Reds trade Broxton to Brewers

[BigDee]

“@Ken_Rosenthal: Source: #Reds trade Broxton to #Brewers.”

[NeedsMoreCheese]

Well thats interesting. Apparently its for 2 PTBNL.
Broxton is signed through next year for 9 mil, and has a mutual option in 2016. (the option is also for 9 mil with a 2 mil buyout)
So at least if KRod gets a big offer somewhere we'll still have a guy with a lot of experience as a closer in the pen for next season.

[Kerb Hohl]

Good trade in a vacuum for right now. Price is high next year and 2 PTBNL is a bit scary.

I am not scoffing at the mention of "closer experience" but I think the Tigers are a good example of why it's a pretty pointless idea. I think their GM just hits the sort button on the saves stat category on ESPN and their bullpen is routinely a dumpster fire.

I get that sometimes, guys have much better confidence/balls for the situation, though.

[coolhandluke121]

I actually like it a lot. I hate overpaying relievers, but I think this means they won't overpay K-Rod and that's really important to me. Would much, MUCH rather overpay this guy for one year than see what they do on the open market. I don't trust K-Rod, and I think his HR rate is more indicative of his true ability at this point than his outstanding WHIP, which has involved some luck.

This also makes them stronger going into the last month of the regular season IMO. Roster expansion allows you to use the bullpen more, so upgrading can give you more of an advantage than it would at other times of the season.

[humanrefutation]

I'd like to know who the PTBNL will end up being before I can fully evaluate this move. Michael Brantley was a PTBNL in the CC deal, so it's not unheard of to give up a quality piece as a PTBNL.

I also don't trust relievers as they are wildly unreliable.

But Broxton has been pretty damn good this year and is signed through next year. We can always flip him if necessary.

[NeedsMoreCheese]

Good trade in a vacuum for right now. Price is high next year and 2 PTBNL is a bit scary.

I am not scoffing at the mention of "closer experience" but I think the Tigers are a good example of why it's a pretty pointless idea. I think their GM just hits the sort button on the saves stat category on ESPN and their bullpen is routinely a dumpster fire.

I get that sometimes, guys have much better confidence/balls for the situation, though.

Yeah i definitely agree with that, but you gotta figure Doug would go into next season with at least 1 healthy guy with "closer experience" in the pen. And at this point it would be beyond foolish to think Henderson will be healthy (he could recover from surgery and be just fine by then, but that seems like a big if). So while 9 mil isn't exactly cheap its not terrible, especially when you're only locked in for 1 year. And as CHL said, its a hell of a lot less scary than paying whatever crazy number KRod is gonna get.

I'm not saying Broxton should be our closer next year by any means (TBH i'd love if Jeffress got to the point where he could be) but I'm just saying that had to be part of their thinking on this trade and its not a terrible idea.

[coolhandluke121]

I think the boost it gives the bullpen this year needs to be given a little more weight here. They're in a playoff race. This could result in 2 extra wins. That could literally mean EVERYTHING when the division and the wild-card spots are so hotly contested. Next year is important too and I'm the last person who usually spews "live for the moment" cliches, but this is very much needed and is great news in that regard.

[MickeyDavis]

Good move short term, we'll see about long term. That' s a lot of coin for next year. We do get Weeks deal off the books. And Ramirez.

[trwi7]

Awful peripherals. He'll probably have a 4 ERA.

[El Duderino]

Until we see the players sent to the Reds, it's hard to know exactly how to feel, but given Broxton makes 9 million next year, i sure hope that when it comes out who the two prospects are, that neither makes me think you gotta be kidding me that X player was included in this trade. I have a bad feeling though that many Brewers fans will unpleasantly surprised when the PTBNL are announced.

[Kerb Hohl]

This is now a horrendously bad trade.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/haudricourt/status/506477898312998912[/tweet]

To be fair, Broxton's splits are fairly neutral.

[WEFFPIM]

This is now a horrendously bad trade.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/haudricourt/status/506477898312998912[/tweet]

To be fair, Broxton's splits are fairly neutral.

So, why is it a horrendously bad trade now?

[Kerb Hohl]

This is now a horrendously bad trade.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/haudricourt/status/506477898312998912[/tweet]

To be fair, Broxton's splits are fairly neutral.

So, why is it a horrendously bad trade now?

Because Ron is an idiot, still and enjoys 1940s baseball strategy.

[WEFFPIM]

Because Ron is an idiot, still and enjoys 1940s baseball strategy.

Sound, thought-out reasoning here.

[Kerb Hohl]

Because Ron is an idiot, still and enjoys 1940s baseball strategy.

Sound, thought-out reasoning here.

Why wouldn't you play matchups? Even if Broxton is "pretty good" against lefties, why define a guy's role based on an inning? That's stupid. If Pedro Alvarez is up there with the playoffs on the line, wouldn't you want Zach Duke in the ballgame? Broxton is "pretty good" but I'd wager that Duke is a better option. But no, it's the 8th inning, so pitch Broxton.

Broxton may be neutral with a .640 OPS against with both sides, but we have lefties that hold left-handed batters to a .540 OPS. We also have an incredible amount of lefties that do that.

This is a bit more of a nit-picky case because Broxton is at least decent against lefties, but I'd rather have somebody that specializes in it.

Hell, I'd rather have Will Smith in there against lefties. He's also better than Broxton. He's at a .540 vs. LH and .890 vs. RH split this year (LOL).

Put the better player in the situation.

Will Smith was the "8th inning guy" when he was hot, and then we found out over time that righties could hit him once they caught on. Probably cost us 2-3 games as the season moved along. Of course, Ron is always pushing the right buttons. Smith was obviously a stud because he "knew his role" as the 8th inning guy, until we realized that we got **** with a sandpaper condom by the fact that he couldn't get righties out. But it was his time of the game! He has 8th inning experience!

You can find multiple instances of me calling out Ron for having Smith in there for the entire 8th inning earlier in the year instead of just LH batters. He succeeded for a while as I said this, but as always, the numbers played out and it ended up killing the season.

[Kerb Hohl]

Translation: I am too set in my ways to understand modern baseball.

"There's not any restrictions for me," Roenicke said. "I haven't really looked at the exact splits on [Broxton], but I know that [whether] you're the eighth-inning guy or the closer, you don't care about those things."

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20140901&content_id=92531408&notebook_id=92550374&vkey=notebook_mil&c_id=mil

[WEFFPIM]

It's actually relatively modern to not worry about righty-righty/lefty-lefty matchups. It hasn't mattered who he's seen this year, Broxton's been good. So, instead of putting Broxton in a spot he's been good in AND the Brewers need... you'd rather needlessly complicate things and waste a pitcher in the process?

This makes Ron Roenicke an idiot? To put him in a position he's succeeded in this year and a position the Brewers desperately need right now? A scenario that you acknowledge is happening and makes sense, but you then qualify it as a horrible trade? You'd rather have someone who specializes in getting lefties out? I'd rather have someone who specializes on not having frisbees getting hit 800 feet, regardless of what hand they use.

This team spends five ****ing months in first place, then one slide and *gasp* putting a good player into a needed spot and he's the antichrist.

Stop searching for little, bitchy reasons to hate the guy and just hate him for being him.

[Kerb Hohl]

No, you should always look at numbers. If 2 lefties are coming up, I'd put Will Smith or Duke in. It's 2014.

I'm not "looking for reasons." Look at our last 8th inning guy. Right now, he's sporting a Mike Rizzo OPS against righties. That's right, the collection of righties that faced Will Smith have Rizzo's .890 OPS.

This race could come down to 1 or 2 games. Saying, "ah, **** it, numbers don't matter for closers or 8th inning guys" is **** stupid, even if Broxton is decent against LH hitters. How many games did Will Smith blow for us in the 8th?

Going with your, "why burn a reliever" theory...in the 7th inning, we likely have to waste our lefties, unless we always go with Jeffress.

This is one of the least-threatening "8th inning guys" Ron has had. He's employed Kameron Loe, who lefties feasted on, and Will Smith this year.

This stuff matters. Again, maybe Broxton is OK against lefties for now, but it tells us that Ron still isn't fully comfortable with modern baseball.

[NeedsMoreCheese]

Well the PTBNL have been revealed,

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Brewers/status/509861528640581632[/tweet]


no loss there imo

[raysbookclub]

nice trade. salary relief for Reds, big league relief help for the Brewers, and it was at least supposed to help keep the Cards out...