Mavericks 2017 Draft #9

[Nowitness]

According to mike fisher dsj inched slightly ahead of frank on the mavs draft board

[bobsquad]

I've been anti-DSJ for months. I didn't think a raw ball-dominant guard would be the best fit for this team, development- and timeline-wise. DSJ's floor, for me, is a more athletic Larkin.

And by many insider accounts, the Mavs FO viewed Smith lower than other prospects for much of the pre-draft process.

Now that I hear the FO is on board, I'm sold... almost. DSJ plays like he wants to be the next Russell Westbrook. If RC can convince him to be the next Chris Paul instead, we could have a fit.

[Pointguard01]

Watched some more Dennis Smith highlites, definitely torn over which PG I would want given the choice.

Lillard could be Smith's ceiling. Frank is definitely more of a wild card, has size unlike most PG's as well.

Starting to feel very comfortable with Smith, could be the spark we need..but would he do well under RC? Frank seems to be a more likable personality.

Regardless its starting to seem like a very nice option could fall to us at #9. Exciting stuff.

Same here. I watch DSJ highlights and I come away with the idea he can be some version of Steve Francis, Steph Marbury, Kemba Walker type. But, there are so many question marks about him that it becomes risky. I would love that he would be surrounded by a great veteran team (Dirk, Matthews, Barnes, Harris, Barea) and no questionable character guys.

My biggest concern with Smith is if he is a winner. Sure, I think the guy is going to a player and could, at worst, be a scoring machine, but are you going to win a championship with him? If we are ACTUALLY saying "Let's build a contender from scratch", are we going to be looking to either sell high on him in 2-years, in which you never get good value (see the De'Angelo Russell trade) or riding that train until we notice he isn't a winner?

With Frank Ntilikina, I don't know what I'm getting. I love his defense. I love that he already could be a 40% shooter from 3 at age 18. I love his intangibles. And I do trust the Maverick's international department surprisingly enough. With international prospects, we never see enough and it's a completely different game, speed, tempo, style, etc.

These are my top two prospects of those that could fall to #9 and I would be happy with the risk that each brings. Anyone who can sit here and say "Player X is trash" is completely delusional to the faults in both of these players and how that fits the long-term direction of Dallas.

Ultimately, it's SUPER unlikely Dallas has to make the decision. And we can only hope one of these two are available so we can move forward with a really solid prospect. Otherwise, we are looking at limited potential (Markkanen), poor fit (Monk), or a reach (Collins, Mitchell, or Lennard).

Smith has the athletic tools to be another Steve Francis except he'd be a better shooter. I think Smith is going to be the best point guard in the draft. Fultz is a jack of all trades, master of none type player. I think he'll be a solid starter, but not an all star. Ball has severe problems with his shot and is questionable on defense. Then you have the problem of his father getting involved and whispering in his ear. Smith has a way higher ceiling than both.

If Monk, Ball, Fultz, Smith are all gone then I would trade the 9th for Dlo. He's developed nicely and he's still young. There's no point in wasting that pick on someone like Kennard.

I think DSJ's ceiling is a more explosive Lillard. Ball's ceiling is Andre Miller.

But what's their floor? And how likely do we expect them to be somewhere in-between?

BTW, do we consider Steve Francis a winner? I see this comparison all the time (see my post above lol), and I'm wondering if we actually think we can build around that...and then win a championship?

[daoneandonly]

Watched some more Dennis Smith highlites, definitely torn over which PG I would want given the choice.

Lillard could be Smith's ceiling. Frank is definitely more of a wild card, has size unlike most PG's as well.

Starting to feel very comfortable with Smith, could be the spark we need..but would he do well under RC? Frank seems to be a more likable personality.

Regardless its starting to seem like a very nice option could fall to us at #9. Exciting stuff.

Same here. I watch DSJ highlights and I come away with the idea he can be some version of Steve Francis, Steph Marbury, Kemba Walker type. But, there are so many question marks about him that it becomes risky. I would love that he would be surrounded by a great veteran team (Dirk, Matthews, Barnes, Harris, Barea) and no questionable character guys.

My biggest concern with Smith is if he is a winner. Sure, I think the guy is going to a player and could, at worst, be a scoring machine, but are you going to win a championship with him? If we are ACTUALLY saying "Let's build a contender from scratch", are we going to be looking to either sell high on him in 2-years, in which you never get good value (see the De'Angelo Russell trade) or riding that train until we notice he isn't a winner?

With Frank Ntilikina, I don't know what I'm getting. I love his defense. I love that he already could be a 40% shooter from 3 at age 18. I love his intangibles. And I do trust the Maverick's international department surprisingly enough. With international prospects, we never see enough and it's a completely different game, speed, tempo, style, etc.

These are my top two prospects of those that could fall to #9 and I would be happy with the risk that each brings. Anyone who can sit here and say "Player X is trash" is completely delusional to the faults in both of these players and how that fits the long-term direction of Dallas.

Ultimately, it's SUPER unlikely Dallas has to make the decision. And we can only hope one of these two are available so we can move forward with a really solid prospect. Otherwise, we are looking at limited potential (Markkanen), poor fit (Monk), or a reach (Collins, Mitchell, or Lennard).

Smith has the athletic tools to be another Steve Francis except he'd be a better shooter. I think Smith is going to be the best point guard in the draft. Fultz is a jack of all trades, master of none type player. I think he'll be a solid starter, but not an all star. Ball has severe problems with his shot and is questionable on defense. Then you have the problem of his father getting involved and whispering in his ear. Smith has a way higher ceiling than both.

If Monk, Ball, Fultz, Smith are all gone then I would trade the 9th for Dlo. He's developed nicely and he's still young. There's no point in wasting that pick on someone like Kennard.

I think DSJ's ceiling is a more explosive Lillard. Ball's ceiling is Andre Miller.

But what's their floor? And how likely do we expect them to be somewhere in-between?

BTW, do we consider Steve Francis a winner? I see this comparison all the time (see my post above lol), and I'm wondering if we actually think we can build around that...and then win a championship?

I don't think calling a PG who averages 1.5 assists a game and looks timid whenever he gets on the court (against players that would amount to people fighting for a D league spot here) trash is being delusional. it's being realistic and wanting whats best for this team. Remmeber Roddy B, Pavel; Pok, Antoine Rodwhatever, yeah this team had one superstar find overseas, and evidence now points to that being Poppa nelson given how sorry Donnie/Cubes have proven to be.

[Pointguard01]

I don't think calling a PG who averages 1.5 assists a game and looks timid whenever he gets on the court (against players that would amount to people fighting for a D league spot here) trash is being delusional. it's being realistic and wanting whats best for this team. Remmeber Roddy B, Pavel; Pok, Antoine Rodwhatever, yeah this team had one superstar find overseas, and evidence now points to that being Poppa nelson given how sorry Donnie/Cubes have proven to be.

Dallas hasn't drafted in the top 20 in the past 19 years, except when we traded for Devin Harris. You're example are irrelevant. Every team in the league has swung and missed in the 20s and 2nd round. You are lucky if you get a rotation player where we have drafted.

For those doubting Donnie, this is a solid read:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2715633-metrics-101-ranking-nba-draft-track-records-for-each-teams-commander-in-chief

Donnie has made mistakes but he is far from the worse. The issue most of us are ignoring is that we haven't been in position to draft a true prospect in 20 years.

And yes, if you think just bc Frank is a bust bc he is international and Dallas is interested in him, you are delusional. And don't understand international basketball.



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[daoneandonly]

I don't think calling a PG who averages 1.5 assists a game and looks timid whenever he gets on the court (against players that would amount to people fighting for a D league spot here) trash is being delusional. it's being realistic and wanting whats best for this team. Remmeber Roddy B, Pavel; Pok, Antoine Rodwhatever, yeah this team had one superstar find overseas, and evidence now points to that being Poppa nelson given how sorry Donnie/Cubes have proven to be.

Dallas hasn't drafted in the top 20 in the past 19 years, except when we traded for Devin Harris. You're example are irrelevant. Every team in the league has swung and missed in the 20s and 2nd round. You are lucky if you get a rotation player where we have drafted.

For those doubting Donnie, this is a solid read:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2715633-metrics-101-ranking-nba-draft-track-records-for-each-teams-commander-in-chief

Donnie has made mistakes but he is far from the worse. The issue most of us are ignoring is that we haven't been in position to draft a true prospect in 20 years.

And yes, if you think just bc Frank is a bust bc he is international and Dallas is interested in him, you are delusional. And don't understand international basketball.



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That first statement is false, Dallas has been there multiple times, 2013 coming to mind, but traded the pick for trash, which also falls on the GM/Owner. Look who is the only other team talking about Nkinnia, the NYK, run by a guy who most believe is purposely trying to get fired so he can walk away with a full pay day. That goes to show you how inept this FO is. granted an opinion is just an opinion, but i truly believe they are just trying to make up for the fact that they missed on Giannis. The problem is, those guys are a rare breed, and there are much more international guys that succeed at the forward positions than guards

San Antonio is an exception to every rule, so outside of their guys, who really has been a very solid international guard worthy of being a top 10 pick? Living in Maryland and watching all 6 games of the Wiz-Hawks, I hope no one says Shroeder, cause he's good, but he's not top 10 in a loaded draft good.

[daoneandonly]

Pretty decent read: https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2017/06/19/will-mavericks-draft-smith-ntilikina-neither-guess-good

The big thing that stuck out to me was the athleticism/explosiveness that Smith has, and Nkinnia doesn't. We already have Noel and Barnes who are on the skinnier end for their respective positions, do we really need another guy?

[Dirk]

Latest Chad Ford mock draft

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/19675199/chad-ford-nba-mock-draft-72-potential-trades-most-likely-picks-rounds

[Mr B]

Pretty decent read: https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2017/06/19/will-mavericks-draft-smith-ntilikina-neither-guess-good

The big thing that stuck out to me was the athleticism/explosiveness that Smith has, and Nkinnia doesn't. We already have Noel and Barnes who are on the skinnier end for their respective positions, do we really need another guy?

I definitely wouldn't call Barnes skinny. Also with the way the NBA is today I don't think having skinnier players is that big an issue. There are fewer and players that even have a back to the basket game these days. It's more of a perimeter game now and lack of bulk can actually be a benefit.

With that said I still prefer DSJ over Ntilikina. Even though I think he will have a shorter career than Ntilikina he has more star potential.

[Mr B]

I heard this morning that the Mavs are almost certain they will be able to get back in the bottom of the 1st round and their main target there is Giles.

[dirkforpres]

Latest Chad Ford mock draft

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/19675199/chad-ford-nba-mock-draft-72-potential-trades-most-likely-picks-rounds

Only team I'm worried about taking him ahead of us is Orlando. If they take Isaac at 6, I think we will end up with Smith.

[Devassa]

I heard this morning that the Mavs are almost certain they will be able to get back in the bottom of the 1st round and their main target there is Giles.

I don't think Giles makes it past 15, so Dallas either needs to trade for a higher pick or find a new main target.

Either way, please let Wes Matthews be shipped out

[Dirk]

Only team I'm worried about taking him ahead of us is Orlando. If they take Isaac at 6, I think we will end up with Smith.

He says this on Orlando:

Jonathan Isaac

The Magic appear to be leaning toward Isaac. Both team president Jeff Weltman and GM John Hammond have a long track record of gambling on long, athletic players with upside like Isaac. Some scouts believe that after Fultz and Ball are off the board, he has the most upside of anyone in the draft.

The team has also shown strong interest in Tatum and several players a little lower in the draft, including Luke Kennard (who works out for the Magic on Tuesday) and Donovan Mitchell.

And the Wolves:

Lauri Markkanen

We've been back and forth between Isaac and Markkanen here for several mock drafts.

Both are excellent fits for the Wolves, who are looking for a stretch-4. Isaac would offer more upside. Markkanen is more ready now and a more proven shooter.

With Isaac off the board, this looks like Markkanen's spot.

[Nowitness]

So Mavs are supposedly trying to get up to 7 to take Frank b4 the Knicks....don't think it's necessary, still like DSJ more by a bit.

[Devassa]

So Mavs are supposedly trying to get up to 7 to take Frank b4 the Knicks....don't think it's necessary, still like DSJ more by a bit.

Sounds like a smokescreen.

1. We don't have anything to trade
2. All I've read lately is that we are higher on DSJ than Frank lately, so the trade doesn't make much sense

[daoneandonly]

Hope the Frank love is a smokescreen. if we trade an asset away to take Frank over DSJ, then this FO is more far gone than I ever imagined.

[dirkforpres]

If we got Isaac at 7 then I'm fine with trading up to that spot, but it should only happen if he is still available and even then, in not very comfortable with it. For a team to continuously say that this is a 9+ man draft, it doesn't add up trying to trade assets to get anybody ahead of where we are.

[Mr B]

Hope the Frank love is a smokescreen. if we trade an asset away to take Frank over DSJ, then this FO is more far gone than I ever imagined.

Even if that asset is Wes Matthews?

[Mr B]

So Mavs are supposedly trying to get up to 7 to take Frank b4 the Knicks....don't think it's necessary, still like DSJ more by a bit.

Sounds like a smokescreen.

1. We don't have anything to trade
2. All I've read lately is that we are higher on DSJ than Frank lately, so the trade doesn't make much sense

Yea that's the sense that I'm getting. It's almost as if the Mavs are putting that out there so that a team like the Knicks will draft him. It's going to be very interesting to see what they do if Minnesota does take Markkanen and then the Knicks draft Ntilikina and then the Mavs are sitting there at 9 with both DSJ and Isaac still on the board.

[Devassa]

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So my assumption off these 2 tweets is that Dallas wants to keep 9 and somewhere acquire 7... maybe a 3 way trade with Detroit involving Rubio to the Pistons, 12 and Barnes going to Minny, and Dallas getting #7?

Fillers and future picks (to Minnesota) probably have be included too, but that would be amazing if Dallas was able to get Isaac AND Smith