordable/tradeable price. His performance has been inconsistent and his next contract should reflect that. A few years ago, I'd argue he at least had a defined value as the guy you could put on an Al Horford in the playoffs and neutralize him, but these days? Who cares about Horford. You can have Tristan switch on guards, but about all you can say is that at least he'll try to contest their shot, and not many teams care about offensive rebounding.

I'm just not sure he'd want to come back to us on a cheap deal.
The problem is there are approximately 10 matchups league wide where TT just takes the L as a starter. Love actually defends bigger post players better.

Opposing bigs who play center-field defensively kill us because TT provides zero spacing and rolls to the rim to secure the rebound before the shot goes up.

Nothing about the box numbers surprised me tbh. Our defense rarely improves when Love comes off the floor.

So what is a team-friendly contract for a guy who is a situational starter on a good team? Is there any chance that TT will be happy with that? Who is he taking minutes from? It's time to wish him well IMO.


He'd potentially be taking minutes from Jordan Bell, Dean Wade, or a draft-pick (tbd) and in exchange making some of the existing players happy.

Tristan won't like a low-ball offer, but I'm not sure he'll get better.

But TT did lead the team in 3pt% (among players with more than 4 attempts)...
Absent context, I'm willing to give him a team-friendly, one-year deal as a place holder expiring contract. But we auditioned him as a trade piece last year and it backfired. It lead to him starting way too often, to the point where it obviously decreased both his trade and market value.

In terms of multi-year, team-friendly deal, he won't sign one and you're eventually going to want to start drafting and/or signing folks who you're going to want to give those minutes to.

It just feels like both parties could benefit from a change of scenery.

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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#17 » by JonFromVA » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:30 am

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:The problem is there are approximately 10 matchups league wide where TT just takes the L as a starter. Love actually defends bigger post players better.

Opposing bigs who play center-field defensively kill us because TT provides zero spacing and rolls to the rim to secure the rebound before the shot goes up.

Nothing about the box numbers surprised me tbh. Our defense rarely improves when Love comes off the floor.

So what is a team-friendly contract for a guy who is a situational starter on a good team? Is there any chance that TT will be happy with that? Who is he taking minutes from? It's time to wish him well IMO.


He'd potentially be taking minutes from Jordan Bell, Dean Wade, or a draft-pick (tbd) and in exchange making some of the existing players happy.

Tristan won't like a low-ball offer, but I'm not sure he'll get better.

But TT did lead the team in 3pt% (among players with more than 4 attempts)...
Absent context, I'm willing to give him a team-friendly, one-year deal as a place holder expiring contract. But we auditioned him as a trade piece last year and it backfired. It lead to him starting way too often, to the point where it obviously decreased both his trade and market value.

In terms of multi-year, team-friendly deal, he won't sign one and you're eventually going to want to start drafting and/or signing folks who you're going to want to give those minutes to.

It just feels like both parties could benefit from a change of scenery.


Yeah, I'd written him off, figured he was gone ... but then Covid happened, he reopened the door and garnered some support from teammates.
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Re: Re-signing TT? 

Post#18 » by Stillwater » Fri Sep 11, 2020 1:15 am

they cannot resign him even if cheap if he is not in the long term plan imo which would not make a lot of sense at all really given they already have Loves front court veteran presence in place a few seasons.But they may see him as being in his prime despite most players of his type being past their prime by 29
Thanks to isolation and becoming one with the darkness of self I have
now harnessed a semi- permanent hypnagogic state of consciousness
where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
There's Mud in the moonshine- Stillwater

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