2015 Minors Thread

[LittleRooster]

That one man's opinion is the editor of Baseball America, a **** website that ranks prospects and farm systems. That isn't good enough for you?

And even if Law or anybody else thinks they didn't get enough in return, they all agree that the Brewers drastically improved their farm system at the deadline.

Keith Law will never be an advocate for anything in the Brewers system. I also dont think you can ever take Bleacher report as anything remotely credible concerning the minors. There really is no way to debate it isnt a top 10 system anymore. Callis was on the radio and I heard what Bern heard. He said they werent elite but did improve. While I dont see a top flight starter in the system I do see an elite player in Arcia. Having him and three others in the top 100 makes this a very good system. Trent Clark also has tools to become elite. For his level he has absolutely played well beyond first year expectations. Gatewood has also played well. As has Denson. Its easily a top 10 system.

Agreed. Law never likes anything the Brewers do

[trwi7]

We have some depth and guys with upside, but there really are no even near elite hitting or pitching prospects in the system to think of it as a top 10 farm.

When I asked Baseball America editor in chief John Manuel for assistance in reconfiguring the Top 10, he sent me this message:

"It's gone from a middle of the pack (farm) system to a top five or 10 system, and that's with last year's boom-or-bust guys all having decent to middling seasons. Pretty amazing."

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/brewers/bumper-crop-down-on-the-farm-for-brewers-b99552933z1-321152361.html

One man's opinion, found for JSOnline for the purposes of enhancing a favorable article. It doesn't mean much

That other rating referred to here had it 13th.

And Callis on the radio seemed to allude to still not believing it was a very good system. Maybe a little above average.

I didn't agree with him, but Keith Law was quite negative on the return in the trades that were made.

The one opinion you cherry picked isn't more relevant. The fact he was even calling it middle of the pack before all the trades displays he's coming from a position where he was more favorable than most.

If you think it's so good now (if you don't that response was out of place), why were you an advocate of dealing everybody and tanking? We should already have enough ammo or near it to contend in the future without that.

So you say there's no reason to think of it as a top 10 farm system and a guy from Baseball America says it's a top 5 or 10 system and that still isn't enough for you? The fact that a guy from BA thinks it's a top 5-10 system should at least give you reason to think that it's a top 10 system. Not all of them might rank it in the top 10 but many will rank it in the top 10.

[Outlander]

Having a guy from baseball america say it is a top 10 system is good evidence that it is. However, there isn't much out there right now with updated rankings so until there are more updated rankings out there it will be difficult to convince others. I imagine there will be plenty of places listing them in the top 10 prior to next season.

Also, in regards to selling current players off, I was/am in favor because those players that were traded or I wanted traded are not going to be part of the next wave of good teams so might as well trade them for guys that could like Santana, Phillips, Hader, Davies, Barrios etc. The Brewers can never have too much talent and they of course can always be traded for positions that they are still lacking when the team gets better.

[Outlander]

(btw I don't agree that Baseball America is a s**t website).

He didn't say it was a s**t website he said it is a four star website.

[rarjake]

how can you honestly say you don't see an elite starter in the brewers system? there is just so much we do not know yet about Kodi . He is obviously the best chance of having an Ace in the brewers system as of now. But he has pretty much surpassed all expectations set upon him this year, and has not allowed a HR yet. Going from pitching in h/s ball in HA, to pitching in Single A is a huge jump.

To a lesser extent devin williams should be included in this as well, hes ceiling and raw ability has always been sky high, and he has put together a great season.

Just do not understand how you can be down on the brewers system, Phillps, Kodi, Arica, Williams, Tyrone Taylor, None of these guys excite you? Clark? Lara?

Anyways, whatever the case, brewers are almost assured a top 5ish draft pick, so we will get to add anther ace to our system :p

[ReasonablySober]

Arguing whether or not the Brewers have a top ten system is mostly a fool's errand. Nobody knows how most of these guys will turn out, all anyone can do is make educated guesses.

The fact is most of the potential impact players as far as toolsy guys go (the kind your typical Law/Calli types like) are still in the lower levels. If Clark, Taylor, Lara, Harrison, Gatewood, Orimoloye, etc. tear up up the lower levels and continue it in AA, the farm system will be universally recognized as one of the best. As of right now the system is being judged on guys like Phillips, Arcia, Santana and Davies. Not sure you could compare our upper level prospects against those in

Minnesota
LA
Was
Philly
Chicago
Texas
Pittsburgh
Boston
Colorado

I like our system now, but in terms of national recognition it'll come in a couple years.

[Kerb Hohl]

Noticing the Twins

I'm starting to think that the Twins' are going right back into the doldrums. Their team management is horrible. It all hinges on Byron "Cameron Maybin" Buxton.

-Sano is legit. If he's a superstar then it changes things a bit.
-Buxton is Cameron Maybin and not Andrew McCutchen, IMO. May provide some nice impact in 4 years.
-May/Meyer seem to not be developing into what they thought.
-Berrios is a good prospect, Stewart, Gordon, Jay, among others all look to help.

Point is, I think it's Sano and a bunch of solid prospects at this point. Couple that with the fact that they are obsessed with signing a bunch of mediocre vets (worse than the Brewers) and enjoy sabotaging themselves by playing Mauer at 1B, thought the 2014 BABIP machines of Suzuki and Santana were going to actually help them. Their entire offense is filled with AAAA utility players and Shane Robinson while Oswaldo Arcia sits in AAA.

They're probably the worst team in baseball right now and it looks like Buxton is not there yet.

Point is, I think they're screwed.

Hicks is intriguing. He should probably give up this switch hitting idea, though. .639 OPS this year against RHP and that is his best performance.

[Bernman]

So you say there's no reason to think of it as a top 10 farm system and a guy from Baseball America says it's a top 5 or 10 system and that still isn't enough for you? The fact that a guy from BA thinks it's a top 5-10 system should at least give you reason to think that it's a top 10 system. Not all of them might rank it in the top 10 but many will rank it in the top 10.

You're twisting my words. I never spoke in absolutes about it, wichmae has on the other hand.

[Bernman]

(btw I don't agree that Baseball America is a s**t website).

He didn't say it was a s**t website he said it is a four star website.

I was joking around.

[trwi7]

So you say there's no reason to think of it as a top 10 farm system and a guy from Baseball America says it's a top 5 or 10 system and that still isn't enough for you? The fact that a guy from BA thinks it's a top 5-10 system should at least give you reason to think that it's a top 10 system. Not all of them might rank it in the top 10 but many will rank it in the top 10.

You're twisting my words. I never spoke in absolutes about it, wichmae has on the other hand.

We have some depth and guys with upside, but there really are no even near elite hitting or pitching prospects in the system to think of it as a top 10 farm.

You're basically saying right there that it's not.

[Bernman]

how can you honestly say you don't see an elite starter in the brewers system? there is just so much we do not know yet about Kodi . He is obviously the best chance of having an Ace in the brewers system as of now. But he has pretty much surpassed all expectations set upon him this year, and has not allowed a HR yet. Going from pitching in h/s ball in HA, to pitching in Single A is a huge jump.

To a lesser extent devin williams should be included in this as well, hes ceiling and raw ability has always been sky high, and he has put together a great season.

Just do not understand how you can be down on the brewers system, Phillps, Kodi, Arica, Williams, Tyrone Taylor, None of these guys excite you? Clark? Lara?

Anyways, whatever the case, brewers are almost assured a top 5ish draft pick, so we will get to add anther ace to our system :p

I'm not down on it. That's the homer read, seeing persecution that's not there, from a fellow fan no less.

I'm just not up on it yet, per se. That ranking that had them 13, seems about the right projection to me right now.

We're coming from the gutter, so I think there is a tendency to perceive an Oldsmobile as a Cadillac. You're kind of proving my point about that in countering an argument that there are no elite, #1 starter type pitching prospects in the system, by pointing to the potential and unknown of some in the system at the lower levels. If they capitalize on the high draft pick this year or some of the guys with potential at the lower levels start producing like aces or big-time hitters at the mid to higher levels, then the system will warrant a bump to top 5 or 10 in most impartial eyes.

[Bernman]

So you say there's no reason to think of it as a top 10 farm system and a guy from Baseball America says it's a top 5 or 10 system and that still isn't enough for you? The fact that a guy from BA thinks it's a top 5-10 system should at least give you reason to think that it's a top 10 system. Not all of them might rank it in the top 10 but many will rank it in the top 10.

You're twisting my words. I never spoke in absolutes about it, wichmae has on the other hand.

We have some depth and guys with upside, but there really are no even near elite hitting or pitching prospects in the system to think of it as a top 10 farm.

You're basically saying right there that it's not.

Nope, it's just my opinion, and seems to be that of most people.

This is what an absolute looks like: wichmae said, "There really is no way to debate it isnt a top 10 system anymore." So maybe quote that and respond to him with articles claiming it's not a top 10 system.

[wichmae]

Just going off of Pipeline. Youre honestly telling me you see ten systems better than ours.

Baltimore Orioles - Hunter Harvey (69), Dylan Bundy (75)
Boston Red Sox - Moncada (10), Devers (15), Margot (30), Johnson (46), Owens (47), Benintendi (72), Guerra (88)
New York Yankees - Severino (16), Judge (21), Mateo (99)
Tampa Bay Rays - Adames (43), Snell (48, Honeywell (56), Whitley (79), Robertson (91)
Toronto Blue Jays - Pompey (51), Harris (92)
Chicago White Sox - Anderson (44), Fulmer (49), Montas (62),
Cleveland Indians - Zimmer (31), Frazier (41), Kaminsky (86)
Detroit Tigers - Daniel Norris not included will graduate from lists None
Kansas City Royals - Mondesi (39), Russell (95)
Minnesota Twins - Sano not included will graduate from lists Buxton (1), Berrios (25), Jay (74), Polanco (87), Gordon (89)
Houston Astros - Bregman (26), Appel (50), Daz (61), Tucker (64),
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim - Newcomb (24)
Oakland Athletics - Barreto (23),
Seattle Mariners - Jackson (52), Marte (70)
Texas Rangers - Gallo (probably wont get enough AB's to graduate needs 90 more, 8), Mazara (17), Tate (54), Brinson (76), Ortiz (98)

NL
Atlanta Braves - Albies (36), Touki (80), Allard (100)
Miami Marlins - Kolek (60)
New York Mets - Conforto not included will graduate from lists, Matz also could feasibly not be eligible by next year, Matz (18), Nimmo (82), Rosario (94)
Philadelphia Phillies - Aaron Nola not included will graduate from lists Crawford (6), Thompson (59), Williams (63), Alfaro (68), Randolph (97)
Washington Nationals - Giolito (3), Turner (13), Ross (32),
Chicago Cubs - Schwarber not included will graduate from lists Torres (35), McKinney (40), Edwards (65), Under wood (78)
Cincinnati Reds - Winker (33), Stephenson (42), Garrett (81)
Milwaukee Brewers - Arcia (14), Phillips (38), Trent (84), Sanatan (85)
Pittsburgh Pirates - Glasnow (9), Meadows (27), Bell (37), Taillon (how the hell is this dude still even on lists)(54), Hanson (77)
St. Louis Cardinals - Piscotty not included will graduate from listsReyes (22)
Arizona Diamondbacks - Bradley not included will graduate from lists Swanson (12), Blair (71), Shipley (90)
Colorado Rockies - Rogers (11), Gray (Another candidate who could graduate. Only needs 40 IP to graduate)(34), Dahl (55), Hoffman (57), McMahon (58), Wall (93)
Los Angeles Dodgers - Seager (2), Urias (5), DeLeon (28), Peraza (29), Holmes (66)
San Diego Padres - Renfore (83)
San Francisco Giants - None.

[wichmae]

Teams that undoubtedly have better systems.
Texas Rangers - Gallo (probably wont get enough AB's to graduate needs 90 more, 8), Mazara (17), Tate (54), Brinson (76), Ortiz (98)
Philadelphia Phillies - Aaron Nola not included will graduate from lists Crawford (6), Thompson (59), Williams (63), Alfaro (68), Randolph (97)
Washington Nationals - Giolito (3), Turner (13), Ross (32)
Boston Red Sox - Moncada (10), Devers (15), Margot (30), Johnson (46), Owens (47), Benintendi (72), Guerra (88)
Pittsburgh Pirates - Glasnow (9), Meadows (27), Bell (37), Taillon (how the hell is this dude still even on lists)(54), Hanson (77)
Colorado Rockies - Rogers (11), Gray (Another candidate who could graduate. Only needs 40 IP to graduate)(34), Dahl (55), Hoffman (57), McMahon (58), Wall (93)
Los Angeles Dodgers - Seager (2), Urias (5), DeLeon (28), Peraza (29), Holmes (66)

Teams without a shadow of doubt have a lessor system
Cincinnati Reds - Winker (33), Stephenson (42), Garrett (81)
Baltimore Orioles - Hunter Harvey (69), Dylan Bundy (75)
Tampa Bay Rays - Adames (43), Snell (48, Honeywell (56), Whitley (79), Robertson (91)
Toronto Blue Jays - Pompey (51), Harris (92)
Chicago White Sox - Anderson (44), Fulmer (49), Montas (62),
Cleveland Indians - Zimmer (31), Frazier (41), Kaminsky (86)
Detroit Tigers - Daniel Norris not included will graduate from lists None
Kansas City Royals - Mondesi (39), Russell (95)
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim - Newcomb (24)
Oakland Athletics - Barreto (23),
Seattle Mariners - Jackson (52), Marte (70)
Atlanta Braves - Albies (36), Touki (80), Allard (100)
Miami Marlins - Kolek (60)
New York Mets - Conforto not included will graduate from lists, Matz also could feasibly not be eligible by next year, Matz (18), Nimmo (82), Rosario (94)
St. Louis Cardinals - Piscotty not included will graduate from listsReyes (22)
Arizona Diamondbacks - Bradley not included will graduate from lists Swanson (12), Blair (71), Shipley (90)
San Diego Padres - Renfore (83)
San Francisco Giants - None.

That leaves these remaining teams to duke out the 8-12 spots. I have the Brewers 10 behind Chicago and Minnesota.
New York Yankees - Severino (16), Judge (21), Mateo (99)
Minnesota Twins - Sano not included will graduate from lists Buxton (1), Berrios (25), Jay (74), Polanco (87), Gordon (89)
Houston Astros - Bregman (26), Appel (50), Daz (61), Tucker (64),
Chicago Cubs - Schwarber not included will graduate from lists Torres (35), McKinney (40), Edwards (65), Under wood (78)
Milwaukee Brewers - Arcia (14), Phillips (38), Trent (84), Santana (85)

In doing this list I realized there are 6 players who will graduate very shortly. Im interested to see if the Jonathan Mayo hypetrain on Jorge Lopez finally finds its way to this list. This is merely the easiest list to reference and has been used here for reference. BP and BA have the Brewers prospects rated much higher than pipeline (which always tend to sway towards larger market teams). I think BA has Arcia as the #7 overall and Phillips as #21.

[wichmae]

Davies getting hit somewhat hard tonight. Leaving quite a bit up in the zone.

[wichmae]

Tough night for the guys

[wichmae]

Davies got rocked. 0-6 so far for Arcia and Phillips.

[LUKE23]

Trent Clark continues to impress. Orimoloye and Perry have both been good at Maryvale too.

If we can get a pitcher with true ace potential this next draft, I'll love our system overall. The bats are there.

[ReasonablySober]

Two guys make MLB.com's list of ten players playing well from the 2015 class.

Demi Orimoloye, OF Brewers (4th round)
A tremendous all-around athlete, Orimoloye's stock fell a bit over the spring. The Brewers didn't complain since they were able to nab him in the fourth round. The Canadian outfielder has shown why scouts liked his raw tools, as he's hit six homers and stolen 17 bases in 20 attempts. Orimoloye will need to refine his approach (two walks, 37 strikeouts), but he's hit .279 and slugged .519 in the Rookie-level Arizona League.

Cody Ponce, RHP, Brewers (2nd round)
The 6-foot-5, 235-pound product of Cal Poly Pomona has been impressive in his debut, most of which has come in the full-season Midwest League. The right-hander, perhaps under-ranked at No. 30 on the Brewers' list, has thrown 29 innings and has a 1.86 ERA. Ponce has allowed 24 hits and six walks while striking out 23.

[wichmae]

Phillips 3-3 tonight so far and is a HR away from a cycle.