Trade Discussion 22/23

fuller4379 · Post #1381 » by **fuller4379** » Wed May 26, 2021 4:51 pm

I would rather have Doug McDermott than Markannen. Neither play defense, both can shoot, but McBuckets is healthy.

Bob8 · Post #1382 » by **Bob8** » Wed May 26, 2021 4:57 pm

They should get as much as possible for KP and then we can start talking what Mavs need. Trading KP for something solid would be huge. This is a must.

Markannem could be ok, if he's cheap.

The biggest problem in this offseason will be skyrocketed price of THJ/Brunson and Richardson opting in.

JD45 · Post #1383 » by **JD45** » Thu May 27, 2021 6:18 pm

If JRich ops in as expected, and they resign THJ, the Mavs are out of the Cap room game. What they could free up by letting WCS go wouldn't be as much as the MLE, and he is useful.

Realistically, the Mavs have to be looking for what they could get for JRich/Burke/Powell. Maybe DFS and Maxi could also be on the table for a good starter. I think that leaves them in the market for rotation players or starters with bad contracts.

DJ_3_Ball · Post #1384 » by **DJ_3_Ball** » Fri May 28, 2021 4:20 am

JD45 wrote:If JRich ops in as expected...

I'm flabbergasted why so many folks here think J Rich will opt in.

It's an $11.6 mil opt in for next year. If another team offered him 2 for 16, I think he'd take that.

Players almost always take more years and higher total sum. All another team has to do is beat 1 year and 11 mil dollars.

DJ_3_Ball · Post #1385 » by **DJ_3_Ball** » Fri May 28, 2021 4:22 am

fuller4379 wrote:I would rather have Doug McDermott than Markannen. Neither play defense, both can shoot, but McBuckets is healthy.

1000% agree. The best ability? AVAILABILITY

JD45 · Post #1386 » by **JD45** » Fri May 28, 2021 4:05 pm

Markannen is younger and bigger than McDermott, so he is likely to still be getting better. I think he is better long term addition.

I would be interested in Otto Porter with the MLE. Another injury risk, but 40% 3pt shooting and solid defense from 3 would be a great addition.

ozwizard8 · Post #1387 » by **ozwizard8** » Fri May 28, 2021 9:33 pm

JD45 wrote:Markannen is younger and bigger than McDermott, so he is likely to still be getting better. I think he is better long term addition.

I would be interested in Otto Porter with the MLE. Another injury risk, but 40% 3pt shooting and solid defense from 3 would be a great addition.

- I think those two are very different players. Marknanen is a big man and I don't think he can defend perimeter. He does not have much experience defending perimeter.
- Mcdermott is a SF. He runs around the screens, play off-ball, make cuts and score. On defense he has no business to protect to rim, or get a rebound over another big men.

Marknanen due to his younger age, height/rim protection will command a big contract for sure.
I haven't watch much of Mcdermott since his Knicks days but I don't think he'd be valued more than MLE level and I'd doubt for him to get multiple year contract.

So very different players, contracts, availability.

ejs78 · Post #1388 » by **ejs78** » Fri May 28, 2021 10:17 pm

Rim protection????

ozwizard8 wrote:
JD45 wrote:Markannen is younger and bigger than McDermott, so he is likely to still be getting better. I think he is better long term addition.

I would be interested in Otto Porter with the MLE. Another injury risk, but 40% 3pt shooting and solid defense from 3 would be a great addition.

- I think those two are very different players. Marknanen is a big man and I don't think he can defend perimeter. He does not have much experience defending perimeter.
- Mcdermott is a SF. He runs around the screens, play off-ball, make cuts and score. On defense he has no business to protect to rim, or get a rebound over another big men.

Marknanen due to his younger age, height/rim protection will command a big contract for sure.
I haven't watch much of Mcdermott since his Knicks days but I don't think he'd be valued more than MLE level and I'd doubt for him to get multiple year contract.

So very different players, contracts, availability.

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ozwizard8 · Post #1389 » by **ozwizard8** » Fri May 28, 2021 10:24 pm

* felt like I've jinxed Mavs team so removing this.

JD45 · Post #1390 » by **JD45** » Fri May 28, 2021 11:42 pm

ozwizard8 wrote:
JD45 wrote:Markannen is younger and bigger than McDermott, so he is likely to still be getting better. I think he is better long term addition.

I would be interested in Otto Porter with the MLE. Another injury risk, but 40% 3pt shooting and solid defense from 3 would be a great addition.

- I think those two are very different players. Marknanen is a big man and I don't think he can defend perimeter. He does not have much experience defending perimeter.
- Mcdermott is a SF. He runs around the screens, play off-ball, make cuts and score. On defense he has no business to protect to rim, or get a rebound over another big men.

Marknanen due to his younger age, height/rim protection will command a big contract for sure.
I haven't watch much of Mcdermott since his Knicks days but I don't think he'd be valued more than MLE level and I'd doubt for him to get multiple year contract.

So very different players, contracts, availability.

I wasn't explicit in what I meant. I didn't mean that Markannen was a bigger perimeter defender. I meant that he was a bigger player and bigger players often have a longer development timeframe. McDermott is almost certainly at his development peak and will not be any better in 2 or 3 years. But Markannen is younger and bigger, so whoever signs him now is likely going to have a better player in 2 to 3 years than the Markannen the Bulls have now.

DJ_3_Ball · Post #1391 » by **DJ_3_Ball** » Sat May 29, 2021 12:44 am

ozwizard8 wrote:Ok everyone, my fingers crossed and I'll tell my dream scenario for Mavs.

Lets have a flashback to the 2013 NBA Playoffs:
A stacked 3rd seed Denver team get into playoffs with high hopes.
Coach: George Karl
GM: Masai Uijri
Roster:
Iguodala, Ty Lawson, Gallinari, Faried, Chandler on their primes.
Mcgee-Koufos-Mozgov at their athletic prime days with good bench players in Fournier, old A.Miller.

This team expected to beat young Warriors as all of those players were hungry for success. They had a very balanced squad built by Masai. And they had George Karl against GSW's Mark Jackson. And GSW won the series with S.Curry and Jarrett Jack. Carl Landry started at 4 for GSW but they outplayed Denver anyway.

That Denver team was led by Iguodala as he was the most experienced allstar level talent they had. He was able to go against Lebron at the time, and he was taking clutch time scoring if needed. Ty Lawson/Gallinari was also very good. I don't think anyone expected AI to leave the Denver. Can't beat GSW so he joined them and Warriors got their final key piece to become a championship team. The next year they didn't do good but now they had that player to stop opponents best player and give some tough buckets from forward position when its needed.

Coming back today:
The dream scenario would be eliminating Clippers and signing Kawhi in the offseason...

Interesting look back at that Nuggets team.

I don't think there's a basketball fan alive who wouldn't love to have Kawhi Leonard on their team. I just don't see it for the Mavs, and even if he did come here, what does that say about his locker room presence on a team?

Let's not forget Kawhi basically just refused to play for San Antonio for a full season and forced his way out. Really got Raptors' fans hopes up, and then he's going to do the same thing to Clippers' fans too?

If you marry a girl who cheated on her last 3 boyfriends, what do you expect her to do to your marriage? I say no thanks. Kawhi is problematic, and because of those problems, I don't even think he's looking for the best basketball situation (or he would have stayed in Toronto).

Personally, my favorite ability is availability, and I'm not real keen on KP missing so many games, and I don't love the idea of getting Kawhi "Load Management" Leonard either.

ozwizard8 · Post #1392 » by **ozwizard8** » Sat May 29, 2021 8:04 pm

DJ_3_Ball wrote:
ozwizard8 wrote:Ok everyone, my fingers crossed and I'll tell my dream scenario for Mavs.

Lets have a flashback to the 2013 NBA Playoffs:
A stacked 3rd seed Denver team get into playoffs with high hopes.
Coach: George Karl
GM: Masai Uijri
Roster:
Iguodala, Ty Lawson, Gallinari, Faried, Chandler on their primes.
Mcgee-Koufos-Mozgov at their athletic prime days with good bench players in Fournier, old A.Miller.

This team expected to beat young Warriors as all of those players were hungry for success. They had a very balanced squad built by Masai. And they had George Karl against GSW's Mark Jackson. And GSW won the series with S.Curry and Jarrett Jack. Carl Landry started at 4 for GSW but they outplayed Denver anyway.

That Denver team was led by Iguodala as he was the most experienced allstar level talent they had. He was able to go against Lebron at the time, and he was taking clutch time scoring if needed. Ty Lawson/Gallinari was also very good. I don't think anyone expected AI to leave the Denver. Can't beat GSW so he joined them and Warriors got their final key piece to become a championship team. The next year they didn't do good but now they had that player to stop opponents best player and give some tough buckets from forward position when its needed.

Coming back today:
The dream scenario would be eliminating Clippers and signing Kawhi in the offseason...

Interesting look back at that Nuggets team.

I don't think there's a basketball fan alive who wouldn't love to have Kawhi Leonard on their team. I just don't see it for the Mavs, and even if he did come here, what does that say about his locker room presence on a team?

Let's not forget Kawhi basically just refused to play for San Antonio for a full season and forced his way out. Really got Raptors' fans hopes up, and then he's going to do the same thing to Clippers' fans too?

If you marry a girl who cheated on her last 3 boyfriends, what do you expect her to do to your marriage? I say no thanks. Kawhi is problematic, and because of those problems, I don't even think he's looking for the best basketball situation (or he would have stayed in Toronto).

Personally, my favorite ability is availability, and I'm not real keen on KP missing so many games, and I don't love the idea of getting Kawhi "Load Management" Leonard either.

Just going by your marriage analogy, I would say not to marry her. You can have some casual relationship without overly attaching. Yea, don't give the house and the car for a short-term marriage. But you can pay for her vacation expenses, she might worth it.

I don't think Raptors fans should be disappointed in Kawhi experience. They ****' got a ring with him. The way he left might be disappointing but the overall experience should be a very positive one. They didn't spend much for him anyway. The other parts of the roster were aging so their downturn is not only associated with Kawhi either.

Looking at Kawhi's background is fair but I am not saying let's trade Doncic for him. Doncic is the franchise player and you plan for his success. Like you said, no one can say no to Kawhi signing on FA and neither Mavs should say no. After Kawhi signing I'd not mind trading couple of picks either if its a 4-year contract. Of course you should not trade 4 picks and 4 pick swaps like LAC did but I dont think Cuban would be that clueless.

In any case, it'd be great to Luka win his first chip sooner. Even making consecutive WCF-NBA Finals would mean so much for Mavericks as we would be able to attract top FAs, ring chaser veterans. Kawhi load management thing would not be an huge issue. The team constructed around Luka can lift the regular season, top 4 seeds even if Kawhi only plays half of the games. We just need our 2nd superstar to show up on playoffs. This 3rd game of LAC-Mavs series was a disaster for KP. Imagine if we had 15-20 good minutes from late 2010s Igoudala. He'd score some, go FT line to kill Clippers runs. And he'd actually defend couple possessions. It'd be enough to make the series go 3-0.

For Kawhi, I guess he can go anywhere he wants. LA does not like him as he does not play for Lakers. He's not liked much in Raptors-Spurs either. I guess he'll look for the money, comfort and perhaps some career accomplishments. Mavs with Carlisle-Doncic wouldn't be a bad choice for him. He'd probably a recognition as he brought success to Dallas. Or he can take the easier route as well. I dont think he'd afraid backlash from Clippers fans. After all there are like 6 of them and the rest are bandwagoners.

I mean Lebron changed teams many times to play with multiple franchise players, superstars. He go back to Cavs because they had three 1st picks and stacked assets. The Lakers situation was similar and the way they got A.Davis was shady as hell. But after all, people/media still puts Lebron top. Kawhi can **** go Warriors next year and win 2-3 more rings with Curry-Klay and people/media would talk about how much a winner he is like they did with lebron.

arkuo · Post #1393 » by **arkuo** » Sun May 30, 2021 6:59 am

Would you trade KP for Kemba Walker straight up?

And given that it's Danny Ainge, Cuban would add two first rounders and offer to wash his car.

Another option is to have Atlanta sign and trade John Collins to the max then trade him for KP. Atlanta doesnt lose Collins for nothing. They get a big man who pairs well with Capela. Dallas gets more scoring from the C/PF position. Plain and simple.

What's your take on a John Collins - Richaun Holmes front court tandem?

Post #1394 » by **Mavrelous** » Sun May 30, 2021 7:03 am

Absolutely not, Boston needs to add assets.

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arkuo · Post #1395 » by **arkuo** » Sun May 30, 2021 7:09 am

C- Holmes / WCS / Powell
PF- Collins / Kleber / Powell
SF- DFS / Green
SG- THJ / Richardson
PG- Doncic / Brunson

That frontcourt could work. Holmes and Collins being way quicker and active on their feet than KP. Given that Collins is no defensive stud, but KP cant guard a chair now either.

ATL does it and cements their NYK rivalry. Knicks fans would boo KP for life.

JD45 · Post #1396 » by **JD45** » Sun May 30, 2021 6:18 pm

arkuo wrote:Would you trade KP for Kemba Walker straight up?

Kemba has similar efficiency and per minute production as Brunson. But he is 7 years older and makes 20x as much salary. I don't see a reason to add Kemba at any price.

41Dirk41 · Post #1397 » by **41Dirk41** » Sun May 30, 2021 6:41 pm

Seems Kemba is done and overpaid...no thanks.

boogiezen · Post #1398 » by **boogiezen** » Mon May 31, 2021 8:22 am

Make this happen Donnie.

KP+Jrich+Burke for Turner+Brogdon+McDermott.

Add one more wing in the off season. And we're ready to go.

Post #1399 » by **HMFFL** » Mon May 31, 2021 1:41 pm

arkuo wrote:Would you trade KP for Kemba Walker straight up?

And given that it's Danny Ainge, Cuban would add two first rounders and offer to wash his car.

Another option is to have Atlanta sign and trade John Collins to the max then trade him for KP. Atlanta doesnt lose Collins for nothing. They get a big man who pairs well with Capela. Dallas gets more scoring from the C/PF position. Plain and simple.

What's your take on a John Collins - Richaun Holmes front court tandem?

Atlanta has no interest in KP.
The Hawks drafted Onyeka Okongwu with the 6th overall pick in last year's draft. He will be the future 4 if the Hawks don't match offer(s) for John Collins.

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Post #1400 » by **HMFFL** » Mon May 31, 2021 3:07 pm

boogiezen wrote:Make this happen Donnie.

KP+Jrich+Burke for Turner+Brogdon+McDermott.

Add one more wing in the off season. And we're ready to go.

How does KP have the value of Turner, Brogdon, and McDermott? Indiana wouldn't trade Brogdon or Turner straight up for KP if cap space was a non factor.

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