Rosenthal says Yanks front runner for Haren

[Lconte17]

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/dan- ... cks-072310


If this happens I expect this package to be something like Joba, Zach McAllister, and one (read this on some site earlier today). If they dont include Joba, expect a name like Brackman to be tossed around IMO

[nykgeneralmanager]

He has been pretty average this year, but I'd take the chance on him and hope that he can get back to his stellar self. He is only 29 years old and signed through 2013 (team option) and not for a too insane amount ($12.75 mil next year and 2012).

I'll hold off judgment until what we would actually give up is reported, but we definitely have more than enough pieces to get it done and not hurt the farm.

[Lconte17]

Hearing that Ivan Nova would be key piece for Arizona in a Haren deal w/ Yankees. Talks progressing


on another side note, looks like the Royals have put a 2 major League ready pitcher price tag on Greinke

Royals put two-pitcher pricetag on Greinke — 5:17 p.m.

The Royals will listen if teams want to trade for right-hander Zack Greinke, just as they would on any player, major-league sources say.

But when clubs inquire about Greinke, the Royals respond by saying they would want two major-league-ready pitchers with top-of-the rotation potential in return.

Their logic is that Greinke gives them a chance to win 35 times a year. To move him, they would want to multiply that number to, say, 70 times a year.

Greinke, 26, is under club control for this season and two more, just as Mariners right-hander Felix Hernandez was at last year’s non-waiver deadline.

— Ken Rosenthal

[Christophersp10]

Dan Haren has given up 50 homeruns so far the last 2 seasons. That scares me.

[Pharmcat]

PASS on haren

[Lconte17]

Apparently the sticking point is Joba. Arizona wants Joba plus Nova and two other lesser prospects. The yankees rejected this offer and offered up just a package of prospects, i can assume Ivan Nova and Zach McAllister as the centerpieces. Now, am i worried about Haren's HR rate? Yes, do i think he still is an Ace on a decent team? Yes i do. Arizona Defense, and team as a whole has been **** this year. I think Haren would be the second best pitcher in our staff if we got him. I get a little giddy with the idea that the Yanks could possible end up with CC, LEE, HAREN, AJ, and Hughes as a rotation next year. But the sticking point seems to be Joba... and frankly i cant see why? Haren will out perform Joba, and Nova the next three years undoubtedly.

[nykgeneralmanager]

Joba has struggled this season, but to just throw him away this early in his career isn't completely worth it. Our issue is the pen right now, not the rotation. Swapping Joba for Haren, although an upgrade in talent on the surface, doesn't really make us more prepared to win the World Series this year. For all of Joba's struggles, his peripherals are still really good across the board which gives me hope that he can turn himself around and become a very good reliever. If we were talking about somebody like Lee or another top notch starter, its a no brainer because those guys put you right over the top. Haren, however, would probably be our 3rd/4th best starter next season (if we sign Lee, at best he is our 4th).

I'm not saying we can't do that trade, but I don't think its a no brainer. Even Nova is a solid prospect, probably in the 10-15 range in the system and having an awesome year in AAA. In his last few starts he has reportedly been hitting as high as 95 and 96 on his fastball, and he is still young and cannot be totally disregarded as a filler in a trade.

EDIT:

http://www.minorleagueball.com/2010/7/2 ... e-________

Just came across this

[Ed_The_3rd]

I think that if you can get Haren for something like Joba, Nova and a couple of lesser guys (McAllister? Laird?) then it's a deal you've gotta make. Don't be deceived by his ERA, his K rate and LD% are right at his career norms, an uncharacteristically high BABIP is driving his hit numbers and Arizona's park is tough on righty fly-ball pitchers (his HR/FB is also a touch higher than normal). This is a guy who's coming off a three-year run of numbers that stand up to any pitcher in the league so I'm willing to believe that this season's results are more of a luck-induced blip than anything. His contract isn't exactly onerous for pitcher of his caliber and it creates some flexibility going into this winter in terms of whether or not to make a huge offer to Lee.

BTW, crazy that the Royals are taking offers on Grienke. I understand that his salary is going to jump next season, but it's still great value for a pitcher of his age and ability and it's going to be very tough to get back equal value for him.

[Lconte17]

By no means do i think Nova is a filler. Remember how a few years ago the yankees held Hughes, Joba and IPK in the same breathe? well Nova, Mcallister, Brackman are all being placed along the same path. Its similar to Montero, Sanchez and Romine all being linked together talent wise.

I personally believe Joba has already shown us the best he can be, his problem is maintaining that... which i don't think he can do. So i have no issue moving Joba. I didnt have a problem trading him for Santana, or Halladay or Lee... Haren IMO is one of the top 10 SP in the game. so i wouldnt have to think about moving Joba for him... I dont mind moving Nova either, its what other 2 players would they want. But Joba, Nova for Haren seems like a steal to me... but maybe thats because I have been off the Joba bandwagon for a while now. Only time i like him his when he is throwing at Youk's face

[Dr. Detfink]

PASS on haren

What he said, this is stupid...wanna waste talent and cash on a #4 in the MLB? Joba has the talent, his head needs an enema.

[nykgeneralmanager]

By no means do i think Nova is a filler. Remember how a few years ago the yankees held Hughes, Joba and IPK in the same breathe? well Nova, Mcallister, Brackman are all being placed along the same path. Its similar to Montero, Sanchez and Romine all being linked together talent wise.

I personally believe Joba has already shown us the best he can be, his problem is maintaining that... which i don't think he can do. So i have no issue moving Joba. I didnt have a problem trading him for Santana, or Halladay or Lee... Haren IMO is one of the top 10 SP in the game. so i wouldnt have to think about moving Joba for him... I dont mind moving Nova either, its what other 2 players would they want. But Joba, Nova for Haren seems like a steal to me... but maybe thats because I have been off the Joba bandwagon for a while now. Only time i like him his when he is throwing at Youk's face

I guess it just depends on how everybody views Haren. I view him as a 2nd tier SP, which is good but our bullpen is too shaky to throw Joba away. Yes, he is half the reason that our pen is shaky, but I trust that at some point (if not this season) he will figure himself out. This is the first year in his career that he has been in one role, and he is going to have to accept that and get used to it. Like I said, if we sign Lee our rotation will be CC-Lee-Hughes-Burnett next year, and that isn't counting if Pettitte comes back. So if Pettitte retires, Haren will be our #4. I just feel that Joba can play a huge role for this team down the road, and Haren's role as a #4 starter won't be as big. We can fill in the rest of our rotation from the minors in the coming years and of course free agency.

As for Haren being a top 10 pitcher, I'd rank almost every all-star pitcher ahead of him from this season. That's Jiminez, Johnson, Halladay, Gallardo, Lincecum, Price, Sabathia, Buchholz, Hughes, Lee, Lester, Verlander, Weaver, Greinke. Then there are guys like Strasburg, Hernandez, Santana, Wainwright, Carpenter whoa re all better. There is another group of Kershaw, Hanson, Garza, Oswalt who are all just as good, arguably better. I think Haren is closer to 20-30 than anything near top 10, but thats just a matter of opinion really.

[moocow007]

What other team is going to be willing to pay Haren's contract?

[jack_theripper]

Joba for Haren straight up is a pretty decent deal... probably put in a player like Garrison Lassiter or a fringey relief pitcher... maybe Melancon if they ask for more.

[bishnykfan]

I see no reason to go after a guy like Haren. He is not enough of an upgrade to give up the players the DBacks want back in a trade. I would rather go after a guy like Soria and fix the bullpen that way. I think that we could go after a starter, but I would rather look for a guy that is not signed for next year. If the Yanks are going to get Lee, which it sounds like they will, we have no room for another pitcher signed next year. Lee/Sabathia/Burnett/Hughes/Pettitte should be the starting five next year.

And there is no way Haren is a top 10 pitcher. I am not sure if he ever was even in his best year, nevermind now.

[HCYanks]

A lot of you guys are seriously underrating Haren. He was without doubt a top-10 pitcher in 08 and 09 and every indication says that he's having some bad luck this year. His BB/K is still outstanding and his HR/FB rate is on the high side, so the dingers are going to lessen. He's an Ace, and the rest of the AL is screwed if we get him, Joba or not.

Man if reports are true and Cashman was willing to ship out a Montero package for a Lee rental yet wouldn't get Haren because of **** Joba i'll be pissed.

[nykgeneralmanager]

I felt Lee was unnecessary because of our starting pitching, so that wouldn't change for a lesser pitcher in Haren. Of course he is very good, but if you point to him being unlucky then Joba has been just as unlucky.

Right now our pen is our weakness and our starting pitching is our strength, and Joba + prospects would do nothing to help any weakness on this team. It wouldn't be a "bad" trade but it would be unnecessary, and that is why I wouldn't jump to do it.

It would leave our middle relief even thinner. Robertson takes over the 8th inning role and then who is left in middle relief? Boone Logan? Given that everybody hates Mitre so much, I would think that Nova would have more value around here...he is the 6th starter who is there to replace injured starters. He can certainly play a role even if just as a long reliever someday and would be better than Gaudin and Mitre.

EDIT:
If Pettitte does come back, we would have CC - Haren - Hughes - Burnett - Pettitte. Would we then pass on Lee? Would we even have the money left for Lee if we eat Haren's contract? Obviously we would all rather have Lee and Joba as opposed to just Haren.

[Lconte17]

EDIT:
If Pettitte does come back, we would have CC - Haren - Hughes - Burnett - Pettitte. Would we then pass on Lee? Would we even have the money left for Lee if we eat Haren's contract? Obviously we would all rather have Lee and Joba as opposed to just Haren.

The assumption is and i have read numerous people write that the Yankees are working on the assumption that Pettitte is retiring at seasons end. They are planning on pursuing players based on that unless Andy tells them something otherwise. So that would still leave us with one open spot for Lee. I also don't think it isnt possible to see Burnett mentioned in off season trade rumors.

[HCYanks]

If Haren gets back to the level he's been at the past couple years (and I think he will), he's at the very least comparable to Lee. He's also two years younger and (relatively) cost controlled until 2013. Don't forget that signing Lee will likely require a Sabathia-like deal that takes him into his late 30s. And above all else, it's bad management to be building around signing a specific free agent--it's done wonders for the Knicks clearly.

I still certainly think Joba can get himself back on track. But if he's the centerpiece to this deal, I think it's well worth it. Nova's having a nice season in Scranton but does he even have a future with the team?

[HCYanks]

SI's Jon Heyman tweets that in addition to Chamberlain, the Yankees are hesitant to part with pitchers Hector Noesi and Dellin Betances in a potential Haren trade.

I mean really. I'd like to keep Betances too but since when is Noesi too vital to deal in such a trade? Either Cashman is leaking bad rumors to screw with people or he's getting as bad as the Angels FO with overhyping his own prospects.

[nykgeneralmanager]

Hmm, does that mean the DBacks want Joba, Noesi, and Betances? Or one of Noesi/Betances. I'd imagine its the former, because there is no way the Yankees value Noesi nearly as much as Betances. His stuff is ok, not spectacular, its his control that is going to make him a major leaguer...he is closer to Ian Kennedy as a prospect than he is to Joba or Betances.

No way would I give up Joba and Betances for Haren, none the less with Noesi thrown in as well.