Shawn Marion

Post #1 » by **TheOUTLAW** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 1:13 am

A few years ago there were several Cavs fans that really wanted this guy.

He's likely to be a free agent after this year (although he'd be stupid to opt out of a +17 mil contract). He really has appeared to me to be a cancer in most of his stops. A player that has more confidence in his ability than he should.

Are you happy the Cavs didn't pursue him, or do you still think he's someone that'd help the team?

Niko23 · Post #2 » by **Niko23** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 1:22 am

I have never been a Marion guy. I think that he was a product of a very good system.....nothing more.

FlightNo.23 · Post #3 » by **FlightNo.23** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 1:39 am

Well I think he can bring a lot. A good perimeter defender that would guard the other team's best player and can block shots/force turnovers. Plus it'd help our transition game too. Having Delonte pushing it and having LeBron and Marion as two great finishers would definitely be a plus.

On the downside, he's what? 31 or 32 now? And he has an atitude similar to Hughes. I read that Phoenix Suns book 7 second or less and when after a big Suns playoff win he was whiny. He said something along the lines of "whenever we lose it's my fault and whenever we win its not because of me." Mike D'Antoni basically had to alter his post game comments to give props to Marion on seeing this.

heathmalc · Post #4 » by **heathmalc** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 1:49 am

Niko23 wrote:I have never been a Marion guy. I think that he was a product of a very good system.....nothing more.

I disagree. In 8 games with Miami he has continued to shoot a high percentage (47%), while getting almost 1 more rebound per game (10.9), 1 more assist per game (3.1), and 1 more point per game (16.

.

Those are pretty much the same as his career stats. So his numbers go against your theory of him being a "system" guy.

I DEFINITELY think Marion would be a huge pickup for us - but not at 17 million.

If we could trade expiring contracts head-up for him, then I'd do it in a second. Otherwise, we don't need someone crying about needing to feed their family because they only make 17 million a year.

Marion is without question a TOP talent in the league. However, with us having LeBron, we'd do better with a couple cheaper guys who were consistent, but perhaps not as talented as Marion.

A few players that I wouldn't mind doing a deal for:

Baron Davis
Jason Kidd (He is too good. He makes plays so easily that it's sickening)
Devin Harris (Don't forget that the Nets have another point-guard they were grooming)
Gilbert Arenas? (Dunno if this would work..but it may be a good move)
A top-5 pick in this year's draft ( WAY TOO MUCH talent to miss out on this group!!!! )

I'm sure there are some others that will be available this off-season, but those are the ones I can think of that I'd like to see in Cleveland*

* Technically Jason Kidd wont be available. However, if the Mavericks don't at-least make it to the conference finals, then I think the Mavericks may move him.

SonicYouth34 · Post #5 » by **SonicYouth34** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 2:14 am

what about Michael Redd? He'd average 30+ with LeBron dishing the rock to him on his drives

eyejayem · Post #6 » by **eyejayem** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 2:16 am

I'd add Andre Iguodala to that group. I think he would play better with less pressure, is defensive 1st and could play the sg but has to improve his jump shot. Plus he's 23 or 24 and would be a great core for Lebron and AI to start. Show Gilbert he is right and become Scottie Pippen.

I'd just rather a defensive SG over an offensive one. Someone who can stop those top tier Guards.

As far as Marion , I agree with if we can pick him up for expirings. That could be sick with Wallace,Marion, and James in the front court,the athletic freaks.

But I think we can get Baron Davis because I dont see them keeping Andre Biedrins, Monte Ellis, and Baron unless they get rid of Al harringtn and stephen jackson.

Niko23 · Post #7 » by **Niko23** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 2:59 am

I disagree. In 8 games with Miami he has continued to shoot a high percentage (47%), while getting almost 1 more rebound per game (10.9), 1 more assist per game (3.1), and 1 more point per game (16..

They lost 6 of those 8 games.....moreover Miami has not played an important game all year

Baseline Runner · Post #8 » by **Baseline Runner** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 4:10 am

Shawn Marion has been one of the most overrated players in the NBA for years. He's not a top 50 player in the league.

If we acquired him he'd still help us, and he'd probably do well alongside Lebron, but there are so many other players I'd rather go after with a contract and a starting job.

chrice · Post #9 » by **chrice** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 6:48 am

Niko23 wrote:I have never been a Marion guy. I think that he was a product of a very good system.....nothing more.

Dude, When did you start watching basketball? Marion was putting up close to 20/10 before Nash and D'Antoni came along. Marion was always a great player off the ball, I don't know what you're talking about.

Post #10 » by **crackjack** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 9:14 am

The system helped out Marion quite a bit, but he's a talented player as well.

I think he could form a pretty good duo with James.

Also, the Cavaliers could be pretty formidable defensively with Marion and Wallace.

Joseph17 · Post #11 » by **Joseph17** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 9:28 am

He could have been a lot better than he is right now if he had better shooting mechanics and the ability to create off the dribble. The only sf in the game that has better combination of speed, strength, and athleticism than Marion is Lebron. I think that the Cavs would be better with him, but I don't think he'd be good enough to make the Cavs a contender.

heathmalc · Post #12 » by **heathmalc** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 11:48 am

People have said that Miami lost 6 of the 8 games that Marion played in...

Well here's a ticker: Miami only won a total of 9 games in 50 BEFORE he went there.

Before Marion: Miami won LESS than 1 in 5

AFTER Marion, they win 1 in 4.

That is an improvement.

But...beyond that, I never said that Marion would be able to make a horrible team great. Wade is Miami's man..not Marion. He can only do so much.

But in Cleveland he'd be surrounded by talent.

In Miami he's surrounded by idiots, except Wade.

For those of you that keep mentioning Michael Redd - #1 Michael Redd is NOT going to leave Milwaukee. #2 Michael Redd is a worse defender than Damon Jones and Wally Szczerbiak. Redd doesn't even attempt to play defense.

eyejayem · Post #13 » by **eyejayem** » Mon Mar 3, 2008 8:15 pm

I second the Michael Redd not playing defense and would rather a defensive sg upgrade over almost any other position.

eyejayem · Post #14 » by **eyejayem** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 1:33 am

I dont care for the double post.lol.

If we get a wing to team with Lebron I'd truthfully much rather them be competent defensively over offense since we are a defensive team. I would love a scoring wing but when we play the Kobe, Wade, etc of the league I want that stopper, not the guy who is going to try and out shoot them. I dont care if NJ takes Wally straight up for Carter, thats not really going in the right direction. Out of all the guys we speak about Mike Miller is probably best because his versatility in ball handling,rebounding, and good shooter. But his defense and team play is the best out of the guys we speak about. No to Vince, Michael Redd, or any other team cancer, no defense playing, overpaid players.

I'll settle for Mike Miller, or even Stephen Jackson(yes about to turn 30 but wants to be back in the East). I'd give up a lot to team Lebron with Andre Iguodala(Scottie Pippen...ask Gilbert) and hopefully Lebron can share his shooting coach.

And Michael Redd isnt the player I would target on Milwaukee since they are trying to get rid of players. I would try Mo Williams before Redd but thats just me.

Baseline Runner · Post #15 » by **Baseline Runner** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 2:22 am

Before Nash, Marion had Kidd running fastbreaks. The only year he was without a PG he won 29 games with Stoudamire. The last couple of years his scoring and rebounding has been dropping off despite the Suns scoring as much as ever. He was relegated to a role player expected to rebound while getting occasional transition and garbage points. Its no surprise that Miami is still losing with him.

In my opinion we need a legitimate second option to go alongside Lebron, a player that teams need to fear and focus on. We don't necessarily need a swingman to fill that roll, but it makes most sense acquiring one since we are weakest at SG and there is an abundance of scoring swingmen. My first choice would be Artest and second would be Michael Redd. Both players are still in their prime.

cavshats · Post #16 » by **cavshats** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 7:41 am

joeyyowee wrote:He could have been a lot better than he is right now if he had better shooting mechanics and the ability to create off the dribble. The only sf in the game that has better combination of speed, strength, and athleticism than Marion is Lebron. I think that the Cavs would be better with him, but I don't think he'd be good enough to make the Cavs a contender.

hed make us better but not a contender?? ummm werent we in the finals last year? i cant believe that we still get no credit for that

heathmalc · Post #17 » by **heathmalc** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 8:11 am

cavshats wrote:hed make us better but not a contender?? ummm werent we in the finals last year? i cant believe that we still get no credit for that

good point! :clap:

CzBoobie · Post #18 » by **CzBoobie** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 9:02 am

cavshats wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

hed make us better but not a contender?? ummm werent we in the finals last year? i cant believe that we still get no credit for that

The Pistons are much better this year and we didn't win it last year, they just lost it. Plus we played two NBDL teams on our way to the ECF and got destroyed in the Finals because we had no business to be there at first place [/green font]

Post #19 » by **TheOUTLAW** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 12:03 pm

The Pistons didn't lose it last year, we took it from them. They are deeper this year and maybe a bit more focused but if get to how we were playing at that time they'd have just as much trouble with us as they did last year.

andyhop · Post #20 » by **andyhop** » Tue Mar 4, 2008 1:35 pm

heathmalc wrote:
I disagree. In 8 games with Miami he has continued to shoot a high percentage (47%), while getting almost 1 more rebound per game (10.9), 1 more assist per game (3.1), and 1 more point per game (16..

Those are pretty much the same as his career stats. So his numbers go against your theory of him being a "system" guy.

He is a system guy to the extent that playing with Nash made him one of the more efficient scorers in the league, whilst without Nash he still scores but nowhere near as efficiently.

Just check out his eFG% pre-Nash in Phoenix,with Nash and in Miami to see how big an effect Nash had on it.