RealGM

or: a general off-season thread.

out is josh lueke! in is catcher john jaso! WOW!

ok, not really 'wow' worthy, but at least its some mariner news.

hit .224/.298/.651 in 89 games for tampa last year. 5 home runs, 27 rbi.

Overall, I like the Jaso trade. Lueke was on borrowed time with the M's and I'm happy Z managed to keep him on the roster long enough to trade him for something of potential value. Z made a statement earlier today indicating he's counting on bounce-back years from Guti/Wells/Ryan, but Jaso's also got to be in that heap. If he produces more like he did in '10 than he did in '11, then that trade's a steal. The free agent market for catchers was bare, and we'd been supposedly sowing interest in Kelly Shoppach [who's possibly the only worst hacking catcher in the league than Olivo].

What's next?

espn's jim bowden says seattle is the favorite to land fielder.

unconfirmed rumor joy!

TTown wrote:espn's jim bowden says seattle is the favorite to land fielder.

unconfirmed rumor joy!

Yes, I'm a buzzkill...but I don't buy it. Once Pujols is off the market [Cardinals? Marlins? Cubs?] the market would seem to shift to Fielder. I expect the Cubs would be the favorite; Epstein probably wants to make a big splash, and sticking Fielder at 1B would seem to accomplish that.

in other words, we need to speed things up and try to lock in a deal before Pujols has a chance to decide his team.

on a side note, hanley ramirez doesn't seem too happy in miami with them forcing him to play third base. any opinions about making a trade to land him?

ichiro
ackley
han-ram
fielder
carp

that would be pretty sweet. but would def. cost us say pineda or one of our other pitching prospects.

Knowing the Mariners, our biggest move is going to be trading for some pitcher who had a 3.50 ERA in single-A ball.

good, pujols and cj wilson to the halos.

i was worried the gap wouldn't widen this offseason. phew.

TTown wrote:good, pujols and cj wilson to the halos.

i was worried the gap wouldn't widen this offseason. phew.

Well...that's the end of that. Now the rumor that the Rangers may go after Fielder just needs to come to fruition, and we can start to put the pieces in place to contend within our own division by 2017.

our mission now is simple.

just finish ahead of the damn astros when they come over.

oh, fantastic. chris paul to the lakers. i was afraid one giant kick to the nuts was going to have to suffice, but then at the eleventh hour another archrival was able to swoop in and deliver one.

quick, somebody start working the phones and get aaron rodgers and tom brady to the nfc west, let's make this a day to really remember.

TTown wrote:just sign with somebody already, prince fielder.

It's irritating, isn't it? It feels like we've thrown our lot in with Prince Fielder or nothing at this point. So far, this offseason has been extremely disappointing. Our primary competition has gotten much stronger and we're treading water.

I think what the M's are willing to pay isn't enough for Prince/Boras, and I wouldn't be shocked if Prince really isn't stoked about the idea of coming here to play. The team seems further away from contending that it did a few months ago, and we're nowhere near where he considers 'home.'

Just sign already...

apparently we're in some sort of pursuit of both kevin millwood and jeff francis, or at least, the agents of kevin millwood and jeff francis are telling media outlets that we are in pursuit to drive up the price of their clients.

I have no problem with adding either. Or both. Assuming the price for each is what I would expect it to be, anyway. We could possibly use a couple stopgap vets while waiting for the youngsters to arrive and possibly move Vargas. If I had my choice I would prefer Millwood over Francis but they'd each fill a role.

Sweezo wrote:

TTown wrote:just sign with somebody already, prince fielder.

It's irritating, isn't it? It feels like we've thrown our lot in with Prince Fielder or nothing at this point. So far, this offseason has been extremely disappointing. Our primary competition has gotten much stronger and we're treading water.

I think what the M's are willing to pay isn't enough for Prince/Boras, and I wouldn't be shocked if Prince really isn't stoked about the idea of coming here to play. The team seems further away from contending that it did a few months ago, and we're nowhere near where he considers 'home.'

Just sign already...

Egads, yes. I just hope that we are offering Fielder what it would take to get him, and that Boras is just "working it" with other teams to get more. I'm with Geoff Baker on this one. We have to make the big play for Fielder, a sincere and aggressive play for him. The team's fan-base is becoming less interested, and needs a strong infusion of hope now.

If we do make such a play for him, but we don't land him because the money is close enough elsewhere and he really doesn't really want to play here, then I also agree with Baker in that it changes our objectives looking forward. We well might have to consider moving Felix for a boatload of prospects, as we well might not be able to reasonably contend before his contract comes close to expiring.

The fate of our team, or the long term strategy for it, well might be hinging upon what happens with Fielder now. I have to think the M's are serious about their quest of him. Just have to.

Pardon my directionless frustration in advance...

Bulltalk wrote:Egads, yes. I just hope that we are offering Fielder what it would take to get him, and that Boras is just "working it" with other teams to get more. I'm with Geoff Baker on this one. We have to make the big play for Fielder, a sincere and aggressive play for him. The team's fan-base is becoming less interested, and needs a strong infusion of hope now.

The fate of our team, or the long term strategy for it, well might be hinging upon what happens with Fielder now. I have to think the M's are serious about their quest of him. Just have to.

But what if that isn't really an option? Missing out on Fielder may suck, but not as bad as centering your entire offseason around pursuing a player who doesn't want to come here and is using you as leverage to parlay a better deal elsewhere [i.e. Nationals]. So far, what's come of our offseason?

[1] We acquired a back-up catcher for a young relief pitcher [Jaso]
[2] The market to trade League and/or any other pricey reliever crashed.
[3] We were rumored to be interested in an older OF/IF type [Cuddyer] who signed elsewhere
[4] We were rumored to be interested in an older OF/DH type [Willingham] who signed elsewhere
[5] We were rumored to be interested in an in his prime 1B/DH type who may or may not reciprocate that interest [Fielder]
[6] We added a veteran LOOGY [Sherill]
[7] We were rumored to be interested in trading for a platoon OF [S. Smith]
[8] We were rumored to be interested in some MOR SP [Millwood/Moyer/Francis/Iwakuma]

That's pretty much it. Certainly Jack Z doesn't let the fanbase in on the inner workings of the team and what they are or aren't attempting to do, but the stuff that has leaked has been underwhelming.

Maybe the interest from the Nationals is all misdirection. God knows the attempts at making the Cubs and/or Rangers out to be suitors have gone nowhere to this point. But that's Boras' game.

If Fielder comes here on a big deal with an opt out clause that lets him leverage this team in a couple years like Sabathia just did to the Yankees is it worth the trouble? I don't really want to pay $25 million to someone who quite simply does not want to be here and is going to be looking for an excuse to leave in 2-3 years anyway. That sets us up for a scenario where Fielder can simply leave early if he does well, or sits on our payroll for forever if he doesn't. Neat.

The whole Fielder thing pisses me off. I like him as a player but not at any cost. If we're at the point where the entire offseason is clearly made or broken by whether we acquire a player who may only come here for the money, that frustrates the hell out of me.

I hate Scott Boras.

Bulltalk wrote:If we do make such a play for him, but we don't land him because the money is close enough elsewhere and he really doesn't really want to play here, then I also agree with Baker in that it changes our objectives looking forward. We well might have to consider moving Felix for a boatload of prospects, as we well might not be able to reasonably contend before his contract comes close to expiring.

I don't know that I disagree with that, as painful as that sounds. And if that happens, then I guess we try again next offseason with a young core and Ichiro's contract off the books. But then this season will be brutal for our fans to watch, and I can't imagine Jack Z would survive the season even if the cupboards are stocked with prospects.

The reality is we're still paying for the mistakes Bavasi made, and that sucks. The speed with which that **** killed the momentum of this franchise and this fanbase is outstanding. He left his antecedent with a scuttled minor league system and a smattering of bad contracts.

mariners sign iwakuma. $1.5 base, 4.9 in potential incentives.

honestly, i haven't been paying super close attention to this. the incentives seem to be based around starts and innings pitched, which naturally lead me to assume he's coming over here to lock down a spot in the rotation. felix/pineda/beavan/vargas/iwakuma?

TTown wrote:mariners sign iwakuma. $1.5 base, 4.9 in potential incentives.

honestly, i haven't been paying super close attention to this. the incentives seem to be based around starts and innings pitched, which naturally lead me to assume he's coming over here to lock down a spot in the rotation. felix/pineda/beavan/vargas/iwakuma?

There's also reports out there that we're interested in Paul Malholm, who really wouldn't be a bad fit either if his shoulder's healthy.

I like the Iwakuma signing; here's a guy that the A's offered $15 million to later year [after posting a $19 million fee]. We just got him for a fraction of that. If he's healthy I think he has a good chance to be a valuable starter for us.

The FA pitchers the M's are looking at this year seem to fit the mold of what Jack Z likes [low risk/high reward]. Putting Bedard on an incentive laden deal last year really worked pretty well. We have some fantastic talent in the minors...why not bridge the gap until we know they are ready?

Cubs acquired Rizzo from Padres, which means one of his suitors are gone. Which now still leaves Nationals and Rangers. God this has been one boring off season.