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2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick)

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matt6715
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#441 » by matt6715 » Thu Oct 8, 2020 2:58 pm

JJP wrote:I rather doubt there's anyone at #12-15 that is substantially more likely to be a success, but I don't have access to what the front office knows. I fully expect some player of interest will fall to the Mavs at #18, but at this point just about all the options have about an equal chance of playing out.


Or, they are specifically high on someone who they believe will go in the late lottery and want to move up to target that player. Let's say for argument's sake its a guy like Devin Vassell who I haven't seen fall past #14 in any mock. Why not take the two picks and move up to grab the guy they want? I highly doubt regardless of outcome they will leave this draft with 2 drafted players... Not enough roster spaces anyway.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#442 » by arkuo » Thu Oct 8, 2020 3:37 pm

Thing is, anyone we get at 18 has to be substantially better than the players we have in waiting. Josh Reaves, Willie Caulie Stein and Delon Wright have yet to play big minutes. The new guy has to climb the rotation or spend time in the G-League. And that typically ends up being on Carlisle's 15th guy on the bench. In which case, I'd rather trade Delon Wright + 18 and 31 to see if you can get an upgrade at that position. Doesnt have to be an all star. I'd even take an expiring contract for Dwight Powell right now. Clears extra room for 2021.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#443 » by gottamakeit » Thu Oct 8, 2020 8:10 pm

arkuo wrote:Thing is, anyone we get at 18 has to be substantially better than the players we have in waiting. Josh Reaves, Willie Caulie Stein and Delon Wright have yet to play big minutes. The new guy has to climb the rotation or spend time in the G-League. And that typically ends up being on Carlisle's 15th guy on the bench. In which case, I'd rather trade Delon Wright + 18 and 31 to see if you can get an upgrade at that position. Doesnt have to be an all star. I'd even take an expiring contract for Dwight Powell right now. Clears extra room for 2021.


i think your view is short sighted. Remember that it took Jimmy Butler 2+ years of waiting in the wings before breaking out as a star.
We draft and we develop, there are no shortcuts to this thing.
I'm not suggesting that draft steals are not easy to find, because they aren't. But even a decent draft prospect is going to be worth more in the long run than some middling player that we'd have to overpay to acquire.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#444 » by matt6715 » Thu Oct 8, 2020 8:27 pm

arkuo wrote:Thing is, anyone we get at 18 has to be substantially better than the players we have in waiting. Josh Reaves, Willie Caulie Stein and Delon Wright have yet to play big minutes. The new guy has to climb the rotation or spend time in the G-League. And that typically ends up being on Carlisle's 15th guy on the bench. In which case, I'd rather trade Delon Wright + 18 and 31 to see if you can get an upgrade at that position. Doesnt have to be an all star. I'd even take an expiring contract for Dwight Powell right now. Clears extra room for 2021.


Teams that don't maximize the draft when given opportunities are destined to be losers IMO. The Nuggets and Heat are great examples of that - the depth they have around their core pieces is directly due to their ability to draft well in the middle of the first round. Reaves might never crack a rotation. Personally I hope WCS declines his PO and moves on. Justin Jackson shouldn't play another minute on a winning team. Wright isn't a good fit. This team needs more wings, more defense, more shooting, more talent. Period. And drafting a guy who can blossom into a real talent is a huge unlock at a cost-controlled price.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#445 » by JJP » Fri Oct 9, 2020 2:31 am

matt6715 wrote:
JJP wrote:I rather doubt there's anyone at #12-15 that is substantially more likely to be a success, but I don't have access to what the front office knows. I fully expect some player of interest will fall to the Mavs at #18, but at this point just about all the options have about an equal chance of playing out.


Or, they are specifically high on someone who they believe will go in the late lottery and want to move up to target that player. Let's say for argument's sake its a guy like Devin Vassell who I haven't seen fall past #14 in any mock. Why not take the two picks and move up to grab the guy they want? I highly doubt regardless of outcome they will leave this draft with 2 drafted players... Not enough roster spaces anyway.


They would need to be sure Vasell would be there at #14. That can be tricky. I would be all on board with that - but you'd have to feel like would get just the right fit at #14.

Given the lack of good evaluations so far, it's going to be hard to know about the talent in the mid-first. It's a dice roll.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#446 » by Darren » Fri Oct 9, 2020 2:55 am

arkuo wrote:Thing is, anyone we get at 18 has to be substantially better than the players we have in waiting. Josh Reaves, Willie Caulie Stein and Delon Wright have yet to play big minutes. The new guy has to climb the rotation or spend time in the G-League. And that typically ends up being on Carlisle's 15th guy on the bench. In which case, I'd rather trade Delon Wright + 18 and 31 to see if you can get an upgrade at that position. Doesnt have to be an all star. I'd even take an expiring contract for Dwight Powell right now. Clears extra room for 2021.


I don't think it is the case. This Mavs roster sorely missed athleticism. I think any athletic player getting drafted will make impacts felt very soon whether it is athletic defender in Matrix manner or speedy penetrating Jet-clone. The bottom line is RC can't play rookies who's not smart or unprofessional. Disciplined and smart athletic freak are always welcomed. Wright gets playing time early but later benched because of severe lack in smartness. Brunson gets minutes early but later benched due to severe lack in athleticism. Powell gets playing time early as a Mavs due to smartness and professionalism. It is likely the Mavs can find one or two rookies with these attributes.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#447 » by arkuo » Fri Oct 9, 2020 8:14 am

gottamakeit wrote:
arkuo wrote:Thing is, anyone we get at 18 has to be substantially better than the players we have in waiting. Josh Reaves, Willie Caulie Stein and Delon Wright have yet to play big minutes. The new guy has to climb the rotation or spend time in the G-League. And that typically ends up being on Carlisle's 15th guy on the bench. In which case, I'd rather trade Delon Wright + 18 and 31 to see if you can get an upgrade at that position. Doesnt have to be an all star. I'd even take an expiring contract for Dwight Powell right now. Clears extra room for 2021.


i think your view is short sighted. Remember that it took Jimmy Butler 2+ years of waiting in the wings before breaking out as a star.
We draft and we develop, there are no shortcuts to this thing.
I'm not suggesting that draft steals are not easy to find, because they aren't. But even a decent draft prospect is going to be worth more in the long run than some middling player that we'd have to overpay to acquire.


Clearly you do not know Rick Carlisle and Donnie Nelson.

Let me give you a quick introduction:

Carlisle is the coach who benches rookies and keeps them in the dog house. The coach would rather play his trusted vets like JJ Barea and Devin Harris. So if said rookie is not Luka Doncic, he will be the 15th man.

Nelson is the GM who drafts Justin Andersons 9 times in a row. So Im not holding my breath for him to suddenly draft the next Jimmy Butler. Let's not confuse Donnie with Riley, West, Buford and the others. Let's not kid ourselves here.

So if you are playing the odds, the odds of Donnie picking busts are higher than him trading the pick for guaranteed veteran talent. I'd take the latter if I were a betting man.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#448 » by arkuo » Fri Oct 9, 2020 8:17 am

matt6715 wrote:
arkuo wrote:Thing is, anyone we get at 18 has to be substantially better than the players we have in waiting. Josh Reaves, Willie Caulie Stein and Delon Wright have yet to play big minutes. The new guy has to climb the rotation or spend time in the G-League. And that typically ends up being on Carlisle's 15th guy on the bench. In which case, I'd rather trade Delon Wright + 18 and 31 to see if you can get an upgrade at that position. Doesnt have to be an all star. I'd even take an expiring contract for Dwight Powell right now. Clears extra room for 2021.


Teams that don't maximize the draft when given opportunities are destined to be losers IMO. The Nuggets and Heat are great examples of that - the depth they have around their core pieces is directly due to their ability to draft well in the middle of the first round. Reaves might never crack a rotation. Personally I hope WCS declines his PO and moves on. Justin Jackson shouldn't play another minute on a winning team. Wright isn't a good fit. This team needs more wings, more defense, more shooting, more talent. Period. And drafting a guy who can blossom into a real talent is a huge unlock at a cost-controlled price.


The Nuggets and Heat front office draft way better than Donnie Nelson. Let's not compare Riley to Donnie Nelson here. C'mon man. If Riley was with our front office, I'd be confident going into every draft night the past 20 years. For all we know Donnie might be looking for another 7'5 Indian guy like Satnam Singh or another Pavel Podkolzine type to replace Boban in 5 years.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#449 » by boogiezen » Fri Oct 9, 2020 1:03 pm

LOL I'm not optimistic we can find a hidden gem on this draft. The track record of the Mavs in the draft is not good.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#450 » by gottamakeit » Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:08 am

with our 31st pick i think we should go with Cassius Stanley. he could be the steal coming out of the second round. We could even trade down to pick him with him being projected at mid-second round.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#451 » by JJP » Thu Oct 22, 2020 1:31 am

A player whose stock has risen from the mid-second round into the very top of the second round is Malachi Flynn from San Diego State. Impressive PG.

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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#452 » by HMFFL » Thu Oct 22, 2020 3:13 am

Kristaps Porzingis is a star worthy of the Warriors’ No. 2 overall pick

https://bluemanhoop.com/2020/10/21/kristaps-porzingis-star-worthy-warriors-pick/amp/

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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#453 » by dirkforpres » Thu Oct 22, 2020 4:08 am

HMFFL wrote:Kristaps Porzingis is a star worthy of the Warriors’ No. 2 overall pick

https://bluemanhoop.com/2020/10/21/kristaps-porzingis-star-worthy-warriors-pick/amp/

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Maybe if it also came with the 2021 Minny pick
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#454 » by JD45 » Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:25 pm

dirkforpres wrote:
HMFFL wrote:Kristaps Porzingis is a star worthy of the Warriors’ No. 2 overall pick

https://bluemanhoop.com/2020/10/21/kristaps-porzingis-star-worthy-warriors-pick/amp/

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Maybe if it also came with the 2021 Minny pick


Unless they thought KP's knee's were a ticking timebomb, I can't see that trade being considered. KP would be a perfect fit in GS. But he is just as perfect fit with Luka. I don't think they find anyone as good a fit at #2. Even last year, the only draft pick that I would have rather had than KP was #1 to get Zion.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#455 » by dirkforpres » Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:29 pm

JD45 wrote:
dirkforpres wrote:
HMFFL wrote:Kristaps Porzingis is a star worthy of the Warriors’ No. 2 overall pick

https://bluemanhoop.com/2020/10/21/kristaps-porzingis-star-worthy-warriors-pick/amp/

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Maybe if it also came with the 2021 Minny pick


Unless they thought KP's knee's were a ticking timebomb, I can't see that trade being considered. KP would be a perfect fit in GS. But he is just as perfect fit with Luka. I don't think they find anyone as good a fit at #2. Even last year, the only draft pick that I would have rather had than KP was #1 to get Zion.


Since we didn’t get a combine or a tournament this year, gauging the value available at the top of the draft is way too difficult to gamble a proven star on, even taking into account injury concerns. This is a historically weak draft class so i don’t see it as anywhere close in value. Unless Luka and him didn’t get along or he had actually asked out of Dallas, I can’t imagine the Mavs FO entertaining an offer like this.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#456 » by Pointguard01 » Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:33 pm

ESPN’s draft guru Jwass posted this trade:

Blazers get #7 (Okoro)
Pistons get: #16 (Bey), Anfernee Simons, #46

If that was available, would love if we could trade #18, #31 and Jalen Brunson to move up. Would love to take a top player like Okoro.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#457 » by dirkforpres » Thu Oct 22, 2020 11:49 pm

Pointguard01 wrote:ESPN’s draft guru Jwass posted this trade:

Blazers get #7 (Okoro)
Pistons get: #16 (Bey), Anfernee Simons, #46

If that was available, would love if we could trade #18, #31 and Jalen Brunson to move up. Would love to take a top player like Okoro.


If Detroit would actually do that then Dallas would be crazy not to. I’d hate to lose Brunson, but Okoro/Avidja/Vassell would all fit well here
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#458 » by arkuo » Fri Oct 23, 2020 8:02 am

dirkforpres wrote:
Pointguard01 wrote:ESPN’s draft guru Jwass posted this trade:

Blazers get #7 (Okoro)
Pistons get: #16 (Bey), Anfernee Simons, #46

If that was available, would love if we could trade #18, #31 and Jalen Brunson to move up. Would love to take a top player like Okoro.


If Detroit would actually do that then Dallas would be crazy not to. I’d hate to lose Brunson, but Okoro/Avidja/Vassell would all fit well here


Yeah. Just signing Trey Burke should offset the loss of Brunson. Getting Okoro or Vassell is too good to pass up.
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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#459 » by HMFFL » Fri Oct 23, 2020 8:50 pm

Pointguard01 wrote:ESPN’s draft guru Jwass posted this trade:

Blazers get #7 (Okoro)
Pistons get: #16 (Bey), Anfernee Simons, #46

If that was available, would love if we could trade #18, #31 and Jalen Brunson to move up. Would love to take a top player like Okoro.


Will Okoro even be around?
I wijld be happy with Obi Toppin, Tyrese Haliburton, Onyeka Okongwu, or Devin Vassell.








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Re: 2020 NBA Draft Discussion (18th and 31st pick) 

Post#460 » by jpengland » Sat Oct 24, 2020 12:46 pm

HMFFL wrote:Kristaps Porzingis is a star worthy of the Warriors’ No. 2 overall pick

https://bluemanhoop.com/2020/10/21/kristaps-porzingis-star-worthy-warriors-pick/amp/

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Eating Wiggins? Ouch. He's negative value.

KP has more value than #2 in this crapshoot of a draft.

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