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RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8)

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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#21 » by dirkforpres » Wed Nov 8, 2023 5:45 pm

Mavrelous wrote:
dirkforpres wrote:
Mavrelous wrote:No one is trading expensive package for OG when DET, IND, PHI and ORL have max space next summer waiting to sign player like him, especially not the Mavs.


We all know that agents make trades. If OG gets dealt to Dallas (or anywhere), I assume it comes with a handshake agreement beyond this season.

Same thing with Porzingis... Same thing with Kyrie...


KP was a RFA, significantly younger, and higher profile player in general, and he returned unprotected 1st and a heavily protected 1st (+ salary dump).
OG is an UFA, can choose where he wants to go, and there is no guarantee he chooses to stay, teams will choose to wait for him or try to get him in S&T.
OG isn't Kyrie, Kyrie had very little suitors, Mavs felt confident in ability to resign him, OG OTOH, fits everywhere and doesn't have that kind of baggage, top 3 3&D player in the league who seems to be loved by his teammates, I definitely see IND and PHI offering him north of 130/4 in FA, and teams lining up to do S&T, you don't bankrupt yourself out of assets for the option to overpay a 3&D player.


Getting bird rights is important when youre making the OG trade. Again, any trade for OG would almost surely come with a handshake agreement and a new contract immediately when free agency opens, barring things dont just completely unravel ala Rajon Rondo
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#22 » by BeiBeau » Wed Nov 8, 2023 6:17 pm

mademan wrote:
BeiBeau wrote:
Michaellam1987 wrote:
There are no realistic trade offer that DAL can acquire OG.


OG is on an expiring and is probably not going to resign. There is a trade for him that exists. But only if Dallas is willing to overpay.


Whats Dallas willing to overpay with tho? At this point, Lively will almost certainly be off the table, which means Raps arent getting a singular high upside asset (besides like an unprotected pick 6 years from now that might be high value).

Dallas is still a 3 way team option for whatever role player salary filler Toronto would get from ATL in a potential Siakam deal that i think both teams will circle back on (hunter or capela), as i think the Raps would value Hardy a lot and he seems like a luxury at this point for you guys.


I think that I probably didn’t work my original post well. I want Nico to inquire about an OG trade because I think it would actually be possible and is an avenue I want Dallas to consider, not necessarily follow through with. Dallas played the nets a couple weeks ago and I hope Nico was talking about DFS trades as well.

The other thing is that we’ve seen this cycle before. OG is a premium player who has his value severely diminished. And when this situation comes up regular people like us typically overrate that players value. The 1 year rental and who ever keeps him will have to overpay for him and overpay him, is a major gamble. So I don’t think anyone is offering good assets. We know New York offered 3 1st a while ago but I strongly believe those 1st were the garbage lottery protected convey to 2nd picks. I don’t think anyone has offered unprotected 1st, +a full package yet, and at this point I’m not sure anyone will.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#23 » by BeiBeau » Wed Nov 8, 2023 6:23 pm

daoneandonly wrote:Yet another reason why extending Green at an inflated # was a mistake. His best value would be in a trade, which is all but impossible now. It o ne thing if you got him for 9-10 mil, probably his value, but now u just locked urself in and cant trade him in deals for guys like an OG or someone similar that would help the team.

Just because it was a mistake not extending Brunson because u thought he had more value in a trade doesnt mean Josh was the same situation.


Before he was resigned you kept saying he had no value because teams were going to have to pay him next summer. Now he’s on a fair deal and he has no value because he’s locked up for 3 years. Maybe there was no winning in that situation.

Also something about having cake and eating it too.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#24 » by ejs78 » Wed Nov 8, 2023 6:48 pm

daoneandonly wrote:Yet another reason why extending Green at an inflated # was a mistake. His best value would be in a trade, which is all but impossible now. It o ne thing if you got him for 9-10 mil, probably his value, but now u just locked urself in and cant trade him in deals for guys like an OG or someone similar that would help the team.

Just because it was a mistake not extending Brunson because u thought he had more value in a trade doesnt mean Josh was the same situation.


Green has been a disappointment early, but I haven't really heard anyone says this was an overpay. I think Zach Lowe said the contract was fine or close to it.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#25 » by ejs78 » Wed Nov 8, 2023 6:49 pm

Lively is questionable.............................this board may have a meltdown tonight
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#26 » by BeiBeau » Wed Nov 8, 2023 6:56 pm

ejs78 wrote:Lively is questionable.............................this board may have a meltdown tonight


What’s your source. All that I saw was Kyrie was off the injury report and maxi as questionable.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#27 » by ejs78 » Wed Nov 8, 2023 6:57 pm

BeiBeau wrote:
ejs78 wrote:Lively is questionable.............................this board may have a meltdown tonight


What’s your source. All that I saw was Kyrie was off the injury report and maxi as questionable.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#28 » by BeiBeau » Wed Nov 8, 2023 7:04 pm

ejs78 wrote:
BeiBeau wrote:
ejs78 wrote:Lively is questionable.............................this board may have a meltdown tonight


What’s your source. All that I saw was Kyrie was off the injury report and maxi as questionable.
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If he doesn’t play we’re gonna see Holmes at some point.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#29 » by dirkforpres » Wed Nov 8, 2023 7:29 pm

BeiBeau wrote:
ejs78 wrote:
BeiBeau wrote:
What’s your source. All that I saw was Kyrie was off the injury report and maxi as questionable.
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If he doesn’t play we’re gonna see Holmes at some point.


Sadly, we probably wont. However, I could see us going small ball with Grant at C and maybe that means we actually get some OMax minutes
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#30 » by dirkforpres » Wed Nov 8, 2023 7:32 pm

ejs78 wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Yet another reason why extending Green at an inflated # was a mistake. His best value would be in a trade, which is all but impossible now. It o ne thing if you got him for 9-10 mil, probably his value, but now u just locked urself in and cant trade him in deals for guys like an OG or someone similar that would help the team.

Just because it was a mistake not extending Brunson because u thought he had more value in a trade doesnt mean Josh was the same situation.


Green has been a disappointment early, but I haven't really heard anyone says this was an overpay. I think Zach Lowe said the contract was fine or close to it.


The contract IS fine. Hes decent on both ends of the court. He makes way too many stupid decisions, and I absolutely despise when he attempts jump passes, but hes definitely not a bad contract.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#31 » by daoneandonly » Wed Nov 8, 2023 8:03 pm

dirkforpres wrote:
ejs78 wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Yet another reason why extending Green at an inflated # was a mistake. His best value would be in a trade, which is all but impossible now. It o ne thing if you got him for 9-10 mil, probably his value, but now u just locked urself in and cant trade him in deals for guys like an OG or someone similar that would help the team.

Just because it was a mistake not extending Brunson because u thought he had more value in a trade doesnt mean Josh was the same situation.


Green has been a disappointment early, but I haven't really heard anyone says this was an overpay. I think Zach Lowe said the contract was fine or close to it.


The contract IS fine. Hes decent on both ends of the court. He makes way too many stupid decisions, and I absolutely despise when he attempts jump passes, but hes definitely not a bad contract.


The poison pill/extension sadly means we cannot trade him, still say that would have been his best value, thats what I think the issue is. He could have been a piece in a trade for a starting caliber 3. Contract's not terrible, but he's more a Aaron Nesmith/Cole Anthony than the other guys in the 2020 draft, so he should have gotten the deals that they did. Dallas felt eh deserved more for some reason.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#32 » by BeiBeau » Wed Nov 8, 2023 9:24 pm

dirkforpres wrote:
ejs78 wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Yet another reason why extending Green at an inflated # was a mistake. His best value would be in a trade, which is all but impossible now. It o ne thing if you got him for 9-10 mil, probably his value, but now u just locked urself in and cant trade him in deals for guys like an OG or someone similar that would help the team.

Just because it was a mistake not extending Brunson because u thought he had more value in a trade doesnt mean Josh was the same situation.


Green has been a disappointment early, but I haven't really heard anyone says this was an overpay. I think Zach Lowe said the contract was fine or close to it.


The contract IS fine. Hes decent on both ends of the court. He makes way too many stupid decisions, and I absolutely despise when he attempts jump passes, but hes definitely not a bad contract.


Green is our best player at attacking close outs and plays really good ISO defense. If he could figure his screens issue that he has started the season with then he would already have beaten out DJJ for the starting job.

Also yeah we can flame some of his turnovers from jumping without a plan to finish. But offensively Dallas does nothing to help Green out by running 0 sets for him. He can and will score more. But he’s on a team with Luka, Kyrie, and Tim all being volume guys, so it’s helpful that he doesn’t have an ego and is efficient.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#33 » by BeiBeau » Wed Nov 8, 2023 11:21 pm

Also saw OMax is probably going down to the G-League in a week or so and I think that is a really good thing.

Edit: JKidd said he’s not going down.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#34 » by ejs78 » Wed Nov 8, 2023 11:56 pm

Maxi-IN
Lively-OUT



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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#35 » by kacey ring » Thu Nov 9, 2023 1:33 am

Does anyone know why Devin Harris has been filling in for Derek Harper?
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#36 » by Maverick41 » Thu Nov 9, 2023 1:36 am

ejs78 wrote:Maxi-IN
Lively-OUT

Oh boy. Poetl about to have a huge game. Mavs better gang rebound like it's the 4th quarter all game.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#37 » by Michaellam1987 » Thu Nov 9, 2023 1:41 am

Maverick41 wrote:
ejs78 wrote:Maxi-IN
Lively-OUT

Oh boy. Poetl about to have a huge game. Mavs better gang rebound like it's the 4th quarter all game.


Hopefully the team step up, especially Powell and Holmes
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#38 » by BliscoSantos » Thu Nov 9, 2023 1:46 am

The faster pace Got the Mavs off to a hot start :)
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#39 » by Maverick41 » Thu Nov 9, 2023 1:49 am

What a start so far from DJJ.
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Re: RS 23/24 - Mavs vs Raptors (Nov 8) 

Post#40 » by Michaellam1987 » Thu Nov 9, 2023 1:58 am

BeiBeau wrote:
Michaellam1987 wrote:
BeiBeau wrote:
Hasn’t been one yet


Let's see who will be right at the end. Please bookmark this thread.


Right about what? I have made 0 hot takes in this thread, nor have I said anything that I’d eat crow over. Dallas could get OG if they were willing to overpay which no teams currently are willing to do or he’d be traded.

The reason no teams are making that trade is as was mentioned in this thread. OG could leave for nothing at the end of the season. But that decrease in value goes both ways, because he is probably going to walk from the raptors for nothing right now.

I’m suggesting Dallas should consider overpaying for a decreased value premium player. Just like they did last year. I don’t know if it’s what they should for sure do, but it’s an idea. And I doubt OG actually ends up on the Mavs, but mostly because after the gamble that was Kyrie, I don’t know if Dallas would be willing to roll the dice again.


Unless TOR determined to keep OG (IMO they definitely should), otherwise tons of teams will be lining up to trade for OG, and even overpay for him(More than what PHI get for Harden)

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