No Need to Blow It Up

[your_dallas_mavericks]

It's time to blow it up...

[Rand10]

I'd rather retool and make one more run at a title. If we do rebuild though, the ideal trade for me would be Dirk for Bynum/Odom. It's not very likely, but maybe if LA won the title this year they would consider it. Add in Howard for Ariza, Mihm if it makes them pull the trigger.

[Teffer10]

I've seen a couple of my fellow fans suggesting that the Mavs are one star or one great wing player away from title contenders. But how exactly are we going to get that player with the assets we have? Jason Terry, a guy we thought had no trade value at all, has played fairly well the past two games and upped his value to mediocre (w/the contract). Josh, who had a ton of value last offseason, now has seen his drop to mediocre as well. Stack has none. Kidd's value is as an expiring contract or perhaps to a young team on the verge...but we still won't be able to get a ton for him. Bass has great value now, IMO, as does Dirk.

So the two guys we want to keep have the most value. Sound familiar?

The facts, IMO, are these:

(1) We haven't been close to championship-caliber all season, and we're certainly not there right now.
(2) Even if we only need "one star" or one good wing player, we don't have the assets necessary to acquire that player without trading someone we already need or want to keep (e.g., Bass).
(3) We're at least a year late in blowing this up, and that needs to happen this offseason.

Very well put!!!

Time to rebuild using Dirk's current value which is still fairly high.
If we wait a few years, over the next decade we can expect to be like the Hawks and Clips were most of this decade or the Mavs of the 90s.

[DDansby123]

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Very well put!!!

Time to rebuild using Dirk's current value which is still fairly high.
If we wait a few years, over the next decade we can expect to be like the Hawks and Clips were most of this decade or the Mavs of the 90s.

It's not just that Dirk's value is high, but we actually, for ONCE, have a backup for Dirk who can step right into the starting lineup for the next 5-7 years. It's not that Bass is an All-Star, but I think he's a capable starting PF in this league, particularly in the WC. And, of course, he's pretty young.

If we could get a mobile, tough C in a Dirk deal and a SG, we'd have the start of a pretty solid rebuilding project. I believe we can build a Pistons-like defensive unit that is capable of winning a championship in a few years.

The fact that our two best trade pieces play the same position isn't necessarily a bad thing.

[JordansBulls]

The Mavs need someone to be consistent other than Dirk.

Dirk is averaging 28 ppg and 12 rpg on 50% shooting.

The reason the Mavs are not doing well currently is because of Josh Howard and the rest of the cast.

Josh Howard is getting 13 ppg and 6.5 rpg but on 26% fg

Jason Kidd is getting 7 ppg and 7 rpg and 6.3 apg on 37% fg

Stackhouse is getting 5 ppg and 3 rpg on 27% fg

Devean George is shooting 30% fg

Eddie Jones is shooting 33% fg


The supporting cast for Dallas is absolutely terrible in these playoffs.

[Teffer10]

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It's not just that Dirk's value is high, but we actually, for ONCE, have a backup for Dirk who can step right into the starting lineup for the next 5-7 years. It's not that Bass is an All-Star, but I think he's a capable starting PF in this league, particularly in the WC. And, of course, he's pretty young.

If we could get a mobile, tough C in a Dirk deal and a SG, we'd have the start of a pretty solid rebuilding project. I believe we can build a Pistons-like defensive unit that is capable of winning a championship in a few years.

The fact that our two best trade pieces play the same position isn't necessarily a bad thing.

That is what I was thinking. Not that Dirk is expendible, but we do have a promising player that can play his position. Dirk's value can land us some decent young promising players and draft picks that could help us compete in the coming years.

However, the only reason why I would be apprehensive about rebuilding now is because we don't have 2 draft picks in the next 3 years and teams like Portland, NO, Utah, and Lakers will be nearly impossible to compete with for the next 5+ years.
In addition to that, teams like Minny, Memphis, and Seattle would have a nice head start on us in the rebuild process so it could be another 90's decade for us if we attempt to go the rebuild route now.

[DDansby123]

However, the only reason why I would be apprehensive about rebuilding now is because we don't have 2 draft picks in the next 3 years and teams like Portland, NO, Utah, and Lakers will be nearly impossible to compete with for the next 5+ years.
In addition to that, teams like Minny, Memphis, and Seattle would have a nice head start on us in the rebuild process so it could be another 90's decade for us if we attempt to go the rebuild route now.

Here's what I see if we don't rebuild now: 2-3 wasted years chasing Utah, San Antonio, LAL, New Orleans, and maybe even Houston, followed by 2-3 years of "rebuilding" chasing Minny, Memphis, Seattle, and Portland. So, if we wait to rebuild, we'll be behind the contenders while trying to contend, then behind the rebuilders while trying to rebuild. Either way, we come out in the middle. Oh, and we waste Dirk's prime in the process.

But I believe the Mavs could trade Dirk, do a quick, decisive rebuild over a two-year period, and wind up ahead of the teams currently rebuilding, while giving a couple of the current contenders (SA, Phoenix, Houston, and possibly Utah) a chance to fizzle out.

[Pointguard01]

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Here's what I see if we don't rebuild now: 2-3 wasted years chasing Utah, San Antonio, LAL, New Orleans, and maybe even Houston, followed by 2-3 years of "rebuilding" chasing Minny, Memphis, Seattle, and Portland. So, if we wait to rebuild, we'll be behind the contenders while trying to contend, then behind the rebuilders while trying to rebuild. Either way, we come out in the middle. Oh, and we waste Dirk's prime in the process.

But I believe the Mavs could trade Dirk, do a quick, decisive rebuild over a two-year period, and wind up ahead of the teams currently rebuilding, while giving a couple of the current contenders (SA, Phoenix, Houston, and possibly Utah) a chance to fizzle out.

EXACTLY

The problem with ALLL teams is they wait to rebuild until its too late and all their players dont have value. Dirk has GREAT GREAT value. Howard, contrary to popular belief still has value IMO, with a solid contract. He's not a 2nd option, but a damn good 3rd option for a team contending. We can get some good young talent with these players, as well as getting other teams to take on the contracts of Damp, Stack and Terry in the process I'd think.

We are stuck in that middle where we arent good enough but also not bad enough. Look at the Kings, when they traded Webber, they shoulda traded Bibby, Miller and Peja for expirers and young players that next offseason, but they tried to remain with them and re-tool. Dallas is in that same situation IMO, and we need to make the right decision.

[DDansby123]

We are stuck in that middle where we arent good enough but also not bad enough. Look at the Kings, when they traded Webber, they shoulda traded Bibby, Miller and Peja for expirers and young players that next offseason, but they tried to remain with them and re-tool. Dallas is in that same situation IMO, and we need to make the right decision.

The Kings are about the closest comparison I can think of. Both teams were in very similar positions: talented teams that never won a title with superstars a lot of people questioned as soft, poor defensively, etc. The Kings traded Webber a year or two too late and failed to recognize that a total rebuild was necessary at the time. It's been downhill for the Kings since then...as they've waited until the worst possible times to trade off their once-valuable pieces. Bibby was a 21-PPG scorer in 2005 when he should've been traded, and a 13-PPG scorer this year when he finally was traded. Peja was a 20-PPG scorer in 2005 when he should've been traded, and a 16-PPG scorer when he was dealt for headcase Ron Artest. They'd be lucky to get an expiring for Brad Miller now. How far they've fallen. I don't want to risk the possibility that the same could happen to the Mavs.

[djsunyc]

no need to panic folks.

kidd is still a great player...just need a new offense.

maybe parlay josh howard for marion?

and try to sign someone with the MLE. (ricky buckets?)

you can't blow it up...not with the highest payroll and 2 of the next 3 #1's traded. you have to keep adding to this. the team still wins a bunch of games, sells out the arena and makes a ton of money.

[Flexx10dzl]

But Dallas will have to give something to get something..Dirk is Soft and the MAvs need another leader that will allow dirk to be robin instead of batman

[etopn23]

Woo i'm a have to catch the lil ball of hate tomorrow morning. She is going to rip UP Avery. I'm not even going to get started with Galloway.

Irvin is going to look like a dumb ass for backing up Avery. Lol.

[Pointguard01]

Yea DDan, they waited way too late even though the signs were pointing to rebuild. I think alot of us still imagine this team as a 67 win team and last year was just a mishap. No! This is what we are. A borderline playoff team. Yes we can make trade to improve, but will it eb enough. Has it ever been enough? Who are we targeting to improve us? Redd is probably the best player available, but does he really make us good enough to compete with the Lakers or Hornets? IMO, probably not....

no need to panic folks.

kidd is still a great player...just need a new offense.

maybe parlay josh howard for marion?

and try to sign someone with the MLE. (ricky buckets?)

you can't blow it up...not with the highest payroll and 2 of the next 3 #1's traded. you have to keep adding to this. the team still wins a bunch of games, sells out the arena and makes a ton of money.

Kidd is not a great player anymore. He's a good player, and serves a very important role still, but he's no star anymore IMO. From what I've seen, he's really fallen off.

This yr's pick doesnt matter b/c its gonna be in the 20's and we dont have it whether we rebuild or retool. Yes, we risk losing a top pick in 2010 if we rebuild, but by trading Dirk and getting the 2009 lottery pick assuming we would be bad, that could be top top level talens to build around. Howard could also net another young stud or pick.

[JES12]

Woo i'm a have to catch the lil ball of hate tomorrow morning. She is going to rip UP Avery. I'm not even going to get started with Galloway.

Irvin is going to look like a dumb ass for backing up Avery. Lol.

Nate's my boy!!!!!!!!!
I seem to always agree with Nate and always disagree with Irvin.....go figure.

[jbsg02]

Rebuilding is a scary thought. Alot of teams "rebuild" and just stay bad for a long time. I don't think Cuban is the kind of owner who will rebuild either. And plus, how do you rebuild when you trade all your draft picks

[DDansby123]

Rebuilding is a scary thought. Alot of teams "rebuild" and just stay bad for a long time. I don't think Cuban is the kind of owner who will rebuild either. And plus, how do you rebuild when you trade all your draft picks

You're absolutely right about Cuban. I don't think rebuilding suits him business-wise or fan-wise. He's too in love with profits (as he should be) to rebuild, and he's too in love with the Mavs/players to suck for a little while. Tough for him.

But in terms of rebuilding, that's a fairly simple formula: acquire draft picks (via trading your star players or sucking for a while), obtain cap space (via letting expiring contract expire and acquiring short deals for longer-term ones), and dedicate yourself to developing.

In terms of picks, 1-10 guys are usually the difference makers, 10-20 are usually solid NBA players, maybe even All-Stars, and guys in the 20-31 range usually are nothing more than decent role players (if that). You rebuild with lottery picks, not the picks we've had over the past several years (Harris excluded). Those picks (our picks) are what you use to retool...to find cheap replacement players with some potential.

If you guys are torn up over us losing picks in 08 and 10, trading Dirk could probably net a high first in either of those years. Suck next season and pick up another lottery pick. Sign FAs that offseason and the offseason thereafter, and retool with our late-first draft picks in following seasons. Simple! Sort of...

[jbsg02]

[quote="DDansby123"][/quote]

I realize that picks ini the late 20's don't net star players, but if we were to rebuild and stuggle in the next few years, those picks could be lottery picks

[Pointguard01]

Ya'll we are nly losing ONE pick. We arent getting the 2008 pick whether we rebuild or try to compete, its gone. Yes, it would suck to have a top 10 pick in 2010 and not get to keep it, but Id take that over in the offseason of 2010 still not having a championship and wondering what happened and thinking "what if".

[DDansby123]

Ya'll we are nly losing ONE pick. We arent getting the 2008 pick whether we rebuild or try to compete, its gone. Yes, it would suck to have a top 10 pick in 2010 and not get to keep it, but Id take that over in the offseason of 2010 still not having a championship and wondering what happened and thinking "what if".

Exactly. I don't understand all this "we can't rebuild since we don't have our 2010 pick" nonsense.

[myconsumerclub]

Free agents on the cheap:

C/F Kwame Brown: Better than Diop offensively and less than Diop on the defensive end but a nice back up with a decent defensive game would be an improvement over what our bench currently has. Nice size as well.

C/F Earl Barron: 7' and can score big on ocasion is a developing young player that we can get now for cheap who may develop into a good player later on.

PG Beno Udrih showed signs of developing into a solid potential starter for a good team and would offer insurance if Kidd is not resigned. Not a great PG but for the money he should be able to help out more than Lue or JJ.

Then we trade for an impact player at SG who can score and play D, draft best available in the 2nd round, bring back R Terry and resign Antoine Wright.