Time to discuss josh Green

Teffer10 · Post #121 » by **Teffer10** » Sun May 15, 2022 7:42 pm

Bob8 wrote:Something must be wrong with evaluation of players. Just look at Brunson, 2x NCAA champion, MVP and he falls on 33. Because he's older and not extremely quick. Wtf? Or taking those bigs in front of Luka, who was dominating in Europe with 18 years. This fascination with athleticism is just baffling.

Drafting Josh is total mystery. Everyone knows that players playing with Luka need to be at least solid shooters. Then you draft a player, who is not even attempting shots.

I'll never understand sheer athleticism prevailing over skill when drafting either.
I'm not giving up on Josh just yet though because I think unselfishness is his biggest problem.
He doesn't even look to score unless the defense leaves him so open he doesn't have choice.
In other words, he's what I call a "thinking shooter" opposed to an "instinctive shooter".
Even when he drives he seems to have a pass-first mentality.

If he can ever get past that overly unselfish mentality, I think he could eventually become a bigger part of the rotation because he isn't completely skillless.

My concern is that he'll become the next MKG.

SOUNDCHASER · Post #122 » by **SOUNDCHASER** » Sun May 15, 2022 10:27 pm

he is 6 fouls to use in a game when you need to bang and play physical to send a message. Will he start to score more? I hope he does but I do not see it till he takes that next step and works on his shot in the off season to become an assassin.

arkuo · Post #123 » by **arkuo** » Mon May 16, 2022 6:30 pm

SOUNDCHASER wrote:he is 6 fouls to use in a game when you need to bang and play physical to send a message. Will he start to score more? I hope he does but I do not see it till he takes that next step and works on his shot in the off season to become an assassin.

I don't think Kidd is willing to experiment on lineups anymore being this deep in a playoff run. Even Ntlikina will get more minutes by simply being able to guard Steph and Klay.

MrGoat · Post #124 » by **MrGoat** » Sun May 29, 2022 4:27 pm

Teffer10 wrote:
Bob8 wrote:Something must be wrong with evaluation of players. Just look at Brunson, 2x NCAA champion, MVP and he falls on 33. Because he's older and not extremely quick. Wtf? Or taking those bigs in front of Luka, who was dominating in Europe with 18 years. This fascination with athleticism is just baffling.

Drafting Josh is total mystery. Everyone knows that players playing with Luka need to be at least solid shooters. Then you draft a player, who is not even attempting shots.

I'll never understand sheer athleticism prevailing over skill when drafting either.
I'm not giving up on Josh just yet though because I think unselfishness is his biggest problem.
He doesn't even look to score unless the defense leaves him so open he doesn't have choice.
In other words, he's what I call a "thinking shooter" opposed to an "instinctive shooter".
Even when he drives he seems to have a pass-first mentality.

If he can ever get past that overly unselfish mentality, I think he could eventually become a bigger part of the rotation because he isn't completely skillless.

My concern is that he'll become the next MKG.

Skill can be developed more than sheer athleticism. When an elite athlete develops skills that's when they become unstoppable. DFS was pretty much just an athlete with some length when we drafted him, it took him a few years to develop that 3 point shot, he was a straight up scrub in his first three seasons, but he also slightly improved every year. Now he's a 3 & D guy who could probably start on some other teams too. Josh was better in year two than year one so at his cheap price he's worth holding on to to hope he continues developing or as a trade filler.

Josh Green hit 28 3s last year, that's as many as MKG hit in his entire career

41Dirk41 · Post #125 » by **41Dirk41** » Fri Jul 22, 2022 9:18 pm

https://www.basketballnews.com/stories/josh-green-impact-basketball-dallas-mavericks-playoffs-joe-abunassar-offseason-training-diet-nutrition

He needs a break out season, he is our only asset or player with upset.

LAL1947 · Post #126 » by **LAL1947** » Fri Jul 22, 2022 9:29 pm

41Dirk41 wrote:https://www.basketballnews.com/stories/josh-green-impact-basketball-dallas-mavericks-playoffs-joe-abunassar-offseason-training-diet-nutrition

He needs a break out season, he is our only asset or player with upset.

I think you mean "upside".

41Dirk41 · Post #127 » by **41Dirk41** » Fri Jul 22, 2022 9:58 pm

LAL1947 wrote:
41Dirk41 wrote:https://www.basketballnews.com/stories/josh-green-impact-basketball-dallas-mavericks-playoffs-joe-abunassar-offseason-training-diet-nutrition

He needs a break out season, he is our only asset or player with upset.

I think you mean "upside".

Yes of course :banghead:

SOUNDCHASER · Post #128 » by **SOUNDCHASER** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 5:16 am

well of all the many sub rotation guards / wings that we have I think Green will have his break out season first, Pinson Hardy Frank and Dorsey all have potential and all we need is for one to become rotation worthy but if 2 or more can do it this season it will be awesome. With Hardy it is just a matter of time. Green is creeping closer as he shows improvement each season. I expect our coaches to have success with improving them all.

Bob8 · Post #129 » by **Bob8** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:10 am

SOUNDCHASER wrote:well of all the many sub rotation guards / wings that we have I think Green will have his break out season first, Pinson Hardy Frank and Dorsey all have potential and all we need is for one to become rotation worthy but if 2 or more can do it this season it will be awesome. With Hardy it is just a matter of time. Green is creeping closer as he shows improvement each season. I expect our coaches to have success with improving them all.

Dorsey is far the best at the moment and Green has probably last chance to show something more. Ntilikina won't play in Nba next season. Pinson looks to be unmovable for non basketball reasons. Nobody expects anything from Hardy this year.

Post #130 » by **Mavrelous** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:19 am

Bob8 wrote: Ntilikina won't play in Nba next season.

Why?

Bob8 · Post #131 » by **Bob8** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:45 am

KhalilS wrote:
Bob8 wrote: Ntilikina won't play in Nba next season.

Why?

This's his 6th season, if he doesn't miraculously improve, Mavs won't give him new contract, they will rather have Dorsey on normal contract instead. And we have seen, when he was sacked in New York that there's no market elsewhere.

Post #132 » by **Mavrelous** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:54 am

I thought you were talking about 2022/23 season, there's always place for defensive stopper who can handle the ball, he'll find suitors on vet min.

Bob8 · Post #133 » by **Bob8** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 8:07 am

KhalilS wrote:I thought you were talking about 2022/23 season, there's always place for defensive stopper who can handle the ball, he'll find suitors on vet min.

I had in mind 2023/24 season. Handling the ball part is very basic. Dorsey is light years better than him in everything except defending. Value of being defensive stopper drops significantly, if you can't score.

Maverick41 · Post #134 » by **Maverick41** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:38 pm

If either one (or better case both) of Josh or Frank can be a reliable 3 point shooter this coming season, it would help the team tremendously. Unfortunately, the current roster is filled with 1 way guys and the only 2 way guys we have can't dribble. Hopefully they're putting in the work this summer or they may struggle to get an NBA job when their contract expires if their shooting doesn't improve.

Archx · Post #135 » by **Archx** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:48 pm

Maverick41 wrote:If either one (or better case both) of Josh or Frank can be a reliable 3 point shooter this coming season, it would help the team tremendously.

Yeah i'm very sceptical of this. Mid and top teams improved by a lot this season and West is going to be a bloodbath. In order for these two to have any kind of improved impact, their minutes would also need to go way up. I don't see it.

The only hope for this team at this point is Maxi's health and THJ coming back stronger than ever. They added Wood but lost Brunson for nothing.

I already lost all my hope when Kidd said he'll start McGee and Dinwiddie. That's so puzzling and so wrong on many levels.

Maverick41 · Post #136 » by **Maverick41** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:00 pm

Archx wrote:Yeah i'm very sceptical of this. Mid and top teams improved by a lot this season and West is going to be a bloodbath. In order for these two to have any kind of improved impact, their minutes would also need to go way up. I don't see it.

Yeah but they will definitely have opportunities. The RS is long and their will be players in and out of the rotation due to injuries, rest or whatever other reasons they have nowadays. Also it's not like we have much wing depth anyway.

Our best chance to succeed barring a trade is that at least 1 of the younger guys on the bench can develop into a playoff rotation player. I wouldn't bet my money on it happening but I sure hope so. Their success would be the Mavs success.

Archx · Post #137 » by **Archx** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:53 pm

Maverick41 wrote:
Archx wrote:Yeah i'm very sceptical of this. Mid and top teams improved by a lot this season and West is going to be a bloodbath. In order for these two to have any kind of improved impact, their minutes would also need to go way up. I don't see it.

Yeah but they will definitely have opportunities. The RS is long and their will be players in and out of the rotation due to injuries, rest or whatever other reasons they have nowadays. Also it's not like we have much wing depth anyway.

Our best chance to succeed barring a trade is that at least 1 of the younger guys on the bench can develop into a playoff rotation player. I wouldn't bet my money on it happening but I sure hope so. Their success would be the Mavs success.

Would be awesome if both make it but i kinda stopped thinking about regular season long time ago. Playoffs already showed us what teams need and i think Green still has the best chances out of these two.

Bob8 · Post #138 » by **Bob8** » Wed Jul 27, 2022 5:35 am

Archx wrote:
Maverick41 wrote:
Archx wrote:Yeah i'm very sceptical of this. Mid and top teams improved by a lot this season and West is going to be a bloodbath. In order for these two to have any kind of improved impact, their minutes would also need to go way up. I don't see it.

Yeah but they will definitely have opportunities. The RS is long and their will be players in and out of the rotation due to injuries, rest or whatever other reasons they have nowadays. Also it's not like we have much wing depth anyway.

Our best chance to succeed barring a trade is that at least 1 of the younger guys on the bench can develop into a playoff rotation player. I wouldn't bet my money on it happening but I sure hope so. Their success would be the Mavs success.

Would be awesome if both make it but i kinda stopped thinking about regular season long time ago. Playoffs already showed us what teams need and i think Green still has the best chances out of these two.

Unfortunately Dorsey will be more useful than those 2.

SOUNDCHASER · Post #139 » by **SOUNDCHASER** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 10:28 pm

I think all 5 can become rotation worthy but Green Dorsey Hardy are the most likely to succeed from what I see.

Not to say Frank wont start hitting shots but he has been at it for a while now and with Pinson I would have to see more of his game to rate him any higher.

Hardy gets the rookie pass but he has potential to develop fast enough to play some this season. Green looks like he is serious and Dorsey has many years of experience.

MrGoat · Post #140 » by **MrGoat** » Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:50 pm

Until we drafted Hardy he was the only player on the roster younger than Luka. He showed some improvement from his first to his second season so I'd be in no rush to throw him away. He has a long timeline and the trend is heading the right direction. Hardy's addition doesn't mean we need to move on, Green is still only 21. Not playing the long game on some players really backfired on us post 2011