Brewer Game Thread: August 2016

[wichmae]

Kirk is 29 Keon 26. Im not sure what more you can hold out for. Again I dont understand your infatuation with a 29 yr old AAAA player who is obviously not part of the future. Post All Star Break Keon is hitting very well. Cecchini has not exactly sucked and again you need to see what your 20 something year olds can do versus your guy who will be 30 next season. Just doesnt make any sense to keep holding on to hope he turns into something.

[Kerb Hohl]

Kirk is 29 Keon 26. Im not sure what more you can hold out for. Again I dont understand your infatuation with a 29 yr old AAAA player who is obviously not part of the future. Post All Star Break Keon is hitting very well. Cecchini has not exactly sucked and again you need to see what your 20 something year olds can do versus your guy who will be 30 next season. Just doesnt make any sense to keep holding on to hope he turns into something.

Kirk just turned 29 a week ago (granted, Keon just turned 26).

Kirk hits righties well and plays good defense. That is value in the MLB. I'm not tying our future to Kirk, but that has potential trade chip value or could stay on as a 5th OF or something in the future. Again, I'm not putting him into our future, but he's playing at the expense of Keon Broxton losing out on 50 ABs in 2016 and a bunch of guys that don't seem ready for the majors yet not being in the majors. I'm fine continuing to see if you can get a trade for him or just letting him get a few more ABs.

You started complaining about how we're not playing the young guys and now the argument has been widdled down to Kirk playing a few too many games over Broxton.

Flores, Elmore, etc. are bench players. It seems pretty clear that they want the younger guys to get actual ABs in the minors as starters. Other than catcher, there isn't an open position on the field and only Wren really warrants current playing time (along with Santana, obviously). Carter and Gennett will eventually be moved but not yet.

If they don't trade Kirk, he may move to the cheaper bench role so that our younger guys aren't rotting on the MLB bench next year and they'll boot Flores out.

I'll spoil the rest for you: Cecchini and Reed will not hit in the majors if called up this year, and if they do, it will be a mirage.

[wichmae]

Kirk is 29 Keon 26. Im not sure what more you can hold out for. Again I dont understand your infatuation with a 29 yr old AAAA player who is obviously not part of the future. Post All Star Break Keon is hitting very well. Cecchini has not exactly sucked and again you need to see what your 20 something year olds can do versus your guy who will be 30 next season. Just doesnt make any sense to keep holding on to hope he turns into something.

Kirk just turned 29 a week ago (granted, Keon just turned 26).

Kirk hits righties well and plays good defense. That is value in the MLB. I'm not tying our future to Kirk, but that has potential trade chip value or could stay on as a 5th OF or something in the future. Again, I'm not putting him into our future, but he's playing at the expense of Keon Broxton losing out on 50 ABs in 2016 and a bunch of guys that don't seem ready for the majors yet not being in the majors. I'm fine continuing to see if you can get a trade for him or just letting him get a few more ABs.

You started complaining about how we're not playing the young guys and now the argument has been widdled down to Kirk playing a few too many games over Broxton.

Flores, Elmore, etc. are bench players. It seems pretty clear that they want the younger guys to get actual ABs in the minors as starters. Other than catcher, there isn't an open position on the field and only Wren really warrants current playing time (along with Santana, obviously). Carter and Gennett will eventually be moved but not yet.

If they don't trade Kirk, he may move to the cheaper bench role so that our younger guys aren't rotting on the MLB bench next year and they'll boot Flores out.

I'll spoil the rest for you: Cecchini and Reed will not hit in the majors if called up this year, and if they do, it will be a mirage.

No not really. Point still remains as I originally posted. We shoudl be looking at our own AAA guys and not trotting out turds. I get you have a man crush for some weird reason on Kirk. Ill maintain my stance on him being a very replaceable with at least 2 guys playing in AAA right now at a younger age and higher upside.

Moving along. Glad Garza sill sucks. Hopefully him and Chase get lit up tonight so we can see a MLB debut.

[Kerb Hohl]

I don't have a **** man crush on Kirk lol. He's replaceable and a AAAA guy I agree, though I maintain that having a good split vs. righties is a possible small value to somebody.

Broxton actually also projects to possibly be a AAAA guy. Broxton and Wren will get their time soon enough...be patient. They are the "future" 4th OF type guys whereas Kirk is a lower-tier 4th OF right now.

I have no idea why this is a huge deal. We had Aaron Hill taking up playing time and we traded him. We're not going to put future pieces on the MLB bench right now and we're not going to burn service time for non-Arcia guys.

We've argued for 2 pages now on a 1.2 (projected) WAR guy this year getting demoted/benched/cut instead of building his trade value so that we can get to see some low-ceiling prospects play a month early in a season that is already lost.

No not really. Point still remains as I originally posted. We shoudl be looking at our own AAA guys and not trotting out turds. I get you have a man crush for some weird reason on Kirk. Ill maintain my stance on him being a very replaceable with at least 2 guys playing in AAA right now at a younger age and higher upside.

They're both starting in AAA right now. Reed can't crack an .800 OPS in **** Colorado Springs so I think it's safe to leave him there. Wren, sure...he's getting every day ABs, though. If you'd rather see Kyle Wren come up and play once every 2-3 days behind Broxton, Braun, Hernan Perez instead of just starting in the minors, I don't really know what to tell you. It is just as meaningless to care about that as it is to worry about your so-called turd player gobbling up a bit of a timeshare in CF for an extra month.

I have no idea why this is such a huge deal when Stearns has generally done everything else right, that he would decide to sabotage the franchise's fate by not playing future 4th OF Kyle Wren in August in a 90 loss season.

Who else do you want called up? You can't just cut Scooter or Carter. Keep using them to try to build some trade value and to block the service clocks of younger players.

[wichmae]

I don't have a **** man crush on Kirk lol. He's replaceable and a AAAA guy I agree, though I maintain that having a good split vs. righties is a possible small value to somebody.

Broxton actually also projects to possibly be a AAAA guy. Broxton and Wren will get their time soon enough...be patient. They are the "future" 4th OF type guys whereas Kirk is a lower-tier 4th OF right now.

I have no idea why this is a huge deal. We had Aaron Hill taking up playing time and we traded him. We're not going to put future pieces on the MLB bench right now and we're not going to burn service time for non-Arcia guys.

We've argued for 2 pages now on a 1.2 (projected) WAR guy this year getting demoted/benched/cut instead of building his trade value so that we can get to see some low-ceiling prospects play a month early in a season that is already lost.

No not really. Point still remains as I originally posted. We shoudl be looking at our own AAA guys and not trotting out turds. I get you have a man crush for some weird reason on Kirk. Ill maintain my stance on him being a very replaceable with at least 2 guys playing in AAA right now at a younger age and higher upside.

They're both starting in AAA right now. Reed can't crack an .800 OPS in **** Colorado Springs so I think it's safe to leave him there. Wren, sure...he's getting every day ABs, though. If you'd rather see Kyle Wren come up and play once every 2-3 days behind Broxton, Braun, Hernan Perez instead of just starting in the minors, I don't really know what to tell you. It is just as meaningless to care about that as it is to worry about your so-called turd player gobbling up a bit of a timeshare in CF for an extra month.

I have no idea why this is such a huge deal when Stearns has generally done everything else right, that he would decide to sabotage the franchise's fate by not playing future 4th OF Kyle Wren in August in a 90 loss season.

Who else do you want called up? You can't just cut Scooter or Carter. Keep using them to try to build some trade value and to block the service clocks of younger players.

Never said those two should be released but whats the harm in replacing some of Scooters and Carters PT with playing Perez over there. Braun also sits usually one game a week. Theres plenty of time to be found all across the diamond for PT for players who will be coming up in 2 weeks.

Theres also the possibility we could post deadline trade some of these guys too. Now I get keeping Carter and Scooters value relevant for future asset purposes but Kirk I do not. Fangraphs and Steamer project him to end up an under 1 WAR player (.8 to be on FG .4 on Steamer)with his only saving grace being his CF defense. The offensive The comment I directly made was in re: to Broxton sitting for Kirk, Elmore gettings starts, Flores getting starts, and even Braun to a lessor degree. Brauns value isnt going to take a hit if he has a couple more off days here and there. Truthfully none of it ultimately matters until September but we need to see what our guys do against MLB pitching instead of running the treadmill of the above conglomerate.

At the end of the day holding out AB's for your own guys to try and cycle minimal trade value on a guy who has been poor outside of an extreme home road split is baffling. We'll see come September what we do with the end of roster crap and the guys coming up. We need to create 40 spots at some point with only Houser being the candidate to generate an opening. I also dont see them carrying only 2 catchers through Sept so theyll probably add McKenry if Susac is truly done for the year.

Im done sidetracking this thread though with Nieuwenhuis discussion.

[wichmae]

Garza is the true tank commander. Can always count on a L when he is pitching.

[wichmae]

Stupid Cubs pen better not blow this.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[ReasonablySober]

I'd forgotten that Cravy can bring it a bit.

[ReasonablySober]

Magnifico throwing 98 mph but can't find the mitt.

[Kerb Hohl]

I don't have a **** man crush on Kirk lol. He's replaceable and a AAAA guy I agree, though I maintain that having a good split vs. righties is a possible small value to somebody.

Broxton actually also projects to possibly be a AAAA guy. Broxton and Wren will get their time soon enough...be patient. They are the "future" 4th OF type guys whereas Kirk is a lower-tier 4th OF right now.

I have no idea why this is a huge deal. We had Aaron Hill taking up playing time and we traded him. We're not going to put future pieces on the MLB bench right now and we're not going to burn service time for non-Arcia guys.

We've argued for 2 pages now on a 1.2 (projected) WAR guy this year getting demoted/benched/cut instead of building his trade value so that we can get to see some low-ceiling prospects play a month early in a season that is already lost.

No not really. Point still remains as I originally posted. We shoudl be looking at our own AAA guys and not trotting out turds. I get you have a man crush for some weird reason on Kirk. Ill maintain my stance on him being a very replaceable with at least 2 guys playing in AAA right now at a younger age and higher upside.

They're both starting in AAA right now. Reed can't crack an .800 OPS in **** Colorado Springs so I think it's safe to leave him there. Wren, sure...he's getting every day ABs, though. If you'd rather see Kyle Wren come up and play once every 2-3 days behind Broxton, Braun, Hernan Perez instead of just starting in the minors, I don't really know what to tell you. It is just as meaningless to care about that as it is to worry about your so-called turd player gobbling up a bit of a timeshare in CF for an extra month.

I have no idea why this is such a huge deal when Stearns has generally done everything else right, that he would decide to sabotage the franchise's fate by not playing future 4th OF Kyle Wren in August in a 90 loss season.

Who else do you want called up? You can't just cut Scooter or Carter. Keep using them to try to build some trade value and to block the service clocks of younger players.

Never said those two should be released but whats the harm in replacing some of Scooters and Carters PT with playing Perez over there. Braun also sits usually one game a week. Theres plenty of time to be found all across the diamond for PT for players who will be coming up in 2 weeks.

Theres also the possibility we could post deadline trade some of these guys too. Now I get keeping Carter and Scooters value relevant for future asset purposes but Kirk I do not. Fangraphs and Steamer project him to end up an under 1 WAR player (.8 to be on FG .4 on Steamer)with his only saving grace being his CF defense. The offensive The comment I directly made was in re: to Broxton sitting for Kirk, Elmore gettings starts, Flores getting starts, and even Braun to a lessor degree. Brauns value isnt going to take a hit if he has a couple more off days here and there. Truthfully none of it ultimately matters until September but we need to see what our guys do against MLB pitching instead of running the treadmill of the above conglomerate.

At the end of the day holding out AB's for your own guys to try and cycle minimal trade value on a guy who has been poor outside of an extreme home road split is baffling. We'll see come September what we do with the end of roster crap and the guys coming up. We need to create 40 spots at some point with only Houser being the candidate to generate an opening. I also dont see them carrying only 2 catchers through Sept so theyll probably add McKenry if Susac is truly done for the year.

Im done sidetracking this thread though with Nieuwenhuis discussion.

I wouldn't have any problem if they cut Kirk tomorrow and gave Wren some regular playing time.

Since they haven't, I don't think it's a huge deal. Wren will probably be given a chance to be in the OF rotation early next year and we'll have plenty of time to evaluate.

The fact that they're keeping Kirk means they probably want to not meaninglessly throw away a year of service of Wren and they want him to get regular ABs in the minors as well as maybe squeeze an ounce of Kirk's trade value out.

[Flap Jackson]

I'd like to see Kyle Wren get a shot. I know power numbers are more sexy, but the guy has hit for high batting average and on-base percentage at every stage of his minor league career (after maybe an initial period of adjustment). At 25 years old, he isn't getting any younger. He should platoon with Broxton the rest of the season.

[El Duderino]

Kirk is 29 Keon 26. Im not sure what more you can hold out for. Again I dont understand your infatuation with a 29 yr old AAAA player who is obviously not part of the future. Post All Star Break Keon is hitting very well. Cecchini has not exactly sucked and again you need to see what your 20 something year olds can do versus your guy who will be 30 next season. Just doesnt make any sense to keep holding on to hope he turns into something.

Kirk just turned 29 a week ago (granted, Keon just turned 26).

Kirk hits righties well and plays good defense. That is value in the MLB. I'm not tying our future to Kirk, but that has potential trade chip value or could stay on as a 5th OF or something in the future. Again, I'm not putting him into our future, but he's playing at the expense of Keon Broxton losing out on 50 ABs in 2016 and a bunch of guys that don't seem ready for the majors yet not being in the majors. I'm fine continuing to see if you can get a trade for him or just letting him get a few more ABs.

I'm not fine with that. I don't buy that Nieuwenhuis has trade value and even if he did, 5th OF types won't bring squat in return.

Broxton is not only three years younger, unlike Nieuwenhuis, this has been his first year getting a chance to face big league pitching. I want to see what he can do playing everyday the rest of the season, including vs righthanders, not just mainly against lefties. This is the 5th year in which Nieuwenhuis has been able to face big league pitching.

This is exactly the type of season where a guy like Broxton should get everyday playing time the rest of the season, not being platooned mostly vs lefties so that some slim hope arrives that Nieuwenhuis can be traded for a low ceiling lottery ticket. Our minor league system is already jam packed with those.

Unless or until Santana gets back, our OF lineup nearly everyday should be Braun/Broxton/Perez, with Nieuwenhuis playing when Braun needs a day off.

[wichmae]

I'd like to see Kyle Wren get a shot. I know power numbers are more sexy, but the guy has hit for high batting average and on-base percentage at every stage of his minor league career (after maybe an initial period of adjustment). At 25 years old, he isn't getting any younger. He should platoon with Broxton the rest of the season.

I wouldnt do a strict platoon. If thats how you feel then cool.
I think theres enough AP's that can be found in a MLB lineup to accomodate him. Especially when you have a RF who can play almost every position in baseball. Theres plenty of flexibility that can be found up there. Keon has earned very day CF job PT at this point. He's the guy we should be auditioning to increase trade value going forward along with Perez and Villar. Those are our next best bets to decent returns.

[Flap Jackson]

I'd like to see Kyle Wren get a shot. I know power numbers are more sexy, but the guy has hit for high batting average and on-base percentage at every stage of his minor league career (after maybe an initial period of adjustment). At 25 years old, he isn't getting any younger. He should platoon with Broxton the rest of the season.

I wouldnt do a strict platoon. If thats how you feel then cool.
I think theres enough AP's that can be found in a MLB lineup to accomodate him. Especially when you have a RF who can play almost every position in baseball. Theres plenty of flexibility that can be found up there. Keon has earned very day CF job PT at this point. He's the guy we should be auditioning to increase trade value going forward along with Perez and Villar. Those are our next best bets to decent returns.

I agree with everything you said except assuming we should ship Villar and Perez. Those guys are only 25 years old and good players.

[coolhandluke121]

I change my mind often on Carter, Kirk, and Gennett, but overall I think your best bet is to play them and hope they get hot and have some trade value. They're capable of that. I live in NYC and I saw Kirk in his best season. He won't have seasons like that often but it wasn't a total fluke either. I have always thought he is going to have a couple Bill Hall type seasons in his prime but I have to admit it's getting late. Odds are that he and the other two each have more potential value to the franchise in the short term than Reed, Wren, Broxton, or Cecchini (all of whom can wait anyway) IMO but it's reasonable to be on either side of the debate.

Those 3 guys are the biggest dilemma on the team. Right now it's looking like a bit of a waste because the wins they added have cost them in draft position, but I have a hunch we'll be pleasantly surprised what we get for at least one of them in a trade. Doesn't look like that will be Kirk but it was a guessing game all along and I still approve of the attempt at developing an asset.

[wichmae]

I'd like to see Kyle Wren get a shot. I know power numbers are more sexy, but the guy has hit for high batting average and on-base percentage at every stage of his minor league career (after maybe an initial period of adjustment). At 25 years old, he isn't getting any younger. He should platoon with Broxton the rest of the season.

I wouldnt do a strict platoon. If thats how you feel then cool.
I think theres enough AP's that can be found in a MLB lineup to accomodate him. Especially when you have a RF who can play almost every position in baseball. Theres plenty of flexibility that can be found up there. Keon has earned very day CF job PT at this point. He's the guy we should be auditioning to increase trade value going forward along with Perez and Villar. Those are our next best bets to decent returns.

I agree with everything you said except assuming we should ship Villar and Perez. Those guys are only 25 years old and good players.

I somewhat agree. Though at this point anyone shoudl be tradable for talent upgrades. Say for instance that the Pirates call and want Villar in January as their SS going forward. They offer you Josh Bell, KeBryan Hayes, and Nick Kingham. I pull that trigger and not think twice. Villar has been a great story for us all year and is a hell of a player so far. Though with all that said next season he'll be 26 and then going into his first arby eligible year following. Same story with Perez.

I wouldnt be out shopping these guys because the value will probably maintain there going into next season and beyond. In the end though those guys are probably not going to be major core pieces when the young guys get here.

[wichmae]

No Arcia game 2

[Tfence92]

RIP Braun.

Tank away boys!

[ReasonablySober]

welp.

[GB_Packers]

Yeah, he's walking a little better right now but that could be Brauns season if the injury is bad enough.