and does it scare you?
I'll admit I was a bit pessimistic entering the season; I pegged the Mariners hanging out in the cellar by mid-May. Now that they seem to be on a roll and a (somewhat) legit contender for the division/wild card, do you see Bavasi making any kind of play to improve their chances down the stretch? More importantly: are you worried he may make another foolish deal?
Let
What Do You See the Mariners Doing at the Deadline...
What Do You See the Mariners Doing at the Deadline...
-
Basketball Jesus
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 31,180
- And1: 7
- Joined: Sep 04, 2003
- Location: P-nuts + hair doos
What Do You See the Mariners Doing at the Deadline...
Manocad wrote:The universe is the age it is. We can all agree it's 13 billion years old, and nothing changes. We can all agree it's 6000 years old, and nothing changes. We can all disagree on how old it is, and nothing changes. Some people really need a hobby.
-
Ex-hippie
- Assistant Coach
- Posts: 4,213
- And1: 0
- Joined: Jun 17, 2003
I read somewhere that Mark Buehrle could go on the market and the M's could be a possible destination. He'll be a free agent at the end of this season, so I hope we wouldn't give up too much for a rental.
Overall my inclination would be to stand pat since we're a longshot no matter what we do; might as well build for the future. But another variable is that Ichiro is going to be a free agent, and supposedly the organization wants to do everything it can to convince him they're building a winner. Even a symbolic move might help that cause. Personally I'd let Ichiro walk, save a big chunk of change and get a compensatory draft pick.
Anyway, if Bavasi trades for a starting pitcher, would that be an admission that the Batista, Weaver and Ramirez acquisitions were mistakes?
Overall my inclination would be to stand pat since we're a longshot no matter what we do; might as well build for the future. But another variable is that Ichiro is going to be a free agent, and supposedly the organization wants to do everything it can to convince him they're building a winner. Even a symbolic move might help that cause. Personally I'd let Ichiro walk, save a big chunk of change and get a compensatory draft pick.
Anyway, if Bavasi trades for a starting pitcher, would that be an admission that the Batista, Weaver and Ramirez acquisitions were mistakes?
-
Basketball Jesus
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 31,180
- And1: 7
- Joined: Sep 04, 2003
- Location: P-nuts + hair doos
hippie wrote:I read somewhere that Mark Buehrle could go on the market and the M's could be a possible destination. He'll be a free agent at the end of this season, so I hope we wouldn't give up too much for a rental.
I think what makes me the most uneasy is that the Mariners trade for somebody like Buehrle (i.e. a marginal rental player with name recognition) in false hope that he'll make an impact down the stretch and in doing so, giving up some of their better young prospects. I don't Bavasi's dumb enough to trade Adam Jones especially considering he's mashing AAA pitchers right now, I'm more concerned he flips anybody else doing well in the minors.
Overall my inclination would be to stand pat since we're a longshot no matter what we do; might as well build for the future. But another variable is that Ichiro is going to be a free agent, and supposedly the organization wants to do everything it can to convince him they're building a winner. Even a symbolic move might help that cause. Personally I'd let Ichiro walk, save a big chunk of change and get a compensatory draft pick.
I think Ichiro's too much of a cash cow that the Mariners will let him walk without making a competitive pitch. The problem, like you said, is convincing him to stay and that would probably take convincing him that the Mariners are dedicated to building a short-term winner. But really, who could the Mariners get that would provide the team with more than a half-season rental? Outside of a select few I'm not too dedicated to any one prospect but I also don't like the thought of sacrificing future depth to placate the whims of an aging CF, no matter how popular or how good.
Anyway, if Bavasi trades for a starting pitcher, would that be an admission that the Batista, Weaver and Ramirez acquisitions were mistakes?
I would imagine that would be the last thing on his mind if the right offer were to come along. Weaver's pretty much an acknowledged unmitigated disaster and neither Ramirez or Batista have the track record to assume they'll turn it around. At worst you have a pissed off 36-year-old and a pissed off career underachiever. I'm sure he doesn't need to save face with the fans; they want what's best for the team.
Manocad wrote:The universe is the age it is. We can all agree it's 13 billion years old, and nothing changes. We can all agree it's 6000 years old, and nothing changes. We can all disagree on how old it is, and nothing changes. Some people really need a hobby.
-
Ex-hippie
- Assistant Coach
- Posts: 4,213
- And1: 0
- Joined: Jun 17, 2003
Unfortunately, Bavasi has a track record -- last year he traded Asdrubal Cabrera for a rental, and now Cabrera is lighting it up for Cleveland's AAA team. (Last I heard, a few weeks ago.)
Another prospect I really hope they don't trade is Wladimir Balentien. He looked like a one-trick pony for a while there, but he's really improved his approach at the plate and I think he can be a good righty power hitter as soon as next year. Balentien, Jones, Tillman, Butler, and I guess Clement... they should be virtually off limits. I wouldn't mind if they traded the likes of Oswaldo Navarro, Bryan Lahair, Andy Barb or Rob Johnson. Matt Tuiasosopo would be a close call. And there's always Jeremy Reed.
Another prospect I really hope they don't trade is Wladimir Balentien. He looked like a one-trick pony for a while there, but he's really improved his approach at the plate and I think he can be a good righty power hitter as soon as next year. Balentien, Jones, Tillman, Butler, and I guess Clement... they should be virtually off limits. I wouldn't mind if they traded the likes of Oswaldo Navarro, Bryan Lahair, Andy Barb or Rob Johnson. Matt Tuiasosopo would be a close call. And there's always Jeremy Reed.
-
Basketball Jesus
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 31,180
- And1: 7
- Joined: Sep 04, 2003
- Location: P-nuts + hair doos
If the Mariners could trick a team into trading for Tuiasosopo, that'd probably be the best-case scenario involving a "top" prospect. I don't like him, but the organization does, probably because of the bloodlines and the athleticism. Right now he's playing out of his mind and I doubt he keeps it up.
The others would be tough sells: LaHair's a bit old and not very good, Johnson's not that good, Navarro's more defensively inclined. I like Barb but he's a relief pitcher, so there's limited upside. He'd make a great throw-in, especially with the numbers he's putting up.
The others would be tough sells: LaHair's a bit old and not very good, Johnson's not that good, Navarro's more defensively inclined. I like Barb but he's a relief pitcher, so there's limited upside. He'd make a great throw-in, especially with the numbers he's putting up.
Manocad wrote:The universe is the age it is. We can all agree it's 13 billion years old, and nothing changes. We can all agree it's 6000 years old, and nothing changes. We can all disagree on how old it is, and nothing changes. Some people really need a hobby.
-
Sweezo
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 18,215
- And1: 36
- Joined: Aug 12, 2001
-
Besides Jones and Truinfel, I can't think of any prospects that I'd be that upset about if moved...
Buerhle was who I had in mind before reading the rest of this thread. The M's have no choice but to look to buy instead of sell as Bavasi's made moves that indicate this is his last stand. If he wants to keep his job, he's going to have to continue the push to keep the M's in the playoff race.
Oh, and if any Sox fans try to make the argument that we should trade them Ichiro in order to make sure we don't lose him for nothing...I'm going to put a gun to my head and end it all.
Buerhle was who I had in mind before reading the rest of this thread. The M's have no choice but to look to buy instead of sell as Bavasi's made moves that indicate this is his last stand. If he wants to keep his job, he's going to have to continue the push to keep the M's in the playoff race.
Oh, and if any Sox fans try to make the argument that we should trade them Ichiro in order to make sure we don't lose him for nothing...I'm going to put a gun to my head and end it all.
-
JCizzle
- Rookie
- Posts: 1,088
- And1: 1
- Joined: Jun 02, 2007
Sweezo wrote:Oh, and if any Sox fans try to make the argument that we should trade them Ichiro in order to make sure we don't lose him for nothing...I'm going to put a gun to my head and end it all.
LOL Already done and I was thinking that exact thing. But only if you guys hit a losing streak. You doing this "winning" thing really screwed up everything.
-
Basketball Jesus
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 31,180
- And1: 7
- Joined: Sep 04, 2003
- Location: P-nuts + hair doos
Sweezo wrote:Oh, and if any Sox fans try to make the argument that we should trade them Ichiro in order to make sure we don't lose him for nothing...I'm going to put a gun to my head and end it all.
You should trade us Ichiro for Julio Lugo and the rights to Kevin Millar's broadcasting career.
Manocad wrote:The universe is the age it is. We can all agree it's 13 billion years old, and nothing changes. We can all agree it's 6000 years old, and nothing changes. We can all disagree on how old it is, and nothing changes. Some people really need a hobby.
-
Sweezo
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 18,215
- And1: 36
- Joined: Aug 12, 2001
-
JCizzle wrote:LOL Already done and I was thinking that exact thing. But only if you guys hit a losing streak. You doing this "winning" thing really screwed up everything.
I don't think any Mariners fans really expected the success the team is having right now, so it's a nice surprise. I think many of us were suspecting a firesale at the deadline...
-
Ex-hippie
- Assistant Coach
- Posts: 4,213
- And1: 0
- Joined: Jun 17, 2003
If we fall out of contention and start selling off pieces for prospects, one guy I'd love to target is Michael Bourn of Philly. He'll be a classic leadoff hitter. Rated by Baseball America as best hitter for average, best speed and best plate discipline in the Phillies' organization. There's your Ichiro replacement.
The reason I'm looking for a leadoff hitter: I still think that re-signing Ichiro to a long-term deal is a scary proposition. No one relies on pure speed more than Ichiro, and you can't say how long that will last now that he's on the wrong side of 30. If he loses just a step or two, a lot of those infield singles turn into outs. As Branch Rickey used to say, better to trade 'em too early than too late.
The reason I'm looking for a leadoff hitter: I still think that re-signing Ichiro to a long-term deal is a scary proposition. No one relies on pure speed more than Ichiro, and you can't say how long that will last now that he's on the wrong side of 30. If he loses just a step or two, a lot of those infield singles turn into outs. As Branch Rickey used to say, better to trade 'em too early than too late.
-
BlackMamba
- Retired Mod
- Posts: 16,297
- And1: 81
- Joined: Jun 20, 2004
- Location: Cd. de M
-
