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Simmons Possible?

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JonFromVA
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Re: Simmons Possible? 

Post#21 » by JonFromVA » Wed Jun 23, 2021 3:32 pm

KuruptedCav wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
KuruptedCav wrote:I don’t think you can add Simmons by sending shooting out.

I’d go Prince, Okoro, Osman, and 2022 FRP assuming the ping pong go against tonight.

The only reason I’d want Simmons is to play Point Forward on offense and free safety on Defense.

Give me: Allen/Love/Simmons/Sexton/Garland with Nance as my 6th man and I’d tune in to watch. But that tax bill…


I get Simmons would move the needle, but even forgetting about the money I think I'd rather try my luck with Okoro and our first rounder. We can have another creator in the lineup, but he has to be able to play off the ball, or what the heck are Garland/Sexton doing besides watching Ben or having to beat their man, Ben's man, and Jarrett's man every time they try to drive?

And on the flip side, did you aggregate enough salary to match Simmons and his trade kicker? And what does our poo-poo platter do for Philly when they want to continue to contend? They'd either need to move our pieces in a 3-way or toss a season while some of those contracts expire and they can go shopping in free-agency.

Anyway, I think the topic is worth discussing, but I think we'd need to move a lot more pieces around for Simmons to make any sense on the Cavs.

JonFromVA wrote:
KuruptedCav wrote:I don’t think you can add Simmons by sending shooting out.

I’d go Prince, Okoro, Osman, and 2022 FRP assuming the ping pong go against tonight.

The only reason I’d want Simmons is to play Point Forward on offense and free safety on Defense.

Give me: Allen/Love/Simmons/Sexton/Garland with Nance as my 6th man and I’d tune in to watch. But that tax bill…


I get Simmons would move the needle, but even forgetting about the money I think I'd rather try my luck with Okoro and our first rounder. We can have another creator in the lineup, but he has to be able to play off the ball, or what the heck are Garland/Sexton doing besides watching Ben or having to beat their man, Ben's man, and Jarrett's man every time they try to drive?

And on the flip side, did you aggregate enough salary to match Simmons and his trade kicker? And what does our poo-poo platter do for Philly when they want to continue to contend? They'd either need to move our pieces in a 3-way or toss a season while some of those contracts expire and they can go shopping in free-agency.

Anyway, I think the topic is worth discussing, but I think we'd need to move a lot more pieces around for Simmons to make any sense on the Cavs.

I would expect Garland, Sexton and Love would need to learn to play off the ball and take more 3pt shots. With Simmons and Love at the forward positions and Garland in the backcourt, there should be enough ball movement to get them open.

I don’t know if I aggregated enough. It worked this year in the trade machine, I didn’t do the maths.

Im not saying it’s a good idea or that it’s work. Just that you need the shooters to work. Similar to the way the Suns, Nets and Mavs tried to build around Jason Kidd.

… any scenario is dependent on Ben learning to shoot a free throw. Worth talking about because Cleveland and talent…

Okoro or pick gets themLowry?


Lowry is a free-agent, no?

And ball movement isn't the issue so much as what is Ben going to do in the half-court when his man and Allen's man are standing in the paint preventing him, Garland, and Sexton from doing anything besides tossing up contested floaters?

In Philly, Embiid had to step out of the paint, shoot J's, and handle the ball more. Not exactly the best use of Jarrett Allen.

I don't want to overvalue players who still haven't proven they can contribute to winning yet, but I think I'd rather just keep Okoro. He shows promise he can do things with the ball in his hands like make smart passes and he already shoots 3's and FT's at a much higher level than Ben. He's going to be a good defender. He won't dominate the basketball, and he's not about to be earning $40M/yr or whatever Ben's going to make after his trade kicker.

I'm simply not optimistic about the chances the Cavs organization would be able to unlock Ben Simmons, move him to a position that might be more productive for him, let alone build a team that makes sense around him.
jbk1234
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Re: Simmons Possible? 

Post#22 » by jbk1234 » Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:45 pm

Things that would have to happen if the Cavs traded for Simmons: (1) We'd have to trade Allen, and worse yet, if he got a big offer sheet, we'd have to seriously think about not matching it. (2) We'd have to trade punt on any type of Sexton extension until we saw how he and Simmons played together. I'm incredibly skeptical that a guy who won't shoot from the outside at all and a guy who always prefers to drive can play together. If it doesn't work out, then you're trading Sexton at pretty steep discount in-season. (3) Okoro would absolutely have to develop a reliable outside shot or we'd have to trade him as well.

I'm just not terribly interested in trading for a max player who can't shoot when it would require a pretty significant roster overhaul to make work. Especially when it would likely turn the Cavs into distressed sellers who couldn't get fair value for what they were sending out.
It is highly unlikely that the Cavs will agree with your Kevin Love evaluation for the purpose of a trade.

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