2017 Trade Rumors Thread

bdpecore · Post #141 » by **bdpecore** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 5:11 pm

I'm not all for letting this roster continue to grow organically but if we can get a solid #2 starter who we control for 2-3 years after this season for prospects at positions of depth then I say go for it. Brinson/Ray and Diaz for Grey works for all parties.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

M-C-G · Post #142 » by **M-C-G** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 5:13 pm

wichmae wrote:Basically the packages probably start with Ray and Woodruff or Burnes with another guy like Diaz or Dubon. Then a lotto ticket type of guy like Mclanahan or Demi. Its just not smart for us to be doing this.

I have a really hard time seeing a guy like Stearns part with any of his top pitching prospects. If that is the cost, I don't think he'd be buying.

Turk Nowitzki · Post #143 » by **Turk Nowitzki** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 5:20 pm

wichmae wrote:Basically the packages probably start with Ray and Woodruff or Burnes with another guy like Diaz or Dubon. Then a lotto ticket type of guy like Mclanahan or Demi. Its just not smart for us to be doing this.

I'm on your side of this right now but just to devil's advocate a bit, at some point we could/should have to deal away our excess middle infielders and/or outfielders to fortify our pitching. Is now the right time? I lean towards "no".

WeekapaugGroove · Post #144 » by **WeekapaugGroove** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 5:38 pm

wichmae wrote:Basically the packages probably start with Ray and Woodruff or Burnes with another guy like Diaz or Dubon. Then a lotto ticket type of guy like Mclanahan or Demi. Its just not smart for us to be doing this.

Yeah at that price it would be foolish. Burnes would be untouchable for me. Heck I'd rather just see if woodruff can bolster the rotation than look outside at that cost.

Now if they want to gamble on a guy who another team wants to salary dump and would only cost a middling prospect I'd be fine with that. Profits have be sky high this year so I dont mind using some of that cash to improve.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

LittleRooster · Post #145 » by **LittleRooster** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 6:00 pm

I know people are saying, "I trust Stearns wouldn't trade player x, y, z" but when he was with the Astros we got a nice package for Gomez/Fiers. Granted he wasn't the GM, but he was involved in that deal.

Turk Nowitzki · Post #146 » by **Turk Nowitzki** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 6:28 pm

LittleRooster wrote:I know people are saying, "I trust Stearns wouldn't trade player x, y, z" but when he was with the Astros we got a nice package for Gomez/Fiers. Granted he wasn't the GM, but he was involved in that deal.

There's no way to know what kind of say he did or didn't have in that deal. For all we know he could've been the biggest champion of that trade or he might've been begging their GM not to do it. We do know that he's been nearly flawless since taking over here. He's earned some trust.

ackypoo · Post #147 » by **ackypoo** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 6:49 pm

if youre not going to trade for a pitcher of quintanas caliber thats under team control for another 3 years, what are you going to trade for?

Kerb Hohl · Post #148 » by **Kerb Hohl** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 6:58 pm

Turk Nowitzki wrote:
LittleRooster wrote:I know people are saying, "I trust Stearns wouldn't trade player x, y, z" but when he was with the Astros we got a nice package for Gomez/Fiers. Granted he wasn't the GM, but he was involved in that deal.

There's no way to know what kind of say he did or didn't have in that deal. For all we know he could've been the biggest champion of that trade or he might've been begging their GM not to do it. We do know that he's been nearly flawless since taking over here. He's earned some trust.

Also, while it seems as though the Brewers clearly won that deal (Fiers is doing fairly well for the 'stros this year and Hader/Phillips have proven nothing in the majors, Santana is good)...the Astros are still doing just fine.

I'm not saying, "hey, let's just lose a trade and we'll be fine" but one of these trades won't crush you if you're well-run.

Turk Nowitzki · Post #149 » by **Turk Nowitzki** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 7:41 pm

ackypoo wrote:if youre not going to trade for a pitcher of quintanas caliber thats under team control for another 3 years, what are you going to trade for?

Take a look at Quintana's stats this year. Sure he's probably a bit better than that but I'm not assembling a huge package of prospects for a guy who is pitching at a Garza-esque level this year.

LittleRooster · Post #150 » by **LittleRooster** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 8:50 pm

I wasn't saying not to trust Stearns, because I do. But I'm nervous about what sort of package we'd deal

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mlloyd10 · Post #151 » by **mlloyd10** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 8:55 pm

Turk Nowitzki wrote:
ackypoo wrote:if youre not going to trade for a pitcher of quintanas caliber thats under team control for another 3 years, what are you going to trade for?

Take a look at Quintana's stats this year. Sure he's probably a bit better than that but I'm not assembling a huge package of prospects for a guy who is pitching at a Garza-esque level this year.

Last 5 starts - 1.79 ERA 30inn, 30K

Edit - That was June

Last 6 starts 2.34 ERA

wichmae · Post #152 » by **wichmae** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 9:00 pm

ackypoo wrote:if youre not going to trade for a pitcher of quintanas caliber thats under team control for another 3 years, what are you going to trade for?

Someone who can carry a rotation during a playoff series. None of the guys available are those level of players. Im not giving up a package of top guys unless Im getting a Chris Sale level of player back.

WeekapaugGroove · Post #153 » by **WeekapaugGroove** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 9:10 pm

I know this is rarity but are there any teams out there with an abundance of young starters that might want to upgrade their offense down in the farm? That's the type of deal I wouldn't mind including someone like Ray in.

ackypoo · Post #154 » by **ackypoo** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 9:14 pm

wichmae wrote:
ackypoo wrote:if youre not going to trade for a pitcher of quintanas caliber thats under team control for another 3 years, what are you going to trade for?

Someone who can carry a rotation during a playoff series. None of the guys available are those level of players. Im not giving up a package of top guys unless Im getting a Chris Sale level of player back.

are you saying they shouldnt make any moves, continue to have a stocked farm?

surely, we have an abundance of talent available in the farm, if quintana is available for a decent price, this move makes sense.

wichmae · Post #155 » by **wichmae** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 9:25 pm

ackypoo wrote:
wichmae wrote:
ackypoo wrote:if youre not going to trade for a pitcher of quintanas caliber thats under team control for another 3 years, what are you going to trade for?

Someone who can carry a rotation during a playoff series. None of the guys available are those level of players. Im not giving up a package of top guys unless Im getting a Chris Sale level of player back.

are you saying they shouldnt make any moves, continue to have a stocked farm?

surely, we have an abundance of talent available in the farm, if quintana is available for a decent price, this move makes sense.

Its not a decent price though. Thats the problem. The ask on these players is way more than theyre worth. Again, if Im giving up three or four top 100 guys I want back a #1 that can carry a staff. Quintana and Gray are not on that level. Basically none of the guys out there right now are worth the package theyll give up. If the price was "decent" he would have been traded in the off-season or at some point already during the season. Its been widely reported they want a Sale type of package back for him which is incredibly stupid for us to do. Quintana or Gray are not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series.

El Duderino · Post #156 » by **El Duderino** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 9:57 pm

wichmae wrote:Its not a decent price though. Thats the problem. The ask on these players is way more than theyre worth. Again, if Im giving up three or four top 100 guys I want back a #1 that can carry a staff. Quintana and Gray are not on that level. Basically none of the guys out there right now are worth the package theyll give up. If the price was "decent" he would have been traded in the off-season or at some point already during the season. Its been widely reported they want a Sale type of package back for him which is incredibly stupid for us to do. Quintana or Gray are not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series.

A few thoughts

1. I wouldn't include Woodruff or Burnes in any trade for Quintana and Gray, but i wouldn't be automatically opposed to Hader who i have real doubts that he can stick as a starter.

2. If Chicago wanted a Sale like return for Quintana, i'd hang up the phone quickly and so should Stearns.

3. As for either of Quintana or Gray not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series, you simply cant know that. The last decade or so has shown just how unpredictable MLB playoffs have been and that needing a true ace is no longer an absolute necessity to advance. Plenty of teams with an ace or even aces have gotten bounced early while other teams with just solid starters advance. The by far biggest key is just getting into the playoffs and both Quintana/Gray would be controlled for multiple seasons, not just this year.

Bottom line for me resides entirely on who we'd have to send for either guy. We have many prospects, more than who would ever make the big league roster. A reasonable deal i'd be fine with. The A's or Sox ask for to much and i'd pass.

bdpecore · Post #157 » by **bdpecore** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 9:57 pm

wichmae wrote:
ackypoo wrote:
wichmae wrote:Someone who can carry a rotation during a playoff series. None of the guys available are those level of players. Im not giving up a package of top guys unless Im getting a Chris Sale level of player back.

are you saying they shouldnt make any moves, continue to have a stocked farm?

surely, we have an abundance of talent available in the farm, if quintana is available for a decent price, this move makes sense.

Its not a decent price though. Thats the problem. The ask on these players is way more than theyre worth. Again, if Im giving up three or four top 100 guys I want back a #1 that can carry a staff. Quintana and Gray are not on that level. Basically none of the guys out there right now are worth the package theyll give up. If the price was "decent" he would have been traded in the off-season or at some point already during the season. Its been widely reported they want a Sale type of package back for him which is incredibly stupid for us to do. Quintana or Gray are not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series.

I trust Stearns will move prospects which others value more than he does. I would package Hader, Clark and Lara for Quintana/Gray.

Hader has struggles with control and developing a quality 3rd pitch which could push him to the bullpen.

Clark could be he odd man out in an already crowded outfield with Brinson and Phillips knocking at the door and Ray just starting out his career.

Lara is also blocked by Arcia, Shaw, Villar, Diaz, Erceg and Dubon. So he is expendable if we are filling a need elsewhere.

wichmae · Post #158 » by **wichmae** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 10:01 pm

bdpecore wrote:
wichmae wrote:
ackypoo wrote:are you saying they shouldnt make any moves, continue to have a stocked farm?

surely, we have an abundance of talent available in the farm, if quintana is available for a decent price, this move makes sense.

Its not a decent price though. Thats the problem. The ask on these players is way more than theyre worth. Again, if Im giving up three or four top 100 guys I want back a #1 that can carry a staff. Quintana and Gray are not on that level. Basically none of the guys out there right now are worth the package theyll give up. If the price was "decent" he would have been traded in the off-season or at some point already during the season. Its been widely reported they want a Sale type of package back for him which is incredibly stupid for us to do. Quintana or Gray are not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series.

I trust Stearns will move prospects which others value more than he does. I would package Hader, Clark and Lara for Quintana/Gray.

Hader has struggles with control and developing a quality 3rd pitch which could push him to the bullpen.

Clark could be he odd man out in an already crowded outfield with Brinson and Phillips knocking at the door and Ray just starting out his career.

Lara is also blocked by Arcia, Shaw, Villar, Diaz, Erceg and Dubon. So he is expendable if we are filling a need elsewhere.

Of course you would. So would just about anyone except the A's and White Sox. Lara has been brutal as a pro so far. He's OPSing .488

wichmae · Post #159 » by **wichmae** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 10:09 pm

El Duderino wrote:
wichmae wrote:Its not a decent price though. Thats the problem. The ask on these players is way more than theyre worth. Again, if Im giving up three or four top 100 guys I want back a #1 that can carry a staff. Quintana and Gray are not on that level. Basically none of the guys out there right now are worth the package theyll give up. If the price was "decent" he would have been traded in the off-season or at some point already during the season. Its been widely reported they want a Sale type of package back for him which is incredibly stupid for us to do. Quintana or Gray are not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series.

A few thoughts

1. I wouldn't include Woodruff or Burnes in any trade for Quintana and Gray, but i wouldn't be automatically opposed to Hader who i have real doubts that he can stick as a starter.

2. If Chicago wanted a Sale like return for Quintana, i'd hang up the phone quickly and so should Stearns.

3. As for either of Quintana or Gray not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series, you simply cant know that. The last decade or so has shown just how unpredictable MLB playoffs have been and that needing a true ace is no longer an absolute necessity to advance. Plenty of teams with an ace or even aces have gotten bounced early while other teams with just solid starters advance. The by far biggest key is just getting into the playoffs and both Quintana/Gray would be controlled for multiple seasons, not just this year.

Bottom line for me resides entirely on who we'd have to send for either guy. We have many prospects, more than who would ever make the big league roster. A reasonable deal i'd be fine with. The A's or Sox ask for to much and i'd pass.

Sure I can see the lightening in a bottle happen like it did with KC but thats not exactly the norm. Its pretty much the counter to the norm. Look at the last three WS Cubs, Indians (Arrieta Kluber) Royals, Mets (No Ace, DeGrom, Syndergarrd, Harvey) Royals, Giants (Shields, Mad Bum). Sure Kershaw, Price, and even MaX have never been to a WS butyoure going to have a better shot at getting to one and winning one with a stud horse in the barn versus a couple of regular ponies. Gray has been bad for two seasons and has poor home road splits. Quintana's ask is sky high. I just dont think it makes any sense to do this kind of move right now.

bdpecore · Post #160 » by **bdpecore** » Fri Jul 7, 2017 10:17 pm

wichmae wrote:
bdpecore wrote:
wichmae wrote:Its not a decent price though. Thats the problem. The ask on these players is way more than theyre worth. Again, if Im giving up three or four top 100 guys I want back a #1 that can carry a staff. Quintana and Gray are not on that level. Basically none of the guys out there right now are worth the package theyll give up. If the price was "decent" he would have been traded in the off-season or at some point already during the season. Its been widely reported they want a Sale type of package back for him which is incredibly stupid for us to do. Quintana or Gray are not winning us a WS or maybe even a playoff series.

I trust Stearns will move prospects which others value more than he does. I would package Hader, Clark and Lara for Quintana/Gray.

Hader has struggles with control and developing a quality 3rd pitch which could push him to the bullpen.

Clark could be he odd man out in an already crowded outfield with Brinson and Phillips knocking at the door and Ray just starting out his career.

Lara is also blocked by Arcia, Shaw, Villar, Diaz, Erceg and Dubon. So he is expendable if we are filling a need elsewhere.

Of course you would. So would just about anyone except the A's and White Sox. Lara has been brutal as a pro so far. He's OPSing .488

Heck, I'd swap out Lara for Diaz if needed.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app